Crackdown On Anti-Thaksin Movement

[hammered]

Call on people not to pay taxes does not soung perfectly legal. Has the actual call been made, or the idea was simply floated, as Rosana claims?

Judicial review of PAD demonstrations is welcome - all the more reasons to see who is "right".

Calling on people not to pay taxes is a bit dodgy, but maybe they could justify it by saying so much of the taxes is being lost to corruption that they don't want to pay it until they are satisfied a government is honest with the money. They could also use thaksins sale of shin as an example and say they wouldn't pay until tax was paid on that.

Calling on people if it were actually done and it were done with an intent for people to actually take action could be problematic. Then again calling on governors and police to not allow peaceful demonstrations could be seen as an attempt to undermine the constitution. We are not seeing the police running to the courts to get warrants to arrest those ordering this on similar charges.

As with everything things are not being dealt with even handed, and that is probably why Khun Anand broke his silence today.

[Hermano Lobo]

Is the really Thailand??

More like China, or North Korea........

It will become like China, if toxic remains in power, or at least like Singapore! Sooner he takes himself and his bag of money and leaves the better. Either that or he might go the way of Chauchescu!

I wrote this two and half years ago. I stand by my assertion:-

A Thai Nightmare

http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/reader/reader667.html

Edited August 31, 2006 by Hermano Lobo

[cclub75]

I wrote this two and half years ago. I stand by my assertion:-

Nice and realistic. But you've made one big mistake : timing.

2010 ? I would rather say 2040.

More seriously :

-yes the "republic" idea looks more and more grounded...

-yes Bangkok like Singapore (cleanliness, political correctness etc.)

But outside Bangkok... I doubt it.

[marquess]

I wrote this two and half years ago. I stand by my assertion:-

Nice and realistic. But you've made one big mistake : timing.

2010 ? I would rather say 2040.

More seriously :

-yes the "republic" idea looks more and more grounded...

-yes Bangkok like Singapore (cleanliness, political correctness etc.)

But outside Bangkok... I doubt it.

It sounds like a it's a cross between Nineteen Eighty Four and Singapore! But it is not without merit. It is only a certain person, who is stopping this toxic disease, from fully and completely engulfing the country with it's corruptive and controlling vapours!

[sriracha john]

Thailand 'at risk of becoming failed state'

Former prime minister Anand Panyarachun yesterday warned that Thailand could become a failed state in need of salvaging by the United Nations unless there was a concerted effort to end division. Without mentioning names, Mr Anand blamed the current caretaker government for bringing crisis to the country. ''Thai society is split into two,'' Mr Anand said. ''The figures do not matter, whether it is 19 million or 16 million,'' he added in an apparent reference to the number of votes caretaker Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra claims to have gained in elections in 2001 and in April this year. ''If Thai society is still divided and there is so much hate, and the environment is conducive to prolonging this hate, and to sustaining conflict, it is frightening, very frightening. It is something that all sides must work to prevent from happening. I don't want to use the term employed by the UN for African countries, that is failing or failed states that the UN has to rehabilitate,'' he said. ''I don't want Thailand to come to this, but it is possible if the situation continues this way for a long time, and no one can, has the means, the desire or the intent to manage it.'' Mr Anand said he was not neutral, however. ''In my life, I have never been impartial when it comes to choosing between right and wrong, good and bad, democratic and undemocratic.'' The political turmoil was the result of an attempt to distort the constitution by people who exploited it. He directed his comments at an unnamed person who often urges others to ''play by the rules''.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/31Aug2006_news01.php

ADDITIONAL INFORMATION HERE:

Former Prime Minister Anand Panyarachun addresses a conference on a new round of socio-political reforms at the Ambassador Hotel yesterday, where he warned about the peril of a polarised Thailand. The Nation

POLITICAL DIVISION

Failed-state danger is real

Published on Aug 31, 2006

Anand warns of deep polarisation with people being afraid to speak their minds

Thailand could be on the brink of becoming a "failed state" if the present polarisation and hatred is allowed to continue, former prime minister Anand Panyarachun warned yesterday.

Anand said the term is used by the United Nations to describe a country with socio-political conditions that are almost impossible to manage and where the government fails to function or is not willing to take control.

"The Democrat Party can't go to the North while Thaksin can't step foot in the South. What kind of country is this?" Anand said.

He was referring to the atmosphere of animosity the Democrats and caretaker PM Thaksin faced when they were in the "territory" of rival parties.

The respected former prime minister said he had avoided giving public speeches in the past several months because he tried to avoid projecting an extreme view of Thailand as a failed state.

"But now I have to speak, so this is what I have to say," Anand said.

"Thai society is now polarised by strong hatred. If this condition is allowed to continue, we will be living in horrifying times. Everybody has to prevent the worst from happening. But as of today, I haven't seen any positive signs."

Such polarisation prevented many people from expressing themselves for fear that they would be accused of siding with the opposing camp, the former premier said. However, Anand said that he, for one, will not hide behind the notion of being non-partisan.

"In my life, I never take a non-partisan stance between right and wrong, good and bad, democracy and anti-democracy, dhamma and non-dhamma, justice and injustice, press freedom and media control.

I always stay on the right side," he stated.

Anand, who is also president of Transparency International (Thailand), was giving a keynote speech yesterday at a conference on a new round of socio-political reforms co-organised by the Thailand Journalists Association, Transparency International, Thammasat University, Midnight University and the National Health Foundation.

The group yesterday announced its initiative to take part in shaping a new round of social and political reforms that involve broad-based participation of people from different sectors.

The first nation-wide reform attempt produced what was then believed to be the most progressive charter - known as the People's Constitution - in 1997. However, critics say the intent and spirit of the charter has been distorted over the past five years.

From now until February, the groups planned to conduct studies and several rounds of public discussions that would focus on issues including morality of leaders, political decentralisation, grass-roots participation, independent organisations and media reforms.

Law Professor Somchai Preechasilpakul, representing Midnight University, yesterday urged people to look at a new round of reforms beyond amending the Constitution - to fix the political damage done during Thaksin's tenure.

To Somchai, if the momentum for a new round of social and political reforms are to be sustained and produce results, the initiatives have to be driven by broad-based groups of people, not just a handful of professionals and the elite.

Without policy changes pushed by popular participation, good initiatives could simply turn into a cliche, such as "sufficiency economy" that everybody would talk about in a rhetorical way.

"[The term] 'sufficiency economy' has almost become another term of greetings like 'sawasdee'," he said.

Dr Juree Vijitwatakarn, secretary general of Transparency International (Thailand), agreed that no meaningful reform could take place without people's recognition of the equality of everybody in society.

"How can we have meaningful reforms when many people still don't believe they are equal to everybody else? Any reform has to start from instilling the sense of social equality."

- The Nation

===============================================================

AND THE GOVERNMENT RESPONSE HERE:

Government raps Anand for 'failed state' remarks

Ex-PM's comments seen as over the top

Former prime minister Anand Panyarachun's predictions that Thailand could become a failed nation were over the top, key government figures said yesterday. Speaking at a forum organised by the Thai Journalists Association, Mr Anand warned that Thailand could become a failed state in need of salvaging by the United Nations unless there was a concerted effort to end division. He did not believe the election would solve the problem. The country needed gradual development of social reform under transparent government policies. Caretaker government spokesman Surapong Suebwonglee said Thailand was still far away from being a failed state. Thais believed in peace, and that political disputes would be solved through compromise, he said. The election would solve the political deadlock, he predicted. The government wanted to ensure political activity was conducted in a peaceful manner. ''It's those who resort to violent means by using abusive words to show contempt towards others, or try to assassinate people they do not want that should be condemned,'' he said. Caretaker Deputy Prime Minister Surakiart Sathirathai said he did not think Thailand would become a failed state. ''Thais are reconciling,'' he said. Kongsak Wantana, caretaker Interior Minister, said political rifts and violence were normal in the run-up to an election. The authorities would keep the situation under control.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/01Sep2006_news10.php

===============================================================

ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ON THE GOVERNMENT RESPONSE HERE:

POLITICAL TENSION

Ex-PM Anand 'no democratic spirit'

Government retaliates over 'failed state' warning, saying there is a way out of the crisis

Key members of the government yesterday hit back at comments by former prime minister Anand Panyarachun that Thailand could become a "failed state".

The heaviest salvo came from Deputy Agriculture Minister Adisorn Piangket, who said Anand came out to criticise premier Thaksin Shinawatra because he wanted to become a royally appointed prime minister through Article 7 of the Constitution.

"Anand has never been aware of democracy and does not have a democratic spirit. He has never run in an election. In his view, politicians are always bad," he said.

Adisorn said if Anand wanted to become prime minister, he should set up his own party and play by the rules.

"But now the time is up for him to return as premier. He cannot be premier under the current Constitution. He should stop commenting right now," he said.

Speaking on Wednesday, Anand warned Thailand could become a "failed state" if the present polarisation and hatred were allowed to continue.

Government spokesman Surapong Seubwonglee said the country was far from being a "failed state". He referred to a Time magazine article about Thailand's silk revolution which showed change need not cause violence.

"Life is not a choice between black and white [as Anand said] because the world is grey," Surapong said.

He also referred to the time when Anand took the premiership in 1992 offered by the then military junta of the National Peace Keeping Council, despite knowing the junta had overthrown Chatichai Choonhavan's administration by coup d'etat.

However, Anand's premiership eventually improved the country. "So doing the right thing to improve the situation might not go along with the democratic line," he said.

Surapong said that despite all the different opinions, the country would find a way out of the current crisis if all parties follow a peaceful path.

"I believe the election will be the best solution to end the political stalemate and to protect our country from failing," he said.

Anand suggested a leader, without naming him, should have accountability and take responsibility.

Surapong said everybody might do wrong. "Thaksin might do something wrong but he is ready to correct it," he added.

Caretaker Agriculture Minister Sudarat Keyuraphan said Anand should make it clear what was behind his concerns. The government was ready to listen to all parties' opinions. "But now we should go straight to the election and stop any idea of having a royally appointed premier under Article 7," she said. don't recall anything about him saying that...

- The Nation

[sriracha john]

ANOTHER RESPECTED EX-PM'S COMMENTS HERE:

Prem: Bad leaders are doomed to failure

Bad individuals are bound for doom if they try to gain control of the nation in order to amass ill-gotten wealth for themselves and their supporters, a chief adviser to His Majesty the King said yesterday.

"I believe the Guardian Spirit of the Kingdom will always guide and protect good people while putting a curse on bad people," General Prem Tinsulanonda said.

The Thai Kingdom is sacred and the forces of evil will be self-defeated in the end, Prem said.

Prem's remarks coincided with growing criticism about the leadership of caretaker Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

Faced with a prolonged political crisis, Thaksin made a veiled attack in June on a leading figure "outside the Constitution" for trying to overthrow him.

In the past month Prem has delivered a series of powerful speeches seen as being critical of flawed leadership. He visited the Chulachomklao Royal Military Academy and the Naval Academy to rally the military behind the monarchy and the Kingdom.

In an analogy, he likened the soldiers to a horse belonging to the King while the government was merely the jockey. He also reminded the military to uphold ethics and morals rather than succumb to greed and the lure of ill-gotten gains.

He concluded his series of military lectures at the Air Force Academy yesterday.

In opening his remarks, he called on soldiers to strictly heed royal advice.

"Some people have heard and understood His Majesty's remarks many times but failed to put them into practice," he said. "This may be because certain individuals who are dishonest and bad can never heed the royal advice."

He drew on the royal advice given in 1969 to illustrate his point.

The King suggested the promotion of good people and preventing bad people from gaining power to stir up trouble, he said.

"This advice about reining in bad people means that leaders should be honest, because those with greed and dishonesty cannot impart good leadership," he said.

It is the duty of every soldier to ensure that bad people are not allowed to rise to or stay on in positions of power, he said.

He said the Thai cultural trait for giving respect to an elder might be cumbersome if practised blindly.

"Respecting your elders should not be allowed to breed tolerance for senior but bad figures," he said.

The armed forces should set an example in reprimanding bad people, he said.

- The Nation

[hammered]

A rising crescendo of voices against Mr. Thaksin. There must be mounting concern about what he has done/is doing to the country in terms of the divisiveness.

[Plus]

He had a go at Prem, not it's Anand's turn. There's no way he would be forgiven.

[kmart]

Thaksin is cornered and wounded. Expect him to do something extreme anytime soon. I cannot remember a "leader" so derided in Bangkok, and so dependant on up-country simpletons for support. I can't see him stepping down. - Its not in his nature. After he has gone though; you have got to hope Thailand gets serious about the supposed checks and balances that prevent rich; egomaniac lunatics like him from amassing such power. Shame on the people in his government that support his lies and tantrums. How much money do they need?

[lukamar]

I cannot remember a "leader" so derided in Bangkok, and so dependant on up-country simpletons for support.

That's because Bangkok doesn't hold the power anymore and the old Bkk establishment no longer gets their cut and they want the old system back. The upcountry people are not simpletons and you show your total ignorance about them and the North & Northeast, with your statement.

[Samuian]

kmart wrote: "How much money do they need?"

ALL THEY CAN PUT THEIR HANDS ON!

"The Eye of Greed, all goods of the world won't fill this cave!"

Firdausi, iranian poet around 14th Century....

Big T lost his marbles already! He believes his own lies and really thinks his actions will lead the country into the golden age. He and his cronies have by now twisted things so often around that they all don't know anymore which way they really going - and what for, except that the level of their wealth is steadily rising - and that is all they and their leader ever persued.

And as Prem said, it will finally take care of it self, let him "win" the next elections!

What happens if you keep on putting more and more weight on just one side of a beam?

If Prawase Wasi, Prem and so many other poeple are already alarmed he and his gang of thugs will have not much more time.

That he has to turn to the impoverished farmers with empty promises speaks for itself.

[Plus]

That's because Bangkok doesn't hold the power anymore and the old Bkk establishment no longer gets their cut and they want the old system back.

Are we witnessing some Marxist revolution, struggle of the classes? Hope it doesn't turn out the way Khmer Rouge did.

The upcountry people are not simpletons and you show your total ignorance about them and the North & Northeast, with your statement.

Well, judging by the way they beat Democrats with the chairs and pelted them with eggs, they do not look like a highly sophisticated bunch. Blockading newspaper offices and promising to rape all female staff also wasn't a high class show. Accepting only one person, The King, but not listening to any of his most loyal servants (Prem, Sumet, and even Anand) is also not a sign of maturity.

It feels good to be a revolutionary, I suppose, to think that you are important and the fate of the country depends on you. Actually it depends on Thaksin. No one else matters to them, no authorities left.

Sorry to say, but Thaksin has turned them into orks, and his "trees and natural beauty minister" trained some of them as uruk-hais.

[womble]

I cannot remember a "leader" so derided in Bangkok, and so dependant on up-country simpletons for support.

That's because Bangkok doesn't hold the power anymore and the old Bkk establishment no longer gets their cut and they want the old system back. The upcountry people are not simpletons and you show your total ignorance about them and the North & Northeast, with your statement.

Those north eastern counrtry folk are not as stupid as you imply, infact most know exactly what they are doing.

I'm not a Thakisn fan, but the fact remains he has done more for them than the rest of all the governments before him combined. As far as they are concerned he is not whiter than white even though he may hope thats what they believe. Far from it they no he has fed himself rather well, but as long as he contunes to let them feed to they are happy. They care nothing for demorcratic principles or for the old style politicans that are cryting foul. The like the fact that they matter and are not willing to give up this new power they have found. Good for them, hopefully this will teach others that they have to consider the electorate as a whole as you can be held accountable at the elections.

The problem here is that even if all these farmers could fully understand what Thaksin has done it wouldn't bother them as he is the best out of a bad bunch, the only one who gave them anything. every leader before him was corrupt to a certain extent, but they never fed the farmers as thaksin has.

We all know that a leader like thaksin is no good for the country as a whole, but for sure these farmers are better off under thaksin. Media freedom, corruption nepotism etc, this can all be overlooked as long as the money keeps flowing.

Whilst they may not understand complex economic models and formulas they do understand the difference between being given some handouts and being given nothing.

Hopefully thaksin will be forced out through the courts, then whoever follows realises that the country folk must also be taken care of, if thaksin can be gotten rid of, maybe, just maybe Thailand will eventually be better off as the poor can no longer be annoyed and left to fend for themselves, otherwise it leaves the door open for another Thaksin in the future.

Thaksins enormous yet dwindling power in my opinion is completely the fault of the old style political elite, if they had taken care of all Thai people as they were supoosed to the this would never have happened. It's a shame that thaksin is doing it for his own gain, he doesn't really care about the poor, they are just his pawns in the game to stay alive in power, however it should be noted that should the next leader fail to take notice of the poor, thaksin or someone like him could well make a comeback.

[sbk]

Interesting evaluation and I do see your point.The problem Thaksin seems to face is that he hasn't been taking care of the entire electorate either. He has alienated the South and divided the country like never before. Its too bad that NE farmers can't put the country's good as a whole ahead of their own but then, that is human nature, I suppose.

[Hermano Lobo]

ANOTHER RESPECTED EX-PM'S COMMENTS HERE:

Prem: Bad leaders are doomed to failure

Bad individuals are bound for doom if they try to gain control of the nation in order to amass ill-gotten wealth for themselves and their supporters, a chief adviser to His Majesty the King said yesterday.

"I believe the Guardian Spirit of the Kingdom will always guide and protect good people while putting a curse on bad people," General Prem Tinsulanonda said.

The Thai Kingdom is sacred and the forces of evil will be self-defeated in the end, Prem said.

Prem's remarks coincided with growing criticism about the leadership of caretaker Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

Faced with a prolonged political crisis, Thaksin made a veiled attack in June on a leading figure "outside the Constitution" for trying to overthrow him.

In the past month Prem has delivered a series of powerful speeches seen as being critical of flawed leadership. He visited the Chulachomklao Royal Military Academy and the Naval Academy to rally the military behind the monarchy and the Kingdom.

In an analogy, he likened the soldiers to a horse belonging to the King while the government was merely the jockey. He also reminded the military to uphold ethics and morals rather than succumb to greed and the lure of ill-gotten gains.

He concluded his series of military lectures at the Air Force Academy yesterday.

In opening his remarks, he called on soldiers to strictly heed royal advice.

"Some people have heard and understood His Majesty's remarks many times but failed to put them into practice," he said. "This may be because certain individuals who are dishonest and bad can never heed the royal advice."

He drew on the royal advice given in 1969 to illustrate his point.

The King suggested the promotion of good people and preventing bad people from gaining power to stir up trouble, he said.

"This advice about reining in bad people means that leaders should be honest, because those with greed and dishonesty cannot impart good leadership," he said.

It is the duty of every soldier to ensure that bad people are not allowed to rise to or stay on in positions of power, he said.

He said the Thai cultural trait for giving respect to an elder might be cumbersome if practised blindly.

"Respecting your elders should not be allowed to breed tolerance for senior but bad figures," he said.

The armed forces should set an example in reprimanding bad people, he said.

- The Nation

He has had the temerity to criticise, in Thaksin's mind, the caretaker PM.

It will be interesting to watch Thaksin's response. It may show how confident

he is of his backing within Thailand and externally. I don't mean a lot of poor

farmers in the North.

What was Thaksin alleged to have implied in Finland ?

Edited September 1, 2006 by Hermano Lobo

[stumonster]

up-country simpletons

I hope your respected others are not enamoured of korean/thai soapies......

It will be interesting to watch Thaksin's response

he thinks he is a dead set legend.

I wonder if his missus is quietly shuffling the family cash out - except for the 2 bill

[lung]

-----

Court reject police's arrest warrant on PAD (1.9.2006-20.00)

---------

The Criminal Court turned down on Friday a police request to issue arrest warrants against seven key members of the antiThaksin People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) for allegedly conspiring to overthrow the government and breaking the law under Article 116 of the Criminal Code.

The court issued an order stating that the seven people, including Bangkok senatorelect Rosana Tositrakul, and PAD coordinator Suriyasai Katasila, were merely exercising their right to freedom of expression under Article 39 of the Constitution, and to hold a peaceful assembly, which was guaranteed by Article 44 of the 1997 charter.

"The speech [by those charged by the police] is first and foremost made to demand Pol Col Thaksin Shinawatra to resign [as prime minister] ... There appears to be no intention to overthrow the law of the land nor the government by using force or to cause havoc and unrest amongst citizens," the court order said.

The two presiding judges also stated that peaceful protest was a constitutional right that could not be denied, especially when considering that the country was not in a state of emergency or war when the protests took place earlier this year.

The order will likely have a positive impact on five other core PAD leaders who face the same allegations by the police, said Nitikorn Lamlhuea, a lawyer from the Law Society of Thailand who is representing both groups voluntarily and without payment, as a public service.

"It will definitely have an [positive] impact especially on the issue of [the right to peaceful] protests," Nitikorn told The Nation after the court order was read (see box).

Rosana, speaking for the six other accused PAD members praised the court order, saying it set a precedent for police investigators not to abuse their power to issue summons. All seven PAD members twice refused summons to report to the police, forcing the police to ask the court for arrest warrants earlier this week.

"[The court order] is setting a new precedent for [police] investigators, so that they may not use their power [to summon people] on a whim. The justice system [which the police is part of] must be free from political interference. simply because they issue a summons letter and let my fingers be printed," Rosana said.

"Article 76 states that the government must promote people's participation [in politics and governance]. The police must look into the charter and not harass citizens."

The police, led by Maj General Chatchawan Suksomjit, deputy commander of the Metropolitan Police, might now try to charge the seven with minor, noncriminal offences such as obstructing traffic, littering and using loudspeakers in public areas.

However, Rosana and Nitikorn vowed to fight these charges as well, even though they merit only fines.

Pravit Rojanaphruk

The Nation

-------

[sbk]

Well, this is good news indeed. Now what about Thaksin's order to the governors to ban peaceful protest in the provinces? Surely that falls under the same guidelines?

The court issued an order stating that the seven people, including Bangkok senatorelect Rosana Tositrakul, and PAD coordinator Suriyasai Katasila, were merely exercising their right to freedom of expression under Article 39 of the Constitution, and to hold a peaceful assembly, which was guaranteed by Article 44 of the 1997 charter.

"The speech [by those charged by the police] is first and foremost made to demand Pol Col Thaksin Shinawatra to resign [as prime minister] ... There appears to be no intention to overthrow the law of the land nor the government by using force or to cause havoc and unrest amongst citizens," the court order said.

The two presiding judges also stated that peaceful protest was a constitutional right that could not be denied, especially when considering that the country was not in a state of emergency or war when the protests took place earlier this year.

[womble]

Yeah this is great, basically gives PAD a green light to demonstrate, I doubt Thaksin will be happy with this as he will now know that if he doesn't play ball with PAD and do something about the demonstrators getting hurt (which he won't), he will almost certainly face renewed street protests.

PAD do not want an election, and the only way for them to stop Thaksin is through protests, should the courts fail. My bet is they would rather wait for the courts and then if things don't go their way then protest. They just gave TRT another 7 days to do something about the incident, they will probobally keep stalling, gauge public opinion for new demonstrations, and if the courts fails to convict Thaksin or if Thaksin somehow tries to stop the courts from sitting, we will then see protests.

You can see how desperate Thaksin is for this election, the senate has now decided on the EC commisioners backgrounds, it was expected to go on longer, TRT must have lobbied hard and paid for some quick decisions, it wouldn't surprised me if the senate dragged it's feet on purpose in order to get payouts for finishing quickly. So now all they have to do is choose the 5, then we're on our way.

End game is getting closer by the day!

Edited September 1, 2006 by womble

[Plus]

PAD do not want an election

PAD's goal is to remove Thaksin. They do not want an election that would legitimise his grip on power and whitewash his sins. Other than that they don't have problems with elections and will accept any outcome as long as Thaksin steps down.

I understand that farmers in Isan and the North feel that Thaksin is the best PM they ever had, afterall he ran the most elaborate vote buying schemes there for five years, travelling extensively and throwing money on various projects and giving out cheap loans and promising the Moon. He played them right, credit is due.

On the other hand, had it been not for a total control of information and vote buying, their love might not have been so "unconditional".

[sriracha john]

---------

Court reject police's arrest warrant on PAD

---------

The Criminal Court turned down on Friday a police request to issue arrest warrants against seven key members of the antiThaksin People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) for allegedly conspiring to overthrow the government and breaking the law under Article 116 of the Criminal Code.

Thank you judges... you made the right choice...

[John K]

---------

Court reject police's arrest warrant on PAD

---------

The Criminal Court turned down on Friday a police request to issue arrest warrants against seven key members of the antiThaksin People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) for allegedly conspiring to overthrow the government and breaking the law under Article 116 of the Criminal Code.

Thank you judges... you made the right choice...

I bet Thaksin is so mad he could build a bomb!!!!

I was going to put an angry smiley but I could not find a square one.

[sriracha john]

PM'S RESPONSE TO THE TWO RESPECTED EX-PM'S COMMENTS HERE:

Thaksin hits back at 'senile leaders'

For three straight days three leading figures in society have aired their critical views of the country's leadership. And while no one was mentioning any names, it is clear the verbal salvos were directed at the incumbent prime minister.

Caretaker Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, 57, yesterday stepped forward to portray "those you-know-whos" as old and senile leaders.

"Some senior people are out of sync with the world even before getting old and becoming senile with advancing age," he said.

Thaksin's statement is seen as a retort to the verbal attacks on his leadership by Anand Panyarachun, 74, and General Prem Tinsulanonda, 86, on Wednesday and Thursday, respectively.

With government officials as his audience, Thaksin made a speech on the theme of changes laced with veiled messages at his critics.

Contrary to popular expectations, the ideological struggle persists even after the Cold War, he said. Forces of globalisation and capitalism are being opposed by the sceptics of state power.

"These sceptics are like anarchists fighting a strong government. Some even go so far as to attack the government's approach to adopt capitalism to help the grass-roots people," he said.

He floated ideas expounded by thinkers like Edward de Bono and Alvin Toffler to back up his views.

"Toffler is an old man but he keeps pace with change, unlike certain senior people," he said, making a thinly veiled reference to Anand and Prem.

Meanwhile, Thai Rak Thai party executive Adisorn Piangket slammed Prem and Anand for taking sides with the anti-Thaksin movements.

He said Prem, as privy council president, should stick to the role defined by the Constitution.

Adisorn blamed Anand for attempting to divide society with his verbal attack on Thaksin.

"Anand assumed the prime ministership twice under dictatorial rule, not democratic rule," he said. "Thaksin is an elected PM, so Anand should respect the incumbent premier," he said.

Caretaker Senator Sopon Supapong said Prem would not have spoken out had the present crisis not been so severe. As long as Thaksin stayed in the office, peace would be impossible, he said.

- The Nation

Edited September 1, 2006 by sriracha john

[cclub75]

"Some senior people are out of sync with the world even before getting old and becoming senile with advancing age," he said.

Wouah ! Guns are getting loaded...

"Anand assumed the prime ministership twice under dictatorial rule, not democratic rule," he said. "Thaksin is an elected PM, so Anand should respect the incumbent premier," he said.

Here it is : that's the perfect rethorical trap.

Thaksin has the legimaticy, given by voters. He is a democrat.

All the "charismatic persons" are not.

Push a little bit further, and you start to foresee the "republic" idea...

[sriracha john]

Extracts from the Criminal Court ruling for PAD

The following is an excerpt from the Criminal Court's three-page order denying a police request for arrest warrants against seven key members of the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD). The order can be interpreted as a boost to people's right to participate in politics, including the right to scrutinise and demand the resignation of the prime minister.

"[The Court] has considered the matter and thinks that people have the liberty to peaceful and unarmed assembly and limiting such right [which is guaranteed under Article 44 of the Constitution] cannot be done ... unless the country is in a state of war or while a state of emergency is being declared ...

hmm... that "state of emergency" clause could present an out for the PM with regard to future rallies.

"[in deciding] whether the assembly and speech of the People's Alliance for Democracy is a violation of Article 116 of Criminal Code [conspiring to overthrow the government and law by force] or not, one must consider each individual's speech ... In considering the speech, the content of the speech must be considered in total and mere words or parts of it should not be used.

very good.. not taking things out of context is important.

"[The alleged offenders] chiefly intended to attack the policy, governance and also the ethics of Pol Colonel Thaksin Shinawatra as prime minister, who is a public figure, and demanded that he resign from the post. There appears to be no intention to overthrow the law of the land or the government by using force to cause havoc and unrest among citizens …

good interpretation.

"As for the speech of Ms Rosana [Tositrakul] which was made on March 5, 2006 ... it is apparent that Ms Rosana's intention was to see protesters boycotting goods of certain private firms [the names of AIS, Nescafe, CP and 7-Eleven were read out], and as for the talk of delaying tax payment and engaging in a general strike as a next-step measure to be adopted if Pol Colonel Thaksin still refused to resign ... Rosana has yet to show the intention to instigate citizens into not paying tax or staging a general strike, which is against the law."

ahhhh ok, that particular one is clearer now... a call to boycott Thaksin and his cronies' businesses is not illegal and as for the other charge she showed no intention.

- The Nation

[John K]

Good news for the good guys, and unfortunately some suggestions for the bad guys.

20+ bombs in banks... state of war against terrorism like the USA?

The state of emergency seems to be a one size fits all..... Car Bombs, bank bombs, evil PAD, evil American business man who is taking the PM to court in a few days.....

Can elections happen when there is a state of emergency?

Not that it matters because Thaksin is sure to blow off the court ruling and invent another reason to try to place the blame on the opposition.

[sriracha john]

Tak forestry chief sent to inactive post

Move linked to row with Thaksin foes

Chief of Tak provincial forestry office Saneh Thipburi was transferred yesterday allegedly for mobilising rangers who confronted anti-Thaksin protesters on Aug 16. Mr Saneh was shifted to an inactive post at the National Parks, Wildlife and Plant Conservation Department. He has been office chief for only 11 months, and has just one month to go before he retires on Sept 30. A panel was being set up to look into Mr Saneh's conduct. He was alleged to have led 100 uniformed and plainclothes forestry officials and rangers to greet caretaker Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra in Tak during his tour of the North. The officials were accused of breaking up an anti-Thaksin protest by a group of women.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/02Sep2006_news11.php

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the favorite target for pro-Thaksin thugs: women...

and children and senior citizens.

[kmart]

I cannot remember a "leader" so derided in Bangkok, and so dependant on up-country simpletons for support.

That's because Bangkok doesn't hold the power anymore and the old Bkk establishment no longer gets their cut and they want the old system back. The upcountry people are not simpletons and you show your total ignorance about them and the North & Northeast, with your statement.

Have a big bowl of somtam and sticky rice, and wipe the sanctimonious look off yer mug

Thaksin is not empowering the North / NE. He's giving them handouts from Govt. coffers; read your money if you live / pay taxes here. In effect making them beggers and dependant on his own personal largesse; "charisma"; and benevolence. Dear Leader #1. Come election time or when he needs a bit of support; he'll turn up in Nakorn Noname wearing pastoral garb; and throwing coloured beads from the back of a truck. I know that much

[hammered]

PAD do not want an election

PAD's goal is to remove Thaksin. They do not want an election that would legitimise his grip on power and whitewash his sins. Other than that they don't have problems with elections and will accept any outcome as long as Thaksin steps down.

I understand that farmers in Isan and the North feel that Thaksin is the best PM they ever had, afterall he ran the most elaborate vote buying schemes there for five years, travelling extensively and throwing money on various projects and giving out cheap loans and promising the Moon. He played them right, credit is due.

On the other hand, had it been not for a total control of information and vote buying, their love might not have been so "unconditional".

Here you get to the crux of the matter. An election should not whitewash sins as everyone should still be equally liable before the law according to the Thai constitution of 1997. The problem is, what happened 5 years ago makes it easy to confuse this obvious distinction leaving us with todays problem.

[John K]

One thing here I tend to disagree with.

This is from the link in post #147

"PAD lawyer Suwat Apaipak said the Administrative Court will be asked to order the Royal Thai Police Office to pay one billion baht in damages for allowing government supporters to assault the Thaksin opponents at the CentralWorld shopping complex."

I think the money should be sent to the people assaulted and not the PAD. At least from the outside it looks better in the public’s eye. Sure some should go to the PAD but a significant part to the people hurt. That may win some votes in the north too.

Action like that will take the eagerness out of many to assault others.