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US envoy snubs NLA's foreign affairs committee


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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

Thais are brought up to believe Thailand and its people are above other people and above other countries. Thats what they are taught in school. The truth is the US is a vast, powerful and successful economy. Granted, its been through an economic crisis recently, but all evidence suggests it is fast recovering, growing and creating jobs and its currency has been the worlds strongest for the past year. Thailand by comparison is a tiny economy, it is a century or so behind the US in its development, especially in terms of education and human rights, and is militarily insignificant. So i really see no reason for the US to march to Thailand's orders, and i see no reason why the US should not express opinions or stick to their principles. It is clear to me at least that Thailand is the flea and the US is the dog. If the flea wants to jump onto China then so be it, it wont really matter. The sooner Thailand wakes up to reality the better for Thailand and Thai people because its never healthy to suffer delusions of grandeur. Then they might stop acting like a spoiled, self entitled brat throwing tantrums and thinking the world revolves around them.

Thailand is advance of the USA in human rights 100 years, not behind....see all the shootings and abuses by the US police. All the started wars of the last years (yes that is human right issue), torture, hunting down Assange, supporting regimes like Saudi Arabia, Thailand related: the support of Pol Pot.

In compare Thailand is the hub of human rights....

Yeah....right! blink.png

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US representatives have met and are meeting Thai representatives unannounced and off the radar. This is called the Back Channel, and it exists. As funny as it may sound, it is a way to save face. The US officially does not violate its own laws, the junta is reassured that posturing and statements will not become policy that interferes with commerce and security (I presume unless both human trafficking and democracy are both ignored for too long). The poresumption is speculative. The existence of the Back Channel is not speculation.

It is a real channel that never makes the news. Apparently the government, being inexperienced in diplomacy, had it explained to them. The vitriolic and insane comments (like the one Thai who declared the US ready to invade Thailand) have almost gone to zero. Apparently, something shifted. I think I explained it well enough.

Ahhh...this is why the US is so endeared to Thaksin and his puppets. They too love back channels and under the table...

Nice deflection, but it is a staple of world politics, not an incarnation of US or Thaksin era politics, but I hope you enjoyed your vent. Have a nice nap. rolleyes.gif

May be a staple of world politics, but it takes two very willing partners to tango to make it an art.

Why do you think the US spied on the Germany leader? Because she did not want to tango...

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Why don't the Americans look back at their track record of installing their brand of democracy on other sovereign states.

Not a particularly successful set of achievements was it, is it ?

So perhaps the inability or the unwillingness of the American envoy to actually appear and explain his governments comments indicate that the truth is becoming unpalatable to the Americans in general and their governments control freak colonial aspirations.

America, put your own house in order before you start ordering other sovereign states around.

their governments control freak colonial aspirations.

Please provide me with the list of countries that America has colonized. coffee1.gif

I was curious about this also, so looked it up: Wikipaedia: Currently, there remain a total of fifteen territories of the United States, five of which are inhabited: Puerto Rico, Guam, Northern Marianas, U. S. Virgin Islandsand American Samoa. The remaining ten territories are the following small islands, atolls and reefs, spread across the Caribbean or the Pacific Ocean, with no native or permanent populations: Palmyra Atoll, Baker Island, Howland Island, Jarvis Island, Johnston Atoll, Kingman Reef, Wake Island, Midway Islands,Navassa Island and Serranilla Bank.

I don't disagree with your post, but I think you will find all of the countries you named are "protectorates" of the U.S.,but my "challenge" was to the poster who bluntly state America's "colonial policy", asking him to provide me with a list of countries the U.S. has colonized. There's a major difference between a "protectorate" and a country that has been colonized.

Edited by Just1Voice
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USA doesn't deal w unelected government?

Iran?

Palestinian Abbas?

Egypts Al-Sisi?

What's that again?

You so wrong.

Iran Election June 2013

Palestine Election April 2014

Egypt Election May 2014

Next?

You mean the USA didn't deal with the country's governments before those dates you listed ?

Rubi, stay current. Foreign policy is about present not past.

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Thailand "summons" the lone superpower and they don't even respond. It probably didnt even get past the embassy's e-mail spam filter. Anyway, Thailand has almost zero strategic significance since 1975, and even then it served as an R&R destination and a closer airbase to Vietnam. Thailand's spotlight on the world stage now occurs once a year like clockwork at the ASEAN photo op, a collection of weak midget SEA leaders holding hands and crossing arms. The coup was second page news in most of the world and barely a footnote on the news ticker.

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Going back in history a few years to the coup that overthrew Thaksin, the USA barely registered an objection to that coup. The USA was quiet as a mouse.

Oh really? Best to research before typing rubbish.

  • The State Department initially announced that it was "monitoring the situation with concern."[3] A spokesman said, "We look to the Thai people to resolve their political differences in a peaceful manner and in accord with the principles of democracy and the rule of law."[4]
  • Later on, the US's criticism increased in severity, with State Department Deputy Spokesman Tom Casey saying, "There's no justification for a military coup in Thailand or in anyplace else, and we certainly are extremely disappointed by this action. It's a step backward for democracy in Thailand. We very much urge that democratic elections are held as soon as possible, which is a commitment military officials have made. That commitment needs to be met, and it needs to be respected. There are also consequences when these kinds of actions take place, and obviously, in light of what's happened, in light of this coup, there are aspects of our relationship that we're going to have to review."[5] Casey later noted that the US would like to see elections held earlier than the one-year timetable set by the coup leaders.
  • U.S. Ambassador to the UN John R. Bolton noted that "We have press reports and I think for now the important thing is to look for the sustaining of constitutional processes in Thailand."[6]
  • White House Press Secretary Tony Snow said that "We're disappointed in the coup. We hope those who mounted it will make good and make good swiftly on their promises to restore democracy." Snow also hinted that currently inconclusive talks with Bangkok on a Free Trade Agreement, might also depend on a return to democratic rule. "Once you have democracy restored, we'll also be in a position to move forward on a free trade agreement with them."[7]
  • Tom Casey also warned that certain US aid to Thailand could be reviewed, figures appear to be referring to some categories of assistance dependent on democracy being maintained.[7] Casey later noted that the US is also reviewing its aid to Thailand. Under the so-called Foreign Operations Assistance Act, the United States has budgeted about 14 million dollars in bilateral assistance, including four million dollars in the military area, to Thailand in fiscal 2006.[8]
  • The US also warned the junta from taking actions for political purposes, like investigating or seizing the assets of Thaksin Shinawatra.[9]
  • The United States later cut off $24 million in aid, including foreign military financing, international military education and training, and peacekeeping operations. "We look forward to being able to reinstate these programs after a democratically-elected government takes office," State Department spokesman Sean McCormack said. Official US military trips to Thailand were also suspended and US military personnel in Thailand were recalled.[10]
  • The US later expressed concern about rumors that the junta would appoint General Surayud Chulanont as Prime Minister, noting that "Somebody with close ties to the military is going to have to at least overcome the perception that they are maintaining a close relationship with the military and may be not acting in defense of Thai democracy."[11]
  • However, Surayud's quick designation by the junta was later welcomed by Tom Casey, US State Department deputy spokesman. "In naming Prime Minister Surayud, the council did fulfill a pledge that it made to its people as well as to the international community, to name an interim prime minister within two weeks of taking power," Casey said, adding "My understanding is the interim constitution that he will be working under provides guarantees for basic civil liberties and basic rights of the people, and that that is something we very much want to see carried out".[12] A declaration followed a day later by a warning from White House spokeswoman Dana Perino "We remain concerned by restrictions on civil liberties, provisions in the draft constitution that appear to give the military an ongoing and influential role in decision-making, and the lengthy timetable for democratic elections."[13]
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USA doesn't deal w unelected government?

Iran?

Palestinian Abbas?

Egypts Al-Sisi?

What's that again?

You so wrong.

Iran Election June 2013

Palestine Election April 2014

Egypt Election May 2014

Next?

You mean the USA didn't deal with the country's governments before those dates you listed ?

Why use extremely vague phrases like "deal with"?

The US "deals with" nearly every country in the world.

What's important is the type of relationship, the type of "dealings", and so on. Here's a hint; its different for every country.

Stop casting blanket statements.

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Thailand is advance of the USA in human rights 100 years, not behind....see all the shootings and abuses by the US police. All the started wars of the last years (yes that is human right issue), torture, hunting down Assange, supporting regimes like Saudi Arabia, Thailand related: the support of Pol Pot.

In compare Thailand is the hub of human rights....

cheesy.gif

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

I view this as a definite positive for Thailand!!

China will not interfere in Thai politics and they will provide so much more in benefits to a fellow Asian country.

America - nobody's friend it seems!!!!

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Thailand is advance of the USA in human rights 100 years, not behind....see all the shootings and abuses by the US police. All the started wars of the last years (yes that is human right issue), torture, hunting down Assange, supporting regimes like Saudi Arabia, Thailand related: the support of Pol Pot.

In compare Thailand is the hub of human rights....

cheesy.gif

they estimate 1-1.5 Million deaths due to US wars in the last years. Thailand has a 3000 from Thaksins war against drugs....how many people got shot by US policemen without reason, how many got shot by Thai policemen....

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

right,

just pointing out the elephant in the room to the Thai 'government' in the nicest of ways and then not reacting to the current right-wing nationalist fascists and their summons is 'acting like a child'...

ok, if you say so... coffee1.gif

I think you don't know the meaning of fascists....But of course not every country can be a lighthouse of democracy and liberal human rights like the best friend of USA: Saudi Arabia...

"I think you don't know the meaning of fascists"

Au contraire. It's you.

Tbthailand put it in a nutshell.

fascism |noun

an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.

(in general use) extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practice.

my congratulation for mastering Google and reducing a pretty difficult term to 2 sentences. Maybe reading a bit about Italian and German history would make the differences clear. But well for some extreme left wing, just about everyone other is fascist....

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

Hmmm, guess this time, after reading the statements made by the U.S. government representative, I have to agree with my government's statements. I see nothing earth shattering nor overly critical here. As to Thailand embracing closer relations with China? Thailand is a sovereign nation free to make its own choices in its own interests. China is very consistent in denouncing any attempt to call for changes in what it considers its internal affairs. Hmmm, my mind did just reflect on Tianamin, Hong Kong and the claims to 80-90% of the South China Sea. I would advise caution. As a student of history, I note that there is danger in surrounding yourself with only thiose who agree with you. A wiser tact is to, at least tolerate and note, friends who raise opposing points of view. I kind of like the British view of a "loyal opposition".

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

right,

just pointing out the elephant in the room to the Thai 'government' in the nicest of ways and then not reacting to the current right-wing nationalist fascists and their summons is 'acting like a child'...

ok, if you say so... coffee1.gif

You can pin labels all you want but it doesn't change the fact that this is the current gov and controls Thailand. The US should address them even if they don't like who or how this happened if they want to keep Thailand as a friend. Either way with China offering their kindness (hehee) and the USA ignoring them it is easy to see who will be Thailand's newest closest friend. The USA should be considering this.

They maybe the government but that don't make them legit does it. Even if Thailand jump into the Chinese arms it will do zero in the balance of power in the world, only egosentric Thai's and people like you believe that the country is more important than what it realy is. As soon as we have an legit government, which may I add will be one that excludes your dear leader and his legions of yes men, the Thai's will return to the middle of the road between China and the US.

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

Oh please stop it. I haven't seen the U.S throwing world class tantrums and smashing thier toys. I wish they would because as an Aussie I haven't had a good American bash for some time. It is Thailand who is throwing the big hissy fits like a spoilt brat who isn't getting thier way. I think Thailand is suffering from ADHD.

As an Australian, throughout most of my life I have supported "most" things American but I am shocked at the stupidity of Obama and his underlings.

The sooner this "Goffy Golfer", the man who talks about an American being beheaded and then goes to play golf, the man who blames the ISIS Burning to Death of a Jordanian Pilot, on the actions of "Christian Crusaders." needs to be removed from Office in a similar fashion, to what happened in Thailand.

Send Murphy home. The US Needs Strategically located Thailand, much more than Thailand needs a weak, gutless America.

Before "Osama/Obama" tries to lecture The Thai Government on anything, he needs to get his own miserable act together. Obama has stuffed-up the Middle East, is dithering over the Ukraine and now, has the uppity audacity to try to tell Thailand how to conduct business. Bring on 2016 before this bumbling buffoon destroys the world!

attachicon.gifMCD Obama Golf Goof.jpg

The goofy golfer, have you seen who is running Australia, the British import commonly know as Tony Dumb Dumb. As an Aussie give me Obama any day. We will swap the U.S for Obama and give you one dumb British imbosile, Australia can't loose.
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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

right,

just pointing out the elephant in the room to the Thai 'government' in the nicest of ways and then not reacting to the current right-wing nationalist fascists and their summons is 'acting like a child'...

ok, if you say so... coffee1.gif

You can pin labels all you want but it doesn't change the fact that this is the current gov and controls Thailand. The US should address them even if they don't like who or how this happened if they want to keep Thailand as a friend. Either way with China offering their kindness (hehee) and the USA ignoring them it is easy to see who will be Thailand's newest closest friend. The USA should be considering this.

They maybe the government but that don't make them legit does it. Even if Thailand jump into the Chinese arms it will do zero in the balance of power in the world, only egosentric Thai's and people like you believe that the country is more important than what it realy is. As soon as we have an legit government, which may I add will be one that excludes your dear leader and his legions of yes men, the Thai's will return to the middle of the road between China and the US.

Well, Thailand alone won't make any difference, but a lot countries agree to trade in Rubels or Yuan instead of USD when trading with Russia or China. This also won't have a big impact, but at some point other countries will trade between them in other currencies than USD or Euro. By reducing their stock of USD it will cause USA a problem. Not now but in future. And a new corrupt elected government will go in the middle again, selling their soul to the highest bidder. So it will be up to the economic success of China and USA.

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

right,

just pointing out the elephant in the room to the Thai 'government' in the nicest of ways and then not reacting to the current right-wing nationalist fascists and their summons is 'acting like a child'...

ok, if you say so... coffee1.gif

You can pin labels all you want but it doesn't change the fact that this is the current gov and controls Thailand. The US should address them even if they don't like who or how this happened if they want to keep Thailand as a friend. Either way with China offering their kindness (hehee) and the USA ignoring them it is easy to see who will be Thailand's newest closest friend. The USA should be considering this.

The US is following protocol in this case and at least someone in Thailand, gov't or media, is making an issue of it. The US is also likely making the point that they're not interested in dealing that seriously with the current government. Whether that's a good policy or not, it's not childish. Sure many so-called democracies are far from perfect, but the US has made it clear they didn't agree with the coup so if only to not look foolish they have to make these kinds of gestures.

It's unlikely this tempest in a teapot will introduce some long-term trend where Thailand "switches" (pivots?) over to China, but regardless the greater risk may well be Thailand's; authoritarian governments are far in the minority world-wide, as they should be, and the thing to wish for is that they go extinct, not be a model and ally. Your good wishes for Thailand are admirable, but short-sighted IMO.

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@ h90

Try something simpler such as an Oxford Dictionary. Like I did.

facepalm.gif

You are talking semantics.

You point to the results of pure fascism.

A goal I believe these autocrats would like to achieve.

Sit back drink the Kool-Aid, be a cheer leader and watch it evolve at the same time.

thumbsup.gif

"a pretty difficult term"? blink.png

Perhaps for you to grasp.

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

And just how do you determine this is "self serving." I'd say a "push to Thailand into China's arms" is the opposite of self serving" ... wouldn't you?

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

Thais are brought up to believe Thailand and its people are above other people and above other countries. Thats what they are taught in school. The truth is the US is a vast, powerful and successful economy. Granted, its been through an economic crisis recently, but all evidence suggests it is fast recovering, growing and creating jobs and its currency has been the worlds strongest for the past year. Thailand by comparison is a tiny economy, it is a century or so behind the US in its development, especially in terms of education and human rights, and is militarily insignificant. So i really see no reason for the US to march to Thailand's orders, and i see no reason why the US should not express opinions or stick to their principles. It is clear to me at least that Thailand is the flea and the US is the dog. If the flea wants to jump onto China then so be it, it wont really matter. The sooner Thailand wakes up to reality the better for Thailand and Thai people because its never healthy to suffer delusions of grandeur. Then they might stop acting like a spoiled, self entitled brat throwing tantrums and thinking the world revolves around them.

Thailand is advance of the USA in human rights 100 years, not behind....see all the shootings and abuses by the US police. All the started wars of the last years (yes that is human right issue), torture, hunting down Assange, supporting regimes like Saudi Arabia, Thailand related: the support of Pol Pot.

In compare Thailand is the hub of human rights....

supporting Pol Pot was the absolute pits.

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

right,

just pointing out the elephant in the room to the Thai 'government' in the nicest of ways and then not reacting to the current right-wing nationalist fascists and their summons is 'acting like a child'...

ok, if you say so... coffee1.gif

You can pin labels all you want but it doesn't change the fact that this is the current gov and controls Thailand. The US should address them even if they don't like who or how this happened if they want to keep Thailand as a friend. Either way with China offering their kindness (hehee) and the USA ignoring them it is easy to see who will be Thailand's newest closest friend. The USA should be considering this.

Who in a year or so promised to hold elections so what is the point in dealing with them. The next bunch of policies will be completely different.

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

right,

just pointing out the elephant in the room to the Thai 'government' in the nicest of ways and then not reacting to the current right-wing nationalist fascists and their summons is 'acting like a child'...

ok, if you say so... coffee1.gif

You can pin labels all you want but it doesn't change the fact that this is the current gov and controls Thailand. The US should address them even if they don't like who or how this happened if they want to keep Thailand as a friend. Either way with China offering their kindness (hehee) and the USA ignoring them it is easy to see who will be Thailand's newest closest friend. The USA should be considering this.

And your point is what exactly? Thailand is so strategically important. Losing Thailand is going to be a loss for the USA.

This is not the vietnam era any more.

Why is Thailand strategically important to the US at all??

With recent technology like over the horizon radar, and military stationed in the Philippines and other more cooperative countries with elected governments, the US does not need Thailand.

Thailand needs the US.

If they throw away the military and financial support the US has provided Thailand for decades, they are fools.

Most if not all of Thailand's military equipment is of US issue.

Yes, China can be a new friend, but will never provide what the US has and you know there will be very strong strings attached to anything China provides.

Can China provide replacement parts and ammunition needed to keep Thailand's military equipment viable?

Drive through the military base in Korat and tell me if you see a jeep, truck, tank, armored vehicle or gun that is not of US issue.

Please now, tell us..

Why is Thailand strategically important to the US????

Who needs who?

Edited by willyumiii
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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

right,

just pointing out the elephant in the room to the Thai 'government' in the nicest of ways and then not reacting to the current right-wing nationalist fascists and their summons is 'acting like a child'...

ok, if you say so... coffee1.gif

I think you don't know the meaning of fascists....But of course not every country can be a lighthouse of democracy and liberal human rights like the best friend of USA: Saudi Arabia...

I think you don't know the meaning of fascists

oh, of course I do. Don't worry.

but the rest of your post proves that you are just trolling...

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USA doesn't deal w unelected government?

Iran?

Palestinian Abbas?

Egypts Al-Sisi?

What's that again?

You so wrong.

Iran Election June 2013

Palestine Election April 2014

Egypt Election May 2014

Next?

You mean the USA didn't deal with the country's governments before those dates you listed ?

Rubi, stay current. Foreign policy is about present not past.

So, does that mean that the USA government dealt with the previous governments ?

BTW Iran also had a general election in 2009, Palestina in 2006, Egypt in 2010.

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I guess this is yet another push to Thailand into China's arms. The USA is acting like a child with their self serving interests.

right,

just pointing out the elephant in the room to the Thai 'government' in the nicest of ways and then not reacting to the current right-wing nationalist fascists and their summons is 'acting like a child'...

ok, if you say so... coffee1.gif

I think you don't know the meaning of fascists....But of course not every country can be a lighthouse of democracy and liberal human rights like the best friend of USA: Saudi Arabia...

I think you don't know the meaning of fascists

oh, of course I do. Don't worry.

but the rest of your post proves that you are just trolling...

I beg to differ.

'fascist' like 'elite', 'amart' and a few more words are just used as easy terms. Labels to convey a negative image without the need to explain as 'everyone' knows 'fascists' are bad, 'elite' are old-fashioned, etc., etc.

Now back to the topic where I'm still wondering about

'According to the United States, there is no regulation that allows it to send the charge d'affaires to talk to the NLA."

PS regarding trolling, with so much 'snubbing' is the hub in the country of those who do 'snub' or in the country of those at the receiving end ?

Edited by rubl
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^^

You have already been asked by a previous poster what you mean by "dealt with". Why won't you respond to his post or are you just conveniently ignoring what you don't like as usual?

Why not read the posts and discover that Scarpofongnes4U asked

"USA doesn't deal w unelected government?"

with our dear Eric answering

"You so wrong. ... next"

BTW not sure why you chose "^^" to ask me a question. I only saw it because I was still in this topic. If I hadn't been I might have missed your question and seemingly not answered two rolleyes.gif

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^^

You have already been asked by a previous poster what you mean by "dealt with". Why won't you respond to his post or are you just conveniently ignoring what you don't like as usual?

Why not read the posts and discover that Scarpofongnes4U asked

"USA doesn't deal w unelected government?"

with our dear Eric answering

"You so wrong. ... next"

BTW not sure why you chose "^^" to ask me a question. I only saw it because I was still in this topic. If I hadn't been I might have missed your question and seemingly not answered two rolleyes.gif

I am referring to kblaze's post.

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^^

You have already been asked by a previous poster what you mean by "dealt with". Why won't you respond to his post or are you just conveniently ignoring what you don't like as usual?

Why not read the posts and discover that Scarpofongnes4U asked

"USA doesn't deal w unelected government?"

with our dear Eric answering

"You so wrong. ... next"

BTW not sure why you chose "^^" to ask me a question. I only saw it because I was still in this topic. If I hadn't been I might have missed your question and seemingly not answered two rolleyes.gif

I am referring to kblaze's post.

Now, please pay attention, I'll only say this once:

I know. That's why I suggested you read some more posts as kblaze's was the last in a list of replies.

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