Man Detained In Thailand Over Jonbenet Death

[Beavis and Butthead]

Patsy Ramsey could certainly be the killer. She may have been jealous of Daddy's little girl and committed the horrific crime. She might have been legally insane. After reading that analysis of the ransom note, it certainly looks like she wrote it

[LoveDaBlues]

Patsy Ramsey could certainly be the killer. She may have been jealous of Daddy's little girl and committed the horrific crime. She might have been legally insane. After reading that analysis of the ransom note, it certainly looks like she wrote it

Read this Butthead:

http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Estates/5046/ransom.html

This ransom note has been 'analyzed' to death.

Patsy Ramsey, by all accounts, was the one who encouraged JonBenet to enter the pageants and she loved their time together at these events. NOTHING in the background of either parent would suggest they were capable of this crime. Bottom line....an inexperienced (with regards to murder) police force that botched the case. Both parents normal, well adjusted people who have been put under a microscope and guess what.....nothing abnormal has been revealed. How many people can stand up to this kind of scrutiny?

Edited August 19, 2006 by LoveDaBlues

[Beavis and Butthead]

Where's the footprints in the snow, Mr Blue? That note surely looks like a female wrote it who was mighty close to Mr Ramsey.

http://www.statementanalysis.com/ramseynote/

[Beavis and Butthead]

duplicate post

Edited August 19, 2006 by Beavis and Butthead

[Merlin]

there's too many holes in this case - some of them big enough to drive a truck through.

He said he had chloroformed her and had sex with her and then realised she was dead from too much chloroform, and so it was an accident.

YET... :

* the autopsy said there was no drugs present in her blood system

* there was no evidence of sex just before death

* she had a head wound which would have rendered her unconcious

* cause of death was strangulation by a nylon cord around her neck, tightened by the handle of a paint brush [how do you "accidentally" tighten a rope around soneone's neck???]

* she was NOT a virgin [yet had not had sex just before death] indicating she was sexually active in the months/years BEFORE she died.

remember, this is a SIX year old girl we're talking about...

Oh and Thailand is the pedo's paradise.

yeh right.

[glassdude007]

Wow! So Sad Patsy could not have lived to have seen this! There was a huge cloud of suspicion over the family that has not yet completely lifted! Plus a blight on Boulder's reputation due to the police never solving this case! Good News! I sure hope this pans out to be true!

this guy is just getting his 15 minutes of fame to get his pheofile ass out of a thai jail/stituation dont sleep yet patsy...IMHO

[loveandlaughter]

This is from Saturday's Guardian - British newspaper.

Seems that what the man said to the police in Bangkok is confused as to the facts of the case and he may be amking it all up

DNA tests to decide if JonBenet murder suspect is fantasist

· Questions raised over bizarre remarks to police

· Ex-wife casts doubt on credibility of confession

· Questions raised over bizarre remarks to police

· Ex-wife casts doubt on credibility of confession

DNA testing will decide whether John Mark Karr, the man arrested in Bangkok in connection with the 1996 murder of JonBenet Ramsey, was involved in the six-year-old's death or is a fantasist.

As prosecutors awaited Mr Karr's return to the US from Thailand doubts surfaced about the bizarre nature of his confession and remarks he made to Thai police during questioning.

Thai immigration police said he had confessed that he collected JonBenet from school and drugged her with chloroform before sexually assaulting her. But the child beauty queen's body was found on Boxing Day 1996, during the school holidays. No traces of chloroform were found in her autopsy and she had not been raped.

DNA was found beneath the girl's fingernails and on her clothing that came from a Caucasian white male. Authorities have never said whether the DNA matched anyone on an FBI database.

A DNA mouth swab test was carried out on Mr Karr in Bangkok. The results are unknown. He will be given another test when he is handed over to prosecutors in Boulder, Colorado, where the murder took place.

"DNA is the big ticket, the 600lb gorilla in this case," the former Denver prosecutor Craig Silverman told the Rocky Mountain News. "If his DNA doesn't match, that's a huge problem for the prosecution. If it's a match, then it's game, set and match for the state."

Other doubts surfaced about Mr Karr's credibility. His former wife said that she was with him in Alabama throughout the Christmas of 1996. "She cannot think of a Christmas while they were together when he was away from the family on Christmas Day or immediately thereafter," said her attorney, Michael Rains.

A series of emails between Mr Karr and Michael Tracey, a British academic who has made three television documentaries about the case, also cast doubt on his state of mind. In one, he asked Prof Tracey to recite an ode called JonBenet, My Love at the child's grave. "JonBenet, my love, my life," it read. "I love you and shall forever love you. I pray that you can hear my voice calling out to you from my darkness - this darkness that now separates us."

In other emails Mr Karr expressed sympathy for Michael Jackson at the time he was facing child molestation charges, compared himself to Peter Pan, and referred to children as his peer group.

Prof Tracey, of the University of Colorado, who alerted police to the emails, said: "Let him have his day in court and let JonBenet have her day in court and let's see how it plays out."

Further details about Mr Karr's background emerged yesterday. He was married twice, both times to 15-year-old girls, and had three children.

[glassdude007]

Hey

The late night ABC News has just said that the suspect is being held by FBI Agents in Thailand awaiting the arrival of US Marshalls who will facilitate his extradition.

Apparently he gave details nor previously released by the authorities to a person he was communicating with back in Boulder CO.

There is a Special Report on Nightline on ABC tonight with Barbara Walters, who had previously interviewed both John & Patsy Ramsey.

Kind regards

Peter

this must be true if BABERA WA WA IS REPORTING IT....

.........daaa NOT GUILTY BY REASONE OF INSANITY...

[sonnyJ]

there's too many holes in this case - some of them big enough to drive a truck through.

He said he had chloroformed her and had sex with her and then realised she was dead from too much chloroform, and so it was an accident.

YET... :

* the autopsy said there was no drugs present in her blood system

* there was no evidence of sex just before death

* she had a head wound which would have rendered her unconcious

* cause of death was strangulation by a nylon cord around her neck, tightened by the handle of a paint brush [how do you "accidentally" tighten a rope around soneone's neck???]

* she was NOT a virgin [yet had not had sex just before death] indicating she was sexually active in the months/years BEFORE she died.

remember, this is a SIX year old girl we're talking about...

Oh and Thailand is the pedo's paradise.

yeh right.

I'd like to challenge some of these points. On basis of what info i have collected from media.

The drugs tests performed were only basic and might not have found chloroform, being it not being searched for.

Huge skull fragture could have caused the death.

There was no signs of sex recently (as a penetration), but she had many cuts and bruises inside her genital areas, like caused by insertion of a small wooden object (paintbrush).

[LoveDaBlues]

Where's the footprints in the snow, Mr Blue? That note surely looks like a female wrote it who was mighty close to Mr Ramsey.

http://www.statementanalysis.com/ramseynote/

Mr. Butthead:

Police statements about there being no footprints in the snow were misleading as there was no snow around most of the perimeter of the house.

A quote (in red) from the link I provided sums up my feelings:

Although Judge Julie Carnes’ ruling is based on a civil suit, it painstakingly examines evidence gathered by police and points out shortcomings in the investigation.

I've said all along, the Boulder Police screwed up this case because of their inexperience handling such cases.

Read this, maybe you'll change your mind or at least have some doubts as to the guilt of Patsy:

http://www.longmontfyi.com/ramsey/storyDetail03.asp?ID=25

LDB

[glassdude007]

If this guy proves to be guilty, of course, it is good news.

However, have people picked up how the US press (CNN) is characterizing THAILAND in this story.

"... arrested in Bangkok, Thailand, NOTORIOUS for its sex trade and child prostitution ... "

Personally, I find such a characterization vile and unbalanced. Assuming this is the real creep, the press should be thanking the Thai authorities for assisting in his arrest, not insulting the entire Thai nation with lurid, yellow journalism.

10/4 you are absoulutly RIGHT dont trust CNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[swervie2000]

This story is getting far more attention then it deserves. Typical western media...Unfortuantely, it also brings attention to Thailand and the foreigners who live here. Most of the foreigners who live here don't like their country of origin, thus, the reason we live here. It's always the few bad rotten apples focused on, instead of the few truly rotten. This story will pass soon from people...it already has with me.

[LoveDaBlues]

This story is getting far more attention then it deserves. Typical western media...Unfortuantely, it also brings attention to Thailand and the foreigners who live here. Most of the foreigners who live here don't like their country of origin, thus, the reason we live here. It's always the few bad rotten apples focused on, instead of the few truly rotten. This story will pass soon from people...it already has with me.

hmmmm.......care to share the 'poll' you took from all or a significant number of the foreigners living here to back up your claim? Or perhaps you can point us to a link containing this data?

[Beavis and Butthead]

This story is getting far more attention then it deserves. Typical western media...Unfortuantely, it also brings attention to Thailand and the foreigners who live here. Most of the foreigners who live here don't like their country of origin, thus, the reason we live here. It's always the few bad rotten apples focused on, instead of the few truly rotten. This story will pass soon from people...it already has with me.

hmmmm.......care to share the 'poll' you took from all or a significant number of the foreigners living here to back up your claim? Or perhaps you can point us to a link containing this data?

I'd like to see that poll as well. I bet it would be 70% the other way around. Speak for yourself swervie

[Papa_Lazarou]

I've been reading online forums about this case and general consensus is no one believes this guy committed the crime.

"online forums" .....global 24/7 access to the people that know ....the truth.

"*Edit... same post deleted...beaten to the post again, this time by John K by 50 seconds... "

Is this all some kind of competition between you all?

Edited August 19, 2006 by Papa_Lazarou

[george]

Update:

JonBenet murder suspect set to leave for Los Angeles on Sunday

BANGKOK: -- The American teacher arrested here in connection with the decade-old murder of child beauty queen JonBenet Ramsey is set to leave Bangkok for Los Angeles this weekend, a senior police official told AFP on Saturday.

John Mark Karr, 41, is expected to take a Thai Airways flight on Sunday evening to Los Angeles, the senior immigration police official said, speaking onconditi on of anonymity.

"He will leave the immigration center around 3:00 pm (0800 GMT) and he is booked on Thai Airways flight 794 leaving at 7:20 pm," he said.

A Thai Airways official confirmed that Karr was booked on the flight, to be accompanied by US security officials.

Thailand revoked Karr's visa after he was arrested Wednesday in Bangkok over the brutal killing of the six-year-old girl who was found strangled and beaten to death in the basement of her family's Colorado home on the day after Christmas 1996.

The US arrest warrant charges him with murder, kidnapping and sexual assault of a child.

--The Nation 2006-08-19

[swervie2000]

Well...with that response from a farang with a username like Beavis&Butthead. All you need to do is talk to your friends. For me, I love Thailand and am %10,000 happier then I could ever be back in the evil empire. There's no poll required period.

Those who are not happy here here, evidently, have some internal or external issues which probably make them unhappy whereever they are. And, if you do come across foreigners who are unhappy, I recommend sending them to a local wat or back home. Quite simple really...

[swervie2000]

Well...with that response from a farang with a username like Beavis&Butthead. All you need to do is talk to your friends. For me, I love Thailand and am %10,000 happier then I could ever be back in the evil empire. There's no poll required period.

Those who are not happy here here, evidently, have some internal or external issues which probably make them unhappy whereever they are. And, if you do come across foreigners who are unhappy, I recommend sending them to a local wat or back home. Quite simple really...

[jdinasia]

Well...with that response from a farang with a username like Beavis&Butthead. All you need to do is talk to your friends. For me, I love Thailand and am %10,000 happier then I could ever be back in the evil empire. There's no poll required period.

Those who are not happy here here, evidently, have some internal or external issues which probably make them unhappy whereever they are. And, if you do come across foreigners who are unhappy, I recommend sending them to a local wat or back home. Quite simple really...

What might be quite simple .... is that you can't speak for MOST farang in Thailand. Your psycho-babble bout happiness ... no-one said unhappy ... YOU made a baseless statement about not liking YOUR country of origin .... and applied it to MOST of the rest of us. Simple really .... you have no clue.

On a personal note I prefer living in Thailand ... but I don't HATE where I came from <the US>. Maybe they should have brought you to a local church in the US?

[swervie2000]

Well...with that response from a farang with a username like Beavis&Butthead. All you need to do is talk to your friends. For me, I love Thailand and am %10,000 happier then I could ever be back in the evil empire. There's no poll required period.

Those who are not happy here here, evidently, have some internal or external issues which probably make them unhappy whereever they are. And, if you do come across foreigners who are unhappy, I recommend sending them to a local wat or back home. Quite simple really...

In addition...anyone who supports satanic farang politicians like a Newt Gringich or W Bush must report immediately for duty in Iraq. People who support this war should go fight and have fun for Israel and oil corporations.

[Beavis and Butthead]

'TOY' CLUE VS.

JONBENET PERV

TEDDY BEAR AND LETTERS TO PROF

MAY CRACK SLAY

By JENNIFER FERMINO, BARRY BORTNICK and LUKAS I. ALPERT

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

John and Patsy Ramsey

Photo: AP Email Archives

Print © Reprint

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August 19, 2006 -- A mysterious white Santa Claus teddy bear found in JonBenet Ramsey's room after she was killed - which has stumped investigators for a decade - has emerged as a tantalizing clue that may tie her confessed killer, John Mark Karr, to the lurid crime.

The bear resurfaced after a University of Colorado professor, an expert on the case, carried on a correspondence with Karr over the years.

Karr, who is expected to be extradited back to the United States tomorrow, faces murder, kidnapping and sexual assault charges, Thai police said early today.

The professor's students said he told them he had received a childhood photo which showed someone he identified as "D" holding a white teddy bear similar to the one found in Jon Benet's bedroom in Boulder, Colo., after she was found dead on Dec. 26, 1996.

A Ramsey family private investigator told The Post that "D" was Karr.

The clue emerged as prosecutors contacted a former high school classmate of Karr in Alabama after she re vealed he had written in her yearbook in 1983, "Though, deep in the future, maybe I shall be the conqueror and live in multiple peace."

Investigators are eyeing the expression "shall be the conqueror" - which was written in capital letters - as the possible source for "S.B.T.C.," the cryptic signoff on the ransom note found in the Ramsey home.

The TV show "Inside Edition" obtained several handwriting samples from Karr - a job application and a note he wrote to a friend - and asked handwriting expert Robert Baier to compare them to the ransom note. He found striking similarities with the letter "D" and the letter "A."

Meanwhile, Marie Case, a lawyer who represented Karr in a 2001 child porn possession case in northern California, told The Washington Post that law enforcement officials suspected he may have been involved in JonBenet's death.

Members of the Sonoma County Sheriff's Department told her that "there was possibly some involvement" in the tiny beauty queen's slaying, saying, "Hey, we're looking at this guy," she said.

Case said it "seemed somebody dropped the ball" because "it never went anywhere."

Wendy Hutchens, who became a police informant in the case, said she exchanged e-mails and recorded 20 hours of phone conversations with Karr in which he revealed his fascination with JonBenet's slaying.

The Santa Rosa (Calif.) Press Democrat reported that in one late-night conversation, Karr described the circumstances surrounding the girl's strangulation:

"She was in a lot of pain before she died and suffered and was tortured. There is physical evidence of that. What a shame. It's shameful. That person did that to the most beautiful girl in the world."

Karr sent Professor Michael Tracey hundreds of e-mails over the years - including a creepy poem to "JonBenet, my love, my life" and another in which he sympathized with Michael Jackson's plight.

With the ninth anniversary of JonBenet's death approaching in 2005, Karr penned a startling ode to the focus of his obsession - titled "JonBenet, My Love," The Rocky Mountain News reported.

Karr then e-mailed his homage to Tracey with a bizarre request: for him to read it aloud outside the home where the beauty-pageant girl was killed, on the anniversary of her death.

"JonBenet, my love, my life. I love you and shall forever love you. I pray that you can hear my voice calling out to you from my darkness - this darkness that now separates us," it read.

Tracey told his media class last fall that "D" sent him a childhood photograph - supposedly taken on Christmas morning - of "D" holding a white Santa Claus teddy bear, according to student Emilie Johnson.

"Tracey did mention the teddy bear," Johnson recalled. "I remember that it stuck out in Tracey's mind and that 'D' said Tracey might want to check this out."

The bear was found in JonBenet's room the day after Christmas in 1996 - the day after she was murdered - and her parents reportedly told probers they didn't recognize it.

In 1999, Colorado authorities appealed to the public to help identify who manufactured the distinctive toy and which stores sold it, and even released a photo of the bear.

At the time, authorities declined to say anything more about it - fueling endless speculation about whether the killer left behind a creepy memento.

The trail had appeared to grow cold on the bear mystery - until Tracey told the classroom of students about "D."

When students asked whether "D" was a pedophile, "Michael Tracey was like, there's no doubt in my mind - he likes kids way too much," recalled Johnson.

Private eye John San Augustin, who works for the Ramsey family, said he has seen the e-mails and "D" is simply the first initial of an odd word the sender chose as a moniker.

"D" claimed his nickname symbolized the month of December, among other things.

Karr's birthday is Dec. 11, 1964, and JonBenet is believed to have been killed the night of Dec. 25, 1996.

San Augustin told The Post he's aware that Karr sent Tracey a photo and claimed it depicted himself as a boy, holding a bear.

At one point in the e-mail exchange between the professor and Karr, the alleged killer expressed alarm that Tracey had gotten his photograph from a third person. Karr claimed he had been the focus of a four-state federal investigation "for child murder and child molestation."

Karr wrote of how his mother had raised him "as a little girl," but became belligerent with the notion that his sexuality had been affected adversely because of it.

"I will not discuss my sexuality as if it is a psychological disorder from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. In my case, I disagree with it totally, and if this is to be the way we progress in discussing it. I might as well stop while I am ahead," he wrote in one exchange.

In other developments yesterday:

* CNN reported that Karr provided graphic details to police about the condition of Ramsey's body that had never been publicly released and had been known only by the medical examiner and investigators in the case.

* The attorney for Karr's second wife - who has provided him with an alibi for the day Ramsey was killed - said his client could not specifically remember what they did for Christmas 1996, but "cannot think of a Christmas while they were together when he was away from the family."

Additional reporting by Andrew Drummond in Bangkok and David K. Li in Hamilton, Ala.

lukas.alpert@nypost.

http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/to...s_i__alpert.htm

[taxin]

* she was NOT a virgin [yet had not had sex just before death] indicating she was sexually active in the months/years BEFORE she died.

Am I reading this correctly, she was 6 right ?

[Beavis and Butthead]

Many faces of solitary fiend

Bizarre Karr's look altered by Thai docs

BY MATHEW SCOTT

SPECIAL TO THE NEWS

The building where John Mark Kerr resided in Bangkok.

BANGKOK - John Mark Karr was changing his face in the months leading up to his capture this week in Thailand.

Phone records show that in the nine months the self-confessed killer of JonBenet Ramsey was holed up in a grubby room in one of Bangkok's seedy apartment buildings, he made just 12 calls - nine of them to some of the city's legions of cosmetic surgeons.

Records indicate he had work done by doctors at the Piatunum Poly Clinic in March, and went to the Pruk Shin Care Centre for more work the next month.

By the end of April, the ice-faced 41-year-old was signing up for a series of laser treatments to remove facial hair at the Pruksan Laser Centre - treatments that would continue on a regular basis up until the start of this month when Colorado police began tracking him down.

The revelations fit the picture that emerged in Bangkok yesterday that this is a perv with many faces.

Staff at the Blooms Residence - where records show Karr checked in on Dec. 18 before being led out shamed and in handcuffs Thursday night - said he was a model patron.

"He was very quiet," said Blooms receptionist Kewaree Tungkam. "He never had any guests - no ladies like some of the other guests do. He paid on time and only got angry when the storms stopped him watching CNN. Then he would get angry and yell."

Records show Karr paid 52,060 baht - $1,385 - for his nine-month stay at Blooms, a notorious, grubby haunt for sex tourists. Staff said he ate quietly on his own in the hotel café, and never bothered anyone.

He apparently also drank alone. The only thing left behind in his room besides the hotel's dreary furniture were empty booze bottles in his bedroom and the bathroom.

But fellow Blooms resident Bijan Fadjad had a different story to tell.

"You could tell he was a creep just by looking at him," said the 27-year-old American. "He never looked anyone in the eye and was always sneaking about on his own. It gave me the chills."

Fadjad has spent the past three months in a room three doors down from Karr with the same sparse, bleak fittings.

"People stay here because it is cheap - and you are left alone," he said. "For a guy like this one, it makes sense why he would be here."

Karr's ex-employers at the all-boys Bangkok Christian College also described the sometime teacher as a quiet man who went about his business. But the mothers of his ex-pupils were casting him in a different light entirely.

"He worked for us for two weeks at the start of June," said Dr. Banchong Chompoowong, the school's assistant director. "He was a nice man with a nice philosophy about why he wanted to teach - he liked children.

"Some students loved him, but some thought he was too strict. That is why we had to let him go."

One mother, whose 6-year-old son was in Karr's class, spoke outside the school while her little boy held her hand.

"He was there for about a month," she said, before refusing to offer her name for fear of recriminations from the school. "There were many complaints about him and about how he treated the children. He was very harsh, and he made the kids uncomfortable."

Karr had begun work at another international school in Bangkok just days before he was arrested.

While the world speculated about Karr's story, the man who has been interviewing him in his Bangkok detention cell for the past few days said Karr continues to cut a solitary figure.

"He is alone," said Maj. Supachai Paladech, the inspector in charge of deportation at Thailand's immigration department.

"He is relaxed and said he has no friends in Thailand. He said he had made a lot of money working in Europe and Central America. He has spoken to no one - not even his family. I think he just wants to go back to the United States."

"To us he was just a good guest," said Blooms' Tungkam. "But I guess you never know."

Originally published on August 19, 2006

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/444818p-374553c.html

[swervie2000]

This story definitely deflects who the real killers of the world are...anyone who is so into this story intensely must have their priorities a little out of whack, or on the payroll to distract attention.

http://www.iraqbodycount.net/

[Briggsy]

All statements from the Thai police, whether official or not, need to be passed through a reality filter. Often nothing will be left.

[Beavis and Butthead]

This story definitely deflects who the real killers of the world are...anyone who is so into this story intensely must have their priorities a little out of whack, or on the payroll to distract attention.

http://www.iraqbodycount.net/

Straying from the topic are we, spervie? By all means start up an Iraqi thread and get caught up in that

Edited August 19, 2006 by Beavis and Butthead

[taxin]

The building where John Mark Kerr resided in Bangkok.

Records show Karr paid 52,060 baht - $1,385 - for his nine-month stay at Blooms, a notorious, grubby haunt for sex tourists. Staff said he ate quietly on his own in the hotel café, and never bothered anyone.

"People stay here because it is cheap - and you are left alone," he said. "For a guy like this one, it makes sense why he would be here."

Originally published on August 19, 2006

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/444818p-374553c.html

Funny enough im looking for a place in Bangkok and this place sounds right up my street ! Does anyone know if theres any rooms going for grabs ?

[jdinasia]

The building where John Mark Kerr resided in Bangkok.

Records show Karr paid 52,060 baht - $1,385 - for his nine-month stay at Blooms, a notorious, grubby haunt for sex tourists. Staff said he ate quietly on his own in the hotel café, and never bothered anyone.

"People stay here because it is cheap - and you are left alone," he said. "For a guy like this one, it makes sense why he would be here."

Originally published on August 19, 2006

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/444818p-374553c.html

Funny enough im looking for a place in Bangkok and this place sounds right up my street ! Does anyone know if theres any rooms going for grabs ?

only if you can get the CNN and BBC freelancers to move out!

[LoveDaBlues]

This story definitely deflects who the real killers of the world are...anyone who is so into this story intensely must have their priorities a little out of whack, or on the payroll to distract attention.

http://www.iraqbodycount.net/

Just slightly

And lighten up on Beavis&Butthead you huhu.....huhuhu......huhuhuhuhuhuhuhuhu

I am happy here but I don't hate the states just prefer Thailand at this time.

With a nick like 'Swervie'.......don't think I'd make fun of someone else's nick......

LIGHTEN UP YOUR SHORTS ARE TOO TIGHT!

[leftcross]

what a hilarious description of The Blooms!!!! i lived there for six months and there is nothing 'seedy' about the place. in fact, it's quite decent.