Thais Savage B900,000 Bride Price

[mrentoul]

Someone posted a message at a Thai webboard yesterday about the dowry (bride price) her groom, a farang, was proposing to pay.

She is getting married next month and said many people had told her that the bride price was too cheap, as she planned to live with her husband overseas and would have to leave her mother here. They have challenged her to demand more. She is not sure what to do, but the dowry price had also caused her problems at home.

She gave a breakdown of the bride price, which came to more than B900,000. Her mother, she said, was still not happy, and wanted more.

The post triggered a huge response, about 90 messages when I last looked. Most posters took her to task, suggesting her mother could think of nothing but money

and telling her not to marry the man if that was all she was interested in.

They said it sounded like she wanted to boast to her friends how much her rich farang husband had paid her, and reminded her that in the West, often the groom's family gives just a ring, and the bride's family meets the wedding expenses.

They said that in being so greedy she was making Thais look bad and that her mother seemed to be selling her daughter to meet her living expenses.

In many cases, they said, the bride's family returns the dowry, so it's not that important to demand a high price. It is not clear whether her mother plans to do that in this case!

The groom said she was getting more than the bride price, as they would be living together overseas, and that he loved her enough to marry her, which must count for something as well.

She is aware that for some farang, marriage is not so important. Often they simply choose to live together, without getting married (in which case, of course, the bride's family gets no dowry).

The bride price is broken down as follows:

Cash, B200,000

gold 65,000

diamond 295,000

On top of that, she gives expenses related to the wedding, which the groom is also meeting:

Five-star hotel, B200,000 (a bit steep!)

Making merit B30,000

Wedding photographs B50,000

Wedding dress, suit B50,000

One exception to the tide of criticism above came from someone who said her elder sister was paid B4 million, when she married a man from Norway. However, another poster said the norm for a westerner was about B30,000 baht - and some farang paid nothing at all.

The thread (in Thai) is a great read - plenty of angry, animated people! - and can be found here:

http://www.mthai.com/square/news/news60590.html

(also posted under 'how much are you paying' thread)

[elsie]

This is really interesting. Actually, I think it is not a bad deal at all. The bride's family is not paying a single baht anyway. I would pay my darling 50 THB to get down on his knee though..

Pretty curious on five-star hotel for 200,000 THB... wonder where it is... or if it really is a five-star hotel?

[Gatsby]

It is stories like this that make me love my wife and her family even more than usual. I paid "zero" baht for her. She told me flat out "I am not a phone or a pair of shoes, nobody is paying for me" Her parents agree, they think the dowry system is way outdated. The fact that I treat her well is all they need.

[Bob Chittie]

I know guys who have paid a million baht... It depends on the status of the bride's family among other things.

[mrentoul]

I would pay my darling 50 THB to get down on his knee though..

For you, I am sure he'd go down on bended knee for nothing.

[dkstoney]

The bride's family should pay the groom for taking on the extra burden.

[Khutan]

Yes; My connection finally works again, but by my sin-sod calculator, I cannot see if she has worked as a so-pa-nee or not, anh her family's historical ahsievements are not seen, so I only calculate the sin-sod to be 23, 800 Baht....

[mrentoul]

The bride's family should pay the groom for taking on the extra burden

Some westerners here are so unproductive I think it should be the other way around.

The post at the Thai website has now drawn more than 115 replies. Most still say the poster is being too greedy, but a few attempt to explain how the bride price system works.

One woman who married a westerner said she undertood where the poster was coming from. Her family also demanded a high bride price, because the man was a farang.

At first her husband did not understand why he had to pay, and said it seemed more like a sales transaction. However, he eventually accepted that this was the way it was done here. She maintained it was not such a big deal anyway - simply a way to save face.

Another poster explained this, saying the bride's parents were probably held in some social esteem and (I guess) asked for a high amount in the expectation that friends would ask them how much he paid.

However, the poster said that at the end of the wedding the bride's family could return the money, or the groom could well end up helping the bride's family in other ways: sending money to them regularly, or whatever.

A Thai friend tells me that on the matter of face, sometimes the bride's family keeps half the dowry, the idea being that they can buy the things that they did not have when their daughter was growing up. I think the idea here is that they can ''even the score'' between the families, at least in theory.

The woman who posted the message also replied. She denied she was boasting and said in fact she urged a more modest reception than her groom was prepared to provide (at the Oriental Hotel). Initially she wanted nothing from him. If she demanded a hgh price and it caused problems after they were married, then they would both have to suffer, so there was really no point.

The bride price, she said, was really about appearances, and also gave her parents confidence the couple would be happy together. If the groom complied with the wishes of the bride's family with respect to the bride price, then her parents could be confident they would be happy. She is their only daughter.

She said she was still not sure how much to ask for, and everything bar the ring was going to her mother. She just wanted her wedding next month to go smoothly.

[mrentoul]

The bridal price debate has brought out some moving posts (there are now more than 120). Several women have spoken of how their mother's demands for a high price have upset them and caused rifts within the family.

The woman who posted the original message, and who has received a scathing response, said her mother originally asked for B3 million (!), which her daughter evidently managed to negotiate downwards.

On top of that, her farang groom was going to have to meet all expenses related to the wedding. The woman, who is getting married next month, said that over time she was able to make her mother understand that demanding so much money was not going to make her happy. In fact, it led to misery. She had shed four kilogrammes of weight in one week.

She understood that her mother wanted the family to look good in other people's eyes. But she explained that the people who came to the wedding would be able to see that a Thai family and a farang family do not have the same economic status. Nothing more would have to be said. She asked her mother simply to be happy and to love her husband-to-be.

Another poster said she had also married a man from overseas, a pilot. She had tried to make him understand the Thai tradition of demanding a bridal price, but he still thought it was odd. Her father did not demand anything, but her mother wanted one million baht. She managed to persuade her to lower it a bit.

She (the daughter) felt dreadful. It wasn't going to hurt her husband, who could evidently afford it, but she didn't want him to end up feeling resentful towards her family.

Finally, another poster said she was in the process of marrying a man from overseas. Her family had not demanded anything like one million baht, but the groom was still meeting all expenses, which including wedding costs came to less than B300,000.

He didn't mind, but she helped him save the money. They decided to take the money that they could have used to show off (a high bridal price) and put it into buying a house and car, and ignore any gossip.

[ASIC]

How about farang women marrying Thai men? I once saw such a couple, so I guess it happens. Would be interesting to know how their wedding turned out.

ASIC

[mouse]

Darned where we lucky. My Thai Mother in Law asked for nothing except our happiness and even gave us a plot of land for us to build our house on. The only thing she ever asked for where false teeth and I took care of that immediately. She was a good woman and a fantastic Grandmother. We all miss her dearly.

[mouse]

http://www.mthai.com/square/news/news60590.html

I just posted my opinion on that site in English. Kind of like visiting another locker room.

[markt]

My Thai Mother in Law asked for nothing except our happiness and even gave us a plot of land for us to build our house on.

Same same here Mouse.

[mouse]

Does that mean that you married my wife's sister and are my Brother in Law?

[mouse]

here she is:

[mouse]

OOPS!! Sorry that one abovbe is already marreed. Here is the photo of the one I meant.

[mouse]

Actually I was looking at the photo when writing the last post therefore the errors.

[mouse]

Now you know why the mouse is always running. Oh by the way no dowry for this one.

[Yohan]

To pay as farang 3 or 4 million Baht in gold, diamonds and cash for a Thai girl for marriage is out of question - or you are really so rich, that money is not important anymore and you can waste it without consideration. For most foreigners and Thai such an amount is beyond any limits. - Should you be confrontated with excessive financial demands by the girl or by her family, then better leave at once and look for somebody else.

You should however try to have good connections with the parents of your Thai girl. Some contributions (better every month a little bit than a one-time payment) to the old parents is very much appreciated in Thailand.

My friend made an interesting agreement with the family of his Thai wife, offering business instead of cash money, when asked for some contribution - Thai people all like to make business, so he bought first 2 small apartments, and the Thai family are renting them to foreign tourists...(but these two apartments are still his own apartments and do not belong to the Thai family) - then the following year, he bought a convenience store, and the Thai family takes care of it (but this store is still his store and legally does not belong to the Thai family) - finally he bought a small land and constructed 10 simple cheap rooms for local Thais for rent (This is registered in the name of the Thai family, but he owns a legal paper, that this was done out of his money, so that he is the de-facto owner) - he also bought 2 cars and a taxi-operating permit. Cars and permit are in his name and again family members are running that business....very successful, his Thai wife makes the book-keeping and money is coming regularly into his (and her) account - they all share the profit out of these businesses....

The Thai family, which was very poor until the great farang appeared in their lives 10 years ago, is totally happy. - Again, if you are offering financial help to the Thai family of your wife, make it sure, that there will be something business-like in return for you - just marriage of the daughter against payment is no good solution.

Johann

[Pi Sua]

I know guys who have paid a million baht... It depends on the status of the bride's family among other things.

I know some who paid the same amount and 10 bat gold as well. Today 1 bat gold is about 7300 bahts.

They considerated his job and he has to detail how much he was earning.

The main reason he gave to me is that, his wife his graduated and has got a big amount of Chinese blood.