Thailand ranks near bottom in English proficiency: survey

[eddie61]

eben plime miniter, him sapeek engrit no good, same same lite parmer myanma. engrit no importan thailan, soon need sapeek chineed ony

[IDL]

Schoolclasses are too full... sometimes one teacher with fourty kids. Most of the education is merely reproducing. Improving the teacher's education would do much good. Facilitate it and challenge the teachers to improve themselves. The taxanomy of Bloom f.i. will not mean anything to the average teacher in Thailand.

The heaps and heaps of English courses often are done by unskilled staff.

Though there is some truth in the above opinion, the culture of not wishing to learn is a whole more powerful beast.

Often (though not entirely, people are people after all), Thais sign-up to programmes/courses due to pressure from others, bragging rights, and/or a belief that it'll all be very easy with little effort needed. The reality is of course something else.

I believe that a committed ESL teacher can help students (of varying degrees, obviously), regardless of their academic background, but only if the student is equally committed to learn.

[newermonkey]

eben plime miniter, him sapeek engrit no good, same same lite parmer myanma. engrit no importan thailan, soon need sapeek chineed ony

5555

[Moo2cm]

Surprise! Anybody has lived there for any time has noticed the decline.

[bangkoken]

This should come as no surprise to anyone. I have worked in the Thai Governments Educational system as a teacher for six years.. I'm a retired attorney with a Juris Doctrate degree. I have been a teacher at the New York Police Dept.Academy in New York City. I consider myself highly qualified to teach at the high school level here in Thailand preparing the students for there university years. It is my opinion the problem with the farang English teachers here in Thailand is that 90% or more are not Enlish teachers or any other kind of teacher.It seems that every farang that wants to live in Thailand immeditely becomes an English teacher upon arrival.A week ago driving a taxi in the UK, today! an English teacher,a month ago selling clothes at a US department stoe, today! an English teacher. I have been there and watched so many incompetent ,ill prepared "Foreign English Teachers" who literally have zero teaching experience,nothing. Until the Thai government gets smart and starts to hire only qualified people to teach their students the problem will never be solved.Being ahead of Iraq is hardly something to be proud of.

[evercurious]

You should try reading the report before making statements as wrong as that. EF has only been tracking data since 2007. Thailand actually shows the 10th best improvement in English ability not a decline as you mention. It is pretty staggering that you got it so wrong. The report also comments that South Korean students spend an average of 20,000 hours each between kindergarden and university learning English yet their proficiency is trending down.Data below is from the report

Turkey +11.86

Kazakhstan +11.73

Hungary +9.61

Indonesia +8.66

Vietnam +7.95

Poland +7.63

India +7.03

Russia +5.29

Peru +5.25

Thailand +5.03

United Arab Emirates +4.84

Spain +4.50

Colombia +4.30

Austria +4.08

Singapore* +0.27

South Korea -0.73

Hong Kong -0.90

This list includes countries where English is or has been 1st language (Hong Kong,) - so measurable improvements would not really appear - where minor reductions probably indicate more migrant workers from non-English speaking countries - and the resurgence of Mandarin in Hong Kong. Still the survey is valid and reinforced by other studies.

ASEAN listing showed Thailand as 9 out of 10 - Cambodia at 10 - which was also out of date by then as Cambodia much improved recently.

However in relative terms, Thailand seems to be worsening - as in dubbing foreign films which it did not do so much10 years ago.

There is now a great appearance of trying to organise English learning for 2015, but with hopeless organisation and last minute desperation.

I have taught in other Asian countries, such as Indonesia where progress has been far quicker over the last few years. Also China has steamed ahead in the last 3 or 4 years, leaving it in a different category to Thailand, when it was once even less open to English speaking;

While it is true that English people might try harder to learn foreign languages of countries they go to, the point is that Thai is not spoken anywhere else, so there's little motivation. People living in China for eg, often find more motivation and interest to try Mandarin.

Of course, Thais need English to help them move about in life, jobs, world travel and education. That is why they need to adopt a better

attitude - not just to please a few wandering tourists or retirees. Also as stated, people earning money in tourism or related fields are often far better at English than university students. If it's a woman with English boyfriend/spouse, then they usually spend time in the country (UK or US/OZ) so clearly they are way ahead and more motivated.

If it is bar workers, then they need the immediacy of conversational skills, on the ground so to speak, therefore abandoning any 'bookish' ways they may have been badly taught in earlier schools.

Many Thai teachers seem to think they do pupils a favour by 'spoon feeding' them in English lessons - such as giving all instructions in Thai and even the answers, just so they can translate or parrot the right words, with no further incentive to fluency.

Even if the teacher speaks the native language of the students, the ESL method always exorts to try explanations in English directly, so that the exposure to listening will eventually improve their comprehension - even if it takes longer to communicate.

[Lucie]

IMO, some of the best english language speakers are bar girls......

A lighthearted remark that is actually very important.

Yes, in my experience (though I'm a woman, so I don't chat to bar girls too often...) bar girls and ex bar girls do often speak the best English. It says something about the education system, and also about HOW and WHY to learn English. If necessity is there, people learn.

Here in Isaan, even in this private school where I work, most of the students don't have any opportunity to speak English with anyone other than their English teachers. But those with a foreign neighbour, an aunt married to a foreigner, etc... they DO learn more quickly, on the whole. They just see the practical use of English, and Bing! - there's the motivation, and therefore the learning. The same applies to bar girls and anyone else working in the tourism sector.

So I shall suggest closing down our school's English department, and sending the kids to Pattaya for the term...

[JJttttt1]

English is a language of colonizers. It didn't come as an international language naturally, but was imposed by British colonial empire and than US. Why should Thailand learn it? More farsightedly is to learn Chinese, this is the next international language.

[somtampet]

This should come as no surprise to anyone. I have worked in the Thai Governments Educational system as a teacher for six years.. I'm a retired attorney with a Juris Doctrate degree. I have been a teacher at the New York Police Dept.Academy in New York City. I consider myself highly qualified to teach at the high school level here in Thailand preparing the students for there university years. It is my opinion the problem with the farang English teachers here in Thailand is that 90% or more are not Enlish teachers or any other kind of teacher.It seems that every farang that wants to live in Thailand immeditely becomes an English teacher upon arrival.A week ago driving a taxi in the UK, today! an English teacher,a month ago selling clothes at a US department stoe, today! an English teacher. I have been there and watched so many incompetent ,ill prepared "Foreign English Teachers" who literally have zero teaching experience,nothing. Until the Thai government gets smart and starts to hire only qualified people to teach their students the problem will never be solved.Being ahead of Iraq is hardly something to be proud of.

Very good post, unfortunately u are right

[somtampet]

IMO, some of the best english language speakers are bar girls......

A lighthearted remark that is actually very important.

Yes, in my experience (though I'm a woman, so I don't chat to bar girls too often...) bar girls and ex bar girls do often speak the best English. It says something about the education system, and also about HOW and WHY to learn English. If necessity is there, people learn.

Here in Isaan, even in this private school where I work, most of the students don't have any opportunity to speak English with anyone other than their English teachers. But those with a foreign neighbour, an aunt married to a foreigner, etc... they DO learn more quickly, on the whole. They just see the practical use of English, and Bing! - there's the motivation, and therefore the learning. The same applies to bar girls and anyone else working in the tourism sector.

So I shall suggest closing down our school's English department, and sending the kids to Pattaya for the term...

Obviously u want the KIDS to work in the tourism industry????

[bbbbooboo]

Yes Thais need to spek ingland proberly

[cup-O-coffee]

Thailand ranks near bottom in English proficiency

And PM Yingluck's interview with CNN proved it beyond a shadow of doubt.

Before:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XJonMclsEw

After:

Funny, but this does not prove anything other than she can't speak English very well. I can't say as I agree with this example, and I don't usually take this stance when it comes to knocking Thais and their lunacy around. The quantity of fluent languages a foreign leader speaks, or does not speak, is not a requirement for that leader to be in his or her position. This, alone, discredits this satirical post, moreover a bash at the current PM's English speaking abilities. Although she is a bit rough around the edges, her comprehension skills are spot on and that is more than I can say about a lot of other people.

If, however this is somehow meant to be a jibe at expecting the PM to somehow lead by example, then we may as well raise the standard, according to this posts line of logic, and expect her to be a great scientist, journalist, gourmet chef, airplane pilot, and so on. You get my point.

Foreign leaders do not need to speak any other language than their mother tongue, and if they do speak a second language, then judging their abilities as a leader by how they sound is stupid and cheap, in my view. After all, why then do they have interpreters at the United Nations meetings; ...because they are stupid?

Edited November 7, 2013 by cup-O-coffee

[stickylies]

[laocowboy2]

This result is an embarrassment and will probably be countered by the Education Ministry. They may, just may, concede there's always room for improvement but things are not as bad as the survey claims BUT Oh Yes They Are !

Those of us who have been / are involved in education are only too well aware of what goes on in the system as a whole but since this is about English language I will address my comments to that.

We have all come accross Thai ' English ' teachers who can't put a spoken sentence together, who teach by writing on the whiteboard then teaching in Thai and who do not use English conversation in class due to their own shortcomings.

I think it's fair to say that many obtained their qualifications in the usual Thai manner and as they themselves now ' pass ' their own students.

The whole system needs a shakeup of earthquake proportions and that's something that isn't going to happen because of the opposition from within.

This survey may have been a paper exercise but the reality of the results will be all too apparent when the AEC gets going and it will be too late for Thailand although I don't for a minute believe they will admit there's any problem.

Ref the AEC, it get's worse. Malaysia has been driving a lot of the rule setting - and these meetings are held in English. Once free movement of professionals becomes possible, a lot of the jobs that require good English (in Thailand) will go to Malaysians and Filipinos (Singaporeans are too expensive)

[bigbamboo]

English is a language of colonizers. It didn't come as an international language naturally, but was imposed by British colonial empire and than US. Why should Thailand learn it? More farsightedly is to learn Chinese, this is the next international language.

How farsighted do you want to be? It won't happen in most people's lifetime but who knows maybe eons from now Chinese will become the world's lingua franca.

Of course they'll have to colonise the world first.

[gerrythepoet]

You should try reading the report before making statements as wrong as that. EF has only been tracking data since 2007. Thailand actually shows the 10th best improvement in English ability not a decline as you mention. It is pretty staggering that you got it so wrong. The report also comments that South Korean students spend an average of 20,000 hours each between kindergarden and university learning English yet their proficiency is trending down.Data below is from the report

Turkey +11.86

Kazakhstan +11.73

Hungary +9.61

Indonesia +8.66

Vietnam +7.95

Poland +7.63

India +7.03

Russia +5.29

Peru +5.25

Thailand +5.03

United Arab Emirates +4.84

Spain +4.50

Colombia +4.30

Austria +4.08

Singapore* +0.27

South Korea -0.73

Hong Kong -0.90

This list includes countries where English is or has been 1st language (Hong Kong,) - so measurable improvements would not really appear - where minor reductions probably indicate more migrant workers from non-English speaking countries - and the resurgence of Mandarin in Hong Kong. Still the survey is valid and reinforced by other studies.

ASEAN listing showed Thailand as 9 out of 10 - Cambodia at 10 - which was also out of date by then as Cambodia much improved recently.

However in relative terms, Thailand seems to be worsening - as in dubbing foreign films which it did not do so much10 years ago.

There is now a great appearance of trying to organise English learning for 2015, but with hopeless organisation and last minute desperation.

I have taught in other Asian countries, such as Indonesia where progress has been far quicker over the last few years. Also China has steamed ahead in the last 3 or 4 years, leaving it in a different category to Thailand, when it was once even less open to English speaking;

While it is true that English people might try harder to learn foreign languages of countries they go to, the point is that Thai is not spoken anywhere else, so there's little motivation. People living in China for eg, often find more motivation and interest to try Mandarin.

Of course, Thais need English to help them move about in life, jobs, world travel and education. That is why they need to adopt a better

attitude - not just to please a few wandering tourists or retirees. Also as stated, people earning money in tourism or related fields are often far better at English than university students. If it's a woman with English boyfriend/spouse, then they usually spend time in the country (UK or US/OZ) so clearly they are way ahead and more motivated.

If it is bar workers, then they need the immediacy of conversational skills, on the ground so to speak, therefore abandoning any 'bookish' ways they may have been badly taught in earlier schools.

Many Thai teachers seem to think they do pupils a favour by 'spoon feeding' them in English lessons - such as giving all instructions in Thai and even the answers, just so they can translate or parrot the right words, with no further incentive to fluency.

Even if the teacher speaks the native language of the students, the ESL method always exorts to try explanations in English directly, so that the exposure to listening will eventually improve their comprehension - even if it takes longer to communicate.

I am also perplexed at why foreign films in Thailand are dubbed in Thai and no subtitles in English. If you cannot impress enough the importance of immersing oneself in the language in this case English then getting people to watch the movies in English and giving Thai subtitles would be one of the stages of getting some interest and motivation going. I have come across newly built cinemas and they have no English spoken films or even subtitled. Surely at this stage does it mean that some of those in the Media would like Thailand to stay out of the A.E.C. I have only come across this attitude in Thailand not in Malaysia or Laos?

[stickylies]

thai have a terrible accent, just like japanese and many other asians. i agree the level of english is very poor but then again, this country is 50 years behind on "us" (westerners). 50 years ago in france or germany or spain only few people spoke english too. let's give them another 20 years or so. eventually they will get it.

[stickylies]

and to all native english speakers: what other language do u speak? i speak 5 languages including my mothertongue and never considered it fun to study these back in the days. i was "forced" by an educational system, something the thai don't have thanx to their xxxminal government. keep the people stupid, Panem et circenses...

[Prbkk]

My observation about the decline was based on the scores achieved by Thais on scores such as IELTS and TOEFL rather than this survey ( but the survey has a ring of truth about it).

Language learning depends a number of factors, including motivation, the perception of the student of the relevance of the learning, access to quality teaching and materials, government funding, the age of the student. Thailand does poorly on a number of these factors.

Yes, of course it is more difficult for learners whose first language uses a different script, vastly different grammar and a tonal language.

As someone else pointed out, Thai kids do see Thailand as the centre of the universe and may feel less need to study English ( complicated by the lack of access to appropriate teaching techniques, huge class sizes, frustration by slow progress, etc). However, some Thai schools are achieving near miracles with their bilingual programs/immersion techniques....so it is not the case that Thailand is a basket case in this area....but the government program has gone off the rails and the best work is being done in the private sector.

Someone mentioned the bank staff being unable to communicate: true. there is a generation of Thai graduates who have under-achieved in learning English ( not because they are dumb but because they have not been given the opportunity to learn how to communicate in English ....but may have quite good skills in reading and writing).

This is a huge problem for Thailand. Teaching Chinese instead is not the answer: the next generation of educated Chinese will be quite fluent in English.

The kids best placed in Thailand are the children of farang/thai ( bilingual, bicultural..a huge advantage).

When thaksin was PM, an international survey of research output in universities placed Thailand 49/50. To his credit, he recognised the seriousness of that problem and provided funds to address it ( stumbled in recent times). The same attention should be placed on English training.

I am not Thai bashing here...frustrated by poor policy that is going to come back to bite Thailand.

55 and on the way to 60. The DECLINE over the past 20 years is staggering.

You should try reading the report before making statements as wrong as that. EF has only been tracking data since 2007. Thailand actually shows the 10th best improvement in English ability not a decline as you mention. It is pretty staggering that you got it so wrong. The report also comments that South Korean students spend an average of 20,000 hours each between kindergarden and university learning English yet their proficiency is trending down.Data below is from the report

Turkey +11.86

Kazakhstan +11.73

Hungary +9.61

Indonesia +8.66

Vietnam +7.95

Poland +7.63

India +7.03

Russia +5.29

Peru +5.25

Thailand +5.03

United Arab Emirates +4.84

Spain +4.50

Colombia +4.30

Austria +4.08

Singapore* +0.27

South Korea -0.73

Hong Kong -0.90

Japan -0.96

[JustAnotherFarang]

This is the simple rhetoric of thai teachers all over Thailand including the thai teachers who are supposed to teach English. It is a "head in the sand" approach much suited to ostriches who do not want to see the problems that are coming. But the question remains that if Thais have so many problems learning English then how do you think they will manage when they try to learn chinese instead ?

The simple truth is that Thailand must escape this feudal, jingoistic head in the sand approach to the english speaking world if they ever hope to compete in the global markets of tomorrow. To speak English would surely be a benefit to the future of thai people and for those who do not wish to learn, they should be allowed to choose another subject that may be beneficial to their future instead..

JAF

English is a language of colonizers. It didn't come as an international language naturally, but was imposed by British colonial empire and than US. Why should Thailand learn it? More farsightedly is to learn Chinese, this is the next international language.

Edited November 7, 2013 by JustAnotherFarang

[cup-O-coffee]

You should try reading the report before making statements as wrong as that. EF has only been tracking data since 2007. Thailand actually shows the 10th best improvement in English ability not a decline as you mention. It is pretty staggering that you got it so wrong. The report also comments that South Korean students spend an average of 20,000 hours each between kindergarden and university learning English yet their proficiency is trending down.Data below is from the report

Turkey +11.86

Kazakhstan +11.73

Hungary +9.61

Indonesia +8.66

Vietnam +7.95

Poland +7.63

India +7.03

Russia +5.29

Peru +5.25

Thailand +5.03

United Arab Emirates +4.84

Spain +4.50

Colombia +4.30

Austria +4.08

Singapore* +0.27

South Korea -0.73

Hong Kong -0.90

This list includes countries where English is or has been 1st language (Hong Kong,) - so measurable improvements would not really appear - where minor reductions probably indicate more migrant workers from non-English speaking countries - and the resurgence of Mandarin in Hong Kong. Still the survey is valid and reinforced by other studies.

ASEAN listing showed Thailand as 9 out of 10 - Cambodia at 10 - which was also out of date by then as Cambodia much improved recently.

However in relative terms, Thailand seems to be worsening - as in dubbing foreign films which it did not do so much10 years ago.

There is now a great appearance of trying to organise English learning for 2015, but with hopeless organisation and last minute desperation.

I have taught in other Asian countries, such as Indonesia where progress has been far quicker over the last few years. Also China has steamed ahead in the last 3 or 4 years, leaving it in a different category to Thailand, when it was once even less open to English speaking;

While it is true that English people might try harder to learn foreign languages of countries they go to, the point is that Thai is not spoken anywhere else, so there's little motivation. People living in China for eg, often find more motivation and interest to try Mandarin.

Of course, Thais need English to help them move about in life, jobs, world travel and education. That is why they need to adopt a better

attitude - not just to please a few wandering tourists or retirees. Also as stated, people earning money in tourism or related fields are often far better at English than university students. If it's a woman with English boyfriend/spouse, then they usually spend time in the country (UK or US/OZ) so clearly they are way ahead and more motivated.

If it is bar workers, then they need the immediacy of conversational skills, on the ground so to speak, therefore abandoning any 'bookish' ways they may have been badly taught in earlier schools.

Many Thai teachers seem to think they do pupils a favour by 'spoon feeding' them in English lessons - such as giving all instructions in Thai and even the answers, just so they can translate or parrot the right words, with no further incentive to fluency.

Even if the teacher speaks the native language of the students, the ESL method always exorts to try explanations in English directly, so that the exposure to listening will eventually improve their comprehension - even if it takes longer to communicate.

I am also perplexed at why foreign films in Thailand are dubbed in Thai and no subtitles in English. If you cannot impress enough the importance of immersing oneself in the language in this case English then getting people to watch the movies in English and giving Thai subtitles would be one of the stages of getting some interest and motivation going. I have come across newly built cinemas and they have no English spoken films or even subtitled. Surely at this stage does it mean that some of those in the Media would like Thailand to stay out of the A.E.C. I have only come across this attitude in Thailand not in Malaysia or Laos?

I think you are giving them too much credit for being able to think this through to the measure which you are implying. More likely, it is possible that most who see these movies cannot read, or cannot read fast enough, or are simply too high strung to flash their eyes back and forth at the subtitles and the action on the screen, which requires multi-tasking abilities, of which they have none. I think it is as simple as that.

It is this kind of handicap with which a lot of Thai culture caters to: go where there is least resistance, don't be responsible or accountable and so on. It isn't scientific. Why bother to change with this kind of free gratis to be a lunatic?

Thais won't be interested much in things which require them to pay something (especially when being entertained by a movie), even if paying equates to exercising their minds to read a sub title and watch the action on the screen; much less getting the gist of the foreign language they hear and corresponding that to the sub titles (which you imply).

As a former teacher, I was often told by Thai directors and Thai teachers to keep it fun. "If it isn't fun, it isn't worth doing." That being the case, it made me wonder what compelled them to get out of bed in the morning.

[belg]

no surprise and bank staff, none able to speak a descent word

but best example it the PM in all her interviews, she does not understand what she is saying, neither do other people

she keep repeating some learned mantra .... evelything ok, good for female powel

[Prbkk]

Speak English On Monday

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SpRgcIKe8I

[belg]

if more thais spoke good english, than how many farangs more would be fleeced out of all their money?

the new economy !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[wileycoyote]

Oh Mum !

[beautifulthailand99]

Looking at the flip side - the Thai mind - I wonder if this is a priority with all Thais in general (excluding the rare exceptions). I do not think it is.

When I consider their propensity for lying, cheating, stealing, laziness, choosing the route of least resistance, avoiding all responsibility and accountability, their love/hate relationship with life and its sanctity, and everything else... and then I contrast that to the methods and means with which they extort, blackmail, betray, reneg, accuse and bleed foreigners of every last ounce of money they can, then... well, I am remiss if I do not see the advantage of not bothering with English.

Learning the English language or not learning the English language will have no effect on the amount of money they intake from foreign presence here. In my view, that is what they solely exist for; to accumulate as much wealth as they can before they die.

This statistic is about as ludicrous as reporting that the Remora fish does not speak shark. Why should it? It gets what it wants.

Ouch sounds like a victim talking.

[eurozhongguo]

This survey is far from representative of reality. It puts China above Thailand. I live in China and can never carry out the most basic transactions unless I take a native speaker with me. In Thailand, I can do everything on my own. I go to Thailand because Thais CAN speak English. Maybe they can't speak it well like Europeans, but the Chinese can't speak it at all. Also, how come they put Malayisa ahead of Singapore? Singapore's official language is English. This survey is meaningless.

[beautifulthailand99]

no surprise and bank staff, none able to speak a descent word

but best example it the PM in all her interviews, she does not understand what she is saying, neither do other people

she keep repeating some learned mantra .... evelything ok, good for female powel

Time again for this ...

[Prbkk]

Singapore's official language is Malay ( notwithstanding the revalence of English in daily life).

This survey is far from representative of reality. It puts China above Thailand. I live in China and can never carry out the most basic transactions unless I take a native speaker with me. In Thailand, I can do everything on my own. I go to Thailand because Thais CAN speak English. Maybe they can't speak it well like Europeans, but the Chinese can't speak it at all. Also, how come they put Malayisa ahead of Singapore? Singapore's official language is English. This survey is meaningless.

[sirchai]

For those Fahrang who are being sarcastic, insulting and making fun of my country, if you don't like it here, get the F out, go back to your country. Why are you here?. I admit the fact that Thai people are not good at English. But there must be a lot of things here in Thailand that you Farang must like and appreciate besides those bar girls. So BE RESPECTFUL ! or go home. I have lived oversea for 25 years and traveled a lot so I know my country is one of the best place on earth.

Thanks. A good post. Would people here respect each other, (including Thais respecting foreigners who're working at schools), things would be different.

I'm really concerned about your government's policy, as they don't seem to know how to solve this problem. Our son will be 18 when ASEAN will kick in and his chances finding a decent job might be pretty slim, as for example Filipinos, Burmese, or Laotian people will do the same job for less money.

The same happened in Europe, hope it will never be the same for people from Thailand.-