Another one bites the dust...

[arend]

There is an old story about a scorpion who needed to cross a river and asked a frog to carry him across. The frog was reluctant and said he was afraid the scorpion would sting him. The scorpion convinced the frog that he wouldn't. Midway the scorpion stung the frog. The frog complained; 'but you promised not to sting me'. The scorpion said; 'but, it's in my nature..."

You are a victim but chose to ignore all the warning signs. I wonder why that is? Naivete? Denial? Like to be the victim? Bad judgement? Sympathy? Enabling?

To salvage something and learn, you'll look at this. If not, destined to repeat and live with bitterness....

Edited January 27, 2014 by arend

[brit1984]

Thai888 in Jomtien insists that all paperwork be in English so that these issues are minimised - you need contracts, proper management, legal advise, accounts etc.

Everyone in business in Thailand needs to keep an eye on things - even if you have been married for 20 years you need to spend a few hours a week checking things - dont listen to the mai pen rai as it will not be alright

It sounds like you wife has a gambling problem and so the loan sharks.

Yes she has a gambling addiction but as another poster suggested that is a sympton rather than a cause of all this.

Sometimes I would learn that she was gambling and after I asked why she would say because she wants to make money!

I am not saying all Thais are evil, but some live in dream world that is completely disconnected to reality.

[jomcondo]

There is an old story about a scorpion who needed to cross a river and asked a frog to carry him across. The frog was reluctant and said he was afraid the scorpion would sting him. The scorpion convinced the frog that he wouldn't. Midway the scorpion stung the frog. The frog complained; 'but you promised not to sting me'. The scorpion said; 'but, it's in my nature..."

You are the victim but chose to ignore all the warning signs. I wonder why that is? Naivete? Denial? Like to be the victim? Just bad discernment? Sympathy???

some of these skanks even have scorpions tattooed on themselves, you can't get any clearer than that can you.

[belg]

another ghost story writer of the week, right ...

big international business? well name it ...

or is it the : we bought several houses to rent .... playing real estate agent while you have 0% entitlement to the land and only 49% in your own fully paid business ?

[brit1984]

There is an old story about a scorpion who needed to cross a river and asked a frog to carry him across. The frog was reluctant and said he was afraid the scorpion would sting him. The scorpion convinced the frog that he wouldn't. Midway the scorpion stung the frog. The frog complained; 'but you promised not to sting me'. The scorpion said; 'but, it's in my nature..."

You are a victim but chose to ignore all the warning signs. I wonder why that is? Naivete? Denial? Like to be the victim? Bad judgement? Sympathy? Enabling?

To salvage something and learn, you'll look at this. If not, destined to repeat and live with bitterness....

Thanks for good advice.

I am not a psychologist so not totally sure why / how I went down this path - luckily I have some close family who are experts in this field who will help me to understand how this happened and hopefully prevent a repeat!

[Tolley]

Of course many business dealings require an element of trust and anyone can be ripped off but you can minimise the losses by following some basic principles.

Never leave temptation in any ones way.

That is why they have best practice in business and segregation of duties and auditors etc

[speedtripler]

There is an old story about a scorpion who needed to cross a river and asked a frog to carry him across. The frog was reluctant and said he was afraid the scorpion would sting him. The scorpion convinced the frog that he wouldn't. Midway the scorpion stung the frog. The frog complained; 'but you promised not to sting me'. The scorpion said; 'but, it's in my nature..."

You are the victim but chose to ignore all the warning signs. I wonder why that is? Naivete? Denial? Like to be the victim? Just bad discernment? Sympathy???

some of these skanks even have scorpions tattooed on themselves, you can't get any clearer than that can you.

which skanks are these ?

[brit1984]

another ghost story writer of the week, right ...

big international business? well name it ...

or is it the : we bought several houses to rent .... playing real estate agent while you have 0% entitlement to the land and only 49% in your own fully paid business ?

It's a SMALL international business and I do not intend to name it here (not least because we are in the process of renaming and forming a new entity) but other forum members know what it's about.

To answer your question (assuming it's not rhetorical), and for clarity for other posters, it is a service sector business and we did not buy any property nor any other significant fixed assets.

[BB1955]

Don't feel that it just happens to us farrangs, my wifes brother who had been married for 14 years had two children . She did the same thing to him left owing 100s of thousands of baht . Took there financed pick up truck and sold it . Ran off to parts unknow in fear of being killed by the sharks .....So lets not all take claim of us poor mistreated farrangs . Happens to Thais in real life too ......

[brit1984]

Of course many business dealings require an element of trust and anyone can be ripped off but you can minimise the losses by following some basic principles.

Never leave temptation in any ones way.

That is why they have best practice in business and segregation of duties and auditors etc

Very sensible advice.

One of my mistakes was too have an over romanticized perspective about running a family business together as a happy team, in contrast to the rigid structure and cold money making focus of my previous career in the city.

[transam]

Don't feel that it just happens to us farrangs, my wifes brother who had been married for 14 years had two children . She did the same thing to him left owing 100s of thousands of baht . Took there financed pick up truck and sold it . Ran off to parts unknow in fear of being killed by the sharks .....So lets not all take claim of us poor mistreated farrangs . Happens to Thais in real life too ......

How true, my wifes daughter has just taken a nice Thai guy for 500,000bht..........

[falangadang]

Sad story,... all you can do is learn from the experience and start to rebuilt your life and your business.

I have found that even in my own marriage to a lovely and honest Thai wife that she has limited money management skills.

Yes she can budget shopping for the household well but when I used to give her all the money in advance for the month's requirements it would invariably not last until the end of the month for now other reason than mismanagement (not abuse). And she isn't a dummy either,.. not a bar girl and with a double degree from Uni.

This is the case with most Thai women unless they grew up with money in a Thai-Chinese family or something.

Since I took over 100% control of the money we never have any problems and I sleep a lot better at night.

Lesson learned; next time don't give your wife control over any of the money!

[brit1984]

Don't feel that it just happens to us farrangs, my wifes brother who had been married for 14 years had two children . She did the same thing to him left owing 100s of thousands of baht . Took there financed pick up truck and sold it . Ran off to parts unknow in fear of being killed by the sharks .....So lets not all take claim of us poor mistreated farrangs . Happens to Thais in real life too ......

How true, my wifes daughter has just taken a nice Thai guy for 500,000bht..........

Maybe you can introduce her to me... I'm willing to give her 100% of my NET wealth.

[sz1a]

I don't want to come off as rude or racist or judging, but there is my interpretation.

Thai girls that have NPD have potentially been involved with many guys and / or bar work / or worse. You either need to have NPD to work in those industries or you will develop it naturally since you need to trade yourself for money. = BIG warning sign, pull out immediately.

If your girl comes from a poor family, chances are you are being duped. Exercise caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If there is a significant age gap, realize that in 9/10 cases you are being duped for money. Exercise extreme caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If your girl comes from the northeast (bear with me) and has had many farang boyfriends before you, PULL OUT NOW. You are being duped for sure.

If your girl hangs around farangs a lot and seems to like white guys / has many commenting on her posts / texting her, exercise caution and don't invest in the relationship. Probably a gold digger.

To summarize: If it seems too good and jolly to be true it probably is. There are tons of good girls in this country that wouldn't steal from you and wouldn't be out for money. You just need to date from a different pool. If you find someone who is the opposite of all the points I posted above you should be fine. And don't trust people too much, period.

[atyclb]

So whats the deal with the kids now then ?

They could become a bitter element in future dealings.

They are with in-laws who are also victims of this, but I have unlimited access.

I expect to swap custody for divorce once my wife inevitably finds a new guy.

Be careful, custody for divorce is not as attractive as custody for cash.

Abandonment, embezzlement, fraud and perhaps gambling go a long way in Thai family court and she got lots of cash already from the former 3.

[transam]

I don't want to come off as rude or racist or judging, but there is my interpretation.

Thai girls that have NPD have potentially been involved with many guys and / or bar work / or worse. You either need to have NPD to work in those industries or you will develop it naturally since you need to trade yourself for money. = BIG warning sign, pull out immediately.

If your girl comes from a poor family, chances are you are being duped. Exercise caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If there is a significant age gap, realize that in 9/10 cases you are being duped for money. Exercise extreme caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If your girl comes from the northeast (bear with me) and has had many farang boyfriends before you, PULL OUT NOW. You are being duped for sure.

If your girl hangs around farangs a lot and seems to like white guys / has many commenting on her posts / texting her, exercise caution and don't invest in the relationship. Probably a gold digger.

To summarize: If it seems too good and jolly to be true it probably is. There are tons of good girls in this country that wouldn't steal from you and wouldn't be out for money. You just need to date from a different pool. If you find someone who is the opposite of all the points I posted above you should be fine. And don't trust people too much, period.

Don't quite like your ''North East'' Thailand comment.

My ex wife who tried to rip me off came from S.E. London.................

[atyclb]

Thai888 in Jomtien insists that all paperwork be in English so that these issues are minimised - you need contracts, proper management, legal advise, accounts etc.

Everyone in business in Thailand needs to keep an eye on things - even if you have been married for 20 years you need to spend a few hours a week checking things - dont listen to the mai pen rai as it will not be alright

It sounds like you wife has a gambling problem and so the loan sharks.

Yes she has a gambling addiction but as another poster suggested that is a sympton rather than a cause of all this.

Sometimes I would learn that she was gambling and after I asked why she would say because she wants to make money!

I am not saying all Thais are evil, but some live in dream world that is completely disconnected to reality.

Try watching the soap operas (la korn tv) for a while and you will see it is not so much a dream world but the reality a majority live in and relate to.

[oogster8]

really out of curiosity, i notice that you did have more than 3000 messages on tv, so here my question: Are you one of those members

who spent their times claiming how much their gf/wife is different, that she come from a good family, she is so honest, you can trust her with you life, she will never harm you, she is the best thing that did happen in your life, and she love you maak????!

(Well inspite of warning, the cultural gap, language barriere, difference of wealth, her family, etc etc)

Because if you are one of them, who spent his times to spread myths and <deleted> on tv, well in fact you might have fooled some other members, but the biggest victims is...you!

Now its time for some weeks holidays, and after to start to build back yourself, and dont run again in the same problems as it seems that some never learn.......

That is a very interesting post.

I'm one of the guys who didn't discover Thaivisa (or really know anything about Thailand) until AFTER I married my wife.

Now I would actually say my wife is very DIFFERENT because most Thai people are not evil monsters with NPD.

where did you first meet her? let us be the judge if she was diffferent...................lol. her having no money could only mean one thing.

Edited January 27, 2014 by oogster8

[brit1984]

I don't want to come off as rude or racist or judging, but there is my interpretation.

Thai girls that have NPD have potentially been involved with many guys and / or bar work / or worse. You either need to have NPD to work in those industries or you will develop it naturally since you need to trade yourself for money. = BIG warning sign, pull out immediately.

If your girl comes from a poor family, chances are you are being duped. Exercise caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If there is a significant age gap, realize that in 9/10 cases you are being duped for money. Exercise extreme caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If your girl comes from the northeast (bear with me) and has had many farang boyfriends before you, PULL OUT NOW. You are being duped for sure.

If your girl hangs around farangs a lot and seems to like white guys / has many commenting on her posts / texting her, exercise caution and don't invest in the relationship. Probably a gold digger.

To summarize: If it seems too good and jolly to be true it probably is. There are tons of good girls in this country that wouldn't steal from you and wouldn't be out for money. You just need to date from a different pool. If you find someone who is the opposite of all the points I posted above you should be fine. And don't trust people too much, period.

Some useful advice in there (albeit mixed up with some over stereotyping which I understand was not your intention).

My wife is the same age as me and her family probably better off than mine. She mixed with farangs but only because she lived in London (where those farangs are everywhere!) and it certainly never felt too good to be true (quite the opposite in fact!).

She is from Isaan but obviously not all Isaan people are evil nor do all evil people come from Isaan.

I think your general point to look out for patterns or clues that suggest sinister motives is good advice.

[oogster8]

How long is it that you know she has npd ?

She has never been medically diagnosed but my mum (who knows a lot more about psychology than me) has been warning me that she has it for years. She even secretly gave me books about NPD.

Afew times when we went to visit doctors in UK about unrelated issues, they could sense (I assume from her demeanour or use of language) something is not right but my wife always refused to discuss mental health issues.

There are different degrees of severity for NPD and while I have been sure for some time she has the condition, it's only now that this has happened AND she has shown no remorse that I see how severe her case is.

If you are living with someone with severe NPD, I'm afraid to say from my understanding it cannot be cured and treatment to treat it requires the patient to be committed to therapy (which goes against the nature of those with NPD).

SORRY. but you are to blame more than anything. YOU had info and yet had 2 kid with her. Where theres smoke there always is fire.

Listen to mommy....they do know best!

I f you buy a donkey with bad legs dont blame the donkey for not winning donkey races...................lol.

Edited January 27, 2014 by oogster8

[brit1984]

really out of curiosity, i notice that you did have more than 3000 messages on tv, so here my question: Are you one of those members

who spent their times claiming how much their gf/wife is different, that she come from a good family, she is so honest, you can trust her with you life, she will never harm you, she is the best thing that did happen in your life, and she love you maak????!

(Well inspite of warning, the cultural gap, language barriere, difference of wealth, her family, etc etc)

Because if you are one of them, who spent his times to spread myths and <deleted> on tv, well in fact you might have fooled some other members, but the biggest victims is...you!

Now its time for some weeks holidays, and after to start to build back yourself, and dont run again in the same problems as it seems that some never learn.......

That is a very interesting post.

I'm one of the guys who didn't discover Thaivisa (or really know anything about Thailand) until AFTER I married my wife.

Now I would actually say my wife is very DIFFERENT because most Thai people are not evil monsters with NPD.

where did you first meet her? let us be the judge if she was diffferent...................lol. her having no money could only mean one thing.

We met in a Thai restaurant in London (both of us were customers).

Not too sure what you mean about her having no money - she has always had money (until 2 weeks ago).

You can judge her as you wish but most Thai people are not evil.

[harrry]

I don't want to come off as rude or racist or judging, but there is my interpretation.

Thai girls that have NPD have potentially been involved with many guys and / or bar work / or worse. You either need to have NPD to work in those industries or you will develop it naturally since you need to trade yourself for money. = BIG warning sign, pull out immediately.

If your girl comes from a poor family, chances are you are being duped. Exercise caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If there is a significant age gap, realize that in 9/10 cases you are being duped for money. Exercise extreme caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If your girl comes from the northeast (bear with me) and has had many farang boyfriends before you, PULL OUT NOW. You are being duped for sure.

If your girl hangs around farangs a lot and seems to like white guys / has many commenting on her posts / texting her, exercise caution and don't invest in the relationship. Probably a gold digger.

To summarize: If it seems too good and jolly to be true it probably is. There are tons of good girls in this country that wouldn't steal from you and wouldn't be out for money. You just need to date from a different pool. If you find someone who is the opposite of all the points I posted above you should be fine. And don't trust people too much, period.

Don't quite like your ''North East'' Thailand comment.

My ex wife who tried to rip me off came from S.E. London.................

Same same but different.

[brit1984]

How long is it that you know she has npd ?

She has never been medically diagnosed but my mum (who knows a lot more about psychology than me) has been warning me that she has it for years. She even secretly gave me books about NPD.

Afew times when we went to visit doctors in UK about unrelated issues, they could sense (I assume from her demeanour or use of language) something is not right but my wife always refused to discuss mental health issues.

There are different degrees of severity for NPD and while I have been sure for some time she has the condition, it's only now that this has happened AND she has shown no remorse that I see how severe her case is.

If you are living with someone with severe NPD, I'm afraid to say from my understanding it cannot be cured and treatment to treat it requires the patient to be committed to therapy (which goes against the nature of those with NPD).

SORRY. but you are to blame more than anything. YOU had info and yet had 2 kid with her. Where theres smoke there always is fire.

Listen to mommy....they do know best!

I f you buy a donkey with bad legs dont blame the donkey for not winning donkey races...................lol.

Thanks for the good advice and interesting metaphors.

[atyclb]

I don't want to come off as rude or racist or judging, but there is my interpretation.

Thai girls that have NPD have potentially been involved with many guys and / or bar work / or worse. You either need to have NPD to work in those industries or you will develop it naturally since you need to trade yourself for money. = BIG warning sign, pull out immediately.

If your girl comes from a poor family, chances are you are being duped. Exercise caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If there is a significant age gap, realize that in 9/10 cases you are being duped for money. Exercise extreme caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If your girl comes from the northeast (bear with me) and has had many farang boyfriends before you, PULL OUT NOW. You are being duped for sure.

If your girl hangs around farangs a lot and seems to like white guys / has many commenting on her posts / texting her, exercise caution and don't invest in the relationship. Probably a gold digger.

To summarize: If it seems too good and jolly to be true it probably is. There are tons of good girls in this country that wouldn't steal from you and wouldn't be out for money. You just need to date from a different pool. If you find someone who is the opposite of all the points I posted above you should be fine. And don't trust people too much, period.

Don't quite like your ''North East'' Thailand comment.

My ex wife who tried to rip me off came from S.E. London.................

My first wife, non thai european tried to rip me off during the divorce, but when she realized I was entitled to 50% of all her future earnings as a lawyer (as I supported her through law school) she agreed to an amicable settlement.

And yes I was also married to an N.E. thai woman that never scammed or ripped me off because there are pockets of integrity.

I dont use the above as a way to rationalize, deflect, or diminish the realities of thailand and very significant scamming that exists and statistically is likely higher in NE due to socioeconomic factors.

[nsimmons]

I too joined the club, was certain she was one thing (honest normal not sociopath), but here is the truth cut from emails to my brother, meant as a warning. Firstly I thought people on this forum were negative and racist against Thais.

I have done a 180 degree turn, were are just "rich cows" to be milked and despised...

They are actually taught "all Farangs somehow have unlimited money and are to be swindled if possible".

I tried to break up with girlfriend Mikky, and even after her 100s of promises, she tried to take me for
everything I have.(and she got a fair bit)
I really try not to blame myself too much (although a lot), because she also fooled four guys (and 1 woman) I trust a
lot, and have lived here for 20 years or more and speak Thai etc. You/I just can’t tell if they are lying.

It went from...

Ian (naive and gullible idiot)
Oh you seem like a nice girl with some problems, I’ll try and help you out of poverty, help you use your brain etc etc
“Oh your late husband dropped dead when you were so young and you got robbed, I will make sure
it can’t happen to you again coz I’m a nice guy etc etc”

Mikky (ethics free thief)
Stupid old bastard, while alive I’ll take him for whatever I can get, and if he dies,
I get the apartment, what a moron. I hope he dies soon, and maybe I can get that plane too!
(bit later)
Oh shit, he won’t have a baby with me and seems he wants to break up and just be friends.
I had better RAPE him for as much as possible.

Apparently all Thai's are the same, irrespective of where you meet them or education etc, apparently they do it to each other all the time.
I asked my pal, “How can she be so cruel after I paid for her mom's multiple operations,
her own monthly "salary", getting her a laptop and a scooter plus the trip to Aus etc etc etc etc?”

He says "right of passage if you try and live here. You won’t believe they can have no remorse or conscience
or basic honesty until you experience it”

I literally have known using heroin addicts that have far more ethics.
But you would/could never believe this unless you experience it.
It is soo far out of our Western values/beliefs. However Japanese are as honest as most, if not more honest than most.

(I lived in Japan over 10 years)
So it is not an Asian thing, it must just be a Thai thing (which I am hearing repeatedly).

On this
http://newsletter.thaivisa.com/sendy/w/F9n6ijPfw5zlC4rdEWrOeg/GqO7cTr5rscAtvOrMfwaig/bQ6QHXd0892KMVdACXaZ969g

You often read where some Western guy kills himself over being “seduced/robbed/swindled/humiliated” by some Thai girl.

I used to think ….

“what a whimp” or “must be really gullible” and “he is old enough to be her father, can’t he see
she is just in it for the money?” etc etc.
Other negative stories you hear, you think the guy must have been really gullible/stupid/greedy/sex addict or
whatever.

Now I think….

"Poor bastard, would never have even seen it coming, probably way too trusting a guy to live in Thailand.”
And can relate completely, many lose their life savings.

Happens a lot….guys fall in love, she takes him for everything, he kills himself.

The ironic thing is, I bet they all think “that will show her”, “she will be sorry now” etc. But the truth is she will not give a shit and simply wonder how she can gain from the death.

Thank God I never loved her, more of a sort of charity thing for me, we made it SUPER clear
and agreed that it was very likely a short relationship. (age etc, and she promised she was fine with that etc)

It still amazes me, the lack of conscience or even belief in Karma here (supposed to be Buddist).
It really is corrupt on soooo many levels.
I am way too much of a trusting guy to be here (perfect 20/20 hindsight!)

I have lived by this….

It is better to suffer wrong than to do it, and happier to be sometimes cheated than not to trust.
--Samuel Johnson

Works in most places but not sure it applies here. <deleted> should have said ….

In England, It is better to suffer wrong than to do it, and happier to be sometimes cheated than not to trust.
--Samuel Johnson ; )

The girl above cleaned out the safe of 16Bht gold, (been together 18 months and trusted her.) I even had a small aircraft (that must be in a Thai's name), bought on borrowed money (worth 1.5M Bht), in her name. She almost got that too!

I went to the Police and really fought it, as per an article posted here from the Phuket Gazette.

Got a bit of the gold back, about 15%, and made it really hard for her. Most guys just “roll over”
and do nothing due to the humiliation and depression etc. I had two physical brawls with them
and went to police etc. Got death threats so that is why I had to up security (cameras) for a while, (she said I get Mafia kill you) but all sorted now. (probably on to next victim)

I was so duped and trusting, I left her an apartment in my will when I found out she was a widow (Thai husband dropped dead at 58), when she was 26. I have since had the humiliation of changing it back, and felt the derision and

ridicule from some that warned me.

Anyway, I will survive, many don’t, especially if they were truly trying to help someone, and then get robbed.
It is worse to get raped by someone you are trying to help, rather than by a stranger.

So hard to believe, few believe it (like me) and so the system/scam/con-game goes on.

Not sure I want to live, knowing everyone is out to scam me, and is insanely good at it.
Your pals warn you, but you can’t see it until you are hurt….. BAD.

As it has been 100% proven, I am unable to tell if a Thai person is 100% honest or 100% evil.

(at the same time I almost got conned very badly by a Thai man I thought of as a friend)

For self protection, I must assume they are all out to totally scam me and must not be trusted.

I simply can't recognize the honest from the dishonest here.

I have read all the books like "Private dancer", have multiple Thai speaker friends that

were also fooled. I had been visiting for 10 years, and STILL I was 100% duped. Be VERY careful

out there guys, if you run into a sociopath, RUN, you can never win in combat, as they will do

what you will be unwilling to do.

TIPS

I hope this saves the next guys....

1) Put NOTHING in her name. If it can't go in your name, don't own it.

(this include iPads, phones, motorcycles etc. Keep the receipt if

you paid for it.)

2) Don't legally marry them, do the ceremony in their village if you must,

but not the paperwork. Thank God this witch was just my girlfriend and not my wife.

If wife, she gets half or more and you are screwed.

3) She was pushing for a kid, now I see how she could "own" me thru the kid.

Avoid pregnancies unless you are ok with being blackmailed thru the kid.

My 3 best friends have all been paying and paying for over 25 years and

all admit, if no kids, would have "kicked her to the curb" long ago.

Cheers,

Ian

PS Thai girls, WARNING Will Robinson WARNING!!!

[Ruin]

Tough for you, hope the recovery is swift.

NPD sounds like big face syndrome.

[oogster8]

I am not saying all Thais are evil, but some live in dream world that is completely disconnected to reality.

-------

re thai and farang marriages. Id say the farang is the 1 disconnected to reality!!!!!!!!!!! more often than not.

[atyclb]

Some very interesting info re NPD from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder

it would seem much of thai society show some of the traits given how image is put on a gold pedestal and saving face is everything.

"pathological narcissism can develop from an impairment in the quality of the person's relationship with their primary caregivers, usually their parents, in that the parents could not form a healthy and empathic attachment to them.^[16] This results in the child's perception of himself/herself as unimportant and unconnected to others. The child typically comes to believe they have some personality defect that makes them unvalued and unwanted.^[17]

To the extent that people are pathologically narcissistic, they can be controlling, blaming, self-absorbed, intolerant of others’ views, unaware of others' needs and of the effects of their behavior on others, and insistent that others see them as they wish to be seen.^[18]

Narcissistic individuals use various strategies to protect the self at the expense of others. They tend to devalue, derogate and blame others, and they respond to threatening feedback with anger and hostility.^[19]

People who are narcissistic commonly feel rejected, humiliated and threatened when criticised. To protect themselves from these dangers, they often react with disdain, rage, and/or defiance to any slight criticism, real or imagined.

Edited January 27, 2014 by atyclb

[oogster8]

I too joined the club, was certain she was one thing (honest normal not sociopath), but here is the truth cut from emails to my brother, meant as a warning. Firstly I thought people on this forum were negative and racist against Thais.

I have done a 180 degree turn, were are just "rich cows" to be milked and despised...

They are actually taught "all Farangs somehow have unlimited money and are to be swindled if possible".

I tried to break up with girlfriend Mikky, and even after her 100s of promises, she tried to take me for

everything I have.(and she got a fair bit)

I really try not to blame myself too much (although a lot), because she also fooled four guys (and 1 woman) I trust a

lot, and have lived here for 20 years or more and speak Thai etc. You/I just can’t tell if they are lying.

It went from...

Ian (naive and gullible idiot)

Oh you seem like a nice girl with some problems, I’ll try and help you out of poverty, help you use your brain etc etc

“Oh your late husband dropped dead when you were so young and you got robbed, I will make sure

it can’t happen to you again coz I’m a nice guy etc etc”

Mikky (ethics free thief)

Stupid old bastard, while alive I’ll take him for whatever I can get, and if he dies,

I get the apartment, what a moron. I hope he dies soon, and maybe I can get that plane too!

(bit later)

Oh shit, he won’t have a baby with me and seems he wants to break up and just be friends.

I had better RAPE him for as much as possible.

Apparently all Thai's are the same, irrespective of where you meet them or education etc, apparently they do it to each other all the time.

I asked my pal, “How can she be so cruel after I paid for her mom's multiple operations,

her own monthly "salary", getting her a laptop and a scooter plus the trip to Aus etc etc etc etc?”

He says "right of passage if you try and live here. You won’t believe they can have no remorse or conscience

or basic honesty until you experience it”

I literally have known using heroin addicts that have far more ethics.

But you would/could never believe this unless you experience it.

It is soo far out of our Western values/beliefs. However Japanese are as honest as most, if not more honest than most.

(I lived in Japan over 10 years)

So it is not an Asian thing, it must just be a Thai thing (which I am hearing repeatedly).

On this

http://newsletter.thaivisa.com/sendy/w/F9n6ijPfw5zlC4rdEWrOeg/GqO7cTr5rscAtvOrMfwaig/bQ6QHXd0892KMVdACXaZ969g

You often read where some Western guy kills himself over being “seduced/robbed/swindled/humiliated” by some Thai girl.

I used to think ….

“what a whimp” or “must be really gullible” and “he is old enough to be her father, can’t he see

she is just in it for the money?” etc etc.

Other negative stories you hear, you think the guy must have been really gullible/stupid/greedy/sex addict or

whatever.

Now I think….

"Poor bastard, would never have even seen it coming, probably way too trusting a guy to live in Thailand.”

And can relate completely, many lose their life savings.

Happens a lot….guys fall in love, she takes him for everything, he kills himself.

The ironic thing is, I bet they all think “that will show her”, “she will be sorry now” etc. But the truth is she will not give a shit and simply wonder how she can gain from the death.

Thank God I never loved her, more of a sort of charity thing for me, we made it SUPER clear

and agreed that it was very likely a short relationship. (age etc, and she promised she was fine with that etc)

It still amazes me, the lack of conscience or even belief in Karma here (supposed to be Buddist).

It really is corrupt on soooo many levels.

I am way too much of a trusting guy to be here (perfect 20/20 hindsight!)

I have lived by this….

It is better to suffer wrong than to do it, and happier to be sometimes cheated than not to trust.

--Samuel Johnson

Works in most places but not sure it applies here. wanke_r should have said ….

In England, It is better to suffer wrong than to do it, and happier to be sometimes cheated than not to trust.

--Samuel Johnson ; )

The girl above cleaned out the safe of 16Bht gold, (been together 18 months and trusted her.) I even had a small aircraft (that must be in a Thai's name), bought on borrowed money (worth 1.5M Bht), in her name. She almost got that too!

I went to the Police and really fought it, as per an article posted here from the Phuket Gazette.

Got a bit of the gold back, about 15%, and made it really hard for her. Most guys just “roll over”

and do nothing due to the humiliation and depression etc. I had two physical brawls with them

and went to police etc. Got death threats so that is why I had to up security (cameras) for a while, (she said I get Mafia kill you) but all sorted now. (probably on to next victim)

I was so duped and trusting, I left her an apartment in my will when I found out she was a widow (Thai husband dropped dead at 58), when she was 26. I have since had the humiliation of changing it back, and felt the derision and

ridicule from some that warned me.

Anyway, I will survive, many don’t, especially if they were truly trying to help someone, and then get robbed.

It is worse to get raped by someone you are trying to help, rather than by a stranger.

So hard to believe, few believe it (like me) and so the system/scam/con-game goes on.

Not sure I want to live, knowing everyone is out to scam me, and is insanely good at it.

Your pals warn you, but you can’t see it until you are hurt….. BAD.

As it has been 100% proven, I am unable to tell if a Thai person is 100% honest or 100% evil.

(at the same time I almost got conned very badly by a Thai man I thought of as a friend)

For self protection, I must assume they are all out to totally scam me and must not be trusted.

I simply can't recognize the honest from the dishonest here.

I have read all the books like "Private dancer", have multiple Thai speaker friends that

were also fooled. I had been visiting for 10 years, and STILL I was 100% duped. Be VERY careful

out there guys, if you run into a sociopath, RUN, you can never win in combat, as they will do

what you will be unwilling to do.

TIPS

I hope this saves the next guys....

1) Put NOTHING in her name. If it can't go in your name, don't own it.

(this include iPads, phones, motorcycles etc. Keep the receipt if

you paid for it.)

2) Don't legally marry them, do the ceremony in their village if you must,

but not the paperwork. Thank God this witch was just my girlfriend and not my wife.

If wife, she gets half or more and you are screwed.

3) She was pushing for a kid, now I see how she could "own" me thru the kid.

Avoid pregnancies unless you are ok with being blackmailed thru the kid.

My 3 best friends have all been paying and paying for over 25 years and

all admit, if no kids, would have "kicked her to the curb" long ago.

Cheers,

Ian

PS Thai girls, WARNING Will Robinson WARNING!!!

You are playing VICTIM. Get a clue you dipshit! You guys are pathetic.

for laughs-can you describe the nature of the mothers operations you paid for...........lol. i hope they were all a success.

Ive said over and over. Its the guys own fault.

Edited January 27, 2014 by oogster8

[FiftyTwo]

I don't want to come off as rude or racist or judging, but there is my interpretation.

Thai girls that have NPD have potentially been involved with many guys and / or bar work / or worse. You either need to have NPD to work in those industries or you will develop it naturally since you need to trade yourself for money. = BIG warning sign, pull out immediately.

If your girl comes from a poor family, chances are you are being duped. Exercise caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If there is a significant age gap, realize that in 9/10 cases you are being duped for money. Exercise extreme caution and don't make her the owner of your business.

If your girl comes from the northeast (bear with me) and has had many farang boyfriends before you, PULL OUT NOW. You are being duped for sure.

If your girl hangs around farangs a lot and seems to like white guys / has many commenting on her posts / texting her, exercise caution and don't invest in the relationship. Probably a gold digger.

To summarize: If it seems too good and jolly to be true it probably is. There are tons of good girls in this country that wouldn't steal from you and wouldn't be out for money. You just need to date from a different pool. If you find someone who is the opposite of all the points I posted above you should be fine. And don't trust people too much, period.

Don't quite like your ''North East'' Thailand comment.

My ex wife who tried to rip me off came from S.E. London.................

And my former wife who did rip me off came from Hereford.