Speaking English: Thailand vs Philippines

[thailiketoo]

If you were right and he was wrong would you expect Thais to go to the Philippines for work? Or people from the Philippines to come to Thailand for work? I just asking. Mexican people come to the US to work and Polish people come to the UK to work. If the Philippines economy was doing so well one would expect Thais and others from SEA to be flooding the Philippines looking for work. Are they?

This whole thread is about Thais poor language skills and you're asking why Thais don't go anywhere to work abroad!

Seriously?

You wrote, "It's such a basket case that it's economy outperformed every other country in Asia,INCLUDING THAILAND,for the first 2 quarters of this year! Why do clueless,uniformed idiots insist on posting utter garbage on here,it's actually embarrassing how little they know!"

I guess you did not want anyone to ask you anything about what you wrote, seriously

PS 134,000 Thais worked abroad in 2012. But not many went to the Philippines.

I think I'll take the word of Reuters over a muppet like you,is this an act or something? :

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/08/29/uk-philippines-economy-gdp-idUKBRE97S04N20130829

Oh and 10,000,000 Filipinos work overseas!If you can't say anything sensible that is backed up by facts PLEASE stop making a fool of yourself!

You wrote, "It's such a basket case that it's economy outperformed every other country in Asia,INCLUDING THAILAND,for the first 2 quarters of this year! Why do clueless,uniformed idiots insist on posting utter garbage on here,it's actually embarrassing how little they know!

Thailand has a GDP per capita of $6,500 US Dollars per year. Philippines has a GDP of $2,400 US Dollars per year. The average person in Thailand makes about 300% more than the average person in the Philippines.

Calling people names normally goes out of style in early adolescence, Try and post maturely.

Next year people in the Philippines may make more than this year (Peso down 8%) but they will still only make about a third of what the average person in Thailand makes.

You should really read the news stories that you quote. Feel free to quote the estimated GDP of both countries per capita for 2013.

[QROPS]

Bringing up GDP is a non starter, as a comparison between Thailand and the Philippines means next to nothing in this respect. The fact of the matter is that most of either countries wealth is held by a few "Elite" families, so in turn this doesn't offer a decent representation when in both countries you will find people living below the poverty line.

You would also assume that a country with a higher GDP should be able to offer a better education system, what happened in Thailand?

The Philippines with all of it's crime, corruption, poverty and low GDP, still manages to have an educational system that teaches their pupils in the international business language of the world.

Yes there is serious levels of crime in both countries, and unless there is a paradigm shift that will always be the case.

The Philippines has more overseas workers than any other country in the world so to quote your good self "So education and English proficiency doesn't really mean much, does it?" doesn't really hold much ground now does it? Roughly 10% of the Philippine population work abroad.

[Hardened Spanker]

This whole thread is about Thais poor language skills and you're asking why Thais don't go anywhere to work abroad!

Seriously?

You wrote, "It's such a basket case that it's economy outperformed every other country in Asia,INCLUDING THAILAND,for the first 2 quarters of this year! Why do clueless,uniformed idiots insist on posting utter garbage on here,it's actually embarrassing how little they know!"

I guess you did not want anyone to ask you anything about what you wrote, seriously

PS 134,000 Thais worked abroad in 2012. But not many went to the Philippines.

I think I'll take the word of Reuters over a muppet like you,is this an act or something? :

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/08/29/uk-philippines-economy-gdp-idUKBRE97S04N20130829

Oh and 10,000,000 Filipinos work overseas!If you can't say anything sensible that is backed up by facts PLEASE stop making a fool of yourself!

You wrote, "It's such a basket case that it's economy outperformed every other country in Asia,INCLUDING THAILAND,for the first 2 quarters of this year! Why do clueless,uniformed idiots insist on posting utter garbage on here,it's actually embarrassing how little they know!

Thailand has a GDP per capita of $6,500 US Dollars per year. Philippines has a GDP of $2,400 US Dollars per year. The average person in Thailand makes about 300% more than the average person in the Philippines.

Calling people names normally goes out of style in early adolescence, Try and post maturely.

Next year people in the Philippines may make more than this year (Peso down 8%) but they will still only make about a third of what the average person in Thailand makes.

You should really read the news stories that you quote. Feel free to quote the estimated GDP of both countries per capita for 2013.

Can you put your Mother on because this really is like speaking to a child?

Just because the size or volume of a country's GDP is bigger doesn't mean that the economy is perfoming better.The UK,Spain and Italy all have MUCH bigger GDPs than Thailand but are their respective economies performing better?

Of course not!By percentage gains for the 1st and 2nd quarter the Philippines has outperformed Thailand's economy,this is a stone-cold fact,get it?

[connda]

Well the United States won the Philippine's from the Spanish as a result of the Spanish American War in 1898, after the Philippine- American War 1899-1902 the Americans defeated the revolt of the people of the Philippines and made English the primary language of, the government, education and business, The US controlled the Philippines from 1898 to 1946.

So to answer your question, Why the people of the Philippines have more English speakers and teachers then Thailand, was a result of 48 years of English language was forced on the people of the Philippines as it official language!

Cheers

First of all sir it was never forced on the Filipino culture. They did have two bases there but are now down to one and Subic Bay is located outside of Angeles city.

English is there second-language because of the American influence, that is correct! I visited many schools when I was in the Philippines basically because I was a principal from the USA. They are taught English on the first grade level through the 12th grade level. They are the third largest English speaking country in the world. They have approximately 94% literacy in the Philippines.

I visited a first grade class with 51 students and you could hear a pin drop. When working for my Doctorate I also did a survey of some of the Filipino educational systems. Their curriculum is very sound and their universities are basically top notch. The number one University is located outside of Manila in Quezon City and the number two is in Dumaguete. The International Universities are totally top notch and with the core of instructors that they have it appears that they are extremely sound.

To sum up most of the questions asked here, it mainly depends on the lecturers or the instructors at the University that makes them a sound and quality-based educational system.

If Thailand had this quality of instructors I truly believe that their educational system could have possibilities, But they must change the curriculum in order to meet the accreditation requirements. Thai students can only be as good as the instructors or the leaders of that individual school. Thai students are extremely intelligent if Instructed properly with quality educators. Once again do not give total Autonomy to the owners of the school and the school must meet accreditation because the teachers are qualified but not in English. This is not the problem of the teachers but the leaders of the school.

I'll agree with you to a point. There are major cultural differences too. Thais are taught not to question authority and not to lose face So independent, analytic thinking is not a trait that is developed in the school systems, nor is risk taking. And in order to learn, you need to to do both. You need to be willing to make mistakes and then learn from your mistakes. That doesn't happen here. And there are some excellent instructors here. Don't let that Doctorate go to your head. Unless those cultural issues are addressed, effective learning doesn't take place, regardless of how dedicated an instructor is.

I didn't see those issue in the PI school systems or with Filipino students. It's a different culture. So please don't arbitrarily blame it on 'poor instructors' or 'poor curriculum'. Within the education system, Thais need a 'quantum leap' in their cultural perspective .

My Doctorate is in Technology and Curriculum and it is not going into my head! I have 12 years as an administrator in the USA and three years experience at an international University in Thailand. I've had teaching experience and have taught teachers from different countries to teach English in their home countries to their students. I have nothing to prove to you nor am I my trying to prove anything to you other than voicing actual facts as I have seen it in the past years. You cannot compare to my qualifications nor experiences so basically cheers! Quality of the curriculum in this country is less than desirable because my daughter attends a Thai school. Her English is better than the instructors.

To enter into a cultural background is the least of the educational problems in Thailand. If you wish to speak to me use respect and not tell me that something is going to my head it offends me talking to an unintelligent individual from some country who feels they are a little more arrogant than others.

Cheers!

I rest my case.

[thailiketoo]

You wrote, "It's such a basket case that it's economy outperformed every other country in Asia,INCLUDING THAILAND,for the first 2 quarters of this year! Why do clueless,uniformed idiots insist on posting utter garbage on here,it's actually embarrassing how little they know!"

I guess you did not want anyone to ask you anything about what you wrote, seriously

PS 134,000 Thais worked abroad in 2012. But not many went to the Philippines.

I think I'll take the word of Reuters over a muppet like you,is this an act or something? :

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/08/29/uk-philippines-economy-gdp-idUKBRE97S04N20130829

Oh and 10,000,000 Filipinos work overseas!If you can't say anything sensible that is backed up by facts PLEASE stop making a fool of yourself!

You wrote, "It's such a basket case that it's economy outperformed every other country in Asia,INCLUDING THAILAND,for the first 2 quarters of this year! Why do clueless,uniformed idiots insist on posting utter garbage on here,it's actually embarrassing how little they know!

Thailand has a GDP per capita of $6,500 US Dollars per year. Philippines has a GDP of $2,400 US Dollars per year. The average person in Thailand makes about 300% more than the average person in the Philippines.

Calling people names normally goes out of style in early adolescence, Try and post maturely.

Next year people in the Philippines may make more than this year (Peso down 8%) but they will still only make about a third of what the average person in Thailand makes.

You should really read the news stories that you quote. Feel free to quote the estimated GDP of both countries per capita for 2013.

Can you put your Mother on because this really is like speaking to a child?

Just because the size or volume of a country's GDP is bigger doesn't mean that the economy is perfoming better.The UK,Spain and Italy all have MUCH bigger GDPs than Thailand but are their respective economies performing better?

Of course not!By percentage gains for the 1st and 2nd quarter the Philippines has outperformed Thailand's economy,this is a stone-cold fact,get it?

Save the Mother jokes for the "Yo Momma" section please.

The gross national product per person in the Philippines is $2,400 and Thailand's is $6,500. Lets say The Thai GNP grows at 1% and the Philippines grows at 5% how many years would it take for the Philippine worker to catch up with the Thai worker? 20 or 30 years. Some math guy can tell us. Come back in 20 years and the Philippines may have a comparable economy to Thailand. Until then its eggs and melons. Can't compare.

PS it is possible that my net worth rose faster than Warren Buffet this year. But. It's just too far apart to even think about meaningful comparisons.

People with college degrees from the Philippines want to work in Thailand because the Philippines is a dangerous, dirty, poor, economically backward country. People in Thailand want to work in .......... well Thailand.

Thai women don't want to leave Thailand. Doctors educated in the Philippines want to practice medicine in the US and Doctors educated in Thailand well....... want to practice medicine in Thailand.

I know you want to bash Thailand as that's what this thread is all about and Philippine people do speak much better English and so does the UK and US. So? What's new. Philippine people are native English speakers and Thai people are native Thai speakers.

[thailiketoo]

My Doctorate is in Technology and Curriculum and it is not going into my head! I have 12 years as an administrator in the USA and three years experience at an international University in Thailand. I've had teaching experience and have taught teachers from different countries to teach English in their home countries to their students. I have nothing to prove to you nor am I my trying to prove anything to you other than voicing actual facts as I have seen it in the past years. You cannot compare to my qualifications nor experiences so basically cheers! Quality of the curriculum in this country is less than desirable because my daughter attends a Thai school. Her English is better than the instructors.

To enter into a cultural background is the least of the educational problems in Thailand. If you wish to speak to me use respect and not tell me that something is going to my head it offends me talking to an unintelligent individual from some country who feels they are a little more arrogant than others.

Cheers!

I rest my case.

I gotta agree with you. My respect for Thai education is going up by leaps and bounds in comparison to other countries.

[connda]

Well the United States won the Philippine's from the Spanish as a result of the Spanish American War in 1898, after the Philippine- American War 1899-1902 the Americans defeated the revolt of the people of the Philippines and made English the primary language of, the government, education and business, The US controlled the Philippines from 1898 to 1946.

So to answer your question, Why the people of the Philippines have more English speakers and teachers then Thailand, was a result of 48 years of English language was forced on the people of the Philippines as it official language!

Cheers

First of all sir it was never forced on the Filipino culture. They did have two bases there but are now down to one and Subic Bay is located outside of Angeles city.

English is there second-language because of the American influence, that is correct! I visited many schools when I was in the Philippines basically because I was a principal from the USA. They are taught English on the first grade level through the 12th grade level. They are the third largest English speaking country in the world. They have approximately 94% literacy in the Philippines.

I visited a first grade class with 51 students and you could hear a pin drop. When working for my Doctorate I also did a survey of some of the Filipino educational systems. Their curriculum is very sound and their universities are basically top notch. The number one University is located outside of Manila in Quezon City and the number two is in Dumaguete. The International Universities are totally top notch and with the core of instructors that they have it appears that they are extremely sound.

To sum up most of the questions asked here, it mainly depends on the lecturers or the instructors at the University that makes them a sound and quality-based educational system.

If Thailand had this quality of instructors I truly believe that their educational system could have possibilities, But they must change the curriculum in order to meet the accreditation requirements. Thai students can only be as good as the instructors or the leaders of that individual school. Thai students are extremely intelligent if Instructed properly with quality educators. Once again do not give total Autonomy to the owners of the school and the school must meet accreditation because the teachers are qualified but not in English. This is not the problem of the teachers but the leaders of the school.

I'll agree with you to a point. There are major cultural differences too. Thais are taught not to question authority and not to lose face So independent, analytic thinking is not a trait that is developed in the school systems, nor is risk taking. And in order to learn, you need to to do both. You need to be willing to make mistakes and then learn from your mistakes. That doesn't happen here. And there are some excellent instructors here. Don't let that Doctorate go to your head. Unless those cultural issues are addressed, effective learning doesn't take place, regardless of how dedicated an instructor is.

I didn't see those issue in the PI school systems or with Filipino students. It's a different culture. So please don't arbitrarily blame it on 'poor instructors' or 'poor curriculum'. Within the education system, Thais need a 'quantum leap' in their cultural perspective .

My Doctorate is in Technology and Curriculum and it is not going into my head! I have 12 years as an administrator in the USA and three years experience at an international University in Thailand. I've had teaching experience and have taught teachers from different countries to teach English in their home countries to their students. I have nothing to prove to you nor am I my trying to prove anything to you other than voicing actual facts as I have seen it in the past years. You cannot compare to my qualifications nor experiences so basically cheers! Quality of the curriculum in this country is less than desirable because my daughter attends a Thai school. Her English is better than the instructors.

To enter into a cultural background is the least of the educational problems in Thailand. If you wish to speak to me use respect and not tell me that something is going to my head it offends me talking to an unintelligent individual from some country who feels they are a little more arrogant than others.

Cheers!

You completely missed the point of the post, Doc. BTW, I graduated at the top of my graduating class in university. Number 1 out of over 4000 grads while raising a preteen daughter as a single parent, and working part-time to make ends meet. I bailed from the Masters program and went to work in order to give my kid a shot at a normal life. So what? My diploma and class standing plus 45 baht will buy me a Kaffe Latte and the local coffee shop. Hubris isn't a characteristic I ascribe to. It gets in the way and does little but reinforces your own biases.. Nothing you said offended me. So gather yourself and reread the content of my previous post.

Cultural issues have a huge impact on learning here in Thailand. I've taught specialized classes to Thai primary and secondary teachers regarding techniques to teach English more effectively. It's interesting to see exactly how ingrained certain cultural traits are that inhibit their ability to change their teaching techniques. Those ingrained culture traits (that I discussed in my previous post) need to be addressed, because until they are, those teachers will never willingly assimilate and effectively teach a revised curriculum. Nor will their own English language skill improve. And I do agree with you. They do need to seriously revise the curriculum that they teach. Rote repetition of mispronounced English isn't helping the students one bit. There are serious issues with the methodology being use (or lack thereof) to teach the language. Best of luck Doc. Hope you're able to make a positive change.

Edited December 18, 2013 by connda

[thailiketoo]

You completely missed the point of the post, Doc. BTW, I graduated at the top of my graduating class in university. Number 1 out of over 4000 grads while raising a preteen daughter as a single parent, and working part-time to make ends meet. I bailed from the Masters program and went to work in order to give my kid a shot at a normal life. So what? My diploma and class standing plus 45 baht will buy me a Kaffe Latte and the local coffee shop. Hubris isn't a characteristic I ascribe to. It gets in the way and does little but reinforces your own biases.. Nothing you said offended me. So gather yourself and reread the content of my previous post.

Cultural issues have a huge impact on learning here in Thailand. I've taught specialized classes to Thai primary and secondary teachers regarding techniques to teach English more effectively. It's interesting to see exactly how ingrained certain cultural traits are that inhibit their ability to change their teaching techniques. Those ingrained culture traits (that I discussed in my previous post) need to be addressed, because until they are, those teachers will never willingly assimilate and effectively teach a revised curriculum. Nor will their own English language skill improve. And I do agree with you. They do need to seriously revise the curriculum that they teach. Rote repetition of mispronounced English isn't helping the students one bit. There are serious issues with the methodology being use (or lack thereof) to teach the language. Best of luck Doc. Hope you're able to make a positive change.

You wrote, "It's interesting to see exactly how ingrained certain cultural traits are that inhibit their ability to change their teaching techniques. Those ingrained culture traits (that I discussed in my previous post) need to be addressed, because until they are, those teachers will never willingly assimilate and effectively teach a revised curriculum." Could you give me an example. Not a principle or some other such concept but a concrete example of what you mean. Thanks because I don't understand how culture prevents anything but I would like to learn.

For example I watched a Thai PhD invent tone marks for English words which I told him was nutty.

[connda]

You completely missed the point of the post, Doc. BTW, I graduated at the top of my graduating class in university. Number 1 out of over 4000 grads while raising a preteen daughter as a single parent, and working part-time to make ends meet. I bailed from the Masters program and went to work in order to give my kid a shot at a normal life. So what? My diploma and class standing plus 45 baht will buy me a Kaffe Latte and the local coffee shop. Hubris isn't a characteristic I ascribe to. It gets in the way and does little but reinforces your own biases.. Nothing you said offended me. So gather yourself and reread the content of my previous post.

Cultural issues have a huge impact on learning here in Thailand. I've taught specialized classes to Thai primary and secondary teachers regarding techniques to teach English more effectively. It's interesting to see exactly how ingrained certain cultural traits are that inhibit their ability to change their teaching techniques. Those ingrained culture traits (that I discussed in my previous post) need to be addressed, because until they are, those teachers will never willingly assimilate and effectively teach a revised curriculum. Nor will their own English language skill improve. And I do agree with you. They do need to seriously revise the curriculum that they teach. Rote repetition of mispronounced English isn't helping the students one bit. There are serious issues with the methodology being use (or lack thereof) to teach the language. Best of luck Doc. Hope you're able to make a positive change.

You wrote, "It's interesting to see exactly how ingrained certain cultural traits are that inhibit their ability to change their teaching techniques. Those ingrained culture traits (that I discussed in my previous post) need to be addressed, because until they are, those teachers will never willingly assimilate and effectively teach a revised curriculum." Could you give me an example. Not a principle or some other such concept but a concrete example of what you mean. Thanks because I don't understand how culture prevents anything but I would like to learn.

For example I watched a Thai PhD invent tone marks for English words which I told him was nutty.

Yeah, agreed. But he was probably just trying to make sense of the language without understanding that tones in English are used for expression, emphasis, and to subtly change the meaning of words or sentences (among other things). He's trying to make rules where rules may not really exist, well, unless you understand the culture and dialects of the English being spoken. It would take to book the size of the dictionary to quantify that, and it still would doubtfully be accurate. Thai tone rules can be summarized in about 20 pages or less. Once you understand them, you can toss transliteration out the window because you can accurately pronounce anything you read.

I can't wait for the Thai PhD to start teaching his method as fact. More misinformation disseminated to already confused Thai students. I'm sure he'll run his thesis by knowledgeable English speakers for peer review -- not! It seems the higher up the social ladder, the less likely a Thai will accept constructive criticism, such as a peer review. Of course, the same could be said of some PhDs in our own countries. Just saying

Edited December 18, 2013 by connda

[beechguy]

Out of all of the people posting, how many have actually spent any length - longer than six months -of time there?

Accents or not, the current Thai educational system cannot compete with that of the Philippines.

One of the major sectors of employment in the Philippines is call centre work. These aren't call centres for local businesses in the most part, but huge international companies use the Philippines for their call centres due to their proficiency in English.

Hmmmm. Well that explains why the Philippines is such a regional basketcase, with crime, corruption, and poverty much worse than Thailand. And it also explains why Thailand, with a population of around 30 million less, has about 40% higher GDP than the PI. Per capita GDP of Thailand is over double that of the PI. So education and English proficiency doesn't really mean much, does it?

It's such a basket case that it's economy outperformed every other country in Asia,INCLUDING THAILAND,for the first 2 quarters of this year!

Why do clueless,uniformed idiots insist on posting utter garbage on here,it's actually embarrassing how little they know!

If it's doing so great, why are so many of it's people fleeing the place?

As to the call centers, I think the ones in the PI are equally useless as those operated by the Indians.

I knew a lot of people from the PI in the Gulf Region, good people but I wouldn't say any smarter than the Thai people I know. Certainly there was a mix of English skill levels, very good, to knowing only very basic English.

Edited December 18, 2013 by beechguy

[QROPS]

Finally, someone else who understands the irrelevance of GDP! I mentioned it twice on this thread to deaf ears it felt like..

Mentioning the GDP of Thailand makes Thailand look bad in this context.

[thailiketoo]

Can you put your Mother on because this really is like speaking to a child?

Just because the size or volume of a country's GDP is bigger doesn't mean that the economy is perfoming better.The UK,Spain and Italy all have MUCH bigger GDPs than Thailand but are their respective economies performing better?

Of course not!By percentage gains for the 1st and 2nd quarter the Philippines has outperformed Thailand's economy,this is a stone-cold fact,get it?

Save the Mother jokes for the "Yo Momma" section please.

The gross national product per person in the Philippines is $2,400 and Thailand's is $6,500. Lets say The Thai GNP grows at 1% and the Philippines grows at 5% how many years would it take for the Philippine worker to catch up with the Thai worker? 20 or 30 years. Some math guy can tell us. Come back in 20 years and the Philippines may have a comparable economy to Thailand. Until then its eggs and melons. Can't compare.

PS it is possible that my net worth rose faster than Warren Buffet this year. But. It's just too far apart to even think about meaningful comparisons.

People with college degrees from the Philippines want to work in Thailand because the Philippines is a dangerous, dirty, poor, economically backward country. People in Thailand want to work in .......... well Thailand.

Thai women don't want to leave Thailand. Doctors educated in the Philippines want to practice medicine in the US and Doctors educated in Thailand well....... want to practice medicine in Thailand.

I know you want to bash Thailand as that's what this thread is all about and Philippine people do speak much better English and so does the UK and US. So? What's new. Philippine people are native English speakers and Thai people are native Thai speakers.

You have two Financial Advisors here trying to explain to you the utter irrelevance of GDP alone but are just too stupid,arrogant and pig-headed to listen!

You claim to be a teacher and I think I can see why,you have no capacity to listen and learn from people on a subject that you know virtually nothing whatsoever about.I actually feel very sorry for your students as you are quite obviously part of the problem and certainly in no way a part of the cure!

Please refrain from posting anymore pathetic and nonsensical arguments as you are just boring everyone to death now and have severely embarrassed yourself,your family and your employer up until now!

Would you care to link or somehow connect your above post to what I wrote or the topic.

Doctors and wives leave the Philippines to work in other countries. Doctors and wives stay in Thailand to work in Thailand. The average Thai person earns 3 times what the average person in the Philippines earns.

Teachers with degrees leave the Philippines to work in Thailand for half what a Farang teacher earns but that is still twice what they can make in the Philippines if they could get a job.

And, of course the Philippines speak better English than Thailand. Philippine people are native English speakers.

[thailiketoo]

Finally, someone else who understands the irrelevance of GDP! I mentioned it twice on this thread to deaf ears it felt like..

Mentioning the GDP of Thailand makes Thailand look bad in this context.

What context? It is INTERNET courtesy to post the subject you are referring to as opposed to a vague reference to something you may or may not have posted previously.

Since the GDP is the main economic indicator used when comparing economies of countries, pray tell when it would be irrelevant?

My percent of increase of wealth was greater than Warren Buffet last year. What makes that irrelevant is our GDP's are completely different.

[QROPS]

It wasn't a vague reference at all to something I may or may not of written, it was fact. You just need to take a moment to digest what is being written by others.

Bringing up GDP is a non starter, as a comparison between Thailand and the Philippines means next to nothing in this respect. The fact of the matter is that most of either countries wealth is held by a few "Elite" families, so in turn this doesn't offer a decent representation when in both countries you will find people living below the poverty line.

You would also assume that a country with a higher GDP should be able to offer a better education system, what happened in Thailand?

The Philippines with all of it's crime, corruption, poverty and low GDP, still manages to have an educational system that teaches their pupils in the international business language of the world.

Yes there is serious levels of crime in both countries, and unless there is a paradigm shift that will always be the case.

What I find astonishing is your naivety by saying what your percentage wealth increase is compared to Warren Buffet- a man whom is 86 years old and has committed to donating 99% of his wealth to charity. With a little applied logic, one could safely assume his wealth is decreasing hence the disparity you're taking pleasure in pointing out between yours and his percentage increase.

[thailiketoo]

It wasn't a vague reference at all to something I may or may not of written, it was fact. You just need to take a moment to digest what is being written by others.

Bringing up GDP is a non starter, as a comparison between Thailand and the Philippines means next to nothing in this respect. The fact of the matter is that most of either countries wealth is held by a few "Elite" families, so in turn this doesn't offer a decent representation when in both countries you will find people living below the poverty line.

You would also assume that a country with a higher GDP should be able to offer a better education system, what happened in Thailand?

The Philippines with all of it's crime, corruption, poverty and low GDP, still manages to have an educational system that teaches their pupils in the international business language of the world.

Yes there is serious levels of crime in both countries, and unless there is a paradigm shift that will always be the case.

What I find astonishing is your naivety by saying what your percentage wealth increase is compared to Warren Buffet- a man whom is 86 years old and has committed to donating 99% of his wealth to charity. With a little applied logic, one could safely assume his wealth is decreasing hence the disparity you're taking pleasure in pointing out between yours and his percentage increase.

You wrote, "The Philippines with all of it's crime, corruption, poverty and low GDP, still manages to have an educational system that teaches their pupils in the international business language of the world."

So does the UK and USA. So what. The US, UK and Philippines are native English speakers.

Is France a backward country because it teaches French instead of English in its schools? Is Quebec a province in an English speaking country bad because its citizens don't or won't speak English?

English was forced on the Philippines because government was conducted in English for many years.

[eldragon]

other than all the reasons stated so far from this stupid question.. I just wanted to add out of my frustration just an hour or so ago at lunch. the bloody Thais sometimes are just so scared to face a foreigner they dont try comunicate at all. I had a waitress walk away from me 3 or 4 times everytime I was about to open my mouth to order and I was going to speak Thai. which I can do moderately well, certainly when ordering my lunch, only to have a note pad thrust at me 10 minute later. I only wanted Paad Thai <deleted> .

This happens to me all the time. And I'll never understand it. I also speak decent Thai.

[pinebits]

Funny reading all the debates here. I think Thailand and the Philippines doesnt even mind their own GDP's at all or which is better than the other...its like comparing apples to oranges. Thailand's economy is better than the Philippines, fact! Filipino's can speak better english than Thai's, fact! Leave it.

[eldragon]

In response to the OP, TH and PI is not really a fair comparision with regards to English. There are hosts of reasons to support that, but the main one seems to be 99% of the people in PI speak English. It's used more often in their culture, and has been for years. So it stands to reason it's easier to learn and more effective to teach.

A better question is "Why does TH- compared to the rest of the world- apparently have so many issues and difficulties regarding learning and communicating in English?" As a foreigner, I'm not sure I'll ever understand the attitude of Thais with regards to English, or foreigners as a whole. The big obstacle seems to be "don't follow the foreigners". This has reportedly been hammered into the general TH mentality for years on end. Think about it. How many times have you been trying to have an insightful conversation with an educated Thai friend about a relatively progressive idea and you're made to feel like you're weird or silly. Or, for those that teach English, how many times have to tried to correct a Thai teacher and gotten the feeling they didn't believe you.

This is not Thai bashing. I've heard it from many Thais and read about it in several publications written by Thais. I'm sure there's a few other reasons too. Face culture and the fear of making a mistake is a big one. The "sabai box" is another argument I've heard: if you have enough (skill, capital, resources, etc.) to get through today, then it's all good. The fact that TH was never colonized certainly plays a big part in things too. Or the notion that you're not supposed to question your elders. But when you're talking about people that don't want to learn anything from outsiders, it stands to reason the "international" language will not be embraced.

Another large hurdle seems to be the Thai teachers. TH really needs to find a way to improve their English communication skills. There's too many of em that would probably score lower than their best students. If it were up to me, they'd use all these native English speakers to teach the Thai teachers (and high-level students), then let them teach the Thai students.

Edited December 19, 2013 by eldragon

[QROPS]

What about the Burmese invasion of 1569 ? Wasnt "Thailand" technically a colony/vassal state of Burma for about 15 years, further were not the Khmers the orginal people of the area and the "Tai" people "invaded" from Southern China ?

[soomak]

Q: Is it that the Philippines set more budget aside for this part of education?

A: No. In the Philippines English is an official language, and is the language used for higher education, business, journalism and more.

Q. Do they hire better/more qualified foreign teachers?

A. They don't hire foreign teachers as far as I know. All teachers are local (Filipino).

Q. Does the Philippines pay better wages?

A. No, they pay less. Salaries in the Philippines are lower then THailand (although the minimum wage is about the same).

Q. Is the education system more professional and less corrupt than in Thailand?

A. Yes to both.

The level of higher education is better, and there is no corruption as far as I know in universities (at least not in the good ones)

Q. I'm just thinking out loud (so to speak) but there must be some reason for it?

A. As I wrote in the first answer, English is an official language of the Philippines.

Universities teach in English.

The most popular newspapers are in English.

Business is usually done in English.

All college educated people speak, read and write English at a reasonable level, much much higher then the Thai level.

[pinebits]

Q: Is it that the Philippines set more budget aside for this part of education?

A: No. In the Philippines English is an official language, and is the language used for higher education, business, journalism and more.

Q. Do they hire better/more qualified foreign teachers?

A. They don't hire foreign teachers as far as I know. All teachers are local (Filipino).

Q. Does the Philippines pay better wages?

A. No, they pay less. Salaries in the Philippines are lower then THailand (although the minimum wage is about the same).

Q. Is the education system more professional and less corrupt than in Thailand?

A. Yes to both.

The level of higher education is better, and there is no corruption as far as I know in universities (at least not in the good ones)

Q. I'm just thinking out loud (so to speak) but there must be some reason for it?

A. As I wrote in the first answer, English is an official language of the Philippines.

Universities teach in English.

The most popular newspapers are in English.

Business is usually done in English.

All college educated people speak, read and write English at a reasonable level, much much higher then the Thai level.

English is the medium of instructions on all levels. Elementary pupils in public schools are oblige to speak English otherwise they will be fined a peso for every word uttered in Tagalog.

[quidnunc]

Mr Panther sir one reason may be, go to google and type, "List of countries where English is an official language." Thailand is not on there, I don't think. Philippines is on there I think, Check it out,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_where_English_is_an_official_language

If you really didn't now the Philippines was a US colony and had thousands of Americans stationed at naval bases in the country for years after that.

The Philippines fought on our side during WWII and the Thais on the other side.

. Thailand had no realistic choicein the matter.. Thailand's surrender greatly mitigated the harm the Japanese would have inflicted on Thailand and gained Japan very little it wouldn't have gotten anyway had it invaded.

Edited December 19, 2013 by quidnunc

[thailiketoo]

Mr Panther sir one reason may be, go to google and type, "List of countries where English is an official language." Thailand is not on there, I don't think. Philippines is on there I think, Check it out,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_where_English_is_an_official_language

If you really didn't now the Philippines was a US colony and had thousands of Americans stationed at naval bases in the country for years after that.

The Philippines fought on our side during WWII and the Thais on the other side.

The Philippines fought on our side in the same way that Puerto Rico did. It had no choice. It was a U.S. colony It's almost like saying the state of New Jersey fought on our side during WW2. . Only after WW2 did The Phillipines gain its independence.

And it certainly didn't put up much (any) of a fight. Which was no more their fault than the Thais' siding with Japan. Thailand had no realistic choice either. Thailand's surrender greatly mitigated the harm the Japanese would have inflicted on Thailand and gained Japan very little it wouldn't have gotten anyway.

Shame, shame, shame on you. 57,000 Philippine soldiers and 1,000,000 civilians died during WWII. Not much of a fight indeed!

[quidnunc]

! Quality of the curriculum in this country is less than desirable because my daughter attends a Thai school.

So all that needs to be done is to take your daughter out of a Thai school and the quality of the curriculum will improve. Please, for the sake of Thailand, do this at once!

[quidnunc]

Out of all of the people posting, how many have actually spent any length - longer than six months -of time there?

Accents or not, the current Thai educational system cannot compete with that of the Philippines.

One of the major sectors of employment in the Philippines is call centre work. These aren't call centres for local businesses in the most part, but huge international companies use the Philippines for their call centres due to their proficiency in English.

Hmmmm. Well that explains why the Philippines is such a regional basketcase, with crime, corruption, and poverty much worse than Thailand. And it also explains why Thailand, with a population of around 30 million less, has about 40% higher GDP than the PI. Per capita GDP of Thailand is over double that of the PI. So education and English proficiency doesn't really mean much, does it?

It's such a basket case that it's economy outperformed every other country in Asia,INCLUDING THAILAND,for the first 2 quarters of this year!

Why do clueless,uniformed idiots insist on posting utter garbage on here,it's actually embarrassing how little they know!

If you were right and he was wrong would you expect Thais to go to the Philippines for work? Or people from the Philippines to come to Thailand for work? I just asking. Mexican people come to the US to work and Polish people come to the UK to work. If the Philippines economy was doing so well one would expect Thais and others from SEA to be flooding the Philippines looking for work. Are they?

actually, if you do a google search you will find that lots of middle class Filipinos are returning to the Philippines because of the improving economy. The problem is that there is still an excess of poor people largely due to the fact that until very recently, birth control was outlawed in the country.

[quidnunc]

Mr Panther sir one reason may be, go to google and type, "List of countries where English is an official language." Thailand is not on there, I don't think. Philippines is on there I think, Check it out,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_where_English_is_an_official_language

If you really didn't now the Philippines was a US colony and had thousands of Americans stationed at naval bases in the country for years after that.

The Philippines fought on our side during WWII and the Thais on the other side.

The Philippines fought on our side in the same way that Puerto Rico did. It had no choice. It was a U.S. colony It's almost like saying the state of New Jersey fought on our side during WW2. . Only after WW2 did The Phillipines gain its independence.

And it certainly didn't put up much (any) of a fight. Which was no more their fault than the Thais' siding with Japan. Thailand had no realistic choice either. Thailand's surrender greatly mitigated the harm the Japanese would have inflicted on Thailand and gained Japan very little it wouldn't have gotten anyway.

Shame, shame, shame on you. 57,000 Philippine soldiers and 1,000,000 civilians died during WWII. Not much of a fight indeed!

You're correct and I was wrong. I did edit it out of my comments before I read yours but it was already too late.

[thailiketoo]

Hmmmm. Well that explains why the Philippines is such a regional basketcase, with crime, corruption, and poverty much worse than Thailand. And it also explains why Thailand, with a population of around 30 million less, has about 40% higher GDP than the PI. Per capita GDP of Thailand is over double that of the PI. So education and English proficiency doesn't really mean much, does it?

It's such a basket case that it's economy outperformed every other country in Asia,INCLUDING THAILAND,for the first 2 quarters of this year!

Why do clueless,uniformed idiots insist on posting utter garbage on here,it's actually embarrassing how little they know!

If you were right and he was wrong would you expect Thais to go to the Philippines for work? Or people from the Philippines to come to Thailand for work? I just asking. Mexican people come to the US to work and Polish people come to the UK to work. If the Philippines economy was doing so well one would expect Thais and others from SEA to be flooding the Philippines looking for work. Are they?

actually, if you do a google search you will find that lots of middle class Filipinos are returning to the Philippines because of the improving economy. The problem is that there is still an excess of poor people largely due to the fact that until very recently, birth control was outlawed in the country.

I did, http://antipinoy.com/comparison-of-economic-well-being-jobs-and-fertility-rate-philippines-and-thailand/

Unemployment Thailand 1% Philippines 7.2%

When the Asian Financial Crisis took place in 1997 to 2000 – Thailand pursued strict fiscal and financial policies and reduced government spending – the Philippines increased government spending

While the Philippines and Thailand both pursued subsidies – Thailand also pursued Free Trade Agreements. The Philippines however maintained its economic xenophobia and limited free trade to export processing zones only.

As of 2010, the CIA reported that Thailand’s Gini coefficient (income inequality) is 42- lower than the Philippines’ 44.

1. Philippines GDP Per Capita was higher than Thailand’s GDP Per Capita from 1960 to 1984.

2. Philippines GDP Per Capita was lower than Thailand’s GDP Per Capita from 1985 upwards.

The conclusion I came to was, "the ability to speak English does not relate directly to a better economy."

Edited December 19, 2013 by thailiketoo

[pinebits]

Philippines economy was better during the time of Marcos. The president they ousted for being corrupt only to find out that the presidents after Marcos was more corrupt than him! Tsk, tsk, tsk...

[tim armstrong]

A linguist would know better than me but the Spanish connection is the key. Spanish and English have Latin as the root and as you may know its not that difficult for English speakers to learn Spanish. Whereas Thai being tonal and having very different origins fro English or Spanish is really quite difficult for English speakers to learn, and vice versa. Written Thai is a whole other topic.

[Pacificperson]

The Philippines has been a much more dangerous place for foreign investors to work, particularly for Taiwanese investors. Thailand's graft can be dealt with as a cost of doing business, but when your employee's are kidnapped and held for ransom, it makes unlikely that you will make any more investments in the country. Taiwanese money and technology went to China and other Southeast Asian countries and the Philippines shot themselves in the foot.