What If Peaceblondie

[ratchabuild]

What if..............having seen both sides of the coin, your parner could magically have their personality and character transferred into the body of an attractive woman. Would you love the woman? Or if the partner became a Ladyboy having to all intents and appearences the body of a woman but retaining the sexuality of a man would you love your partner. To belabour the point what is it about partners that we love and if they changed radically would we still love them. It's easy to say for better or worse, but does that mean disablement or disfigurement? Wouldn't you be pretty shallow to leave after that? But would the loving continue after the physical desire went, perhaps because of the accident or illness. I think people who have a bi or hetero and/or gay background have a unique perspective to offer because at different times they can find both or either sex attractive sexually. Therefore perhaps they are well placed to answer the question What is love? and can you truly sav you love someone if you cannot separate the mind from the body because people are so much more than just a body. Does sex and sexuality get in the way of love? Or are you just lucky to have both? It seems to me if you can't define it you cannot know it. Any body (no pun intended) got any answers?

[Ijustwannateach]

1. What does Peaceblondie have to do with this thread?

2. As has been already pointed out in the ladyboy thread, this is the gay forum, where most of us are men who sexually prefer human bodies with male characteristics; e.g., usually no breasts and male genitalia. I would venture a guess OP is not gay, or he wouldn't belabour the point. Your premise of "magic" is simply silly; it happens often enough that a gay man dating what he thinks is another gay man finds out that his partner is suddenly growing breasts or planning an operation.

As I mentioned, most of us are gay men. We've signed on for gay relationships, usually to start with men who are mostly men. If our partners were completely open about their "feminization" plans, and we accepted those at the start, then we would have a moral and emotional obligation to stay on for the duration. If those plans were not discussed, then they are either a deception or a new element, and in such cases renegotiation of a relationship is the right of the deceived or surprised partner. As sexuality is a major factor in a relationship, changing or renegotiating our primary relationship in reaction to such an event is not shallow at all. I suppose to cover one's bases, one should mention directly to his partner early on if one is open to MTF "trans"formations or not.

I would hope that I could remain friends with a partner even if he deceived or surprised me in this regard, but I certainly would not consider him my main sexual partner or lover any longer.

With this surge of interest in the topic by *ahem* straight readers, perhaps we could open a Thaivisa "ladyboys" forum? These topics are really not that relevant to most of us gay guys.

"Steven"

[ratchabuild]

1. What does Peaceblondie have to do with this thread?

2. As has been already pointed out in the ladyboy thread, this is the gay forum, where most of us are men who sexually prefer human bodies with male characteristics; e.g., usually no breasts and male genitalia. I would venture a guess OP is not gay, or he wouldn't belabour the point. Your premise of "magic" is simply silly; it happens often enough that a gay man dating what he thinks is another gay man finds out that his partner is suddenly growing breasts or planning an operation.

As I mentioned, most of us are gay men. We've signed on for gay relationships, usually to start with men who are mostly men. If our partners were completely open about their "feminization" plans, and we accepted those at the start, then we would have a moral and emotional obligation to stay on for the duration. If those plans were not discussed, then they are either a deception or a new element, and in such cases renegotiation of a relationship is the right of the deceived or surprised partner. As sexuality is a major factor in a relationship, changing or renegotiating our primary relationship in reaction to such an event is not shallow at all. I suppose to cover one's bases, one should mention directly to his partner early on if one is open to MTF "trans"formations or not.

I would hope that I could remain friends with a partner even if he deceived or surprised me in this regard, but I certainly would not consider him my main sexual partner or lover any longer.

With this surge of interest in the topic by *ahem* straight readers, perhaps we could open a Thaivisa "ladyboys" forum? These topics are really not that relevant to most of us gay guys.

"Steven"

You've missed the point Steven its not about deceit, its not about any actual changes, I was asking PeaceBlondie who is one of the most interesting and intelligent posters about what constitutes love. I could equally ask a straight man in love with a hetero woman if they could love 'that' personality and character in another body or in a gay person. Its about how imprtant sexuality is to us. If its not that important then what counts is the relationship and that doesn't have to be sexual; I simply used the ladyboy metaphor to suggest that appearences can be deceptive whereas character and personality don't change that much unless there is some underlying illness. It's simply asking a person whose thoughts on the subject I respect what his view of love and attraction is. How much is sexual, how much is it the whole package and how much is it character and personailty and that last category seems to me to have the potential to be A-sexual to an extent and therefore capable of being loved whatever the sexuality, be it gay straight or bi. I was thinking about it because I always assumed love and sex to be closely linked until a friend witha supposedly successful marriage said they had not had sex for ten years, though had sex with others, but so loved each other the sexuality was irrelevant. They were going to stay together isrrespective of anything else. That I found hard to understand and wanted PeaceBlondies opinion. Having read with interest all his posts.

Edited June 27, 2006 by ratchabuild

[Ijustwannateach]

Ok... didn't mean to give you a hard time, but it was a strange post (and we've had too many ladyboy-based trolls lately). Hope you don't mind others jumping in, as it is a public thread- if you want solitary commentary from PB, maybe a PM is best!

Personally speaking, I'd say sexual matters have to be squared away correctly for the primary romantic/sexual relationship. I may know sweet, wonderful ladies that I consider attractive, but I'll never choose any of them for my primary relationship and if some sort of strange thing of the type you propose happened, I'd have to renegotiate the relationship. I'm not going to be celibate. The same would be true if my partner suddenly suffered a loss of sexual function or was withholding sex for a long period of time. It wouldn't mean that I wouldn't keep my friendship, love, or other parts of my relationship with the partner- but these things are not eternal and unchanging. All of our lives all of our relationships must constantly develop.

"Steven"

[mayacan]

Hmmm.....very interesting "what if".....

I guess it would all depend on what you define is LOVE. For some Love is only in the physical, others base love on the spiritual, yet for others, love might be based on the cerebral....Then you have the others elements of personaility, character, and one's humanity. Anyone of us will be define love is our own way.

"The greatest joy you'll ever learn, is just to love, and to be loved in return"

So if your love is simply based on "giving" of yourself to another, with no set pre-conditions, just the giving of you, your heart, your spirit, your time, your ear, your entire being....it shouldn't matter if your lover/ spouse changed their physical appearance for you love them for who they are

as a human being, for their inner essence, for their spiritual essence.......and you should love them as they grow and change with each day,for nothing is permanent.

If you giving your love for any pre-conditions, sex, favors, money, stopping the lonliness, etc...then you really don't know about love.

If the person you love changes their sexuality...it is a re-birth of the spirit.....we must free ourselves of these attachments and cravings, and let ourselves truly enjoy the beauty and gift of love, for love is allowing someone to be free....to grow, change, be who they want to be. If you detach yourself from all your mental and physical barriers, and allow your heart to open to other virtues, caring, compassion, and love...pure love....giving love....then it should not matter what your lover/spouse does...because life is about constant change, change is constant, love change, love growth, love, give, love.....

Peace,

Mayacan

[PeaceBlondie]

Hi there, folks. It's always scary to scan the latest topic titles and see your own pretend-name right there. Gulp, well, I could start with "unaccustomed as I am to speaking in public," but that's not true.

ratchabuild, I guess I should be a gentleman and thank you for your comments here, except....I don't know what you're talking about!

I did that "hetero" thingie for decades, and finally decided that my long-term partner had the wrong anatomy. She's still a friend of mine, but I'm long past the point where I could get excited about female genitalia. The flag would not fly. So, I can't imagine.

Oh, my current boyfriend.....he's always been gay, and he's never been a ladyboy, never wanted to have those female thingamajigs. Nah, it's like asking us to turn into some bizarre cartoon characters, or two different science fiction aliens. Not going to happen.

Imagine asking a hetero person, "What if you woke up tomorrow and suddenly discovered that your partner of the opposite gender suddenly morphed into your own gender?" Huh?

Maybe your point in starting this, ratchabuild, was not trollish. While we're imagining (disk jockey, cue John Lennon's Imagine all the people, yearning to be transgendered....."), let's imagine this was all a trolly thingy. Thanks, y'all.

[Scott]

Would I love him-- h*ll no! I doubt that I would even tolerate him.

[PeaceBlondie]

In all fairness to the opening post, whether it was trollish or trannish, let's have the hetero posters imagine - okay, more specifically, the macho men with feminine, female, frilly, negligee-and-bra wearing wives can just imagine something like this: One day, after leading up to the subject, your lovely lass says, "I want be man, I want go doctor and get quay, and chop off my boobies - okay, fan?" Would your love for your "wife" - soon to be former wife, maybe your new ex-husband - force you to love her as a man?

I think not. But hey, This is Amaaaazing Thailand; the Thai surgeons could probably do that kind of operation. Or, maybe the lovely lady would want to start speaking in a false lower voice, wear men's clothes, and what - find other ladyboys? Are there boyladys? What if you're already married to a Tom or a Dee and she hasn't told you?

There are some great jokes here somewhere....

[Boon Mee]

What does Peaceblondie have to do with this thread?

Because he used to have the cutest avatar a while back before Peter Pan?