Belgian man arrested for working as tour guide

[NickJ]

You dont show up to a country and think you can bypass Immigration Law...Labor Law and Tax law.......and plead ignorance....

roll the dice if thats your game and get blacklisted and deported....play nice or share a free cell with 100 others before being allowed to leave.

[jabis]

Nothing wrong with translating. he apparently is not a tourguide.

He DID NOT break the law. A simple case of farang bashing.

Fine the man 500 baht and go on catch your own corrupt bunch and fine traffic violaters.

You holier than the pope policemen make me sick!

Incorrect. Working without a work permit is a clear violation of the law. Assuming you have a visa it will clearly state you cannot work.

Nice to agree with you - I think this is the second time

Yes, in the visa it clearly states you are prohibited of working in the kingdom - and it's actually quite easy to obtain a WP and a Non-B thru a valid tour company - one only needs a managerial position -> proof of employment for x years & a valid degree for the position he/she applies for. Tourist Visa is the wrong way to go, as plain and simple as that.

[Stjohnm]

"He said he was paying Bt1,000 to B1,300 a day." he paid them to lead them ???

No one can properly write these articles. Your guess is as good as anyone's.

Thai Visa are in desperate need of translators, trouble is they keep on arresting them

[FredNL]

We offer excursions and package tours to Chiang Rai in English, French, Spanish, German, Chinese and Italian.

We do not offer any Dutch guide because we might only get a few hundred clients a month but prefer German, French etc which guarantees as at least 3000-5000 excursions or package tours a month.

All those rubbish that the tour operators are unable to provide tour guides in Dutch language is rubbish. I know several tour operators in Thailand that have Dutch speaking Thai guides.

I wonder where the Thai guides learned to speak Dutch. Please explain...

[lvr181]

How about the Police also arrest his "employer"?

[luk AJ]

The law is the law regardless what our opinions are and we will never change it because this is Thailand for the Thais only sorry the rest can all go home we don't need you.

SIR

I wish other countries would learn from thais, thais come first for business,land etc, of course they do, and so they should..

Sir, the Belgian guy was not stealing any job from a Thai. There was a Thai guide present, the Belgian did the translation. He did not have a work permit which is no surprise. Sir, do you know how difficult it is for a foreigner to get a WP? Even if he would apply, he would never ever get it. Why? Because Thai are over protective because they know very well that their jobs would be taken by better qualified foreigners.

[off road pat]

Another 'innocent' person arrested?

You asked about it twice, I'll answer you once.

Yes, in my eyes he is innocent.

I don't give a damn about work permits and requirements.

He was offering a service that the Thais could not offer as none of them could probably speak Dutch.

Many of you will condemn me for what I said but this is my opinion.

He didn't commit a crime he just wanted to make a living.

He who is without sin can cast the first stone now....................

Sorry Costas, I often agree with you, but not this one. He did commit a crime. a crime against Thai law. On the other hand you are right that the Thais could not provide this service. but that's a whole other problem.

[luckyman]

The Dutch are very smart people. Most speak some English and some speak it very well. It is possible the Belgian was able to communicate to the Dutch tourists in their own language better than the Thai guides can speak English. However, he broke the law and the law won.

Wrong place, wrong time. Remember where you are!

my thoughts exactly, and if they follow the rule of law to the letter, he will be fined only 500 thb as a first offense for working without a permit, but the next time he is caught, he can even expect to be deported

[jdinasia]

problem in most countries employers want you to work illegally. working is moral, everybody has the right to work.

who is guilty? the company. they should have applied for a work permit for him.

I bet the company will say they don't know him...

problem people need to make some money to buy food and survive. for Pete sake, is it to hard to understand? people need money.... not everybody is 65 and wait for a fat cheque from their nanny government.

There's no inherent right to work in a country you are not a citizen of. It is not a "right" to either work or live in a foreign country. If a foreigner wants to work here they need a work permit.

[jdinasia]

The law is the law regardless what our opinions are and we will never change it because this is Thailand for the Thais only sorry the rest can all go home we don't need you.

SIR

I wish other countries would learn from thais, thais come first for business,land etc, of course they do, and so they should..

Sir, the Belgian guy was not stealing any job from a Thai. There was a Thai guide present, the Belgian did the translation. He did not have a work permit which is no surprise. Sir, do you know how difficult it is for a foreigner to get a WP? Even if he would apply, he would never ever get it. Why? Because Thai are over protective because they know very well that their jobs would be taken by better qualified foreigners.

Strangely, I and all the foreigners I personally know who are working here have work permits.

[gandalf12]

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problem in most countries employers want you to work illegally. working is moral, everybody has the right to work.
who is guilty? the company. they should have applied for a work permit for him.
I bet the company will say they don't know him...
problem people need to make some money to buy food and survive. for Pete sake, is it to hard to understand? people need money.... not everybody is 65 and wait for a fat cheque from their nanny government.

The guilty party is the person accepting a job knowing he doesn't have a permit that allows him to work. Of course the company should not ask him to work knowing he doesnt have a valid work permit but asking is not a crime.

[jdinasia]

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problem in most countries employers want you to work illegally. working is moral, everybody has the right to work.

who is guilty? the company. they should have applied for a work permit for him.

I bet the company will say they don't know him...

problem people need to make some money to buy food and survive. for Pete sake, is it to hard to understand? people need money.... not everybody is 65 and wait for a fat cheque from their nanny government.

The guilty party is the person accepting a job knowing he doesn't have a permit that allows him to work. Of course the company should not ask him to work knowing he doesnt have a valid work permit but asking is not a crime.

The company is also guilty and can be fined up to 100k

[luk AJ]

The law is the law regardless what our opinions are and we will never change it because this is Thailand for the Thais only sorry the rest can all go home we don't need you.

SIR

I wish other countries would learn from thais, thais come first for business,land etc, of course they do, and so they should..

Sir, the Belgian guy was not stealing any job from a Thai. There was a Thai guide present, the Belgian did the translation. He did not have a work permit which is no surprise. Sir, do you know how difficult it is for a foreigner to get a WP? Even if he would apply, he would never ever get it. Why? Because Thai are over protective because they know very well that their jobs would be taken by better qualified foreigners.

Strangely, I and all the foreigners I personally know who are working here have work permits.

as translator for a tour guide? I also have a work permit, but I had to transfer 51% of my company to s Thai national.

[jdinasia]

The law is the law regardless what our opinions are and we will never change it because this is Thailand for the Thais only sorry the rest can all go home we don't need you.

SIR

I wish other countries would learn from thais, thais come first for business,land etc, of course they do, and so they should..

Sir, the Belgian guy was not stealing any job from a Thai. There was a Thai guide present, the Belgian did the translation. He did not have a work permit which is no surprise. Sir, do you know how difficult it is for a foreigner to get a WP? Even if he would apply, he would never ever get it. Why? Because Thai are over protective because they know very well that their jobs would be taken by better qualified foreigners.

Strangely, I and all the foreigners I personally know who are working here have work permits.

as translator for a tour guide? I also have a work permit, but I had to transfer 51% of my company to s Thai national.

See above remarks about guides and language.

I can own a company here with no partners

Some of my work duties include translation and it states that on my work permit.

[luk AJ]

I don't want to argue, my point was that for this particular job "translating for a guide you will not receive a WP. So tourists who would like to visit Thaland, better start learning English.

[jdinasia]

I don't want to argue, my point was that for this particular job "translating for a guide you will not receive a WP. So tourists who would like to visit Thaland, better start learning English.

Nope, as noted above I know Thai tour guides working with Japanese and German and English (and Chinese and Korean) speaking tourists. I am sure that there's plenty that speak Dutch as well.

[ratcatcher]

problem in most countries employers want you to work illegally. working is moral, everybody has the right to work.

who is guilty? the company. they should have applied for a work permit for him.

I bet the company will say they don't know him...

problem people need to make some money to buy food and survive. for Pete sake, is it to hard to understand? people need money.... not everybody is 65 and wait for a fat cheque from their nanny government.

Your post is worthy of comment.

As a V.I.P. in Thailand, at least in your own mind, I would like to take issue with a number of your comments.

1.In most countries employers are required to ensure the people they hire are in the country legally, that they are qualified to do the particular job and that they have written permission from the government to do that job.

2. Of course working is moral as long as you are doing it legally.

3. Everybody has the right to work in their native land. The moment they arrive in a foreign country and are granted permission to stay for a specified period, they are required to obey rules relative to their visa and permission to stay.

4. As a tourist, the company could not apply for a work permit. He did not have the correct visa.

5.Yes people need to make some money to buy food and survive, and in Thailand tens of thousands of people are doing just that according to the rules and regulations set out by the Immigration Dept.

6. Your last sentence is both facile and naive as well as insulting to the people who have worked hard all their lives, saved their money and are entitled to a pension and have chosen to and met the requirements to be able to reside in the Kingdom of Thailand.]

7. I worked long hours at my last job and am entitled to a pension, I am over 65 and do not receive a FAT cheque from my government.As a matter of fact most governments in the western world have put their pensions on a diet.

So basically your whole rant is pointless. The Belgian man in the topic was unfortunate to be caught doing something which to most readers would seem harmless and helpful. However we live in a country where petty rules prevail, so it is best to abide by them rather than try and fight them. You won't win.

[Srikcir]

Thailand should follow the Chinese setup for tour guides. BEFORE tour groups come into China they are assigned official Chinese guides having necessary certifications to be tour guides.

Tour groups planning on trips to Thailand should also be required prior to entry to certify on entry information cards that they are part of a tour group and provide the name of the Thai guide. Failure to make such a declaration or misrepresentation would also subject the tourists to exit fines; this provides a self-enforced policy.

[SamuiAxe]

There tens of thousands of fluent dutch and french speaking Thais and he is stealing their job.

Sorry, I don't believe you.. Being a Dutchman myself and being here already for quite some years I still have to meet the first Thai who speaks Dutch! French? Yes, that I can believe, but Dutch is a far to obscure and difficult language for foreigners. It's not worth the effort to learn to speak Dutch. Unless you have a Dutch partner or you are living in the Netherlands. I doubt it if there are more than a hand-full Thai people who can speak our complicated language....

Edited March 8, 2015 by SamuiAxe

[luk AJ]

I don't want to argue, my point was that for this particular job "translating for a guide you will not receive a WP. So tourists who would like to visit Thaland, better start learning English.

Nope, as noted above I know Thai tour guides working with Japanese and German and English (and Chinese and Korean) speaking tourists. I am sure that there's plenty that speak Dutch as well.

you are a though one... Of course there are tour guides who speak other languages,but not enough for the millions of tourists. Are you also going to contest this?

[Andre0720]

He should get a work permit to process 90 day reporting in Phuket town.

Now that is where there is a lack of trained Thai people to do the job.

There is only ONE person processing 90 day reports in Phuket town for all the tourists that have been welcomed to reside here.... Took me 2 days to get mine.

Last week, some visitors were on their third day of going to the immigration office and waiting to get a re-entry permit. Opportunities there also.

I would certainly not mind getting a stamp from a Belgian....

Edited March 8, 2015 by Andre0720

[larsjohnsson]

A 90 day tourist visa stamp ??

[Ichabod]

In Amsterdam, my home town we often see busloads of tourists. ALL asian tourists (yes, including Thais) bring their own tourguide, usually waving a little flag to keep the herd together. Even though there are Thai Dutchman that could easily do the job. So, if the Thai can "steal" jobs from us Farang, should not we be allowed to do the same especially because it makes sense to be adressed by someone in your own langage, rather than a Thai tourguide without proper english qualifications who has unintelligible english at the best of times.

(Rant out)

As they say: you can not have the cake (tourists) and eat it (Thailand exclusively for the Thai). Time to wake up, here

Ridiculous. Why should Thailand, which has a per capita GDP of $4,800, have the same labor and immigration policies as the Netherlands, which has a per capita GDP of $50,330?

[jdinasia]

I don't want to argue, my point was that for this particular job "translating for a guide you will not receive a WP. So tourists who would like to visit Thaland, better start learning English.

Nope, as noted above I know Thai tour guides working with Japanese and German and English (and Chinese and Korean) speaking tourists. I am sure that there's plenty that speak Dutch as well.

you are a though one... Of course there are tour guides who speak other languages,but not enough for the millions of tourists. Are you also going to contest this?

I have no idea if there are enough or not. English as a lingua franca is indeed the obvious answer. Some guy on a tourist visa is an obvious non starter

[tonbridgebrit]

The Thais, they're not that daft or silly. They're not going to let a load of foreigners enter their country and take-over.

Because compared to any competition, they're deficient.

Well, you might be right. But the point about allowing vast numbers of foreigners into Thailand to work, does this really benefit Thailand ?

A load of Thais who are un-skilled end up competing against cheaper workers from Cambodia, Laos and Burma. So some Thais are unable to compete against this cheap labour, they end up not working, does this benefit Thailand ?

And those tour guides. Yes, foreign tour guides might speak English (or other languages) better, but does Thailand benefit by taking jobs away from tourist guides who are Thai ? Go and put some Thais out of work. So tourism ends up benefiting foreign workers in Thailand. And are there really going to be lots more tourists coming into Thailand because of 'better' tourist guides ?

What next ? How about invite European manufacturers to build new factories in Thailand, give them tax breaks and loans, give them small subsidies from the Thai government. Oh look, the factories are empoying Cambodian people. Does this benefit Thailand ??

[luk AJ]

I don't want to argue, my point was that for this particular job "translating for a guide you will not receive a WP. So tourists who would like to visit Thaland, better start learning English.

Nope, as noted above I know Thai tour guides working with Japanese and German and English (and Chinese and Korean) speaking tourists. I am sure that there's plenty that speak Dutch as well.

you are a though one... Of course there are tour guides who speak other languages,but not enough for the millions of tourists. Are you also going to contest this?

I have no idea if there are enough or not. English as a lingua franca is indeed the obvious answer. Some guy on a tourist visa is an obvious non starter

you have no idea? Guess how many Italians and Spanish speaking people understand english..i know a lot of Belgians who don't speak english. Don't ask me how many! )))

[gigman]

Witch hunt! and nothing to say .....

[kinmaew]

Meanwhile in civilized countries I was out last night at a Thai restaurant 100% Thai owned and staffed. Seems Thais like to have their cake and eat it too.

[ratcatcher]

Uhm that's a real Belgian name he have

Uhm, Marouane Fellaini, you know , the Big Hair with Manchester United? Well, I love his Belgian name, and that dark goalscorer with the funny hair Romelu Lukaka, with Everton, as Belgian as the chocolate. End of !

Perhaps someone can tell me a REAL Belgian name aside from Hercule Poirot.

[gigman]

Actually on second taught ....There is not government or anybody who really should be so concerned about this incident..

Just police state idiots who are trying to do the best to show how good are they and not to loose their f...ing position... that's all.

I do not know any country in the whole world who will do that even in so " as police state " as is Australia.....

Just witch hunt.

Edited March 8, 2015 by gigman