NIDA Poll says 56.59% want Yingluck to resign

[Baerboxer]

wow a sample of 1200 vs an election of millions.

credibility factor, zero.

Sadly here a poll well indeed have more credibility than an election held under SOE with a Shin clan regime in power, even if just caretaking.

They seem to like taking care of things

[Skywalker69]

I think Yingluck should resign. Her resignation might end the protest also.

But it look like she does not want to resign. I guess Thaksin is telling her to stay in.

It is amazing to see that she is still standing after all the issues and problems she created.

It´s her caddie that has the say, in her resigning.

[djjamie]

wow a sample of 1200 vs an election of millions.

credibility factor, zero.

As I said….Keep denying...

Cheers

[HD 205]

NIDA, who is pro Democrat, can even only just barely get a 50%.

NIDA is biased?

Proof please..... and don't say 'everyone knows' because I don't know that and have never read anything to support this.

If everyone knows this then there should be plenty of proof.

Also, 56.6% is closer to 60 than it is to 50 so why would you qualify that as 'barely 50%??

Me thinks this is yet another red corruption supporter telling bare faced lies like we get from Pipkins all the time, because they have very little or nothing to support their agenda.

If he was to talk about the election he would call the 48% the PTP got a landslide and the 52% that didn't want them immaterial.

Why is it trolls can't put up reasonable posts?

Maybe I am wrong but if most government workers are red shirts and they don't want her that would say some thing.

On the other hand I don't believe that a lot of them are red shirts they are from all different parties as far as their loyalty goes. But they are a lot closer to the inner workings so it would do well to listen to them.

On the other hand I always have suspicions about Thai poll's but this time it was not a general poll it was a poll from a specific section of society.

Just trying to be non biased.

You say you always have suspicions about Thai poll's yet defend this particular one in the same line.

48% of the vote compared to 35% in a system with two main parties is a landslide victory, the only people who don't call it a landslide are those who support the democruds.

Nearly every article you read from anywhere in the world calls it a landslide victory.

Stop trying to be non biased, it doesn't work. be yourself.

[HD 205]

wow a sample of 1200 vs an election of millions.

credibility factor, zero.

As I said….Keep denying...

Cheers

Do you think PTP would lose a general election?

[hellodolly]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

I won't point out the obvious flaws in this poll, I'll just ask you this: Do you think the leaders of western democracies should resign whenever their poll numbers drop below 50%?

You mean the 19% who want her to stay...Your fingers faster than your brain...

I don't know where your 19% number comes from, but my point is that polls, whether well conducted and representative or not (this one isn't), don't determine governments. In a democracy elections do. Is that a bit too much for your brain?

Well I hate to break the news to you but this is no longer an elected government. That government was disbanded because of protestors.

Any how it makes no difference to me. You can read your law books and spout your nonsense about democracy which Thailand does not have. The people did not elect Yingluck. The house did. 52% in a democracy would be the winner. They would have to hold another election and on and on it would go to reach a democratically elected PM

Enough Bull Manure.

Their comes a time when people should consider what is best for all of Thailand. No matter what kind of government they have. It is my belief that time has come. I am fed up to the top with people harping on and on about democracy as the nation continues to slide down hill. To them I say stuff it. Forget your petty little man in Dubai with a big mouth and a lot of money and start thinking about the people of Thailand. It is not their fault that they are for the most part poorly educated and easily influenced by glib promises of wealth. That is the fault of all the previous governments also. That includes Thaksin's governments.

But it is time to end it get some people in there to change the constitution in places make it clearer and make the penalties harsher. Also enforce them. In addition change the education system so when a student progress a grade it is because they have done the work and know what it is about in the grade they are about to leave. That of course would call for an complete overhaul of the education system and a new arrangement of priorities. When they have made these changes have an election.

I am not talking about the petty corruption for not wearing a helmet here I am talking about the corruption at the highest levels of government where 100s of billions of baht's disappear into private pockets.

[bigbamboo]

If she does go it won't be her decision. Either the courts or her big brother will decide.

[djjamie]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

I won't point out the obvious flaws in this poll, I'll just ask you this: Do you think the leaders of western democracies should resign whenever their poll numbers drop below 50%?

No definitely not. I completely agree with you 100% (100% is a majority by the way) BUT Thailand government aint acting like a western democracy. When they act like a western democracy (post ballot box) then you can compare them.

Remember POST BALLOT BOX is where democracy begins. Not where it ends.

When the PTP start appreciating that little fact I will appreciate the comparison with the "real" democracies.

Cheers

Edited February 14, 2014 by djjamie

[mrmicbkktxl]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

Feb2nd we had elections.All the democrats had to do was to win this election.but they did not participate.I wonder why if 5trillion % want Yingluk to resign.Anyway election is a way to vote an unwanted government out of office.But if i didn't win an election in decades i would also prefer a coup or bla bla about reforms or come up with people democratic bla bla

[Skywalker69]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

Feb2nd we had elections.All the democrats had to do was to win this election.but they did not participate.I wonder why if 5trillion % want Yingluk to resign.Anyway election is a way to vote an unwanted government out of office.But if i didn't win an election in decades i would also prefer a coup or bla bla about reforms or come up with people democratic bla bla

A new Thaksin cyber warrior?

[djjamie]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

Feb2nd we had elections.All the democrats had to do was to win this election.but they did not participate.I wonder why if 5trillion % want Yingluk to resign.Anyway election is a way to vote an unwanted government out of office.But if i didn't win an election in decades i would also prefer a coup or bla bla about reforms or come up with people democratic bla bla

Feb 2 election has not decided a winner yet unless it has been manipulated to a point where the outcome has been decided before results are released?

I did not know 5 trillion voters lives in Thailand?

So if you didn't win an election you would prefer a coup?

That would not surprise me as Thaksin didn't mind a coup in 1992. That coup made him billions. Not a word spoken about it being anti democratic either. Why? That coup made him billions.

Cheers

Edited February 14, 2014 by djjamie

[HD 205]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

Feb2nd we had elections.All the democrats had to do was to win this election.but they did not participate.I wonder why if 5trillion % want Yingluk to resign.Anyway election is a way to vote an unwanted government out of office.But if i didn't win an election in decades i would also prefer a coup or bla bla about reforms or come up with people democratic bla bla

Feb 2 election has not decided a winner yet unless it has been manipulated to a point where the outcome has been decided before results are released?

I did not know 5 trillion voters lives in Thailand?

So if you didn't win an election you would prefer a coup?

That would not surprise me as Thaksin didn't mind a coup in 1992. That coup made him billions. Not a word spoken about it being anti democratic either. Why? That coup made him billions.

Cheers

And who was Thaksin in 92? Why would there be any interest in him back then?

Also, I asked earlier if you think PTP would lose a general election?

[djjamie]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

Feb2nd we had elections.All the democrats had to do was to win this election.but they did not participate.I wonder why if 5trillion % want Yingluk to resign.Anyway election is a way to vote an unwanted government out of office.But if i didn't win an election in decades i would also prefer a coup or bla bla about reforms or come up with people democratic bla bla

A new Thaksin cyber warrior?

A thaksin cyber warrior to me is a description of someone that believes in corporate greed. That embraces business success. That ignores morales to make a few baht.

I stand here today and say that if I owned a business I would, before anyone else, employ thaksin as my CEO. He is a brilliant CEO.

Brilliant businessman. Great strategist in money making no matter who he burns.

I would never vote for him as a PM though. Saying that, if I was a poor farmer living from hand to mouth and I was offered 50% above market value on rice I would vote for Bozzo the clown.

[hellodolly]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

Feb2nd we had elections.All the democrats had to do was to win this election.but they did not participate.I wonder why if 5trillion % want Yingluk to resign.Anyway election is a way to vote an unwanted government out of office.But if i didn't win an election in decades i would also prefer a coup or bla bla about reforms or come up with people democratic bla bla

A new Thaksin cyber warrior?

That or a troll certainly no one familiar with the situation. Maybe a Chalerm supporter.

[djjamie]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

Feb2nd we had elections.All the democrats had to do was to win this election.but they did not participate.I wonder why if 5trillion % want Yingluk to resign.Anyway election is a way to vote an unwanted government out of office.But if i didn't win an election in decades i would also prefer a coup or bla bla about reforms or come up with people democratic bla bla

Feb 2 election has not decided a winner yet unless it has been manipulated to a point where the outcome has been decided before results are released?

I did not know 5 trillion voters lives in Thailand?

So if you didn't win an election you would prefer a coup?

That would not surprise me as Thaksin didn't mind a coup in 1992. That coup made him billions. Not a word spoken about it being anti democratic either. Why? That coup made him billions.

Cheers

And who was Thaksin in 92? Why would there be any interest in him back then?

Also, I asked earlier if you think PTP would lose a general election?

To make this clear…Read my previous post. Feb elections have not been decided. We don't know the results.

Suffice to say you would like to know what I think. Fair enough. I think the PTP have a minority and this has been highlighted over the past 4 weeks in regards to polls be 3 different polls as well as a back up from 80% of the population that feel that the PTP are responsible for the corruption in the rice scheme.

The fact is, not that 47% voted is beside the point. Even though that is a minority that is not the point. The fact that the voter turnout was 30% less nationally is what counts. Trends is what counts. This includes the north and the north east. It does not include the south that didn't vote. Facts speak. Lies and propaganda don't.

On your other question. If you don't know about Thaksin in 92 then how can you argue that he is a good and democratic man 22 years later?

Read about who you support before you support them.

Cheers

Edited February 14, 2014 by djjamie

[HD 205]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

Feb2nd we had elections.All the democrats had to do was to win this election.but they did not participate.I wonder why if 5trillion % want Yingluk to resign.Anyway election is a way to vote an unwanted government out of office.But if i didn't win an election in decades i would also prefer a coup or bla bla about reforms or come up with people democratic bla bla

A new Thaksin cyber warrior?

That or a troll certainly no one familiar with the situation. Maybe a Chalerm supporter.

Why not attack what the poster says, instead of attacking the poster?

What do you think is factually incorrect about what he has said, obviously without being pedantic enough to point out his intentional 5trillion % exaggeration?

People who have nothing to say besides insulting the poster in a reply add nothing to a debate, maybe because they know they cannot debate what has been said.

[heybruce]

I won't point out the obvious flaws in this poll, I'll just ask you this: Do you think the leaders of western democracies should resign whenever their poll numbers drop below 50%?

You mean the 19% who want her to stay...Your fingers faster than your brain...

I don't know where your 19% number comes from, but my point is that polls, whether well conducted and representative or not (this one isn't), don't determine governments. In a democracy elections do. Is that a bit too much for your brain?

Well I hate to break the news to you but this is no longer an elected government. That government was disbanded because of protestors.

Any how it makes no difference to me. You can read your law books and spout your nonsense about democracy which Thailand does not have. The people did not elect Yingluck. The house did. 52% in a democracy would be the winner. They would have to hold another election and on and on it would go to reach a democratically elected PM

Enough Bull Manure.

Their comes a time when people should consider what is best for all of Thailand. No matter what kind of government they have. It is my belief that time has come. I am fed up to the top with people harping on and on about democracy as the nation continues to slide down hill. To them I say stuff it. Forget your petty little man in Dubai with a big mouth and a lot of money and start thinking about the people of Thailand. It is not their fault that they are for the most part poorly educated and easily influenced by glib promises of wealth. That is the fault of all the previous governments also. That includes Thaksin's governments.

But it is time to end it get some people in there to change the constitution in places make it clearer and make the penalties harsher. Also enforce them. In addition change the education system so when a student progress a grade it is because they have done the work and know what it is about in the grade they are about to leave. That of course would call for an complete overhaul of the education system and a new arrangement of priorities. When they have made these changes have an election.

I am not talking about the petty corruption for not wearing a helmet here I am talking about the corruption at the highest levels of government where 100s of billions of baht's disappear into private pockets.

I am thinking about what is best for Thailand, I'm just not thinking in your simplistic "Thaksin bad, anti-Thaksin good" terms. I don't believe the end always justifies the means.

I am not pro-Thaksin, I am pro-democracy and rule of law. Every time an elected government is toppled through a coup or street mobs it sets this country back in its progress towards democracy and the rule of law. You stated that Thailand does not have a democracy. Well, so long as elected leaders are not allowed to finish their terms it doesn't. Toppling a Thaksin affiliated government through any means possible does more harm than good.

I won't attempt to address all of your points, some were bland statements of the obvious (who doesn't oppose corruption?) and some were displays of ignorance (Yingluck was elected in accordance with current Thai law). Debating issues requires facts and reason, and your posts are notably lacking in both. You have yet to explain your 19%, instead you added another unexplained 52%.

You want to change the education system then have an election, who governs during the changes? Who decides on the changes and then implements them? Who decides what kind of curriculum supports democracy and when the public is sufficiently educated for an election? Criticizing the way things are is easy, coming up with a workable alternative is hard.

If Yingluck resigns do you think the keys to the kingdom should be handed over to the corrupt Suthep? Or would you prefer the corrupt military take charge in another coup? Remember, the military is responsible for the constitution you want to change, they may like it just the way it is. Or do you just assume that once Yingluck is gone the country will govern itself and everything will be wonderful?

[HD 205]

The lower turn out all over could also possibly be because they didn't have any opposition to worry about don't you think?

They didn't need a big campaign.

Anyway, I disagree, I still 100% believe that there are far more PTP supporters than Democrat supporters in the country and they would not lose to them in a general election. Not a hope in hell, which is why we have situations like the present.

First off, I don't argue that he's a good and democratic man... why is it that people feel the need to force opinions on people on this site.

Thaksin in 92 had nothing to do with politics, so I have no idea what you mean???

Tell me what you know about Thaksin in 92 please, besides him running a business.

We could ague all night, but I won't. At least your an intelligent supporter of the "one principle of democracy" unlike the others I deal with here.

I beg to differ on the elections though. Polls and voter turn out have stipulated otherwise. There is not one single majority argument for the PTP in the last 4 weeks. Even the farmers want them out. Admittedly not the majority, but is that the point? The PTP stated they offered a scheme to help farmers.

The Shinawatra's used 1.5 trillion of tax payers money over 14 years stating they were helping the poor and the very people they purported to help scream poor 2 months after a non payment and farmers are committing suicide. As an intelligent supporter of the PTP (and I say this respectfully because I appreciate your replies) what would you have me think? Please don't state the DEMs's did this or that. I agree. This is not about the DEM's. I simple ask you as an intelligent person what you think about a party that neglect voters when in suits them, support voters when it is elections and deny rice farmers the request to speak to the only person they respected in 2011 which is the reason they voted for the PTP. That person is yingluck in case you forget.

Help me to understand how I can support that party?

Please?

I didn't forget it was Yingluck, no need for that dig but I'll look past that as the rest of your post is respectful.

My point about Thaksin in 92 is that his opinion on the coup wouldn't have been of any interest to the public domain so why would we have heard his complaints back then.

I agree that Yingluck should sit and discuss the woes of the farmers, there's no argument from me in that regard.

As for the Thaksin governments helping the poor over 14 years, I believe they did and there is clear evidence of that. You only have to look at the poverty statistics to see it.

Is there corruption among Thaksin governments? Without a doubt but show me a party without corruption.

I guess you could call my support for PTP as picking the best viable option out of a not so great bunch and I'm afraid I'll have to mention the dems because the bunch, in reality of winning elections, only consists of two.

I have to mention the democrats because their policies only began to consider the rural/urban poor when they knew they had to, not because they should.

I believe that the democrats are anti-democracy because they know it won't work for them, so while the PTP are far from perfect, at least they have the upperhand when it comes to upholding the very basic foundation of democracy.

[sirineou]

BANGKOK: -- NIDA Poll says caretaker Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra should step down to allow a neutral prime minister to run the country and resolve the current political deadlock.

Idiotic article, quoting an Idiotic poll.

Why would Thai PBS even publish such trash?

why is anyone in this forum even talking about it?

Even the Fox network in the US would not dare publish such trash.

I bet that if they had interviewed 1251 of Suthep's supporters they might have gotten more than a 56.59% result, might have even gotten 60%

Anyone who does not understand why this poll and article iare Idiotic, is beyond reasoning.

[JRSoul]

"political rallies organized by the PDRC or other protest groups............ 19.02% said they ever took part."

"their future participation in PDRC protest rallies........... 27.5% said they would join, while 10.79% said it depended on situation."

Read the 2 simplified statements above and you will see that future anti-government rallies may well have between 50 and 100% more public servants than before. hopefully that trend will continue across the general public.

Back to our red friends for more spin, lies, and changing of the subject.

[HD 205]

A picture speaks a 1000 words. This is 2 weeks after the coup. Seems he is not saying democracy is lost here. He is not saying "respect my vote here" True yes?

And unlike me not dodging difficult questions like your friends, As for explaining my other points…I support the DEM's because the don't have a Deputy PM telling the voters they are garbage. They don't have a Deputy PM saying he would behead himself. No denying the public a hearing on policy hearings. Not once and I repeat NOT ONCE have the DEMS said to the south, the north and the centre that the voters are garbage. Not once and I repeat not once have the DEM's said to the north "We will not give you an international conference hall until you vote for us"

Thats why I support them. Because I support 15 principles of democracy while the PTP support one.

Simple.

Cheers.

Ok, I agree that there is no argument that could be made to say that Thaksin was against that coup.

While he wasn't in politics at the time, it still makes no difference to his probable views at the time.

As for your support for the democrats, will you be brutally honest with me/yourself and admit that they don't support the fundamental principal of democracy, which is the public vote?

I believe I've been honest enough to admit anything you have pointed out, would you not agree that the democrats don't feel they can get into power by the purest level of democracy?

Would you admit that the only way they can get into power is by ridding the opposition through non-elective means?

I appreciate your honesty in advance.

[casualbiker]

I was correct about him being out of the country during the coup, he wasn't prevented from leaving after he returned in 2008, and he simply chose to stay away when a verdict was handed down under a constitution dictated by the military junta and largely written by the courts passing the verdict. Whether that qualifies as running is open to argument.

Regarding was it really a coup--yeah, with tanks of the street and the military taking over government, I think that qualifies as a coup. How many governments, new organizations, historians, etc. are not calling it a coup?

That's the first time I've ever heard of anyone questioning whether it was a coup or not!

I think many people on here get caught up in a good vs evil line of thinking here, when neither side are either, and that's why we see so many circular arguments.

I think, like you, that it should always be down to the people to decide by their right to vote, no matter what.

Which is why I can't show any respect for the democrat party.

I also agree that the start of democracy is about the vote and personally along with others think that Suthep was a fool not to concede the vote and ensure that the Democrats could participate.

But i also think that the current political - Parliamentary system needs overhauling. As parties are bought into coalitions etc. (a good example is Banharn Silpa Archer's parties, in government since 1997)

Do you also think reform is due?

hd..I also think you know there is more to a democratic government that just winning the highest vote.

Do you think Phua Thai are DEMOCRATIC IN THAT SENSE?

ps: The coup comment was tongue in cheek humour aimed at someone else.. but it looks they have lost their job or been banned!

Edited February 14, 2014 by casualbiker

[HD 205]

I was correct about him being out of the country during the coup, he wasn't prevented from leaving after he returned in 2008, and he simply chose to stay away when a verdict was handed down under a constitution dictated by the military junta and largely written by the courts passing the verdict. Whether that qualifies as running is open to argument.

Regarding was it really a coup--yeah, with tanks of the street and the military taking over government, I think that qualifies as a coup. How many governments, new organizations, historians, etc. are not calling it a coup?

That's the first time I've ever heard of anyone questioning whether it was a coup or not!

I think many people on here get caught up in a good vs evil line of thinking here, when neither side are either, and that's why we see so many circular arguments.

I think, like you, that it should always be down to the people to decide by their right to vote, no matter what.

Which is why I can't show any respect for the democrat party.

I also agree that the start of democracy is about the vote and personally along with others think that Suthep was a fool not to concede the vote and ensure that the Democrats could participate.

But i also think that the current political - Parliamentary system needs overhauling. As parties are bought into coalitions etc. (a good example is Banharn Silpa Archer's parties, in government since 1997)

Do also think so?

hd..I also think you know there is more to a democratic government that just winning the highest vote.

Do you think Phua Thai are DEMOCRATIC IN THAT SENSE?

I do believe it needs an overhaul, another example of parties being bought (even forced) into coalitions is when Abhisit came to power. That's genuinely not meant as a "one up" type comment, just pointing out something that I found disturbing and needs to be cut out as you say.

I 100% agree that there is more to a democratic government than just winning the highest vote but that comes first and foremost.

Do I think PTP have been democratic beyond getting into power? I'm not trying to be difficult but could you be more specific in what you mean.

Do you mean how they act in parliament when voting on bills?

Edit: For spelling

Edited February 14, 2014 by HD 205

[heybruce]

"political rallies organized by the PDRC or other protest groups............ 19.02% said they ever took part."

"their future participation in PDRC protest rallies........... 27.5% said they would join, while 10.79% said it depended on situation."

Read the 2 simplified statements above and you will see that future anti-government rallies may well have between 50 and 100% more public servants than before. hopefully that trend will continue across the general public.

Back to our red friends for more spin, lies, and changing of the subject.

Your math is unfathomable, your conclusions unsubstantiated, and your post incomprehensible. I certainly won't argue with that.

[heybruce]

I was correct about him being out of the country during the coup, he wasn't prevented from leaving after he returned in 2008, and he simply chose to stay away when a verdict was handed down under a constitution dictated by the military junta and largely written by the courts passing the verdict. Whether that qualifies as running is open to argument.

Regarding was it really a coup--yeah, with tanks of the street and the military taking over government, I think that qualifies as a coup. How many governments, new organizations, historians, etc. are not calling it a coup?

That's the first time I've ever heard of anyone questioning whether it was a coup or not!

I think many people on here get caught up in a good vs evil line of thinking here, when neither side are either, and that's why we see so many circular arguments.

I think, like you, that it should always be down to the people to decide by their right to vote, no matter what.

Which is why I can't show any respect for the democrat party.

I also agree that the start of democracy is about the vote and personally along with others think that Suthep was a fool not to concede the vote and ensure that the Democrats could participate.

But i also think that the current political - Parliamentary system needs overhauling. As parties are bought into coalitions etc. (a good example is Banharn Silpa Archer's parties, in government since 1997)

Do also think so?

hd..I also think you know there is more to a democratic government that just winning the highest vote.

Do you think Phua Thai are DEMOCRATIC IN THAT SENSE?

I do believe it needs an overhaul, another example of parties being bought (even forced) into coalitions is when Abhisit came to power. That's genuinely not meant as a "one up" type comment, just pointing out something that I found disturbing and needs to be cut out as you say.

I 100% agree that there is more to a democratic government than just winning the highest vote but that comes first and foremost.

Do I think PTP have been democratic beyond getting into power? I'm not trying to be difficult but could you be more specific in what you mean.

Do you mean how they act in parliment when voting on bills?

There may actually be general agreement here, it seems most think the constitution and the government it dictates needs to be revised. But how to do it?

I would like to see a group of Thai scholars knowledgeable about history, politics and constitutions used throughout the world get together and attempt to draft something for an up or down vote. I would settle for every party submitting its own version of the constitution and letting the Thai people vote for one after an extended education/election campaign.

The wild card is the military, which is very keen to preserve a "traditional" system that gives it considerable power and independence, and its senior officers lucrative ways to supplement their salaries.

But what are the chances?

[sirineou]

I was correct about him being out of the country during the coup, he wasn't prevented from leaving after he returned in 2008, and he simply chose to stay away when a verdict was handed down under a constitution dictated by the military junta and largely written by the courts passing the verdict. Whether that qualifies as running is open to argument.

Regarding was it really a coup--yeah, with tanks of the street and the military taking over government, I think that qualifies as a coup. How many governments, new organizations, historians, etc. are not calling it a coup?

That's the first time I've ever heard of anyone questioning whether it was a coup or not!

I think many people on here get caught up in a good vs evil line of thinking here, when neither side are either, and that's why we see so many circular arguments.

I think, like you, that it should always be down to the people to decide by their right to vote, no matter what.

Which is why I can't show any respect for the democrat party.

I also agree that the start of democracy is about the vote and personally along with others think that Suthep was a fool not to concede the vote and ensure that the Democrats could participate.

But i also think that the current political - Parliamentary system needs overhauling. As parties are bought into coalitions etc. (a good example is Banharn Silpa Archer's parties, in government since 1997)

Do also think so?

hd..I also think you know there is more to a democratic government that just winning the highest vote.

Do you think Phua Thai are DEMOCRATIC IN THAT SENSE?

I do believe it needs an overhaul, another example of parties being bought (even forced) into coalitions is when Abhisit came to power. That's genuinely not meant as a "one up" type comment, just pointing out something that I found disturbing and needs to be cut out as you say.

I 100% agree that there is more to a democratic government than just winning the highest vote but that comes first and foremost.

Do I think PTP have been democratic beyond getting into power? I'm not trying to be difficult but could you be more specific in what you mean.

Do you mean how they act in parliment when voting on bills?

There may actually be general agreement here, it seems most think the constitution and the government it dictates needs to be revised. But how to do it?

I would like to see a group of Thai scholars knowledgeable about history, politics and constitutions used throughout the world get together and attempt to draft something for an up or down vote. I would settle for every party submitting its own version of the constitution and letting the Thai people vote for one after an extended education/election campaign.

The wild card is the military, which is very keen to preserve a "traditional" system that gives it considerable power and independence, and its senior officers lucrative ways to supplement their salaries.

But what are the chances?

There is a saying with in the legal and corporate community.

"A patent is only as good as the lawyers you have to defend it"

The same applies to any constitution, A constitution regardless of how good it is, It is not worth the paper it is written on ,unless there are in place strong institutions willing to defend it.

[casualbiker]

I was correct about him being out of the country during the coup, he wasn't prevented from leaving after he returned in 2008, and he simply chose to stay away when a verdict was handed down under a constitution dictated by the military junta and largely written by the courts passing the verdict. Whether that qualifies as running is open to argument.

Regarding was it really a coup--yeah, with tanks of the street and the military taking over government, I think that qualifies as a coup. How many governments, new organizations, historians, etc. are not calling it a coup?

That's the first time I've ever heard of anyone questioning whether it was a coup or not!

I think many people on here get caught up in a good vs evil line of thinking here, when neither side are either, and that's why we see so many circular arguments.

I think, like you, that it should always be down to the people to decide by their right to vote, no matter what.

Which is why I can't show any respect for the democrat party.

I also agree that the start of democracy is about the vote and personally along with others think that Suthep was a fool not to concede the vote and ensure that the Democrats could participate.

But i also think that the current political - Parliamentary system needs overhauling. As parties are bought into coalitions etc. (a good example is Banharn Silpa Archer's parties, in government since 1997)

Do also think so?

hd..I also think you know there is more to a democratic government that just winning the highest vote.

Do you think Phua Thai are DEMOCRATIC IN THAT SENSE?

I do believe it needs an overhaul, another example of parties being bought (even forced) into coalitions is when Abhisit came to power. That's genuinely not meant as a "one up" type comment, just pointing out something that I found disturbing and needs to be cut out as you say.

I 100% agree that there is more to a democratic government than just winning the highest vote but that comes first and foremost.

Do I think PTP have been democratic beyond getting into power? I'm not trying to be difficult but could you be more specific in what you mean.

Do you mean how they act in parliament when voting on bills?

Edit: For spelling

That would do for starters.. I'm of to bed. Chat tomorrow. Night all!

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[HD 205]

I was correct about him being out of the country during the coup, he wasn't prevented from leaving after he returned in 2008, and he simply chose to stay away when a verdict was handed down under a constitution dictated by the military junta and largely written by the courts passing the verdict. Whether that qualifies as running is open to argument.

Regarding was it really a coup--yeah, with tanks of the street and the military taking over government, I think that qualifies as a coup. How many governments, new organizations, historians, etc. are not calling it a coup?

That's the first time I've ever heard of anyone questioning whether it was a coup or not!

I think many people on here get caught up in a good vs evil line of thinking here, when neither side are either, and that's why we see so many circular arguments.

I think, like you, that it should always be down to the people to decide by their right to vote, no matter what.

Which is why I can't show any respect for the democrat party.

I also agree that the start of democracy is about the vote and personally along with others think that Suthep was a fool not to concede the vote and ensure that the Democrats could participate.

But i also think that the current political - Parliamentary system needs overhauling. As parties are bought into coalitions etc. (a good example is Banharn Silpa Archer's parties, in government since 1997)

Do also think so?

hd..I also think you know there is more to a democratic government that just winning the highest vote.

Do you think Phua Thai are DEMOCRATIC IN THAT SENSE?

I do believe it needs an overhaul, another example of parties being bought (even forced) into coalitions is when Abhisit came to power. That's genuinely not meant as a "one up" type comment, just pointing out something that I found disturbing and needs to be cut out as you say.

I 100% agree that there is more to a democratic government than just winning the highest vote but that comes first and foremost.

Do I think PTP have been democratic beyond getting into power? I'm not trying to be difficult but could you be more specific in what you mean.

Do you mean how they act in parliment when voting on bills?

There may actually be general agreement here, it seems most think the constitution and the government it dictates needs to be revised. But how to do it?

I would like to see a group of Thai scholars knowledgeable about history, politics and constitutions used throughout the world get together and attempt to draft something for an up or down vote. I would settle for every party submitting its own version of the constitution and letting the Thai people vote for one after an extended education/election campaign.

The wild card is the military, which is very keen to preserve a "traditional" system that gives it considerable power and independence, and its senior officers lucrative ways to supplement their salaries.

But what are the chances?

Thai democracy is still very much, realistically speaking, in its infancy, so the chances of such a solution (I realise you were asking rhetorically) are very far away.

For any country coming from the rule of some form of dictatorship/military rule, making the jump from mass obedience, to one side accepting that another side can and will have more say at times, is not an easy change to accept.

This is how we can understand why these protests occur, whether we agree or not, given the history so far in how problems with governments have been 'solved'.

In reality, I think the people all over Thailand - now including the heavily populated rural areas - have only truly began to appreciate the real power of democracy, but that's purely my opinion.

So yeah, basically it's gonna be a long, difficult struggle!

[JRSoul]

"political rallies organized by the PDRC or other protest groups............ 19.02% said they ever took part."

"their future participation in PDRC protest rallies........... 27.5% said they would join, while 10.79% said it depended on situation."

Read the 2 simplified statements above and you will see that future anti-government rallies may well have between 50 and 100% more public servants than before. hopefully that trend will continue across the general public.

Back to our red friends for more spin, lies, and changing of the subject.

Your math is unfathomable, your conclusions unsubstantiated, and your post incomprehensible. I certainly won't argue with that.

Perhaps I should have included my working so that the mathematically challenged and simply stupid can understand.

19% HAVE taken part in rallies,

27.5% said they WOULD take part.

27.5 -19 = 8.5

8.5 is a (nearly) 50% increase on 19.

10.8% said they MAY take part

10.8 is more than 50% of 19. (57%)

If the protesters who have taken part continue, and those that state intent join, the number of public servants protesting will increase by slightly less than 50%. And if those who state that they may participate do join, the numbers will increase by a further 50% (of the original), making a 100% increase.

so there is a strong likelihood of a 50 - 100% increase in the number of public servants.

BTW have you misspelled "Hay"?

Edited February 14, 2014 by JRSoul

[AleG]

I have been waiting to say this for ages.

"Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

I can read from the pro "1 principle of democracy" supporters that this is really getting under their skin.

First the majority didn't vote. Off the majority that did vote only 70% voted for one of the 50 parties.

Then the poll that said 60% wanted yingluck to step down. Then the poll that showed over 80% believed the PTP and or the PM (not the boss Thaksin) were involved in corruption in the rice scheme.

The majority keeps speaking and the "1 principle" supporters keep denying. I LOVE IT!!!

And to make me sleep even better tonight is that even with all the majority against them, it means nothing because the PM (not the boss) and most of the minsters involved in the rice scheme will be impeached and charged with corruption.

I say this day coming, not when the rice scheme was implemented, not when the first car scheme was implemented, but the second after they said another SHinwatra would run in it. The only clean Shinawatra left will be tainted with the same brush as the rest of her family soon.

I will say not once more after I press my SMUG mode button.

PTP - "Time to listen to the will of the majority……..Even if you don't like it!!!"

SMUG mode off

I won't point out the obvious flaws in this poll, I'll just ask you this: Do you think the leaders of western democracies should resign whenever their poll numbers drop below 50%?

Do you think the leaders of western democracies should resign whenever their poll numbers drop below 50%?

Perhaps not, but do you think leaders of western democracies should resign if:

-The have proven to lack leadership and have repeatedly mismanagement their own policies?

-They take orders from a fugitive living abroad?

-Provide a new passport for that same fugitive and refusing to answer for the action?

-They neglect their duties (as in not attending a single meeting of the Rice Committee, which she is chairperson of)?

-Being under investigation for corruption?

-Shown a complete lack of transparency in the use of public money?

-Trying to pass legislation to whitewash 10 years worth of prosecutions against corruption?

-Place cronies in their cabinets that are unfit for the position from either a professional or ethical point of view?

-Ignored rulings from the courts?

How about whenever all of the above, and more, are put together together?