Reform should also aim for a just society: Thai editorial

[webfact]

EDITORIAL
Reform should also aim for a just society
The Nation

It's time to bring an end to the era of "one law for the rich and one law for the poor"

BANGKOK: -- The picture is a familiar one: People have once again taken to the streets in the belief they are being unfairly treated. They complain of double standards and unfair laws designed to benefit certain groups of people.

This kind of problem is not new to Thailand. Wealthy and powerful lawbreakers are often able to escape punishment. Meanwhile we hear reports of poverty-stricken mothers sent to jail for stealing food for their infants.

Even after being found guilty in court, wealthy lawbreakers have managed to escape the hand of the law by fleeing overseas. We have witnessed rich politicians leave the country shortly before being sentenced for crimes involving corruption. Some have had the gall to claim they were the victims of political bias in the courts, despite having used the same courts to launch legal action against their political enemies. Miscreant politicians have also been accused of attempting to influence or even bribe court officials.

Now, years of accumulated anger at such perceived injustice has finally bubbled over and sent citizens onto the streets. The protesters are fed up with "one law for the rich and another law for the poor". Among them are many who have suffered at the hands of state officials or other authorities simply because they refuse to pay bribes or kickbacks. These citizens have diagnosed a worsening corruption problem in Thai bureaucracy and politics and are refusing to tolerate it any longer.

Their call for change is justified and credible. Thailand is crying out for a more just society in which the law is fairly enforced. People who break the law, regardless of their status, must be prosecuted. Politicians who help themselves to taxpayers' money or use public office for private gain deserve more severe punishment than that handed out to mothers who steal to feed their babies.

In addition to fair and efficient law enforcement, we also need to ensure that our laws are designed to be fair and to benefit all from the beginning. Lawmakers must be held to account so that new laws issued by the legislature are designed to benefit the whole country, and not certain groups of people. There must be no more attempts to issue laws like the controversial amnesty bill. Public outrage over the proposed amnesty, which would have absolved politicians convicted of corruption and serious crimes linked with political conflicts since 2004, brought crowds of protesters onto the streets. Lawmakers should instead be held to their duty of supporting draft legislation that would promote social justice, such as proposals for higher taxes on wealthy landowners and inheritances.

A more transparent and just society in which everyone is equal under the law might still be an elusive goal for Thailand. But we should at least aim for it. Efforts toward reform would be a first step in this direction.

-- The Nation 2014-01-16

[Nowhereman60]

They must be talking about Suthep here. He belongs to this wealthy corrupt group also.

[Thai at Heart]

They took 70 odd years to realise that this might be an issue.

If it was a family member of the owner of the nation who was driving a Ferrari at 180kmh down Sukhumvit I wonder what the opinion would be.

[englishoak]

It's time to bring an end to the era of "one law for the rich and one law for the poor"

that'll be the day, mind you I hear Dubai still has a lot of empty hotel rooms so there is hope. Start with getting Red Bulls kid back by employing an international bounty hunter and Taksin, follow it up with some yellows, some judges, lots of police loads of the army, some navy drug dealers one or two massage sex parlour owners and a load more politicians on all fronts.

If they actually wanted to do it they could but it would ruin a lot of the rich elite families so itll never happen. Nice dream tho

[NongKhaiKid]

Once again we read it's time for this that and the other to change.

It's been time for generations but has never even looked like happening and the way this country is set up I doubt it ever will but it always fills up column inches for op ed authors, if nothing else.

[Thai at Heart]

I fancy a trial by jury.

It's so................

Democratic

[poisonus]

This is exactly what I am hoping for with reforms. The justice system is a scam.

I also think that they should go back over past cases and see who in this country has been handed prison sentences and not actually served in prison. Then gather them all up and put them away to serve their time regardless of how much they have paid to stay out.

Also appeals should be handled swiftly and done while the sentenced felon is behind bars as is the case in almost all countries.... Once you are sentenced you are locked up and no amount of money can release you.

[Cricketnut]

The response to the current situation in Thailand at the moment demonstrates that the state has the important role to play in addressing critical challenges as public institutions must have the capacity to address these difficulties while at the same time delivering the benefits of human development. In response to these demands, the PTP and all parties should be focusing on enhancing the capacity of the state to make it more responsive, capable, and answerable. By fostering inclusive participation and promoting responsive institutions, underpinned by international agreed gender, human rights and anti-corruption principles maybe then Thailand can start on a true road to democracy. The Democratic way also has its flaws and can the average Thai bear these ramifications without taking the rule of law per say into their own hands. They need to start with an ideology that appeals and stands for all the people first and foremost. Get rid of government ties to the military and police straight away. Have each minister be a real public servant who has the power to really call the shots for all the peoples interests and enforce the rule of law and a status quo. This Thais are not very good at... Can the elite of Bangkok have a person from let's say Issan as the minister for trade and commerce? Most likely not. One of the main problems with Thailand and like it or lump it, but evidently their is a caste system in place throughout the populace and I don't think they even are aware of this. It heralds back from the breaking away from Hinduism to Buddhism and this too needs to be realised and acknowledged. When the Thai people can deal with this implement these notions and live with them is another topic and where do we start? Sutheps people council sounds great but in reality it will only foster further problems. The reform must come from all sides in styling democracy including the minority and consistency must be maintained, not just through the judicial process but right through the entire system. Until Thailand and its people enforce this upon a government voted in for the people and by the people this will never happen. Until you raise your voices so high that the glass breaks the deadlock remains. Until the entire Military,Police and Justice systems remain in the hands of the powerful elite and not a civil servants acting as Ministers who have the power to reign in and administer real reform can this happen as there is no real accountability. Come up with reform have all the different segments of society represented fairly and your on your way. As long as the feudal and clannish nepotism remains there will be little hope. Thailand does need to look at countries such as New Zealand, Australia, Switzerland and other relatively stable nations as a possible vehicle to emulate. Is this palatable to the average Thai? Probably not..As Thailand see themselves as to proud collectively as a people. Case in point, only ASEAN nation never to have been colonised. So sorry we know better then you Malaysia, Singapore etc. Is it possible that they would have been? Leave that one for another topic. All I do know is Thailand needs to grow up real quick in doing its reform and not raising it as a page filler in The Nation or The Bangkok Post your wasting your time in doing so in fact start reporting the Truth and there is your baby step into the land of democracy. But I guess that is wishful thinking too.....

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Nowhereman60]

The response to the current situation in Thailand at the moment demonstrates that the state has the important role to play in addressing critical challenges as public institutions must have the capacity to address these difficulties while at the same time delivering the benefits of human development. In response to these demands, the PTP and all parties should be focusing on enhancing the capacity of the state to make it more responsive, capable, and answerable. By fostering inclusive participation and promoting responsive institutions, underpinned by international agreed gender, human rights and anti-corruption principles maybe then Thailand can start on a true road to democracy. The Democratic way also has its flaws and can the average Thai bear these ramifications without taking the rule of law per say into their own hands. They need to start with an ideology that appeals and stands for all the people first and foremost. Get rid of government ties to the military and police straight away. Have each minister be a real public servant who has the power to really call the shots for all the peoples interests and enforce the rule of law and a status quo. This Thais are not very good at... Can the elite of Bangkok have a person from let's say Issan as the minister for trade and commerce? Most likely not. One of the main problems with Thailand and like it or lump it, but evidently their is a caste system in place throughout the populace and I don't think they even are aware of this. It heralds back from the breaking away from Hinduism to Buddhism and this too needs to be realised and acknowledged. When the Thai people can deal with this implement these notions and live with them is another topic and where do we start? Sutheps people council sounds great but in reality it will only foster further problems. The reform must come from all sides in styling democracy including the minority and consistency must be maintained, not just through the judicial process but right through the entire system. Until Thailand and its people enforce this upon a government voted in for the people and by the people this will never happen. Until you raise your voices so high that the glass breaks the deadlock remains. Until the entire Military,Police and Justice systems remain in the hands of the powerful elite and not a civil servants acting as Ministers who have the power to reign in and administer real reform can this happen as there is no real accountability. Come up with reform have all the different segments of society represented fairly and your on your way. As long as the feudal and clannish nepotism remains there will be little hope. Thailand does need to look at countries such as New Zealand, Australia, Switzerland and other relatively stable nations as a possible vehicle to emulate. Is this palatable to the average Thai? Probably not..As Thailand see themselves as to proud collectively as a people. Case in point, only ASEAN nation never to have been colonised. So sorry we know better then you Malaysia, Singapore etc. Is it possible that they would have been? Leave that one for another topic. All I do know is Thailand needs to grow up real quick in doing its reform and not raising it as a page filler in The Nation or The Bangkok Post your wasting your time in doing so in fact start reporting the Truth and there is your baby step into the land of democracy. But I guess that is wishful thinking too..... Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You typed all that crap on a phone? damn, now that crazy, lots of spare time I guess waiting for the bus.

[Cricketnut]

The response to the current situation in Thailand at the moment demonstrates that the state has the important role to play in addressing critical challenges as public institutions must have the capacity to address these difficulties while at the same time delivering the benefits of human development. In response to these demands, the PTP and all parties should be focusing on enhancing the capacity of the state to make it more responsive, capable, and answerable. By fostering inclusive participation and promoting responsive institutions, underpinned by international agreed gender, human rights and anti-corruption principles maybe then Thailand can start on a true road to democracy. The Democratic way also has its flaws and can the average Thai bear these ramifications without taking the rule of law per say into their own hands. They need to start with an ideology that appeals and stands for all the people first and foremost. Get rid of government ties to the military and police straight away. Have each minister be a real public servant who has the power to really call the shots for all the peoples interests and enforce the rule of law and a status quo. This Thais are not very good at... Can the elite of Bangkok have a person from let's say Issan as the minister for trade and commerce? Most likely not. One of the main problems with Thailand and like it or lump it, but evidently their is a caste system in place throughout the populace and I don't think they even are aware of this. It heralds back from the breaking away from Hinduism to Buddhism and this too needs to be realised and acknowledged. When the Thai people can deal with this implement these notions and live with them is another topic and where do we start? Sutheps people council sounds great but in reality it will only foster further problems. The reform must come from all sides in styling democracy including the minority and consistency must be maintained, not just through the judicial process but right through the entire system. Until Thailand and its people enforce this upon a government voted in for the people and by the people this will never happen. Until you raise your voices so high that the glass breaks the deadlock remains. Until the entire Military,Police and Justice systems remain in the hands of the powerful elite and not a civil servants acting as Ministers who have the power to reign in and administer real reform can this happen as there is no real accountability. Come up with reform have all the different segments of society represented fairly and your on your way. As long as the feudal and clannish nepotism remains there will be little hope. Thailand does need to look at countries such as New Zealand, Australia, Switzerland and other relatively stable nations as a possible vehicle to emulate. Is this palatable to the average Thai? Probably not..As Thailand see themselves as to proud collectively as a people. Case in point, only ASEAN nation never to have been colonised. So sorry we know better then you Malaysia, Singapore etc. Is it possible that they would have been? Leave that one for another topic. All I do know is Thailand needs to grow up real quick in doing its reform and not raising it as a page filler in The Nation or The Bangkok Post your wasting your time in doing so in fact start reporting the Truth and there is your baby step into the land of democracy. But I guess that is wishful thinking too..... Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You typed all that crap on a phone? dam_n, now that crazy, lots of spare time I guess waiting for the bus.

I wish, babysitting lol and in my home that is a real state of democracy!

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[kurnell]

All these people protesting against a corrupt system are still paying cops bribes, buying fake goods, handing over tea money etc. Thais want whatever benefits them personally.

[spare5]

Justice for the poor or the rich?

[DocN]

Mouthpieces and talking points!

I think it was that infamous Dr. Seri who basically said "corruption is okay, if it is not THEIR corruption..."

Fight against corruption, for democracy and a just society, my backside!

[tomyummer]

Good luck trying to change this part of the culture. This sandbox fight is still about 'who gets to rule the box' while all the rest of the Thai population aren't even allowed into the playground. This will always be the case. When the Thais truly realize that both bullies need to disappear then only then can the country move on.

[englishoak]

This is exactly what I am hoping for with reforms. The justice system is a scam.

I also think that they should go back over past cases and see who in this country has been handed prison sentences and not actually served in prison. Then gather them all up and put them away to serve their time regardless of how much they have paid to stay out.

Also appeals should be handled swiftly and done while the sentenced felon is behind bars as is the case in almost all countries.... Once you are sentenced you are locked up and no amount of money can release you.

we are going to .............. agree

My country is currently locking up and prosecuting quite a lot of people for criminal acts as far back as the 1960s there is no time limit for bringing criminals to justice and that includes some very prominent celebrities in their 80s

Your right, to clean house it must be brutal, merciless and incorruptible The only time I would advocate a dictatorship would be if there was one who was such a person who would see such a thing through but they would have to be beyond doubt and a proven honest track record. Then once done hand it all back to the people. btw Suthep would be in the cell right next to TS just to drive them both nuts

youd also have to build dozens if not hundreds of new prisons to house them all i suspect by the time it was done.

[icommunity]

Whatever reform we are talking about, we still need the input of lawmakers, and a government. Yet, the DEM and its PDRC etc, while shouting for reforms, boycotted the election. They wanted reforms before election and refused every suggestion of reform from the government. Which means they wanted it their way and from people nominated by them, not the people. Whatever reform they are talking about has no credibility, legally illegitimate. The DEM has lost its legitimacy to be a political party because their activities through their PDRC etc are not democratic - they seized government buildings, issuing threats of various kinds and forced workers out of their office to join them etc. They want to bypass electoral, parliamentary and judicial process.

The government has exercised restraint, patience, leniency, compassion, tolerance even when it faces many baseless accusations and the many plots to seize power. It is good that the law enforcement agencies followed the orders and instructions of this government in reaching out to the protesters whom I believe many were misled, misguided, threatened and intimidated to be 'protesters.' This is not seen in any previous governments. This government has also shown the world of its open democracy.

I believe, any incident of violence will not be created by the third party but the party who wanted to see clashes and bloodshed so that they can seize power.

[noitom]

A law and order and fair representation and justice for all editorial stating "it's about time." My lord, where has the Thai press been and what rock have they been under for the past 80 years?

[tingtongteesood]

They must be talking about Suthep here. He belongs to this wealthy corrupt group also.

Deluded red addled fool, they are clearly talking about your dearly beloved fugitive leader hiding out in Dubai.... N

Not to mention the millionaire monk, the red bull heir, the young girl who knocked the van off the expressway among I am sure many many others....They aren't even close to being as contemptuous as the fugitive though...

[tingtongteesood]

Whatever reform we are talking about, we still need the input of lawmakers, and a government. Yet, the DEM and its PDRC etc, while shouting for reforms, boycotted the election. They wanted reforms before election and refused every suggestion of reform from the government. Which means they wanted it their way and from people nominated by them, not the people. Whatever reform they are talking about has no credibility, legally illegitimate. The DEM has lost its legitimacy to be a political party because their activities through their PDRC etc are not democratic - they seized government buildings, issuing threats of various kinds and forced workers out of their office to join them etc. They want to bypass electoral, parliamentary and judicial process.

The government has exercised restraint, patience, leniency, compassion, tolerance even when it faces many baseless accusations and the many plots to seize power. It is good that the law enforcement agencies followed the orders and instructions of this government in reaching out to the protesters whom I believe many were misled, misguided, threatened and intimidated to be 'protesters.' This is not seen in any previous governments. This government has also shown the world of its open democracy.

I believe, any incident of violence will not be created by the third party but the party who wanted to see clashes and bloodshed so that they can seize power.

I am going to counter your ridiculously biased post with some of my own bias to level things out a little....

Why should the PDRC accept the PT version of reforms - their idea of reforms is amnestying the fugitive and all other criminals in their ranks. This is no reform, this is truly ridiculous much as your post is. Attacking protestors in the middle of the night hardly counts as 'restraint, patience, leniency, compassion, or tolerance' in my opinion. And the only reasons there is no 'crackdown' as in 2010 is that the army has refused the government that heavily criticized them for their action in 2010, partly because they don't want to come in for more criticism and partly because 99.999999% of the protestors are peaceful and have a right to protest, and also that Yingluck doesn't want to be brought up on murder charges as her fugitive convicted criminal brother has made sure has happened to Abhisit and Suteb.

Most of the 'baseless accusations' I have seen recently have come from the government and been aimed at the protestors for example 'those bad police who smashed up the poor innocent woman's car were obviously protestors in stolen uniforms' - just one of many !

You believe the protestors were 'misled, misguided, threatened and intimidated to be protesters' - I could say the exact same thing about red shirt voters. Many are intimidated by being stuck in the 'red shirt villages', they are certainly 'threatened' and 'intimidated' that they must vote red for sure. They have no choice but to send their kids to 'red schools' where they are brainwashed and indoctrinated. And those who read the red magazines and watch the red tv shows are seriously 'misguided' and 'misled' by the propaganda and outright lies on them.

Most of the violence ( ie the cowardly hit and run night attacks ) is probably orchestrated by Taksin directly, or indirectly by some cronies. The only ones who want to see bloodshed are the ex PT government as it delegitimizes the protest movement. NOI the protestors do not want a coup, they do not want violence to try and make a coup. They want the government to step down of their own accord. Yingluck wants to, the evil fugitive in Dubai threatened her with criminal charges if she did, his own sister ! He doesn't want his private ATM ( Thailand ) taken away from him. Not that he doesn't have enough money for 10 lifetimes - much of which stolen from the Thai people - already.

There, now we have some balance.....

[maxme]

They must be talking about Suthep here. He belongs to this wealthy corrupt group also.

Deluded red addled fool, they are clearly talking about your dearly beloved fugitive leader hiding out in Dubai.... N

Not to mention the millionaire monk, the red bull heir, the young girl who knocked the van off the expressway among I am sure many many others....They aren't even close to being as contemptuous as the fugitive though...

There has surely bene many of these numbnuts popping in. I wonder what indoctrination camp they originated from. Ting tong, which you really are... have you ever considered that just because you don´t like one side that it doesn't mean you like the other one either? Christ

[HKChris]

Whatever reform we are talking about, we still need the input of lawmakers, and a government. Yet, the DEM and its PDRC etc, while shouting for reforms, boycotted the election. They wanted reforms before election and refused every suggestion of reform from the government. Which means they wanted it their way and from people nominated by them, not the people. Whatever reform they are talking about has no credibility, legally illegitimate. The DEM has lost its legitimacy to be a political party because their activities through their PDRC etc are not democratic - they seized government buildings, issuing threats of various kinds and forced workers out of their office to join them etc. They want to bypass electoral, parliamentary and judicial process.

The government has exercised restraint, patience, leniency, compassion, tolerance even when it faces many baseless accusations and the many plots to seize power. It is good that the law enforcement agencies followed the orders and instructions of this government in reaching out to the protesters whom I believe many were misled, misguided, threatened and intimidated to be 'protesters.' This is not seen in any previous governments. This government has also shown the world of its open democracy.

I believe, any incident of violence will not be created by the third party but the party who wanted to see clashes and bloodshed so that they can seize power.

I am going to counter your ridiculously biased post with some of my own bias to level things out a little....

Why should the PDRC accept the PT version of reforms - their idea of reforms is amnestying the fugitive and all other criminals in their ranks. This is no reform, this is truly ridiculous much as your post is. Attacking protestors in the middle of the night hardly counts as 'restraint, patience, leniency, compassion, or tolerance' in my opinion. And the only reasons there is no 'crackdown' as in 2010 is that the army has refused the government that heavily criticized them for their action in 2010, partly because they don't want to come in for more criticism and partly because 99.999999% of the protestors are peaceful and have a right to protest, and also that Yingluck doesn't want to be brought up on murder charges as her fugitive convicted criminal brother has made sure has happened to Abhisit and Suteb.

Most of the 'baseless accusations' I have seen recently have come from the government and been aimed at the protestors for example 'those bad police who smashed up the poor innocent woman's car were obviously protestors in stolen uniforms' - just one of many !

You believe the protestors were 'misled, misguided, threatened and intimidated to be protesters' - I could say the exact same thing about red shirt voters. Many are intimidated by being stuck in the 'red shirt villages', they are certainly 'threatened' and 'intimidated' that they must vote red for sure. They have no choice but to send their kids to 'red schools' where they are brainwashed and indoctrinated. And those who read the red magazines and watch the red tv shows are seriously 'misguided' and 'misled' by the propaganda and outright lies on them.

Most of the violence ( ie the cowardly hit and run night attacks ) is probably orchestrated by Taksin directly, or indirectly by some cronies. The only ones who want to see bloodshed are the ex PT government as it delegitimizes the protest movement. NOI the protestors do not want a coup, they do not want violence to try and make a coup. They want the government to step down of their own accord. Yingluck wants to, the evil fugitive in Dubai threatened her with criminal charges if she did, his own sister ! He doesn't want his private ATM ( Thailand ) taken away from him. Not that he doesn't have enough money for 10 lifetimes - much of which stolen from the Thai people - already.

There, now we have some balance.....

I hope you feel better now Tingtong.....but it really doesn't help. Picking up icommunity's point, I think most are in agreement that political reforms are required, but what we have not seen yet is what reforms the PDRC have in mind. Perhaps they are all honorable and good - fine, but what are they? Its pointless having something saying "we're going to get rid of corruption" - that's a cultural reform and will take generations. So why can't the PDRC sit down with other interested parties (representatives from all elected parties currently represented in Parliament) and thrash out a set of achievable reforms - present them to the Thai people and vote for them. This will also take some time....so who runs the country in the meantime? Certainly not a bunch of Suthep's mates who have not been subject to voters scrutiny, who feel that its their turn at the trough and will stay there until they've had their fill. The current Govt must remain as the democratically elected body who have the responsibility for the day-to-day running of the country, its ministries, and law enforcement. Once a new set of reforms have been determined and agreed, then have an election under the new reform rules.

I do not condone in any way the tactics of TS and believe he is so divisive that it is preventing electoral progress. I also don't condone the clearly fascist strategies Suthep is employing - little do his followers realize the outcomes should he ever gain the power he is seeking. The Amnesty Bill was a very messy attempt at sweeping 'all ills' under the table and 'starting again' - lets hope it doesn't re-appear. What we need is a Thai Nelson Mandela and a Thai "Truth and Reconciliation" commission to put the past behind us and move forward. Unfortunately, in this current environment, we are a long way from that.

[cup-O-coffee]

It's time to bring an end to the era of "one law for the rich and one law for the poor"

When Thais put things in perspective, it simply gets thicker.

I am convinced their only love is for money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Law = money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Truth = money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Honesty = money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Justice = money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Being offended is all about = money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Doing the right thing comes after money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Being responsible, accountable, self-disciplined comes after money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Consideration, compassion, gallantry, honor, chivalry, morals, ethics, etc. is usually all about money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Recognition, credibility, sincerity, genuineness, originality is usually all about money, FACE or both. Nothing more. Nothing less.

...and so it goes; on and on and never ending ad-nauseum.

Only their words belie that which I am convinced of; that they are not capable of systematically and consistently working together to develop the means and methods to attain any goal other than total corruption, decay and destruction of any opportunity or substance to make their lives more worthwhile and full of well-being.

BANGKOK: -- The picture is a familiar one: People have once again taken to the streets in the belief they are being unfairly treated. They complain of double standards and unfair laws designed to benefit certain groups of people.

Yes. The picture is a familiar one, but only a lunatic would stubbornly see it that way after a couple thousand years. How about, "The picture is beginning to resemble a bunch of fools yelling at each other and no one ever gets anything accomplished, because the fools on all sides (ALL SIDES!) have nothing to contribute. It's all take and no give; it's not my fault, it's your fault; I don't have to say 'Sorry", but you do!"

"The People" you say? I ask, "What do they do with what they have got? How do they behave with the liberties and luxuries that they manage to have and hold and use on a daily basis.

"The People" you say? The ones who get to be the leaders in all areas and casts of this culture, from the lowest right up to the brink of political are no less guilty of the very ones whom "The People" whine about at this very moment in Bangkok.

"The People" you say? The ones who get to be the mothers and fathers and sons and daughters are no less guilty of the very ones whom "The People" whine about at this very moment in Bangkok.

"They complain of double standards and unfair laws designed to benefit certain groups of people."

What utter <deleted>. "The People" need to look in their own back yards and choke back their lies and and exaggerated deceptions when trying to explain how they are any different than the very ones whom "The People" whine about at this very moment in Bangkok.

It's not so much the bad things that happen and the bad things that "The People" do to each other. It's really more about the apathy and avoidance which they demonstrate towards their own dark natures when they are acting like utter lunatics with even the most basic daily routines.

Double standards!!! Unfair laws!!! You have got to be utterly joking. I thought you were talking about the general society, and I do not mean the way they treat the foreigner. What standards? What laws? They seem to make things up as they go along, and sort out the mess by any means or methods at their immediate resource; ...and without absolutely any consideration or foresight given beforehand (There is no emergency or crisis in Thailand until it happens).

Park anywhere you want. Drive any way you want. Don't bother getting a license for anything. Don't bother thinking about the consequences of your actions, just give in to your childish, knee-jerk emotions and do it. Don't "see" others around you. Just let yourself or your children do anything you all want to do, and to hell with them. Just do it. Don't bother having demonstrations at City Hall, The local Police Station, The School Directors Office because they are stealing your money and giving nothing in return. Don't bother minding your children. After all, its not their fault; and neither is it your fault. Don't bother turning off the dam_n Soaps, YouTube, Twitter, Facebook, SMS and all that other pap <deleted> and instead reading a newspaper or a book. Don't bother putting a little aside instead of spending it on lottery tickets, booze, drugs, worthless religions, witch doctors, shamans, charmers, etc, because you never know. You just never know.

No. Instead, let's all just act like a bunch of indignant and outraged, sensible and reasonable "people" who have set a standard that any other country would turn green with envy, and let's march on Bangkok and demand a "just society"! Let's "bother" to demand that pigs fly out of people's <deleted>.

In summary, it seems that there cannot be any "reform" simply because the "form" which exists is simply and plainly following the evolutionary "function" of what "is"; ...and what "is" has absolutely nothing to do with what is being uttered. What "is" is really a cacophony of chaos, lunacy, hypocrisy, irony and the lot. There is no "form" to "re-form" simply because what is mistaken for a "form" is really a swirling mass of raw sewage that keeps getting stirred. The only purpose of any "function" is to keep things "dis-functional".

About the only thing this article has going for it is it's "off-the-mark" suggestion that this is all familiar. But the remainder of the article is about as productive as a Thai bus driver, who sees a familiar curve in the road, yet speeds into it anyways.

Might as well also blame the government for curves in roads.

[climbertrev1]

All these people protesting against a corrupt system are still paying cops bribes, buying fake goods, handing over tea money etc. Thais want whatever benefits them personally.

You are right about this. Until people stop trying to take advantage of the system through bribery the problem will continue. This problem is not limited to Thailand though. Even the USA with a so called mature democracy is now totally corrupted by the power of the lobby. The rich and powerful will exert influence if the system allows it. Laws need to be framed and enforced to prevent this happening.

I have met several Farangs in Thailand who like the fact that you can bribe your way out of problems like drunk driving etc. This is similar to why Thais don't make more of a stand against corruption. This is why wealthy Thais can continue to kill people with impunity.

In Pattaya the corrupt practice, the authorities claim has been stamped out, happens on a daily basis. The famous Jet Ski scam. This still happens every afternoon with the full connivance, corruption and enrichment of the police. There is no real will to deal with these problems. Until there is the will it will continue.

[englishoak]

Oh wow cup O coffee just wow

the first part about money and face i cant say i agree with, there is more to it far more but................. the rest im afraid to say is spot on.

Thais do generally live moment to moment and all that matters is only the now, never tomorrow, its never considered. This in part is a Buddhist flaw as it teaches mindfulness for the now as that is all there is, nothing else exists until it is the now, so no point thinking about it, it merely distracts.

Take mindfulness in the now and slip it into every day life here and thats Thailand. the missing part unfortunately is mindfulness, they have forgotten that part.

[cup-O-coffee]

Oh wow cup O coffee just wow

the first part about money and face i cant say i agree with, there is more to it far more but................. the rest im afraid to say is spot on.

Thais do generally live moment to moment and all that matters is only the now, never tomorrow, its never considered. This in part is a Buddhist flaw as it teaches mindfulness for the now as that is all there is, nothing else exists until it is the now, so no point thinking about it, it merely distracts.

Take mindfulness in the now and slip it into every day life here and thats Thailand. the missing part unfortunately is mindfulness, they have forgotten that part.

Any government is merely the fruit which a tree bears. Any tree is only worth its roots, and its ability to tap into life sustaining ideals. No life sustaining ideals - no fruit - simply a bunch of leaves.

I try not to blame governments for anything that the people themselves give birth to and then ignorantly claim that they were tricked. The Thai people demonstrating is wrong on so many levels that this charade in Bangkok has me beggared. Show me even one Thai community which does not resemble the mess in the most highest offices of Parliament.

I thought so!

Thais only seem to behave collectively as one when it comes to avoidance and apathy. Regrettably, it is this unconscious union that is their continual downfall, because the beauty of it being awakened into their consciousness is continuously being drowned out by the more base and selfish, conscious tendencies.

As long as they continue to deceive themselves into thinking that some of the leaves on the tree are actually fruit, and not simply leaves like the rest of them, then they will continue to think that they are a fruit tree, and not merely a leaf bearing tree; which is exactly what they are. That is why this demonstration is a charade and a rather good definition of sheer hypocrisy, irony and lunacy.

Edited January 16, 2014 by cup-O-coffee

[Scamper]

People don't know just how close to the brink this country was when the amnesty bill was passed by the lower house. The presumption - certainly Thaksin's - is that opposition to him and disgust of the bill would simply dry up, that the Senate was sure to rubber stamp it, and that he would be on his way. That's how close it came. For at least a couple of weeks - after the bill was introduced on October 13. It seemed as if he was right. But then it turned out that not only was he wrong, but he was wrong with an intensity and reach and scale in the country that took even the protest movement by surprise. Something had been tapped - an outrage - long, long buried. And the people had finally had it. They also discovered that not only could they say no, but have come to realize that they can actually be the instruments of change, as well they can.

Edited January 16, 2014 by Scamper

[xminator]

It's time to bring an end to the era of "one law for the rich and one law for the poor"

that'll be the day, mind you I hear Dubai still has a lot of empty hotel rooms so there is hope. Start with getting Red Bulls kid back by employing an international bounty hunter and Taksin, follow it up with some yellows, some judges, lots of police loads of the army, some navy drug dealers one or two massage sex parlour owners and a load more politicians on all fronts.

If they actually wanted to do it they could but it would ruin a lot of the rich elite families so itll never happen. Nice dream tho

The courts will rule such a change to be unconstitutional. And its most certainly not a quote from Sutheps gospels...

[cup-O-coffee]

People don't know just how close to the brink this country was when the amnesty bill was passed by the lower house. The presumption - certainly Thaksin's - is that opposition to him and disgust of the bill would simply dry up, that the Senate was sure to rubber stamp it, and that he would be on his way. That's how close it came. For at least a couple of weeks - after the bill was introduced on October 13. It seemed as if he was right. But then it turned out that not only was he wrong, but he was wrong with an intensity and reach and scale in the country that took even the protest movement by surprise. Something had been tapped - an outrage - long, long buried. And the people had finally had it. They also discovered that not only could they say no, but have come to realize that they can actually be the instruments of change, as well they can.

Every single day, these demonstrators give amnesty to their police, lawyers, judges, teachers, school directors, juvenile delinquents, youth gangs, scofflaws, the mafia, drug dealers, flea-bitten feral mutts, sordid monks, political representatives, mayors, bus and minivan drivers, school bus drivers, dead-beat adult and teenage dads, rapists, pedophiles, murderers, thieves, bullies, scammers, and so on and so on and so on.

But the real laugher here is that every single day, these demonstrators grant themselves amnesty. They grant themselves amnesty on all levels. Every day... every time... every way. They are faultless.

Yes; they have certainly realized what any lunatic realizes; that if you dig deep enough you can almost always tap in to some twisted kind of reasoning which justifies the method and means towards avoidance and apathy at your everyday life, and rather instead go after a bunch of your glorified fellow citizens in Bangkok.

It's a tree that grows beautiful poisonous apples. Every year the tree sheds the apples and the tree generates new poisonous apples in their place. But let's blame the apples and not the tree which produces those poisonous apples, yeah? Let's hope that the tree can hate the apples and reform itself and grow nice, delicious, non-poisonous apples the next time. In Thailand, anything is possible. Water flows uphill.

That's what is happening here, isn't it; spite the fruit and spare the tree?

[tingtongteesood]

They must be talking about Suthep here. He belongs to this wealthy corrupt group also.

Deluded red addled fool, they are clearly talking about your dearly beloved fugitive leader hiding out in Dubai.... N

Not to mention the millionaire monk, the red bull heir, the young girl who knocked the van off the expressway among I am sure many many others....They aren't even close to being as contemptuous as the fugitive though...

There has surely bene many of these numbnuts popping in. I wonder what indoctrination camp they originated from. Ting tong, which you really are... have you ever considered that just because you don´t like one side that it doesn't mean you like the other one either? Christ

Actually I am far from crazy. I can't understand why people continue to try and defend the government of criminals headed by a criminal who isn't even allowed in the country. It's sheer insanity !! They are the crazy ones. When you continually criticize one side and praise the other, that is bias is it not ? I just try and bring some balance. And by blaspheming you have just offended the ones who believe in that stuff, though i am not one of them.

[takkatan in the land]

The response to the current situation in Thailand at the moment demonstrates that the state has the important role to play in addressing critical challenges as public institutions must have the capacity to address these difficulties while at the same time delivering the benefits of human development. In response to these demands, the PTP and all parties should be focusing on enhancing the capacity of the state to make it more responsive, capable, and answerable. By fostering inclusive participation and promoting responsive institutions, underpinned by international agreed gender, human rights and anti-corruption principles maybe then Thailand can start on a true road to democracy. The Democratic way also has its flaws and can the average Thai bear these ramifications without taking the rule of law per say into their own hands. They need to start with an ideology that appeals and stands for all the people first and foremost. Get rid of government ties to the military and police straight away. Have each minister be a real public servant who has the power to really call the shots for all the peoples interests and enforce the rule of law and a status quo. This Thais are not very good at... Can the elite of Bangkok have a person from let's say Issan as the minister for trade and commerce? Most likely not. One of the main problems with Thailand and like it or lump it, but evidently their is a caste system in place throughout the populace and I don't think they even are aware of this. It heralds back from the breaking away from Hinduism to Buddhism and this too needs to be realised and acknowledged. When the Thai people can deal with this implement these notions and live with them is another topic and where do we start? Sutheps people council sounds great but in reality it will only foster further problems. The reform must come from all sides in styling democracy including the minority and consistency must be maintained, not just through the judicial process but right through the entire system. Until Thailand and its people enforce this upon a government voted in for the people and by the people this will never happen. Until you raise your voices so high that the glass breaks the deadlock remains. Until the entire Military,Police and Justice systems remain in the hands of the powerful elite and not a civil servants acting as Ministers who have the power to reign in and administer real reform can this happen as there is no real accountability. Come up with reform have all the different segments of society represented fairly and your on your way. As long as the feudal and clannish nepotism remains there will be little hope. Thailand does need to look at countries such as New Zealand, Australia, Switzerland and other relatively stable nations as a possible vehicle to emulate. Is this palatable to the average Thai? Probably not..As Thailand see themselves as to proud collectively as a people. Case in point, only ASEAN nation never to have been colonised. So sorry we know better then you Malaysia, Singapore etc. Is it possible that they would have been? Leave that one for another topic. All I do know is Thailand needs to grow up real quick in doing its reform and not raising it as a page filler in The Nation or The Bangkok Post your wasting your time in doing so in fact start reporting the Truth and there is your baby step into the land of democracy. But I guess that is wishful thinking too..... Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You typed all that crap on a phone? dam_n, now that crazy, lots of spare time I guess waiting for the bus.

I wish, babysitting lol and in my home that is a real state of democracy!

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

how does it works those i-mobile phones?

I've been checking them at mall and they quite cheap and look quite good.

I have and old Samsung pocket and I would like to buy a tablet or a new smartphone with bigger screen.

Would you recommend it?