Chiang Mai University Language Institute

[CatieB]

I have paid 30,000 Baht for one year Thai course with Chiang Mai University. They accepted payment, then said they could not get ED visa for me because I am +55. Their website guarantees full refund if no visa, but after a series of over 25 emails and phone calls to the Thai Embassy in London I am still no further along. I'm really disappointed and a bit concerned that I'm being led a merry dance. Does the university actually intend to pay me back? would be overjoyed to just get my money back and forget the whole sorry business. Can anyone advise or help me?

[Loaded]

Read these threads.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/395023-cmu-fails-to-provide-visa-support-documents/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/404148-latest-developments-at-cmu-thai-course/

Going on past behaviour, it's highly unlikely you will see your money again.

[MaeJoMTB]

As Loaded says CM University have a past history of bailing on their students and keeping the money.

[harrry]

If you paid with a credit card you should ask for it to reversed. Act quickly.

[CatieB]

Thank you all for your advice. I opened some of the attached threads and I'm in disbelief that a university can act like this and get away with it. I think I will just stay here in Scotland where, for all their faults, the major institutions still tend to honour their promises. I phoned Bank of Scotland (payment was with Visa Debit) and it looks like they can 'chargeback' the full amount since CMU actually admitted in email they could not fulfill their promise and provide me with what I paid for. So, for all other potential students - if you have paid by credit or debit card please get on to your bank and make moves to get your money refunded. I hope all the good Buddhist people operating the scam at CMU Language Institute get at least some karma for the upset and stress they cause people who trusted them.

[Loaded]

Few people who need to know will read the thread on this page. I suggest post on the Chiang Mai page.

[zeichen]

First off, I am sorry that you lost money. As stated before they have had issues in the past and have changed directors and policies.

To be brutally honest though. It is entirely your fault and not theirs. Read their web pages fully and carefully. I would never take a course from them after reading it carefully.

"hope all the good Buddhist people operating the scam at CMU Language Institute get at least some karma for the upset and stress they cause people who trusted them.:

As for your biased and unsanctioned statements, there is no scam at all. They didn't refuse you the course. They told you a simple fact that you at 55+ cannot get an ED visa. It is not their fault that the Thai government has put limitations recently on all educational institutions for getting ED visas.

From their web page, it says assistance, Not guaranteed approval from immigration.

"1-year continuous Education visa assistance"

Also before spouting off libel statements, perhaps you should have read the fine print on their website.

"Effective 31st March 2015 - the maximum age for students to apply for this program will be 55 years due to the regulations related to the issuance of Non Immigrant Education visas as per the request of Chiang Mai Immigration for Chiang Mai University's 1-Year Certificate in Thai Language Program."

Probably a good thing that you won't come to Thailand now, because they actually could sue you for defimation.

Yes, they should refund your money. However, they do state on their website quite clearly that there are no refunds whatsoever and they have the right to cancel courses if not enough students enroll.

Personally, I would never do business with institutions that make these kind of statements but many of the language schools in the area do the same thing.

[harrry]

Their old course was good. The teacher for the short courses is still there and the beginners course....5 days a week was and possibly is one of the best courses there is for beginners. It is a pity they behaved as they did. I have had to hide the certificates I got from their beginners,intermediate and the one year course as I am ashamed of having being associated with an organization that acted as they did.

[harrry]

First off, I am sorry that you lost money. As stated before they have had issues in the past and have changed directors and policies.

To be brutally honest though. It is entirely your fault and not theirs. Read their web pages fully and carefully. I would never take a course from them after reading it carefully.

"hope all the good Buddhist people operating the scam at CMU Language Institute get at least some karma for the upset and stress they cause people who trusted them.:

As for your biased and unsanctioned statements, there is no scam at all. They didn't refuse you the course. They told you a simple fact that you at 55+ cannot get an ED visa. It is not their fault that the Thai government has put limitations recently on all educational institutions for getting ED visas.

From their web page, it says assistance, Not guaranteed approval from immigration.

"1-year continuous Education visa assistance"

Also before spouting off libel statements, perhaps you should have read the fine print on their website.

"Effective 31st March 2015 - the maximum age for students to apply for this program will be 55 years due to the regulations related to the issuance of Non Immigrant Education visas as per the request of Chiang Mai Immigration for Chiang Mai University's 1-Year Certificate in Thai Language Program."

Probably a good thing that you won't come to Thailand now, because they actually could sue you for defimation.

Yes, they should refund your money. However, they do state on their website quite clearly that there are no refunds whatsoever and they have the right to cancel courses if not enough students enroll.

Personally, I would never do business with institutions that make these kind of statements but many of the language schools in the area do the same thing.

You may like to read this which is on another page.

"

On receipt of the above information, LICMU will start seeking approval by the appropriate CMU officials. In the event visa support cannot be approved, LICMU will process a refund, less Baht 2500.- as administration fee. Once approval for visa support is given, such will be notified to the applicant by e-mail. This approval document, along with other papers and the fee, has to be submitted to the the relevant Embrassy of Thailan

http://learnthaicmu.com/1-year-thai/10-1-year-thai-language-culture-program/2-non-immigrant-ed-visa

[Loaded]

First off, I am sorry that you lost money. As stated before they have had issues in the past and have changed directors and policies.

To be brutally honest though. It is entirely your fault and not theirs. Read their web pages fully and carefully. I would never take a course from them after reading it carefully.

"hope all the good Buddhist people operating the scam at CMU Language Institute get at least some karma for the upset and stress they cause people who trusted them.:

As for your biased and unsanctioned statements, there is no scam at all. They didn't refuse you the course. They told you a simple fact that you at 55+ cannot get an ED visa. It is not their fault that the Thai government has put limitations recently on all educational institutions for getting ED visas.

From their web page, it says assistance, Not guaranteed approval from immigration.

"1-year continuous Education visa assistance"

Also before spouting off libel statements, perhaps you should have read the fine print on their website.

"Effective 31st March 2015 - the maximum age for students to apply for this program will be 55 years due to the regulations related to the issuance of Non Immigrant Education visas as per the request of Chiang Mai Immigration for Chiang Mai University's 1-Year Certificate in Thai Language Program."

Probably a good thing that you won't come to Thailand now, because they actually could sue you for defimation.

Yes, they should refund your money. However, they do state on their website quite clearly that there are no refunds whatsoever and they have the right to cancel courses if not enough students enroll.

Personally, I would never do business with institutions that make these kind of statements but many of the language schools in the area do the same thing.

You wrote "It is entirely your fault and not theirs." and "Probably a good thing that you won't come to Thailand now,"

A nasty and disingenuous response.

As harry already pointed out, their terms and conditions state clearly "In the event visa support cannot be approved, LICMU will process a refund, less Baht 2500"

I have taken a screen shot just in case CMU now decides to 'change' it.

CMU changed the maximum age rule on March 29th after they accepted this woman's money which they haven't refunded.

Edited April 9, 2015 by Loaded

[MaeJoMTB]

Until this year CMU didn't provide work permits for their foreign staff either.

They were 'too rich and powerful' to worry about such laws.

[zeichen]

"Until this year CMU didn't provide work permits for their foreign staff either.

They were 'too rich and powerful' to worry about such laws."

You are fabricating another crock and bull story. FYI each faculty and department handle things differently. So there has never been one blanket policy for the entire CMU in regards to how they treat their foreign staff.

CMU follows all rules from the department of labor and immigration. Every faculty and department provide all visa support and paperwork for work permits. Not paying for them isn't the same thing as not providing them.

FYI, they actually have had a special department for more than 10 years that assists all foreign staff with visas, work permits and other issues.

Part time teachers in the English Department have always had to pay for their work permits and visas themselves, but that is not the same thing as saying they didn't provide them. Full time teachers were paid. I have always had to pay for my own visa, but the different departments that I have worked in have always paid for my work permit but I have always been full time.

Loaded" A nasty and disingenuous response."

I am sorry that you interpret that way. I actually mean that she should get her money back completely. What is her fault is that she didn't read carefully about not getting the visa for her age. And that in their fine print on other pages, they make statements that there will be no refunds. They have some conflicting statements and policies on different pages. They always play hard ball once payment has been made.

I just meant buyer beware. Anyone that pays up front for a class that doesn't check into it first does deserves what they get.

Just because the OP has had problems getting her money back, still doesn't give her the right to slander an entire University for one private entity. Under Thai law she really is libel and needs to be careful.

I am not saying that I agree with it, just that is the fact that you have to be careful even if what you say is the truth.

Don't take my statements as defending LICMU, I wouldn't touch their products with a 10' pole. But I wouldn't tarnish the entire University for what they do.

[NancyL]

Yes, I think it is fair to "tarnish the entire University" in this case. You'd think that after the 2010 debacle, the CMULI would bend over backwards to issue refunds in cases like this. The OP clearly submitted her payment before Immigration decided no more ED visas for people over age 55. Yes, it was a circumstance beyond the control of CMULI, but they should be issuing a refund because there was no "fine print" on their website for her to read at the time she submitted her payment.

The upper management of the University should be aware of the damage done to the entire University's reputation after the 2010 problems and be keeping tighter control over the current management. Fortunately, the OP paid with a debit card, issued by a western bank and will get a refund. Had this debit card been issued by a Thai bank, she would have been out-of-luck, just as many were in the original scandal.

[NancyL]

This matter really should be posted on the Chiang Mai forum where it will get wider readership. The CMULI is still up to its old tricks, it seems, and others should be warned that they should not be lulled into thinking they are dealing with a reputable institution because of its association with CMU. It really is no better than any other visa mill language school when it comes to protecting the interests of the students.

Edited April 18, 2015 by NancyL

[richard10365]

Study Thai at Payap University on the other side of town and you should have no problems.

[harrry]

Study Thai at Payap University on the other side of town and you should have no problems.

Providing you are not in a wheelchair. They refused to accept me for their Thai Course because they were not willing to move a class downstairs.

[richard10365]

Study Thai at Payap University on the other side of town and you should have no problems.

Providing you are not in a wheelchair. They refused to accept me for their Thai Course because they were not willing to move a class downstairs.

They have wheel chair access and elevators now.

[harrry]

About time

[richard10365]

I totally agree with you Harry.

[jonesyb]

I am doing this course at the moment and everything has gone perfectly. The teacher is extremely good.

[minimaxx]

I am doing this course at the moment and everything has gone perfectly. The teacher is extremely good.

Hey jonesyb,

thanks for your comment.

I'm considering to join this course in a couple of months, but I'm wondering if the statements on their website are still accurate

1) "The course fees for this course is 30,000 Baht for 216 hours of instruction."

From the last info I got, the minimum hours per years (for an EDVisa) almost doubled.

2) "This is a 12-month program. Class will meet 6-hours per week either in the evenings or weekend."

Although, on the same page they say: "Class will only be held Monday to Friday either (morning session - 09.00 to 12.00, afternoon session 13.00 to 16.00 or evening session 16.00 to 19.00). We do not offer weekend programs."

3) And finally, how do you feel about the school in general and the willingness of your teachers and classmates regarding teaching/learning the Thai language?

Would be great if you could share some insider information.

Cheers -minimax

[jonesyb]

Hey there. I will try and answer some questions for you the best I can.

1) I simply don't know. I shall ask at the university for you on Tuesday when I am there next.

2) Depending on which course you take, you will get two sessions every week during those times specified. For example, my classes are on Tuesdays and Thursdays from 16:00 - 19:00.

3) So far the school has been brilliant in every aspect. From the visa assistance, to the general organisation. I have nothing to compare him to but I think the teacher is brilliant and the structure of his classes is very logical and efficient. I am in a class with a mixture of people from all around the world including Americans, Koreans, Chinese. I am the only person from England. We all started with varying levels of Thai. I have none at all, some others have more but it is a beginners class. Everyone is extremely enthusiastic about learning. The class is also as full as it could be. There are 17 of us. The room could not fit anyone else in but it doesn't feel overcrowded, or that there are too many students for the teacher.

To summarise, I couldn't be any happier with everything so far.

If you want to know anything else feel free to let me know.

I am doing this course at the moment and everything has gone perfectly. The teacher is extremely good.

Hey jonesyb,

thanks for your comment.

I'm considering to join this course in a couple of months, but I'm wondering if the statements on their website are still accurate

1) "The course fees for this course is 30,000 Baht for 216 hours of instruction."

From the last info I got, the minimum hours per years (for an EDVisa) almost doubled.

2) "This is a 12-month program. Class will meet 6-hours per week either in the evenings or weekend."

Although, on the same page they say: "Class will only be held Monday to Friday either (morning session - 09.00 to 12.00, afternoon session 13.00 to 16.00 or evening session 16.00 to 19.00). We do not offer weekend programs."

3) And finally, how do you feel about the school in general and the willingness of your teachers and classmates regarding teaching/learning the Thai language?

Would be great if you could share some insider information.

Cheers -minimax

Hey

[minimaxx]

Hi mate,

hope your student life is going well.

I got a couple more questions...

Have you used any of the benefits provided.? Is the gym any good?

Did you have a chance to ask about the hours per year, included in the 30'000b-1year-package?

How is the learning going?

Do you learn reading and writing, early on?

Does the class sometimes meet outside the class-room to learn about cultural things?

Sorry for flooding you with all these questions.

Take care and many thanks for your insights.

Regards -minimaxx