Redshirts meet to discuss anti-coup campaign

[ggold]

Basil B, on 07 Jan 2014 - 15:55, said:

I think that they just do not have the funds to hire "rent a mob" these days, (someone spent it on a shopping trip).

Wrong.......they already paid 500Baht for a trip to Korat.

Bangkok is between 1000 to 2000 Baht.

Haven't heard how much will be for voting yet.

I'll keep you informed.

how much for lose of life due to clashes between red and yellow shirts?

[ggold]

Redshirts Meet To Discuss Anti-Coup Campaign

Agenda:

1. Intimidate voters

2. Burn shopping malls

3. Invade hospitals

4. Use children as human shields

5.

6.

7.

8.

please add as necessary

PDRC meet 13 January to blockade Bangkok

Agenda:

1. Cause maximum disruption just for the fun of it (for them)

2. Establish elitist fascist dictatorship led by Fuehrer Suthep under the guise of "reform"

4. "Ethnically cleanse" Bangkok and all points north of red-shirt support

4. Expel all foreigners from Thailand period

5.

6.

7.

8.

Please add as necessary

Your attempt at a coparison is quite pathetic and shows you really don't know what you are talking about.

[Baerboxer]

that old avowed communist Thida still lives in her Marxist nightmare world with her ego for company and really believe that Thaksins political aims and hers are in tune with each other .

Poor misguided woman she'd be one of the first for the chop if Thaksin came to power followed by all of her and Thaksins Red Shirt pawns and cronies too.

No competition allowed under a Thaksin dictatorship.

OK so now we go from a "Thaksin Dictatorship" to a suthep dictatorship. So what is the diffence. And thida is not a commi but suthep is and has been showing it.

Do you actually understand anything about the communist ideology? Have you read Marx (not Groucho, Chico or Harpo)?

Clearly the answer must be no. Suthep may be many things, but a communist? What on earth makes you think that?

[anon467367354]

Redshirts Meet To Discuss Anti-Coup Campaign

Agenda:

1. Intimidate voters

2. Burn shopping malls

3. Invade hospitals

4. Use children as human shields

5.

6.

7.

8.

please add as necessary

First of all where are you coming up with all this hype? and second are you actually talking about suthep the murderer?

Where were you here in 2010?

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

items 1-4 are 100% accurate, I was here.

[Roadman]

I just don't understand why there is not a more academic/ethical alternative. The country is ready for

a change. But a real change not just parties saying they want change.

There is not a "more academic/ethical alternative" within Isaan and this is a huge part of the problem. The academic/ethical alternative is available within the Bangkok area as can be seen and heard by their presence and voice. Look at the political scene at its worst in the hinterland of the likes of the Udon Thani area and it is controlled by Maoist type thugs. Talk to the academic's in these areas and fear of intimidation and violence is the most common thread. It is a sad reflection when you talk to young intelligent teenagers in Isaan about changing their political scene by getting involved and you often hear 'I do not want to die'. Basically the academic's and middle class in Isaan hinterland are afraid to step anywhere near the political scene. Academics and ethics also belong to those with resources. Hard to have either when you are eeking a living from 1 rai of rice paddy. Nothing will change in Isaan until the corruption and incompetence is reigned in and basics such as education are given the long overdue attention and resources they need.

Edited January 7, 2014 by Roadman

[SamMunich]

Siampolee posted:

that old avowed communist Thida still lives in her Marxist nightmare world with her ego for company and really believe that Thaksins political aims and hers are in tune with each other .

____________________________________________________________

Where is that information from, that Khun Thida is an "old avowed communist"?

Again and again I read about certain people being blamed for being communist. Last thing was a food hawker calling all Suthep followers commies... and me too <wg>. But for real, where is this kind of information from, if not from people, who were there at that time?

And by that time I refer to a situation after 1976, roughly 40 yerars ago. A lot has happened in the meantime and people can change their oppinion as well.

What is certainly true is, that any left-leaning idea is totally in the wrong place, if among the red shirts. The farmers might be interested, but Taksin and his cronies will be the first to stomp it out. Or just have them killed "on the run".

Sam

[SamMunich]

phutoie2 wrote:

I would not be too dismissive of the Red Shirts as a fighting force, many are ex RTA, this is still the land of the conscript. Only have to look back as far as 1982 and the fighting that took place in North Phetchabun.

Sent from my i-mobile IQ 2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I would not refer to 1976 to 1982, because those fighters are too old now and they had no reason or chance to give their experience to the younger ones. I would more likely refer to the school fightings as the training ground and some soccer hooligans.

There could however be some training of guerilla warfare in red villages, but then again, training and on-hand experience are different things.

IMHO now the issue at hand is the missing payment for the rice, which hinders them to buy foodstuff and the rice for the next seeding season. Instead of 15,000 Baht per ton, they can "sell" their receipts to millers and middlemen for 7,000 Baht. Not the good business, as was anticipated. And I'm not convinced, that this supports the eagerness to fight for the government...

Sam

[JRSoul]

After they discussed the possible coup, did they go on to the actual problems facing northern Thais? You might think that late payments for rice, the inflation spiral pushing up prices, and local opposition to flood projects might warrant a mention at a convention of people's representatives. Silly me, Thaksin wouldn't like that.

[bkkfaranguy]

From the photo posted with the story, the " meeting " appears to be going very well.

Good one, Scamper. This meeting and others, they have called recently. I have yet to see THEIR millions of supporters, in one place

At least, in this picture, the people are a little easier to count and there shouldn't be hours of discussion, on how many were in this picture.

Ah, a bit of lazy thinking, Mr. kurtgruen. It is very easy for people to rally in BKK. Take a day off in Bangbon, ride the BTS, and PRESTO--instant protester number 233,567. Duh. The people up north have many serious considerations, many are more than ten hours away, and this is a busy time of year for them to feed their families. Believe me, there are millions of red shirts, and, yes, I know some of them are very dangerous, and we should all be glad they are not converging on BKK. There are radical elements on both sides, unfortunately. Men In Black is not just for the police, and never was here, and even Will Smith went that way.

The red shirts might converge on Bangkok, depending on how this plays out. This is very serious; this is people's lives and children and aspirations. Do you really think every single ballot was bought? People vote for whoever they think might help improve their life. Many in the US voted for George W Bush, including myself. And that was a BIG mistake.

I think Thais have the right to make their own mistakes.

I really do not support either side in this, even though I have a vested interest in my Thai wife and Thai daughter. I honestly believe that I am only entitled to an opinion about events and information, not people themselves, just their actions and words. I hold that Thai people should determine their own future, and that they should progress, and thrive, and prosper in their own way, in their own time. I for one am glad that foreigners cannot own land here because all the land would be bought up in less than six months by foreign elements, and we all know it.

But your lazy thinking to punt a point for whatever side you consider your side is neither funny nor intelligent nor polite. We are visitors, and Thais only pay attention to polite visitors. Sitting there at your computer, do you think Thailand is some distant country? You breathe Her air.

I do NOT think this is the endgame at all...in chess this would be 'check', not 'checkmate'. This is serious, and Thais are reading what you write. I can tell you have a brain. Please stop being lazy with it.

It is very easy for people to rally in BKK. Take a day off in Bangbon, ride the BTS, and PRESTO--instant protester number 233,567. Duh. The people up north have many serious considerations, many are more than ten hours away, and this is a busy time of year for them to feed their families. Believe me, there are millions of red shirts, and, yes, I know some of them are very dangerous, and we should all be glad they are not converging on BKK. There are radical elements on both sides, unfortunately. Men In Black is not just for the police, and never was here, and even Will Smith went

Didn't stop them coming to burn down the city in 2010 did it, lame excuse !! They are losing support, some eyes are being opened at last !!!

Actually a very well thought out and logical post, I just returned from up North and if anything there support is getting stronger. That is easy to understand, when you have one side telling them they are to stupid to vote or that their vote should not count. Don't worry if the current coup is successful they will be back!

[metisdead]

A flame post has been removed.

[noitom]

A Thai political group is planning counter military options in the event of signals that the Thai military is contemplating a coup. This would be known as sedition.

[SheungWan]

This fights we see since 2005 are not about Thaksin or Democracy. Its a internal fight about the future power from the people behind the curtain. Mostly thai-chinese. Look to the canon fudder from nort/north east and south and wake up

Its certainly about Thaksin and whether he is Punch or Judy behind the curtain (take your pick) to suggest anything other than that is naive.

[NCFC]

The Reds will not fight the next battle on the streets of Bangkok. The Rachaprasong encampment was taken out by little more than a single company of soldiers. The narrow lanes and tall buildings of a city favours army snipers. The next battle will take place on red-territory in the nort and north-east. The Army will have to mobilise More thAn just a company, they will need to use regular recruits many of whom are watermelon soldiers. The fight will take place where the Reds know the land. Where the military will stand out like a sore thumb. Where protestors will melt away into the night. The Southern insurgency is just a taste of things to come and in the north the army is up against millions. The military is well aware that in such circumstances they cannot win. Moving tanks to Bangkok prevents them from being destroyed in Baan-Nok.

It takes a bit more than a bottle of cheap whiskey and a pickup truck to wage a successful guerilla war. And in the age of night vision goggles no one "melts away into the night".

But most of all unless Thaksin opens his war chest and finances everything the reds will not move a single finger. And Thaksin is not interested in financing a civil war. When the Army mopped up the Red Fortress in Bangkok 2010 he had already set out on an expensive shopping spree on the Champs Elysees in Paris to take his mind off the fate of his "red brethren". Low intensity nuisance yes, all out war no, bad for business. And Thaksin´s sole interest is business, not the plight of some "red buffaloes". So you better not hope for Somchai Guevara.

One doesn't require night vision goggles to spot a soldier in Issan and they are worse than useless at identifying a terrorist compared to Somchai going about his nocturnal business. Any amount of high-tech gadgetry won't be worth a satang fighting the Reds on their home turf. Just check out the situation down south and magnify the problems 10-fold for the military. The army won't even be able to trust their own conscripts.

And cheap whiskey doesn't do it these days. What do you think the education programs in the Red villages are for? OTOP basket-weaving?

Somehow I don't think the army are as dismissive of Red capabilities as some of those on TV.

Let´s keep it short. There is a lot of tough talk from the red leaders. But when the army shows up like in 2010 they will be the first to raise the white flag and scream for mercy. It takes a bit more to become the leader of an armed uprising and wage a brutal civil war against your fellow countrymen. And again, if Thaksin does not fund it - and he won´t - nothing is going to happen, they will not even be able to pay the electricity bill for their reunions. And most of all it will be them who suffer most when Thailand is struck off the list of tourist destinations like Egypt.

Frankly, a population that votes for a puppet that ruins their main income - the export of rice, an arrogant millionaire who repeatedly floods their land through incompetency, an education minister who gives them a few crappy Chinese junk tablets instead of proper education and a health minister who makes sure that only those doctors work upcountry that have no chance to work elsewhere by cutting their wages and paying them per patient, etc. etc., won´t endure the hardships of a guerilla war.

The main driving force for the Southern terrorists is a radical religious ideology and a hate against infidels, what do the people in the North have? They voted for the highest bidder and think a corrupt billionaire is the Messiah. They already see that they are being [expletive] and that the promised"ample riches" were never meant for them. You think that is a solid base for fighting?

I have worked as peacekeeper in various countries recovering from vicious civil wars. You apparently have no idea what you wish for.

Based on your experience as a post civil war peacekeeper and with all my sincerity, how will this latest "class" divide play out if not through a civil war?

You ask what the Reds have to fight for? The answer is that they see they have everything to lose. I'm not sure reading a lot of TV whether many posters understand what is going on in Issan. Under Thaksin and his various proxy governments a large proportion of the north and north-east have risen above the poverty line. Issan has been the fastest growing region economically over the past few years. Big investment is taking place there.

Since a number of years Red villagers have been politically educated. The middle class Bangkok-centric beurocracy did nothing for Issan except create a vacuum for UDD to exploit. After May 2010 Abhisit could built bridges of reconciliation to the people but in his usual incompetent style he did nothing.

And now Suthep and billionaire heiresses plan to disenfranchise these people in some form or other. To return them to a self-sufficiency model of serfdom. Well sorry but it is too late for that. The people don't buy that product anymore.

The Reds won't return to Bangkok. It's Suthep's battleground now. Notice how he divides his protest into small scattered groups. He is not making the Red mistake of allowing his terrorists to be surrounded en masse. He will go for guerrilla tactics - cut and run. In a City like BKK small acts of vandalism can have a big impact .

The Red war will take place in the countryside where the army will be thinly spread and conscript soldiers will not fire on their kinsmen. The army knows that in such a situation they will lose.