Australian traveller tells of his holiday nightmare in Thailand

[cumgranosalum]

Oral antibiotics would have been a good idea when the wound was first treated, as anything that size has the chance to get infected and sewing it up will just trap the infection inside.

In a Thai government hospital about 250bht for pain killing injections, washing, stitches, and a course of antibiotics to take home.

Every hospital issues antibiotics when you have road dirt in a wound that needs stitches.

It's so cheap, no need for any insurance claim.

Guessing here,

He didn't take the antibiotics or drank a lot of alcohol (that neutralises the antibiotics).

If a hospital finds you are insured, the chances of leaving with a lovely cardboard carrier bag FULL of various medications and dressing is significantly increased. Including paracetamol at about 10 times the price of a generic brand in a pharmacy.

[cumgranosalum]

Travel insurance is a must no matter where you travel... Cuts in thailand need more attention, due to humidity.. Excess use of antibiotics are also issues a lot off people have, thus they dont work as per usual..

antibiotics don't "work" on people, they work on the bacteria. You have to have bacteria that are resistant to the antibiotics....not the person.

the OP's problem was most likely to be that he wasn't prescribed with a sufficient course or he didn't finish the course....or an inappropriate anti-biotic. Or his wound was simply not cleaned properly or treated.

You are correct.

However I think the poster mean that the person, not the bacteria, takes the antibiotics.

Most doctors around the world should be aware of which bacteria are most drug resistant, and the circumstances under which they may be encountered - they should therefore have a good idea how to treat a common flesh wound with appropriate drugs.....and monitor the situation as well.

The fact is that in Thailand with tourists, doctors and staff are often happy to see the back of them and don't anticipate having to do any follow up treatment - they just "hope" for the best. Anyway at the end of the day the tourist either ends up getting treated at home or in another hospital, either way they're out of their hair.

Edited February 18, 2015 by cumgranosalum

[The manic]

There is no accountability in the UK either. 1000 unnecessary deaths a month and countless botched operations. If you can afford it Thai health care is much better than the NHS in the UK.

Both your premise and your conclusion are completely incorrect.

Your opinion is your own perspective and completely invalid and pointless!!! You could attempt to back up your point of view with some evidence or experience of your own???? Making closed, one sentence rebuffs of arguments don't really add anything of substance to the forum...

Your comment deserves no more than a "rebuff" - if you want to come to the discussion and contribute anything, you need to know what you are talking about - it is apparent from your post that you don't.

If you want to understand my "rebuff" then I suggest you get properly informed on the subject first. It's not for me to educate you here - do it yourself.

No but educate yourself first with the facts sourced by many enquiries into the UK NHS. The most recent government report citing 1000, one thousand, unnecessary deaths a month is an example of the inefficiency of the NHS. As for the scandal of the Bristol,hospital where hundreds of babies were found to have died through inadequate treatment: who answered to the law or to the parents? Nobody. I have been in hospital in the ME, UK and Thailand. The most compassionate and caring and humane was in Thailand. Th most uncaring was the UK NHS. The most efficient and hygienic were in Thailand. The UK NHS hospitals were squalid and dirty. I will not bother to cite countless studies and reports and research into the NHS and its faults, often fatal which demonstrate the untouchability of the doctors, surgeons and consultants who are effectively above the law. If you care enough to make a comment then care enough to be informed by one who knows more than you and has more experience than you.

[bangmai]

I feel a bit sad for people who compare healthcare systems when they know so little about them, this is especially clear when they talk about the US healthcare which has just about the most dilapidated, inequitable system in the developed world.

These folk are unfortunately the ones who are most likely to be taken for a ride by unethical healthcare systems such as the Thai one.

It sure is strange how they gladly accept blood from US donors, while most Europeans are disqualified. We Americans are usually a lot more familiar with how private health insurance works than the Euro-trash, also. BTW, ever hear of Glaxo-Smith-Kline? Smith and Kline were actually American; Glaxo is from greek mythology.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Your comment deserves no more than a "rebuff" - if you want to come to the discussion and contribute anything, you need to know what you are talking about - it is apparent from your post that you don't.

If you want to understand my "rebuff" then I suggest you get properly informed on the subject first. It's not for me to educate you here - do it yourself.

No but educate yourself first with the facts sourced by many enquiries into the UK NHS. The most recent government report citing 1000, one thousand, unnecessary deaths a month is an example of the inefficiency of the NHS. As for the scandal of the Bristol,hospital where hundreds of babies were found to have died through inadequate treatment: who answered to the law or to the parents? Nobody. I have been in hospital in the ME, UK and Thailand. The most compassionate and caring and humane was in Thailand. Th most uncaring was the UK NHS. The most efficient and hygienic were in Thailand. The UK NHS hospitals were squalid and dirty. I will not bother to cite countless studies and reports and research into the NHS and its faults, often fatal which demonstrate the untouchability of the doctors, surgeons and consultants who are effectively above the law. If you care enough to make a comment then care enough to be informed by one who knows more than you and has more experience than you.

Been to hospitals around the world,

Care and cleanliness appears random rather than country based (excluding Africa and S. America which are invariably dirty)

Although I would class CM RAM as generally rundown and dirty.

Plenty of dirty hospitals in the UK.

UK Vs Thailand,

Main difference I see is nurses, Thailand hospitals are filled with nurses and assistant nurses, in the UK you're lucky if you see a cleaner, nurses few and far between.

As for treating cuts,

YOU are the only one who can tell if it's infected, upto YOU to take action early.

Red, swollen and painful, you don't need to be a doctor to tell there is a problem.

It's just foolishness and/or laziness on the patient's part.

[slipperylobster]

Heck, that blue suture looks like fishing line.

used to call it "cat gut"

[kkup]

It's just a PAID article from a travel insurance company. the images of the leg probably aren't his.. Very effective though, and insurance is always a good idea.

[Kaalle]

Travel insurance is the moral of the story.

The first thing that popped in to my mind as I read the headline.

[moe666]

This is why I do not wear flip-flops in Thailand

[Shadychris]

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I'd spend a bit more time on the message rather than the messenger - if you have a problem with anything I've posted what not counter it with a valid argument?

As soon as you hear "in my experience" or "i have found" you can be sure you aren't going to hear a reasoned argument - just someone's personal perspective - as they don't realise how limited this is it is basically invalid and pointless to counter.

the moral of the story is to be aware of the dangers of the Thai healthcare system........... don't think because someone is wearing a white coat or they have modernist armchairs and a fish tank that these people are either trained to the standards you expect or even have the same ethics..........this is NOT just local clinics, this applies to major hospitals as well.

Whoever did that stitching needs to go back to their old job - making handbags

I have found the Thai Healthcare system to be far better than anything I've experienced in Europe. Plus all the doctors are from Thailand which is good as it stops any communication problems if you speak Thai..Although most doctors are fluent in Thai, English and possibly even a third language.... Last Year I spent over six hours in an A and E in England with a very sick four year old. The reason we were in an A and E was because the quickest appointment we could get to see a doctor in a local clinic was 9 days!! Eventually, when a doctor showed up he was a non native speaker who was barely understandable..The ward was full of drunk people and drug addicts! The hospitals in Thailand are much cleaner and safer.The health system here really puts Europe to shame.And we have the audacity to refer to Thailand as a 'developing country'(some uneducated people even refer to Thailand as a third world country!!)

The article about the OP highlights the arrogance of the West towards other countries. It is a weak attempt at continuing the Australian media's attempts to disparage Thailand. The fact that the man in question can't wait to get back to Thailand says it all really...

...and why should your sweeping opinion and perspective that healthcare is not to be trusted in Thailand be any less invalid or pointless??

Whilst deriding others opinions you like to come across as an authority on everything, but don't provide any proof or evidence of your own to back up your opinion or prove that you actually know anything more than nothing yourself

Had a huge amount of experience in many many hospitals and clinics across the Kingdom have we? Carried out extensive surveys to ensure that the training of all the doctors and nurses is up to the high standard you expect?

Where is your evidence to support your claims? At least those saying 'in my experience' or 'I have found' do actually have some experience to back up what they say

Infection is a fact of life not specific to Thailand - how about MRSA which is frequently found in western hospitals? I'm sure one could find good and bad cases of treatment in any hospital in any country. Cases of surgical instruments left inside patients bodies after ops? Incorrect doses or even incorrect drugs administered to patients? All these have, and still do happen in any hospital anywhere in the world. Setting aside negligence, medicine is not an exact science - things can and do go unexpectedly wrong. So why aren't you also saying that people should be aware of the dangers of healthcare systems globally??

This guy got infected by cutting himself outdoors in a tropical environment. He developed a very nasty infection which was subsequently effectively treated over the following days with no long lasting effect to his health or loss of limbs.

But hey - why let the 'facts' get in the way of a chance for you to engage in your favourite pastime of Thai bashing....

As i've said before - I'm talking IN PARTICULAR about the Thai healthcare system. You can take it or leave it but then don't be surprised when it all goes pear-shaped in some hospital. ....but judging from your posts, you are seriously under-informed about the Thai healthcare system - which of course is just the way they like it.

If you had provided a message of any substance, backed up by some proof maybe I would have been able to spend some time on it!

I did spend time questioning you on why you can state with authority that Thai doctors and nurses are not sufficiently trained, or why Thai hospitals are dangerous and unethical, and gave you the chance to provide proof. Typically you have dodged doing so.

You are very quick to dismiss others experiences as irrelevant or wrong, but as others have also pointed out seem to have nothing of significance to add yourself.

I feel a bit sad for people who compare healthcare systems when they know so little about them, this is especially clear when they talk about the US healthcare which has just about the most dilapidated, inequitable system in the developed world.

These folk are unfortunately the ones who are most likely to be taken for a ride by unethical healthcare systems such as the Thai one.

"I feel a bit sad for people who compare healthcare systems when they know so little about them"

Ah you mean people like yourself.....

Well I guess at least you can speak with some authority there and I expect quite a few others also feel sad for you. That is the usual reaction to trolls.

A look through just a small sample of some of your many thousands of posts on TV indicates that you seem to believe yourself to be an expert in many fields ranging from tiger conservation, meteorology, world trade and economics, transport infrastructure and politics to name just a few; and now it seems also the running and performance of healthcare systems - even down to the correct methods of treatment and procedures. All that as well as working for 20+ years on a market stall - you must be about 150 years old!

I think I prefer to take heed of what you 'think' your name says, and take any of your opinions or comments 'with a grain of salt'

Edited February 18, 2015 by Shadychris

[mok199]

this is news worthy are you <deleted> kidding me.... most of us have 10 stories that make his look silly,with bigger sacres to prove it....go hard or go home you wus...

[minikev]

I am living proof that Thai hospitals are very good.

I spent 3 months in Sattahip hospital having had gangrene in my upper right leg, many debridements loads of infection. When I returned to Englands hospitals the doctors there could not believe my leg was saved . In fact they stated bluntly they would have removed it. They also told me it was a waste of time saving it as I would never walk again.

One up to Thailand as I walk all day every day.

[Rajhulmaheesh]

Moral of article-better not marry thai girls(you know the knid) without proper insurance.

[Shadychris]

Moral of article-better not marry thai girls(you know the knid) without proper insurance.

Are you on drugs??

What on earth has marrying a Thai girl got to do with this??

[risky11]

Looking at the pictures it seems like he was infected with Necrotizing Faciitis or 'Flesh Eating Bacteria". It's very prevalent here in Thailand. I have had it no less than 5 times, the bacteria is always present but benign until the skin becomes broken. A small thing like a mosquito bite can turn into a huge gaping ulcer. One of my lower legs had to be amputated because of this disease. This bloke was lucky he didn't suffer the same fate. See https://www.google.co.th/?gws_rd=cr&ei=ZoPLUoPxAaXZigf2xYDIDA#q=necrotizing+fasciitis

Wow - i never knew that. Florida doesn't have that. Makes me happy I am here, not there.

[Shadychris]

Looking at the pictures it seems like he was infected with Necrotizing Faciitis or 'Flesh Eating Bacteria". It's very prevalent here in Thailand. I have had it no less than 5 times, the bacteria is always present but benign until the skin becomes broken. A small thing like a mosquito bite can turn into a huge gaping ulcer. One of my lower legs had to be amputated because of this disease. This bloke was lucky he didn't suffer the same fate. See https://www.google.co.th/?gws_rd=cr&ei=ZoPLUoPxAaXZigf2xYDIDA#q=necrotizing+fasciitis

Wow - i never knew that. Florida doesn't have that. Makes me happy I am here, not there.

Hmmn you might want to do a little research before you assume you are safe in Florida.. Although uncommon and difficult to diagnose

Necrotizing Faciitis has been reported all over the world - 600 reported cases in the US during the year 2000 - a good chance some of those were in Florida I would have thought.

However in spite of some speculation by the armchair doctors and bacteriologists here on TV, there is nothing factual provided to suggest it was the type of infection in this case.

[TerrylSky]

Up north at home in the village even, I learned to immediately treat any scratch or cut - with hot soapy water, then hydrogen peroxide - lots of it - and bandage and keep clean - and repeat frequently multi daily until healed. The smallest cut can become a big problem. Indeed infections seem rampant here; I think not only because of unhygienic conditions sometimes, but because of the heat. Seems to take a little longer to heal too. Have to tend to the little problems right away before the become big ones. Ran into a nice woman in Chiang Mai once, similar situation but it got to be so bad she elected to fly home to Paris. What does that say for the Thai health industry - although there are many fine, quality institutions, and medical teams hereI know. Strange. Long story short, I travel with hyrogen peroxide - baking soda (another wonder product ) - and condoms - always.

Edited February 18, 2015 by TerrylSky

[gamini]

whats the point of this post? Most of us have had a similkar experience or will have in thier life time. The Thai doctors did thier Job. You cant call this mundane post "Best of Thai Visa".

[Traveller45]

Bacteria is different in Thailand? If it's 'stronger' it might just be down to the misuse of antibiotics regularly dispensed for colds and flu which are viral, and for almost anything else.

Maybe it's the chilis.

Oh no. The chilis are good for you. It s actually a natural antiseptic.

[Traveller45]

I am living proof that Thai hospitals are very good.

I spent 3 months in Sattahip hospital having had gangrene in my upper right leg, many debridements loads of infection. When I returned to Englands hospitals the doctors there could not believe my leg was saved . In fact they stated bluntly they would have removed it. They also told me it was a waste of time saving it as I would never walk again.

One up to Thailand as I walk all day every day.

I haven't been to hospital in Thailand, only to the dentist (root canal). Whoever says that this is a minor affair hasn't seen me as a patient. Fantastic job. They must have spent half a day on me. Relatively painless, as far as these things go, and, needless to say, no problems ever afterwards.

[chooka]

This is why I do not wear flip-flops in Thailand

Aussies don't wear flip - flops, they are called thongs and if you said to an Aussie nice flip - flops you will probably get a good thonging

[Shadychris]

This is why I do not wear flip-flops in Thailand

Aussies don't wear flip - flops, they are called thongs and if you said to an Aussie nice flip - flops you will probably get a good thonging

LOL and if I wore one of my gf's thongs I expect I would probably get a flip-flop across my face from her! We already have to contend with 'American' English, dont tell me that now we have to add 'Australian' English as well... ;-)

[AlQaholic]

tetanus vaccination, how long ago? should be done every 10 years or so I think.

[steve187]

i always have a bottle of hydrogen peroxide at the house and with me when i travel.

just pore it all over a wound like water. very cheap. end of problem.

18 baht at Boots for a small bottle that fits in your pocket.

a good tip more on hydrogen peroxide here - http://wakeup-world.com/2012/07/09/27-amazing-benefits-and-uses-for-hydrogen-peroxide/

[pitchag]

I had an insect bite that infected to a painfull swelling, I had it cut to release the poison and had to go back to the hospital every day to get it scraped out and repacked with anti-biotics for over a week, needless to say the scraping of the wound was very painfull, so I feel for this poor lad seeing the size of the wound he had, besides insurance, the lesson is don't wait too long to seek medical help, infections get out of hand very quickly in the tropics, I have lived in the tropics most of my life and seen many wounds turn into ulcers and worse

[sweatalot]

the moral of the story is to be aware of the dangers of the Thai healthcare system........... don't think because someone is wearing a white coat or they have modernist armchairs and a fish tank that these people are either trained to the standards you expect or even have the same ethics..........this is NOT just local clinics, this applies to major hospitals as well.

Whoever did that stitching needs to go back to their old job - making handbags

I do not think the treating hospital has to be blamed. They cleaned the wound before stitching. The wound may have looked clean (I did not see a picture of the wound after cleaning) If the wound looked clean I would have told the patient to check back the next day and come imidiately for antibiotic treatment if it gets any worse. If the doctor did not give this instruction this was a mistake. (I am a doctor and treated many wounds) The problem in Thailand seems to be to give antibiotics when they are not needed - and not to forget antibiotics.

[ksamuiguy]

Yes it kills everything.

HIV, Staff, MSRA, Look it up. the thing about topical anti-bacterial is contact time, take's time in contact the the organism, each is different

This is what the surgeons coat your skin with before they operate.

Washes off easily so must be reapplied often, a great preventive for an open wound until professional treatment can be received.

BETADINE^® Solution is an aqueous solution of 10% povidone-iodine. It is a fast-acting, broad-spectrum antiseptic that helps reduce bacteria that potentially can cause skin infection. It is used for degerming skin, wounds and mucous membranes, and for preoperative skin preparation of patients.

The best 32 baht you'll ever spend.

[sweatalot]

the headline is misleading. When reading it I expected a story Koh Tao style with corrupted police seeming to protect the wrongdoers and looking for scapegoats.

Severe wound infection can happen in every tropic country, even with proper treatment. It is not the fault of Thailand.

And note he got proper treatment in a hospital and says he is happy with that.

[raybal5]

Lucky he had insurance. Don't travel without it.

I book all our return flights on a Platinum Westpac credit card, it covers all our insurance needs and is included when you book the flight. (no extra cost)

Check your cards as most cover travel insurance as stated above. But it must be on a return flight booking from OZ.

Caution: Don't just trust the marketing blurb. Make sure you know exactly what your credit card insurance covers.

1. Does it cover everyone on the booked trip or just the primary card holder? Many just cover one person regardless of how many you booked and paid for.
2. Have you got all of the policy wording so you know exactly what you are covered for?
3. Do you have a 24/7 contact number to call in an emergency? Some things may require pre-approval.
4. Do you have a policy number to quote?
5. Do you know the limits of your cover?

Don't be a dill - make sure you know before you go.

[OmarZaidMD]

Oral antibiotics would have been a good idea when the wound was first treated, as anything that size has the chance to get infected and sewing it up will just trap the infection inside.

Agreed. Looks nasty dirty too .... I would have left a drain in, just in case... put him an antibiotic, calendula and nanosilver soaks .... had him come bck for daily chceks and wound dressing. My guess is, they patched him up .. looks a bit sloppy, and perhaps didn't do a good job of cleaning and or debriding the wound ... tough luck ...