...... have visited Jomtien a few times. I've often thought about buying a small bar, like the ones you see near the beach on Jomtien,

- Sound like this would be your first bar, so no bar experience? (You know how to handle drunken idiots every night?)
- In Jomtien, an area you are not "familiar" with? (You know from who you will take away customers?
Many Thais see new competition as reaching into there rice bowl!)
- No powerful local thai friends, they could help you, just in case?
Without good connections to local VIPs - Forget it!

Edited February 14, 201511 yr by tomacht8

Small monthly donation to the local police by your bar....you need assistance...you call them and problem solved.

This is how it works in Thailand - several years ago my wife sold her bar/restaurant and the guy who bought it didn't pay the police for protection (my wife did) and 6 months later the police raided his bar and closed him down.

_{Actually many of the bars in Pattya/Jontiem are guarded by off-duty police (also owned by police) and they don't display weapons overtly. I certainly have never seen a shotgun toting pub guard anywhere in Thailand, although they used to be common for gold shop guards in HK. (alongside hockey sticks for Sikh guards).}

_{Must have been an interesting pub in Samui.}

_{There are maffai types in Pattaya (I had one 's mia-noi for a neighbour once) but they don't bother ordinary business and the whole "Pattaya is an unsafe, wicked place" is scaremongering promulgated by those who have never been.}

Recommend any biz do this

- have a Thai front person, mandatory.

-rent from important local person like village head man, very helpful.

-give small gifts to everyone you deal with... local police, headman, postal delivery, cooking gas delivery, local tuffs who stand in your street, and any others important to your success. Your Thai front man MUST know how to do this as his first and main job with you. Do this often and deliver in person, you. mandatory.

-if your biz deals with public, consider get your main Thai to hire a good street fighter to hang around after dark, helpful.

-work hard to get proper insurance, not easy but can be done, not cheap, helpful only when you need it.

-And face the fact that you will never really own your biz; you will just be there to provide needed cash and stand around a lot.

If you do not speak Thai, firmly and finally, FORGET ABOUT IT !

In a nutshell....the negative side of thainess....well written.

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

Is this story based on fact, or is it the fiction it appears to be? If it's not fiction, then please state some facts. Who did this happen to? What city? When? What was the final outcome? Sounds like TVF Thai bashing to me. This is what I want to figure out, is there any reality to "mafia" or "protection" claims? Or is it the product of a bunch of bitter farts?

It happened to me in Phuket (Kata). To cut it short, the guy built a brick wall so that the guests in my guesthouse couldn´t get out, I had to close the shop and guesthouse.

Do not expect to get much sympathy on here....some will come along and tell you....you must have done something wrong to get this happened to you.

On Koh Chang seven years ago, I knew a number of foreign bar or restaurant owners.

Not one is still in business. Two are dead.

I was in Koh Chang last week, didn't strike me like that.....your two dead aquaintences were shot?

.

Like what? What did you expect to see that would show you what is done in private?

One was beaten to death by his own employees, using pool cues, because he would not give them yet another pay advance. The other was a drowning by "accident." A handful of others left the country under threat, or fear for their well-being, or after losing money.

People on this thread seem to think all of this is visible to the everyday Joe by simply sitting down at a bar for a beer; or that "mafia" is involved. That because they don't casually see it, it doesn't exist.

"Mafia" was the wrong word for the OP to chose.

Yes ¨mafia¨ is probably the wrong word. It is more likely to be from someone who has a grudge / chip on their shoulder / jealous / sees you as impinging / or simply wants what you have. And they usually have friends in the BIB that if nothing else will prevent you from getting any form of justice.

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

You forgot to mention greedy landlords who see success and decide to double the rent in the middle of your lease. If you say no thanks they they have electricity or water fiddled with etc etc. It all goes on. Or they want their brother cousin etc to move in and make money from all your good work. All this happens. Thais are very jealous people...even among themselves

Small monthly donation to the local police by your bar....you need assistance...you call them and problem solved.

This is how it works in Thailand - several years ago my wife sold her bar/restaurant and the guy who bought it didn't pay the police for protection (my wife did) and 6 months later the police raided his bar and closed him down.

How much did you wife pay every month?

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

Is this story based on fact, or is it the fiction it appears to be? If it's not fiction, then please state some facts. Who did this happen to? What city? When? What was the final outcome? Sounds like TVF Thai bashing to me. This is what I want to figure out, is there any reality to "mafia" or "protection" claims? Or is it the product of a bunch of bitter farts?

It happened to me in Phuket (Kata). To cut it short, the guy built a brick wall so that the guests in my guesthouse couldn´t get out, I had to close the shop and guesthouse.

Do not expect to get much sympathy on here....some will come along and tell you....you must have done something wrong to get this happened to you.

I don´t need sympathy, but I appreciate the thought. Lesson learned, I just put everything in storage I didn´t need and sub let the building. I make more money now, don´t need staff and no hassles.

I did do something wrong though, I was making a successful farang business when the Thai businesses were failing. They tried to copy, as they do, but of course couldn´t get it right.

The main instigator managed to rent the shop next door and as I said then built a brick wall in a shared access area and was even bricking in my guests so they couldn´t get out of their rooms. Both landlords (mine and his) told him he couldn´t do it (Indian guys), they went to the police station and came back and said there was nothing they could do.

As I said, lesson learned.....

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

You forgot to mention greedy landlords who see success and decide to double the rent in the middle of your lease. If you say no thanks they they have electricity or water fiddled with etc etc. It all goes on. Or they want their brother cousin etc to move in and make money from all your good work. All this happens. Thais are very jealous people...even among themselves

Yeah seen that happen more than once. The other one is to up the ¨key money¨ to something ridiculous as soon as you start doing well. As you said there is always a relative waiting in the wind ready to take over and split the profit.....

You must not even do anything wrong.

Small story:

I good foreign guy with his local thai girl bought a nice pice of land with stunning ocean views.

They build up some houses for rent and got there water from there nice thai neighbor.

The nice thai neightbor sold his land to an a.....e.

First thing the new neightbor did: was to cut the water pipe.

Shit can happen.

The most important advice I can give to the OP;

You must know the local VIP´s and they must be really good friends to/for you.

Like too have a lot of memories together, best to be a family member of them.

I do not would like to call them Mafia.

Edited February 14, 201511 yr by tomacht8

Small monthly donation to the local police by your bar....you need assistance...you call them and problem solved.

This is how it works in Thailand - several years ago my wife sold her bar/restaurant and the guy who bought it didn't pay the police for protection (my wife did) and 6 months later the police raided his bar and closed him down.

You only have to pay if you brake the law. No licence, open to late, .....

Keep within the law you don't have to pay anything.

You must not even do anything wrong.

Small story:

I good foreign guy with his local thai girl bought a nice pice of land with stunning ocean views.

They build up some houses for rent and got there water from there nice thai neighbor.

The nice thai neightbor sold his land to a thai a.....e.

First thing the new neightbor did: was to cut the water pipe.

Shit can happen.

The most important advice I can give to the OP;

You must know the local VIP´s and they must be really good friends to/for you.

Like too have a lot of memories together, best to be a family member of them.

I do not would like to call them Mafia.

Shady people are attracted to.....people...to summarize your post. Maffia or not.

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

You forgot to mention greedy landlords who see success and decide to double the rent in the middle of your lease. If you say no thanks they they have electricity or water fiddled with etc etc. It all goes on. Or they want their brother cousin etc to move in and make money from all your good work. All this happens. Thais are very jealous people...even among themselves

BS , if you have a good contract they can't do that. Read the small print before you sign,

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

You forgot to mention greedy landlords who see success and decide to double the rent in the middle of your lease. If you say no thanks they they have electricity or water fiddled with etc etc. It all goes on. Or they want their brother cousin etc to move in and make money from all your good work. All this happens. Thais are very jealous people...even among themselves

BS , if you have a good contract they can't do that. Read the small print before you sign,

BS I saw both contracts and BOTH landlords, who I knew fairly well agreed with me and told him to dismantle the wall. They went with him to the police station and came back and said there was nothing they could do and apologized to me. It didn´t help the tennents I had who couldn´t get out of their rooms. I had to refund their money of course and they had to find other accommodation at 8pm.

It seemed to me the landlords had been warned off, their attitudes changed dramatically. This guy knew someone at the police station.

So how do you suggest it could have been rectified? With a prolonged court case? By the time that had happened, even assuming a win, it would have been all over and more money down the toilet !! Contracts are worthless unless you can enforce them and if the police will not get involved what hope have you got?

I have seen people get into yearly contracts simply because premises are hard to come by in good locations. The landlord plays the game and as soon as the business becomes profitable take it over. Yes buyer beware I guess, but isn´t that what this thread is about? NEVER assume it wont happen.....

EDIT to add :

I have also seen people win court cases and / or get judgements from the police. Guys with Thai wives even, they just stop paying!! What do you do then? Go to the police every second month? Pay the police every time it happens? NEVER EVER forget, they are Thai, you are not !! Thailand is for Thais !!!

I hope this is a reality check....

Edited February 14, 201511 yr by RigPig

Hi DoDoey,

I am a business owner in Bangkok. I am NOT in the bar, hotel or restaurant business but in manufacturing, export and ICT. Experiencing difficulties with foreign companies as they hardly trust companies based in Thailand. Orders are limited. Also customs and their extorsion (export license) are a well known problem.

I have a nephew from my Thai wife that had a music bar in Phuket. About a half a year ago he had to flee out of Phuket because of mafia. They just doubled their extortion rate for the 3rd time in a few months.

A good Italian friend of me (Paulo), had a very good running Italian Restaurant in South Pattaya in 2012. Right now he and his wife are in Italy, never to come back to Thailand ever again. One day he had some Russians inside. They stayed the whole evening, spending a lot. At the end of the evening, they were picked up by some guys with guns. A day later they came back and offered him a certain amount for his place or... Way lower than it was worth. He refused and called the cops. Cops were paid by Russian mafia telling him to sell... He didn't. Next evening some Russians came and redecorated his restaurant. He woke up in a hospital. Right now the restaurant made place for some apartments.

On Koh Samui, English Ricky had a beachbar (2013). Not for long, while he had some good english spenders. Ofcourse the Thai wanted a piece of the action. He spend a third of his income on protection and the Thai wanted more. He didn't pay them more and got raided several times per week by the police and other officials. His place burned down a few months after he opened. Right now he's having a bar in Sihanoukville, Cambodia. Way better and more relaxed, he says. I still have to visit him over there.

Just think about what kind of business you want to start. My advice is NO: restaurant, hotel, massage parlor or (karaoke) bar in tourist destinations.

Edited February 14, 201511 yr by FredNL

On Koh Chang seven years ago, I knew a number of foreign bar or restaurant owners.

Not one is still in business. Two are dead.

Wanting to run/own a bar is and always has been a recipe for disaster. Not mention that it is a black hole to throw money into.

Thanks for the advice. Buying a bar in Jomtien is not likely, only something I've pondered once or twice. My questions are about the supposed mafia; Russian, Turkish, whatever. Reading these posts, you would imagine Thailand is like the wild west, or Chicago in the 1930s. I just don't see any of that here in Bangkok, and wonder how real it is. I haven't seen it in Jomtien, or Chiang Mai for that matter. Could some of you locals of Pattaya, Phuket, Samui kindly explain the reality of the foreign mob here in Thailand? I could easily imagine Thai mafia, but I can't see Thai mafia putting up with foreign mafia. It would be too easy to get rid of them, one phone call to Uncle hiso policeman.

Now, I have seen plenty of thuggish Russians. They're loud and drunk, and I steer clear of them, but that doesn't make them mafia. Are these the 'mafia' so many speak of? Simple tourists?

Starting read between your lines here. Are you planning on organizing your own crime syndicate somewhere??? Why don't you just stay put where you have not witnessed anything like what you have been reading. I doubt you will find the answers your looking for on this forum. You need a police and crime forum.

I don't think it's mafia related. The news report I read on Bangkokpost.com was that a drunken Turkish tourist tried to get a bar to serve him after closing time. When they refused, he went somewhere to get a gun and then threatened the bar again. The security guard subsequently shot him in self-defence.

However, you have to wonder why a guard would be carrying a gun in the first place.

The way the article is written gives me the impression that guns are commonplace on the island which is a bit disturbing.

I can't link to Bangkokpost on this forum since it's forbidden, but here's the Google link to the story. You'll see the link to Bangkokpost on the opening page.

EDIT: Before you seriously consider opening a bar, read this article: http://www.retire-asia.com/thai-bar.shtml

Edited February 14, 201511 yr by Xircal

If you would read the post, you'd know it's not about owning a bar in jomtien, it's about understanding the reality of mafia in Thailand. If it's too difficult to reply to this post, why bother?

Thank you. Everything is too difficult for these types. It would require responsibility and to stop the worship of Lazy apathy.

Not much respect shown there....for a person who was brought up to respect others regardless..................

The dogs in the street (Thai and Farang) seem to know people have to be paid, what more proof do you need?

Edited February 14, 201511 yr by dotpoom

You pay the protection money either to the gangsters or the cops: choose your mafia.

Or ask Thais what it's like doing business with the Thais. They've given me plenty of useful warnings about their compatriots.

Anyone with money is a target in Thailand.

I don't think it's mafia related. The news report I read on Bangkokpost.com was that a drunken Turkish tourist tried to get a bar to serve him after closing time. When they refused, he went somewhere to get a gun and then threatened the bar again. The security guard subsequently shot him in self-defence.

However, you have to wonder why a guard would be carrying a gun in the first place.

The way the article is written gives me the impression that guns are commonplace on the island which is a bit disturbing.

I can't link to Bangkokpost on this forum since it's forbidden, but here's the Google link to the story. You'll see the link to Bangkokpost on the opening page.

EDIT: Before you seriously consider opening a bar, read this article: http://www.retire-asia.com/thai-bar.shtml

Finally! Someone actually read the original post and responded! Thank you!

Some media reports on TV said he was turkish mafia and protected foreigners on Samui. Do you know anything about this? What could possibly be going on there, and how could a gun toting turkish mafia be running around on Samui? Sounds odd to me, but again, I haven't been there, and no plans go.

Again, for the last time, this post is not about owning a bar!

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

You forgot to mention greedy landlords who see success and decide to double the rent in the middle of your lease. If you say no thanks they they have electricity or water fiddled with etc etc. It all goes on. Or they want their brother cousin etc to move in and make money from all your good work. All this happens. Thais are very jealous people...even among themselves

BS , if you have a good contract they can't do that. Read the small print before you sign,

so funny, you are so naive, yeah right " they cant do that" let me guess your incredible Thai lawyer would stop this right?

The only laws here is " the law of the jungle" and he/she with the most money/contacts wins, you can pay dearly with your life

Edited February 15, 201511 yr by kannot

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

You forgot to mention greedy landlords who see success and decide to double the rent in the middle of your lease. If you say no thanks they they have electricity or water fiddled with etc etc. It all goes on. Or they want their brother cousin etc to move in and make money from all your good work. All this happens. Thais are very jealous people...even among themselves

BS , if you have a good contract they can't do that. Read the small print before you sign,

BS I saw both contracts and BOTH landlords, who I knew fairly well agreed with me and told him to dismantle the wall. They went with him to the police station and came back and said there was nothing they could do and apologized to me. It didn´t help the tennents I had who couldn´t get out of their rooms. I had to refund their money of course and they had to find other accommodation at 8pm.

It seemed to me the landlords had been warned off, their attitudes changed dramatically. This guy knew someone at the police station.

So how do you suggest it could have been rectified? With a prolonged court case? By the time that had happened, even assuming a win, it would have been all over and more money down the toilet !! Contracts are worthless unless you can enforce them and if the police will not get involved what hope have you got?

I have seen people get into yearly contracts simply because premises are hard to come by in good locations. The landlord plays the game and as soon as the business becomes profitable take it over. Yes buyer beware I guess, but isn´t that what this thread is about? NEVER assume it wont happen.....

EDIT to add :

I have also seen people win court cases and / or get judgements from the police. Guys with Thai wives even, they just stop paying!! What do you do then? Go to the police every second month? Pay the police every time it happens? NEVER EVER forget, they are Thai, you are not !! Thailand is for Thais !!!

I hope this is a reality check....

Getting into yearly contracts is very stupid for a business.

We belong to a group of local business owners who meet once a month to discuss business and other things.

this group pays the police to come by our shop about every two hours a day.

the police sign a notebook and we turn this in to the group every month.

The police come in our shop and sit for a long time sometimes and are very friendly to me.

I think the best way to protect yourself is to pay the police to come by and do the same as we do.

Too easy. If your business enterprise is successful, whatever it is, you'll inspire the envy of your local thai competition, which is always going to be "dangerous", and require you to have "friends".....somebody, somewhere... (If you're unsuccessful, no problem.)

We belong to a group of local business owners who meet once a month to discuss business and other things.

this group pays the police to come by our shop about every two hours a day.

the police sign a notebook and we turn this in to the group every month.

The police come in our shop and sit for a long time sometimes and are very friendly to me.

I think the best way to protect yourself is to pay the police to come by and do the same as we do.

Paying cops is perhaps cheaper than paying other gangsters. At least the police try to appear honest and law-abiding to the public.

I don't think it's mafia related. The news report I read on Bangkokpost.com was that a drunken Turkish tourist tried to get a bar to serve him after closing time. When they refused, he went somewhere to get a gun and then threatened the bar again. The security guard subsequently shot him in self-defence.

However, you have to wonder why a guard would be carrying a gun in the first place.

The way the article is written gives me the impression that guns are commonplace on the island which is a bit disturbing.

I can't link to Bangkokpost on this forum since it's forbidden, but here's the Google link to the story. You'll see the link to Bangkokpost on the opening page.

EDIT: Before you seriously consider opening a bar, read this article: http://www.retire-asia.com/thai-bar.shtml

Finally! Someone actually read the original post and responded! Thank you!

Some media reports on TV said he was turkish mafia and protected foreigners on Samui. Do you know anything about this? What could possibly be going on there, and how could a gun toting turkish mafia be running around on Samui? Sounds odd to me, but again, I haven't been there, and no plans go.

Again, for the last time, this post is not about owning a bar!

I think you will find that the word ¨Mafia¨ is used different here in Thailand. It does not represent well organized crime as in the ¨Cosa Nostra¨ as we interpret it. ANY group of people with ¨connections¨ can be classified as ¨Mafia¨ here.

The biggest question is who reigns supreme? The Army or the Police? Anyone else is subservient to one or both of the 2 ¨clubs¨. Can´t you see what is going on in the country right now?