Russian out-in visa runs ‘same as other nationalities’ – Thai Immigration chief

[BlackJack]

thin line between unique and discrimination

eh?

Well, Thais have a hard time traveling to many countries, including perhaps your own...

no not at all

took the GF there before

have helped many get T visa's

had many Thai students in my country as well

But Thailand really needs to work on its anti discrimination laws

its not just in travel it has to be across all fields

I don't know where you're from, but I know of cases of Thai women being refused entry to the US, UK, Australia, and especially Singapore where I currently reside, oftentimes traveling with or going to meet their bf. But if you don't believe me, see the list of examples below. And it's not just about denial of visas or denial of entry, it's all the hoops they have to jump through just to apply to go for a two week holiday somewhere.

http://www.thaiwifevisa.com/ (claims over 50% of tourist visa applications from Thais are refused by Australia)

http://ukthaivisa.wordpress.com/2010/01/08/my-thai-girlfriend-has-been-refused-a-uk-visitors-visa/

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/482954-tourist-visa-for-my-thai-girlfriend/page-2

http://www.udonmap.com/udonthaniforum/how-korean-immigration-treats-thais-t28185.html

http://sgforums.com/forums/12/topics/415350

I totally agree

but what they (immigration) look for is a reason to return to Thailand

thats number one on their list as they dont want them running off into hiding and not returning to Thailand

also they need money to support themselves

normally a job in Thailand helps as many say they want 90 days and immigrations says hang on how can they be away from their job for 90 days

then a bank book with regular savings helps

perhaps a bank agreement to say they are paying off a car or house or condo

and then lastly I tell the girls to dye their hair back to its normally black colour instead of blond or light brown

and of course cover up the tatts (tramp stamps as they call them at immigration) and oh yeah remove all the studs from their face, ears and tongue

and dont take pictures of yourself in front of the bar where you work with the new punter you have just hooked.

And for the USA dont argue with the interviewing officer as they can spot one a mile off.

Normally when we get that sorted there's a good chance they will get their visa.

[Igor]

What happens if you are a tourist but owning a condo and wnat to live in your own accomodation?

Not to be pedantic, but if you own a residence here, that sort if autiomatically means you are not a tourist but a, well, resident! Maybe only a part time resident but still...

[brianp0803]

I agree with the technical definition.

A tourist is exploring the area and experiencing the culture.

Someone with the money to own a vacation home to escape cold winters for a few months and then return to their primary home would be cslled- - what?

If anyone wants to have a holiday home and come a lot but live in their home country 60% of the time and can show financial ability they don't need to work then allow them to be tourist.

Why do people that want to be long term tourist object to request to show financial capability to support themselves without working.

Probably because they don't have money and working.

Or is a tourist someone that lives 60% of their lives somewhere else and cones to the same place every year with enough money to relax and not working.

[TechnikaIII]

I agree with the technical definition.

A tourist is exploring the area and experiencing the culture.

Someone with the money to own a vacation home to escape cold winters for a few months and then return to their primary home would be cslled- - what?

If anyone wants to have a holiday home and come a lot but live in their home country 60% of the time and can show financial ability they don't need to work then allow them to be tourist.

Why do people that want to be long term tourist object to request to show financial capability to support themselves without working.

Probably because they don't have money and working.

Or is a tourist someone that lives 60% of their lives somewhere else and cones to the same place every year with enough money to relax and not working.

"Or is a tourist someone that lives 60% of their lives somewhere else and comes to the same place every year with enough money to relax and not working."

Yep. That is precisely what I do, except that it is more like 50%. I come back to the same place every time, then go to other parts of Thailand. I suppose there will be knuckle-heads who question the way I spend my time. I don't go near bars, nor do I go anywhere near jet skis.

Having a semi-permanent base means I don't I have to fly with a heavy camera tripod and other gear, that I use in my chosen retirement activities .. photography and painting. By paying for accommodation, and maintaining it during my absences, I possibly even qualify as a 'Preferred Tourist'. I bring money to the country, and never take any out.

Two visits ago, the Immigration officer I've met a few times, was driving past and stopped at the roadside where I was set up with large-format camera, "Hi ! How are you? I haven't seen you a long time! .. ohh I hope I can see the photos when ready" .. big smiles all round .. She stayed and talked 10 minutes or so.

I qualify for Retirement Visa. They know it, and know I will apply when it suits me. For now, I have to be elsewhere in the world a lot of the time.

[menorah]

What an absolute farce.

I took the advice of so many TV posters saying to stop moaning and 'get the right Visa'. So I tried.

Flew back to the UK to visit the Thai embassy and explain my situation, and ask for a 1 year multiple entry visa based on having family and finances in Thailand;

I'm under 50 but have a Thai partner, own a house together, have a baby together but not married yet. Work outside of Thailand and have enough money in a Thai bank account to survive for a few years.

This is what they told me. "You need Tourist Visa". "But I work outside Thailand and leave and enter every 45 days or so, I need a Visa that allows me to do so."

I was told I have no more rights to live in Thailand than a backbacker has, even though I have invested and I spend all of my money there. Apparently I have no legal rights over my child also if I am not married.

Obviously I can apply for the Elite card, but to now I feel like I am being shafted out of 10 grand because I have the wrong passport.

All you posters who have the correct Visa that suits your own needs then well done I am so happy for you. But don't be so frigging patronizing to people who don't have the correct Visa through no fault of their own, but due to the shambolic system that just makes up and changes the rules whenever it suits their own agendas. These decisions are causing families to suffer, tourism numbers to drop and of course giving the impression of an unorganized and very unfair system.

Thanks so much for reeling us in and then booting us out. Mission accomplished I guess.

In deference to Tonglen, I'm very happy to apologise to you for what may were perhaps flippant and spiteful commentary. Had you explained fully, as you have here, I would have understood the frustrations behind your post.

So many posts are written on TV without any prior research and by foreign nationals looking for a 'quick fix'...nothing else matters to them.

Your own situation is not unique and there is really no 'security' for you until you reach age 50, place 400K or 800K in a bank and acquire a 'retirement' visa.

Your Thai GF, wife will only ever own the land any property stands upon and in fact can only legally accept funding from you for land, property or material asset while remaining unmarried.

You are legally allowed to set up a Usufruct agreement detailing the right to enjoy access to across land and property thereon for a maximum term of 30 years.

After all is said and done, the best way to obtain a multi entry visa, since being the biological parent to a child in Thailand does not automatically grant any concessions, is to marry your GF legally . I'd advise CM since it's less busy and they offer a 'fast track service for nominal fee.

Once married you can obtain a Multi Entry visa easily. Immigration will also be far more flexible regarding extensions to permissions to stay when the father is married to the mother & produces the child for sight at an immigration check point. I know this from experience.

Finally, it should be remembered that a good relationship between yourself & your 'local' immigration office or check point, goes a long way toward how flexible the immigration staff will be.

The rules relating to immigration, irrespective of what anyone says are in fact government guidelines. The officer dealing with your specific needs has the right of discretion and can be as flexible or inflexible as he/she sees fit and based upon his/her impression of you,whether right or wrong.

Again, I know this from experience with Immigration at Nakhonsawan & Maesot crossing, both very good locations.

Good luck and apologies for my lapse into cyber bullying' as defined by, 'The People's Advocate'.

Rather than pigeonhole my quote as "The Peoples Advocate" why don't you and your parochial ilk define it for what it is: The vox populi.

There are too many here acting as a collective Thai Visa Clotho/Lachesis/Atropos - deciding the ultimate fate of a simple inquiry.

There are many here searching for answers that don't want/need the inane tripe disseminated as posts.

Your resultant post was informative. If it started out that way, I wouldn't have posted my smarmy response.

My apologies if I sounded like a "Community Policeman."

Such a shame that to some people an apology is never enough....I tried my best !

I would have been equally recipient of your apology for smarm had it not been preceded with the 'vox populi' doing its own pigeon-holing of 'me and my ilk' as parochial. Then to 'cap it all' the smarm made another appearance in the shape of Greek Mythology but of course 'vox populi' could not or would not accept parochial commentators held sufficient intelligence or wit to determine the spurious and back handed' insult.

" The Lord giveth & The Lord taketh away'.......thankfullu you're not The Lord !

For my own part I'll terminate further commentary here, since none of it is relevant to baxida's original post.

Hopefully we've learnt something along the way.

For myself...a degree of humility and the fact that on occasion,'vox populi' may also be found with its head stuck firmly where the sun don't shine !

Best of luck with your quest baxida.

[Docno]

Well, Thais have a hard time traveling to many countries, including perhaps your own...

no not at all

took the GF there before

have helped many get T visa's

had many Thai students in my country as well

But Thailand really needs to work on its anti discrimination laws

its not just in travel it has to be across all fields

I don't know where you're from, but I know of cases of Thai women being refused entry to the US, UK, Australia, and especially Singapore where I currently reside, oftentimes traveling with or going to meet their bf. But if you don't believe me, see the list of examples below. And it's not just about denial of visas or denial of entry, it's all the hoops they have to jump through just to apply to go for a two week holiday somewhere.

http://www.thaiwifevisa.com/ (claims over 50% of tourist visa applications from Thais are refused by Australia)

http://ukthaivisa.wordpress.com/2010/01/08/my-thai-girlfriend-has-been-refused-a-uk-visitors-visa/

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/482954-tourist-visa-for-my-thai-girlfriend/page-2

http://www.udonmap.com/udonthaniforum/how-korean-immigration-treats-thais-t28185.html

http://sgforums.com/forums/12/topics/415350

I totally agree

but what they (immigration) look for is a reason to return to Thailand

thats number one on their list as they dont want them running off into hiding and not returning to Thailand

also they need money to support themselves

normally a job in Thailand helps as many say they want 90 days and immigrations says hang on how can they be away from their job for 90 days

then a bank book with regular savings helps

perhaps a bank agreement to say they are paying off a car or house or condo

and then lastly I tell the girls to dye their hair back to its normally black colour instead of blond or light brown

and of course cover up the tatts (tramp stamps as they call them at immigration) and oh yeah remove all the studs from their face, ears and tongue

and dont take pictures of yourself in front of the bar where you work with the new punter you have just hooked.

And for the USA dont argue with the interviewing officer as they can spot one a mile off.

Normally when we get that sorted there's a good chance they will get their visa.

. Yes, I always tell my gf to travel with minimum makeup and dressed like a Mormon. She rarely has problems (knock on wood). But she's a farmer's daughter who runs her own one-woman beauty shop. Not much in the way of savings. And certainly not in a professional role that ties her down back home. But can you imagine how you/we would feel if we had to basically justify ourselves every time we go on holiday and worry about if we're going to catch an immigration officer having a bad day. When I go to Thailand on holiday, the officer barely looks at me... stamp stamp, and you're through. And no expectation that I can speak Thai. When a Thai girl goes to another country, she may get grilled, and will have a harder time if she doesn't speak the local lingo. That's simply my point... Thais going overseas face more hurdles than westerners going to Thailand. If Russia has dropped some of these hurdles, it's not surprising that Thailand reciprocates by making life easier for Russian tourists. We might see it as discrimination because we don't have the same entitlements, but the Thais would understandably feel that our countries discriminate against them at the border (with all these extra hurdles I've mentioned).

[Fairynuff]

@brianp0803 being a tourist or not is not defined by percentages, nor is it defined by the type of accommodation that person stays in. Perhaps the true definition is how one spends their time in the country? One could be in a country of this size for years without leaving and still be touring/traveling the length and breadth of the country whilst returning regularly to a condo/rental apartment/house.

[brianp0803]

Interesting suggestion.

A person could regularly stay in one location but while traveling the length and breath of Thailand would require many hotels in many locations.

I am sure having a base vacation home but having hotel recipes through the length and breath of Thailand would be acceptable.

Unlikely someone with enough money to travel for a year would need hotels while exploring the vast country.

Very inconvenient to travel to Chiang Mai in the morning and return the same day. Very very unlikely

[paz]

As always, all the discussion about who is a tourist and who is not, is useless. For Thai immigration, anyone not working is a tourist, can enter and stay in country.

“We have found that [many] do not come for tourism purposes. Lots of them are working illegally and are doing out-in visa runs in order to continue working.”
He explained that if they cannot prove that they are re-entering the country for tourism (for example by showing hotel bookings, a ticket out of the country or sufficient funds to support themselves while in Thailand), “They won’t be allowed in.”

These are Immigration chief words, not mine. That is, as long one has money and is not working illegally, is fine.

[brianp0803]

Why are many people complaining about providing proof the have enough money and will not need to work?

[paz]

Why are many people complaining about providing proof the have enough money and will not need to work?

Because there is no "proper visa" for them and the inconvenience and cost of getting alternative visa and extensions is bigger than for people that can secure a "proper visa".

[TheSpade]

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I agree with the technical definition.

A tourist is exploring the area and experiencing the culture.

Someone with the money to own a vacation home to escape cold winters for a few months and then return to their primary home would be cslled- - what?
If anyone wants to have a holiday home and come a lot but live in their home country 60% of the time and can show financial ability they don't need to work then allow them to be tourist.

Why do people that want to be long term tourist object to request to show financial capability to support themselves without working.

Probably because they don't have money and working.

Or is a tourist someone that lives 60% of their lives somewhere else and cones to the same place every year with enough money to relax and not working.

I don't think there can be a set definition of a tourist.

I've went to places before and spent months just in one city and not went exploring further.

Other trips I've moved around every few days, seeing the sights, doing activities etc.

I was still a tourist in both instances really.

As someone who likes to spend long period of time in Thailand and doesn't have to work there to do so I'd be happy to show immigration bank statements for financial proof but it seems that even when immigration is grilling people and suspicious they don't seem to ask for these sorts of things.

Numerous reports on here that people were grilled about their plans for Thailand due to lots of time spent in country in recent years yet never were they asked for proof of income, travel itineraries etc.

[brianp0803]

Would you agree that not many young people have both time and money for even 3 month holiday.

Most people under 45 are you building their career and have no time.

Very few successful people take 6 month holidays.

People with no job have no money.

But many people over 40 have saved enough to relax in Thailand but maybe not enough for frequent hotels.

There are exceptions but the number is quite small

[paz]

Would you agree that not many young people have both time and money for even 3 month holiday.

Most people under 45 are you building their career and have no time.

Very few successful people take 6 month holidays.

People with no job have no money.

But many people over 40 have saved enough to relax in Thailand but maybe not enough for frequent hotels.

There are exceptions but the number is quite small

Not a small number. And not much money is needed to stay well in Thailand.

[TheSpade]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Would you agree that not many young people have both time and money for even 3 month holiday.
Most people under 45 are you building their career and have no time.
Very few successful people take 6 month holidays.

People with no job have no money.

But many people over 40 have saved enough to relax in Thailand but maybe not enough for frequent hotels.

There are exceptions but the number is quite small

SE Asia filled with young backpackers on 3-6 months trips but I doubt you could say they have "lots of money" or are "successful".

There's also a huge amount of people in this modern age who are young, mobile and global and have regular income (often passive) coming in from online businesses who have a lot of time, money to spend, and no traditional 'job'.

They are all over SE Asia especially in Thailand.

[JLCrab]

Next time just show Thai Immigration your P60 form

[brianp0803]

Recent college graduate on 3-6 month trip on small budget I believe.

2 year tourist I don't believe. Possibly they have money but probably not tourist. Maybe ambitious and using their money to start new business in Thailand.

Ambitious people are usually always trying to make more money and no time for extended holiday relaxing and being a true tourist

[Fairynuff]

Some very weird theories going on here!