Maize and Rotational Crops

[farmerjo]

Hi KS,

Nice picture,when i moved here there was a lot of cattle in the area but the rules changed.

When it was rice growing season a member of the family would take their cows into the national park for the duration until the rice was harvested.

That is no longer allowed and the locals will not buy feed for their animals so most have left the district.There's a few around along with buffalo but

nothing like the numbers of yester year.

I do miss them,it would be nice to talk to a local guy and say bring your friends and 50 cows to my land for a week to clean it up.

I'm lucky to see an old guy with 3 now.

Hopefully what ever nutrients the corn sucked up will go back for the next crop.

I've decided against planting the sunflowers now and will keep the seed for next year,priority is to get the gypsum on and some subsoiling to set it up for next year...

[kickstart]

Hi KS,

Nice picture,when i moved here there was a lot of cattle in the area but the rules changed.

When it was rice growing season a member of the family would take their cows into the national park for the duration until the rice was harvested.

That is no longer allowed and the locals will not buy feed for their animals so most have left the district.There's a few around along with buffalo but

nothing like the numbers of yester year.

I do miss them,it would be nice to talk to a local guy and say bring your friends and 50 cows to my land for a week to clean it up.

I'm lucky to see an old guy with 3 now.

Hopefully what ever nutrients the corn sucked up will go back for the next crop.

I've decided against planting the sunflowers now and will keep the seed for next year,priority is to get the gypsum on and some subsoiling to set it up for next year...

Hi Jo

I would do a bit of homework ,will sunflower seed keep for another year? ,or will the germination % drop drastically, I would go for it ,like maize sowing to harvest 90 days ,put the gypsum on afterwards.

Sow now harvest mid January ,good time to apply the gypsum and sub soil .

[farmerjo]

Hi KS,

Nice picture,when i moved here there was a lot of cattle in the area but the rules changed.

When it was rice growing season a member of the family would take their cows into the national park for the duration until the rice was harvested.

That is no longer allowed and the locals will not buy feed for their animals so most have left the district.There's a few around along with buffalo but

nothing like the numbers of yester year.

I do miss them,it would be nice to talk to a local guy and say bring your friends and 50 cows to my land for a week to clean it up.

I'm lucky to see an old guy with 3 now.

Hopefully what ever nutrients the corn sucked up will go back for the next crop.

I've decided against planting the sunflowers now and will keep the seed for next year,priority is to get the gypsum on and some subsoiling to set it up for next year...

Hi Jo

I would do a bit of homework ,will sunflower seed keep for another year? ,or will the germination % drop drastically, I would go for it ,like maize sowing to harvest 90 days ,put the gypsum on afterwards.

Sow now harvest mid January ,good time to apply the gypsum and sub soil .

Will check it out,after two failed corn crops this year(my 1st to not make money in 11 years)

I'm under the pump from the Missus,LOL.

I've got a bit over 20,000 bahts worth of sunflower seed sitting there,

I have a 17 rai plot nearly laser leveled with heaps of water avalible so that may be an option.

[farmerjo]

Just had a look on the sunflower boxes and it will keep till August next year.

Bit more slashing to do today,one good thing about being on the tractor is it gives plenty of time to think.

Bloody rats have eaten thru a plastic packet of 559 corn seed in the shed,i don't know if they like gypsum but would prefer to get it out

before i have 800 bags with holes in it and a mess everywhere.

Should have time to get the gypsum out then plant and as you say subsoil after.

[kickstart]

End of the Thai lent, wife's daughter visited us ,she and hubby are rice farmers not so far from us ,they also work harvesting maize ,cutting sugar cane ,at the moment they are harvesting sesame seed ,a crop we use to grow with some success , round here an oddball crop for harvesting ,the field is split up in to 1 rai blocks ,each person, working on piece work ,harvesting they 1 rai,,when we grew it we paid 450 Bart /rai ,and we got 28 Bart/kg ,we did all right ,this was,6 years ago ,now harvesting costs are 600 Bart/rie ,and farmers are getting 20 Bart /kg .

Sesame is cut, when still green, and tied up into small stokes, left to dry out ,then the mobile thrasher comes round and thrashes your crop out , when grew sesame thrashing costs where 200 Bart/bag ,now 3 Bart/ kg , for a 90 kg sack.

Been popular this year ,a lot of farmers not trusting the weather ,not growing maize ,trying sesame instead ,a lot more drought resistant than maize ,and like rice ,seed can be kept back ,and used as seed , for the next crop .

Looking at the above ,not a lot of profit in it, this year ,same as 5 years ago ,high harvesting cost 700 Bart/ rai ,killed it for a lot of farmers ,it has come back over the past 2 years ,not now ,costs to high

,Pity ,being more drought resistant than maize ,some farmers grew it as a first crop ,late rains = losing maize crops ,being a legume ,it put some N back in the soil , for the second crop, being maize ,with more of a chance of reliable rains.

So FJ , crap price for maize ,and now sesame seed what will it be for sunflowers ,if the pidgins do not get there first .

[farmerjo]

End of the Thai lent, wife's daughter visited us ,she and hubby are rice farmers not so far from us ,they also work harvesting maize ,cutting sugar cane ,at the moment they are harvesting sesame seed ,a crop we use to grow with some success , round here an oddball crop for harvesting ,the field is split up in to 1 rai blocks ,each person, working on piece work ,harvesting they 1 rai,,when we grew it we paid 450 Bart /rai ,and we got 28 Bart/kg ,we did all right ,this was,6 years ago ,now harvesting costs are 600 Bart/rie ,and farmers are getting 20 Bart /kg .

Sesame is cut, when still green, and tied up into small stokes, left to dry out ,then the mobile thrasher comes round and thrashes your crop out , when grew sesame thrashing costs where 200 Bart/bag ,now 3 Bart/ kg , for a 90 kg sack.

Been popular this year ,a lot of farmers not trusting the weather ,not growing maize ,trying sesame instead ,a lot more drought resistant than maize ,and like rice ,seed can be kept back ,and used as seed , for the next crop .

Looking at the above ,not a lot of profit in it, this year ,same as 5 years ago ,high harvesting cost 700 Bart/ rai ,killed it for a lot of farmers ,it has come back over the past 2 years ,not now ,costs to high

,Pity ,being more drought resistant than maize ,some farmers grew it as a first crop ,late rains = losing maize crops ,being a legume ,it put some N back in the soil , for the second crop, being maize ,with more of a chance of reliable rains.

So FJ , crap price for maize ,and now sesame seed what will it be for sunflowers ,if the pidgins do not get there first .

Hi KS,

To be honest,my land needs TLC,sure it has moisture but with the soil being tight will i be able to unlock the nutrients to make it grow considering we may only get one more rain in the middle of november.Something i'm still pondering with the associated cost of watering and seeing what happened to the second

maize crop,come up and just stagnate in areas.

I have 4 people coming tomorrow to start setting up the gypsum spreading,2 to mark out 12 x 13 metres(for 1 x 50 kilo bag) areas and the other 2 to position the bags Then it will grow from there once a system is in place.

Just looking at the label on the sunflowers box,would it be fair to say they actually grow them around april here in time to get the seed ready for consumers to plant around now.Also does that read 99 percent purity with 80 percent germination rate.

One more question mate,you haven;t seen any cam loc fittings in your travels down your way.Not sure if thats an aussie term or not,quick release fittings for connecting and disconnecting pipes and hoses.

[kickstart]

Hi Jo

Can you put in a photo I think I know what you mean, yours is an Aussie term ,I think we call them nipple fittings .

[farmerjo]

Hi Jo

Can you put in a photo I think I know what you mean, yours is an Aussie term ,I think we call them nipple fittings .

Hope this works.

https://www.google.co.th/search?q=camlock+fittings&espv=2&biw=1280&bih=667&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0CDsQsARqFQoTCLPezajB5sgCFYwklAodCdIItA&dpr=1

[farmerjo]

FIL and BIL earning there keep.

[kickstart]

Hi FJ

I can see where you are going ,most Thai soil needs some TLC ,but farmers round here probably the same where you are , for years just plough ,3 plus 7 disc, then drill they maize crop ,never seen lime applied ,just a few bags of a compound fertilizer ,or some only use 46% urea ,cheaper than ,a compound ,and they still get a crop ,it will be nothing like ,the yields that wayned posted ,in that article he found 3 ton /rie ,but good enough for them ,as we use to say in the dairy cow world with high input , you do get high yields ,but you can get the same profit margin by doing low income , with lower yields, (and with the crop prices Thai farmers receive for they crop that is some time they only option) .But with land some time you must invest in your land ,like you are doing .

,If Thai's can get a fair crop of sunflowers , I am certain you can ,they will just sow ,a 7 disc plough with a seeder on ,straight in to the maize stubble ,or a few now direct drill into the maize stubble ,better for conserving moisture ,not disturbing the soil so much ,then as we use to say just shut the gate on the field ,and open it again to harvest the crop , job done ,most do not apply any fertilizer ,never seen a crop irrigated .and most crops never see any rain ,which after all the years I have been in LOS ,still amazes me .

Google sunflowers fields Lopburi ,I would say at least 90% of the crops were grown in the above way ,most by 7 disc plough and seeder ,get better crops by direct drilling .

A lot of those photos would be taken about the new year a popular Thai event visit the sun flower fields, which would have made drilling time about now .

Hope this makes sense, after to day my brain is about history.

KS

[wayned]

Normally we would be planting sunflowers now since the corn would have been harvested and the sugar cane harvest starting soon and

going through late March. It looks like the corn will be ready for harvest in about 1 to 1.5 months and therein lies a BIG problem.

The same trucks that are used to transport the sugar cane are also those used to transport the corn.

There are not enough to transport the cane now as some lies cut in the field for days awaiting transport.

The added burden of the corn at the same time will create a three ring Thai circus! I'm not sure about sunflowers after the corn harvest.

Corn's looking good. We had a good storm three days ago. We had no wi8nd but the next morning I went to town and passed some

fields that were levelled. Must have been some twisters in-bedded in the storm as the corn was down in all directions. I guess that I was lucky - knock on wood!

[Allgeier]

Last week i past a shop and i ask the owner if he will sell one leg. And i got one. Come normaly from a cornseeder. 3500 Bath for the 45 PS Modell. 2800 for the 36 PS Modell. I bought the 45 PS Modell. But only the yellow leg. The red Frame come frome the cassava attatchment.

There have also this one

The price 12000 Bath but with 5 leg.

Photo from here:

http://www.siamimplement.co.th/pro2_SRSG150-4.php

[kickstart]

P.P.B. Hydraulic Co.,Ltd

P.P.B.Hydraulic Co., Ltd.was establised in Bangkok, Thailand for more than 10 years.We are the main distributor and wholesaler of hydraulic hoses, camlock couplings and other related products in Bangkok.

Telephone66-8-67121661Address522 / 183-5 Soi Subthani Asoke-Dindaeng Rd. Huaykwang, Bangkok,

Hi FJ.

Found the above in BKK, tried round here no luck .

Did think, couplings for compressor hoses, what are used on jack hammers would do ,again if you can find them in los.

Good luck .

[farmerjo]

P.P.B. Hydraulic Co.,Ltd

P.P.B.Hydraulic Co., Ltd.was establised in Bangkok, Thailand for more than 10 years.We are the main distributor and wholesaler of hydraulic hoses, camlock couplings and other related products in Bangkok.

Telephone66-8-67121661Address522 / 183-5 Soi Subthani Asoke-Dindaeng Rd. Huaykwang, Bangkok,

Hi FJ.

Found the above in BKK, tried round here no luck .

Did think, couplings for compressor hoses, what are used on jack hammers would do ,again if you can find them in los.

Good luck .

Thanks KS,

Last night i also managed to find another company who supply global house with gear,i have not see cam locs in there but i'm hoping they have a catologue to order from.

I got this from information from a post made by RICE555 in an old irrigation thread.

http://www.superproducts.co.th/English/pipes%20&%20fittings/cam%20lock%20fittings.html

Have 15 people here today to spread gypsum so its all go. .

[farmerjo]

Gypsum spreading coming along nicely.

[BSJ]

Well it won't be long for Tik and I to invest in a water pump and hoses to water the 10 rai of corn we will be planting soon. I am wondering if any of you know what is the better choice of diesel engine to use: The type they use on the iron buffalo or the modern vertical design? I am limited to 250kg for the complete set-up.

I will buy the diesel and pump seperately, use double drive belt design, make the frame myself so it fits into the carry-all frame I have already. I made the carry-all with a frame and drop in carry rack which I can lift out. The idea is to back the tractor up the side of the dam and drop off the pump, then use the tractor for other purposes during the day.

[farmerjo]

Well it won't be long for Tik and I to invest in a water pump and hoses to water the 10 rai of corn we will be planting soon. I am wondering if any of you know what is the better choice of diesel engine to use: The type they use on the iron buffalo or the modern vertical design? I am limited to 250kg for the complete set-up.

I will buy the diesel and pump seperately, use double drive belt design, make the frame myself so it fits into the carry-all frame I have already. I made the carry-all with a frame and drop in carry rack which I can lift out. The idea is to back the tractor up the side of the dam and drop off the pump, then use the tractor for other purposes during the day.

Hi BSJ,

Have you got a system thought out mate as in fixed piping or mobile sprinklers.(or something similar to your lime tree setup)

I to need to work a few things out for a similar sized area.

Not sure what you mean by vertical design engine.

To minimise irrigation costs,Maizefarmer wrote about pump and pipe sizes in a thread Corn on a cob.

This is the pump setup i've been using for flooding rice.Welded an extra pulley on the engine side to make dual belt drive.

Its a 3/2 centrifical pump coupled to 14 hp yanmar.

Also a sprinkler i bought many moons ago.(its a duplex-a from the superproducts link in a post above)It does over a rai.

I was thinking along the lines of fixed piping buried in the ground and having the sprinkler mobile,just using cam loc fittings and caps at each sprinkler station.

Headache.

[slapout]

If your corn field is sloped properly from 1 side to the other, a effecent way to irrigate is from a narrow supply water

channel on the high side of the field. Plant with the slope and you can have 2 options or irrigation , hose pipe from supply canel to rows

of plants, or flood by daming supply canel and break the dyke behind dam.

You can space your rows when planting of seed where the hose would be

placed to water down the middle of 4 rows of corn with about 4 to 5 inches between the two outter rows. Once put in place its there for other

row crops and 1 person can handle it whle doing other chores around the farm.

[farmerjo]

If your corn field is sloped properly from 1 side to the other, a effecent way to irrigate is from a narrow supply water

channel on the high side of the field. Plant with the slope and you can have 2 options or irrigation , hose pipe from supply canel to rows

of plants, or flood by daming supply canel and break the dyke behind dam.

You can space your rows when planting of seed where the hose would be

placed to water down the middle of 4 rows of corn with about 4 to 5 inches between the two outter rows. Once put in place its there for other

row crops and 1 person can handle it whle doing other chores around the farm.

Is this the style your talking about Slapout.

https://www.google.co.th/search?q=irrigating+cotton&espv=2&biw=1280&bih=667&tbm=isch&imgil=gML8fFYgs3WY6M%253A%253ByiLIozZelMKhHM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.stepcommunication.com%25252Frural.htm&source=iu&pf=m&fir=gML8fFYgs3WY6M%253A%252CyiLIozZelMKhHM%252C_&usg=__Ni6KV1af-ABDrAWULCiP4h9IpWw%3D&ved=0CD0QyjdqFQoTCLP7xq_g7sgCFcZipgodpYQBHg&ei=GMY1VrOPGMbFmQWliYbwAQ#imgrc=gML8fFYgs3WY6M%3A&usg=__Ni6KV1af-ABDrAWULCiP4h9IpWw%3D

[slapout]

yes farmerjo. the ditches between row crops are supplied via ,basicaly a piece of garden hose , size and number determined by quanity of water

in supply channel. much better water application to crop than overhead sprinkler , using less water to get what is needed on crop. Everything except orginal source of irrigation is

moved by gravity, so irrigation cost is reduced by a huge amount.

[farmerjo]

Well my gypsum is spread

Didn't go on as heavy as i would have liked but all the land got covered and bags left which i'll use later

So all up for buy,freight,transfer and spread on land it worked out to 150 baht a bag or 3 baht a kilo.

If i can achieve another 65 kilo's a rai growing corn over 3 years its paid for itself.(should not be hard after this years yields)

Good job to get out of the way with the morning dew soaking it up before the winds come. .

[BSJ]

Hi FJ, spray irrigation isn't in the budget! But your mobile pump setup looks good!

While there is water in the East klong we can pump out, we will use that to start and it's flood irrigation down the paddies till it gets to the bottom of the paddie field.

Going by eye it's less that a metre drop East to West. On the West side at the bottom is a smaller dam. When the East Klong is dry we have to pump water to 3 rai Eastwards from the big dam and 17 rai West. Our back-up is the small dam

I was thinking of using a long poly cloth hose like the Thai's do. A 6" pump and a 15Hp diesel may do the job.

[farmerjo]

Hi FJ

Re. Bent tines.

If you look at my subsoiler and cultivator, the 3 point linkage. I brought the steel ,and a guy near me with a 25 ton hydraulic fly press bent the steel into the 3 point linkage, and he drilled the holes for the top link pins ,plus drilling holes for pins for the linkage arms ,each time 250 Bart .

I think you said your tines are mild steel ,I would say that the place were you brought your steel would have a fly press ,they should be able to straighten those tines ,would have said no more than 100 Bart each? ,might not be 100% straight ,but good enough to use on your box scraper .

When you get the subsoiler working ,and what you say about it being wet, I would put it away ,bring it out a bit after the new year ,would do more good then ,soil has dried out ,it would open out a treat .

Thanks KS,

Took my bent tynes into town to the same place making my ripper blade.

They have a huge hydraulic press in there,stayed to see one straightened and it came back to shape like it was play dough.

Another thing we did in town was go to the local land development office looking for a few samples to try for cover crops.

They said that they didn't have any this year,was wondering whether the government pulled the plug on it being an out of season crop with water shortages or its just our area.

Edited November 3, 2015 by farmerjo

[kickstart]

Hi FJ

Re. Bent tines.

If you look at my subsoiler and cultivator, the 3 point linkage. I brought the steel ,and a guy near me with a 25 ton hydraulic fly press bent the steel into the 3 point linkage, and he drilled the holes for the top link pins ,plus drilling holes for pins for the linkage arms ,each time 250 Bart .

I think you said your tines are mild steel ,I would say that the place were you brought your steel would have a fly press ,they should be able to straighten those tines ,would have said no more than 100 Bart each? ,might not be 100% straight ,but good enough to use on your box scraper .

When you get the subsoiler working ,and what you say about it being wet, I would put it away ,bring it out a bit after the new year ,would do more good then ,soil has dried out ,it would open out a treat .

Thanks KS,

Took my bent tynes into town to the same place making my ripper blade.

They have a huge hydraulic press in there,stayed to see one straightened and it came back to shape like it was play dough.

Another thing we did in town was go to the local land development office looking for a few samples to try for cover crops.

They said that they didn't have any this year,was wondering whether the government pulled the plug on it being an out of season crop with water shortages or its just our area.

It is getting late in the year trying to find seed ,if you can find some mung bean seed ,that would do, but it will need some seed dressing, or the weevils etc. will eat the seed .

Khonwan wrote a piece in the cassava thread ,about using mung beans as a cover crop .

[farmerjo]

Went for a drive this morning and found a guy 5 villages away who works for the government as an adviser to the farmers(he is also a farmer)

He sells a few chemicals,fertilizers and seeds on behalf of the government.

He told us the reason they had no government seed is because the farmers are meant to give back the seed for redistribution the following year

and nobody gives it back which is understandable if its being used for cover crops.

He also said they were being pressured by the middle men where we sell our products to for having lower prices.

I managed to buy 33kg's of sunn hemp @ 20 baht/kilo and 240kg's of soya beans @ 25 baht/kilo off his family's land.

Asked about mung beans but none around.

Also grabbed some of these bags,i presume they would be equivilant to using manure.

[wayned]

The corn harvest here has half heartedly started. There was a lot more damage to corns fields to the west and north of me (mines east) than I had originally thought and it cannot be mechanically harvested, so the hand harvesting has started. But there is a lack of labor. Normally the migrant workers would have already been here to begin the cane harvest, but they are delayed until after Loi Kratong due to the drought. I don't know if the Burmese will come this year or not, last year they didn't because of the new government and iffy immigration /labor laws. There was only a small migrant force of Thais from Issan. The harvest season is normally chaotic but this year with both the corn and sugar going on at the same time it'll probably look more like Abbott and Costello Meet the Keystone Kops and I'll probably be Costello trying to coordinate who's on first and what's on second. Once the combines start harvesting, the trucks will be needed full time to carrying the corn, but they are the same trucks that are used to take the sugar to the mill and they might have to wait there for days to unload. Can't wait for then fun to begin!

[farmerjo]

The corn harvest here has half heartedly started. There was a lot more damage to corns fields to the west and north of me (mines east) than I had originally thought and it cannot be mechanically harvested, so the hand harvesting has started. But there is a lack of labor. Normally the migrant workers would have already been here to begin the cane harvest, but they are delayed until after Loi Kratong due to the drought. I don't know if the Burmese will come this year or not, last year they didn't because of the new government and iffy immigration /labor laws. There was only a small migrant force of Thais from Issan. The harvest season is normally chaotic but this year with both the corn and sugar going on at the same time it'll probably look more like Abbott and Costello Meet the Keystone Kops and I'll probably be Costello trying to coordinate who's on first and what's on second. Once the combines start harvesting, the trucks will be needed full time to carrying the corn, but they are the same trucks that are used to take the sugar to the mill and they might have to wait there for days to unload. Can't wait for then fun to begin!

How do you move your harvesters around Wayned?

[wayned]

If it's close, less than 25 kilometers or so, we drive them down the road using as much of the shoulder as possible, carefully watching for low tree branches. For longer distances, they are transported on low-boy trucks that we have to beg, borrow or steal. The JD harvesters have wheels, not tracks. The tracked harvesters are transported on low-boy trucks.

[kickstart]

The corn harvest here has half heartedly started. There was a lot more damage to corns fields to the west and north of me (mines east) than I had originally thought and it cannot be mechanically harvested, so the hand harvesting has started. But there is a lack of labor. Normally the migrant workers would have already been here to begin the cane harvest, but they are delayed until after Loi Kratong due to the drought. I don't know if the Burmese will come this year or not, last year they didn't because of the new government and iffy immigration /labor laws. There was only a small migrant force of Thais from Issan. The harvest season is normally chaotic but this year with both the corn and sugar going on at the same time it'll probably look more like Abbott and Costello Meet the Keystone Kops and I'll probably be Costello trying to coordinate who's on first and what's on second. Once the combines start harvesting, the trucks will be needed full time to carrying the corn, but they are the same trucks that are used to take the sugar to the mill and they might have to wait there for days to unload. Can't wait for then fun to begin!

Sounds fun ,round here our local sugar mill will not open until at least the 1st week of next month ( word on the street is about 800 Bart/ton for cain ) ,finding cutters is going to be a problem ,most are Cambodians ,but a lot of growers use Issan labour ,but with I every thing being late a lot of Issan labour being rice farmers ,will harvest they crops before heading south to harvest our local sugar cain ,when they get here who knows .

Maize harvest has started ,only hand picking ,to wet for combines , we have had a few heavy showers of rain ,will slow down ripening ,and harvest ,one guy I know said it will be almost end of the month for his harvest ,but it has helped my nappier grass .

This guy also this year they will not be many fields of sunflowers this year ,it will be to late , even for sunflowers as they are nearly always follow a maize crop , any one living in bkk who come to central Lopburi to look at sunflowers around in the new year , might be out of luck .

[farmerjo]

Re rain,we had 24mm yesterday.

Good for the sugar and cassava growers ,most of the corn here is nearly finished but as usual the late year rain has flattened a lot of the rice crops

making it difficult to harvest.

With regards to labour,you may be waiting a while as i haven't seen any rice harvested around here yet which is all done by locals by hand.

The sugar is mainly done contract where teams of 30-40 people go from farm to farm.The only problem with this is they all burn the sugar

to make cutting quicker and easier.