Sydebolle, so this was restaurant or catering firm that you was involved in ? Well, I do think that foreign companies who turn up in Thailand, will always find it pretty difficult if they are trying to make money by selling stuff or offering a service to the local Thais. It's a bit like turning up in China and trying to make a profit selling stuff to Chinese people.

The way how foreign companies can make a profit in Thailand (or China) is to close down their manufacturing plant in Europe or America, and re-open in Thailand or China, and hence, tap into the cheap labour. Now then, companies that re-locate their manufacturing plants to Thailand have a good chance of being better off. This is because the wages are so much lower, even though the quality of the workforce is not as good.

I've just had a Thai working on my house and the difference between him and the Burmese is astounding. All he does is complain of being bloody tired. He's only 45! Another Thai professor told me the same thing, the Burmese, whilst not yet up to specialisation, don't complain and rip through the building in half the time. The Thais are on a hiding to nothing with any so called competitiveness once their neighbours' skills are updated.

I've just had a Thai working on my house and the difference between him and the Burmese is astounding. All he does is complain of being bloody tired. He's only 45! Another Thai professor told me the same thing, the Burmese, whilst not yet up to specialisation, don't complain and rip through the building in half the time. The Thais are on a hiding to nothing with any so called competitiveness once their neighbours' skills are updated.

But you've got to ask yourself why it is that the Burmese in Thailand work harder for less money than the Thais.

Burma is bad place, very few foreign companies want to re-locate their manufacturing plants to Burma, and this is partly because Burma has far less democracy and freedom than Thailand. It's simply untrue when people claim that Burma is open for business nowadays. Even during the last few years, with the 'new' system in Burma, it still turns out that Thailand has received far more foreign investment than Burma.

Basically, one of the few ways for a Burmese man to make money is enter into Thailand, and work hard. If Burma was an okay place, well, practically all the Burmese in Thailand would go back home in Burma. A lot of the Burmese working in Thailand are illegal migrant workers, they have rights, and are scared of being sent home, that's one of the reasons why they tend to shut up and work hard. They work like slaves, and that is because, well, they are.

Is it right for Thais and foreigners in Thailand to exploit the cheap labour by giving them jobs ? Thailand itself keeps the Burmese in Thailand as slaves, a lot have no work permit and no rights. A lot of the Burmese work hard, but lose a lot of money by being forced to pay bribes, and being extorted by Thai people. Thailand will make sure that the Burmese in Thailand are second-class workers or slaves, it is cruel, but that's what's happening. The Burmese in Thailand will never be allowed to compete with the Thais on a level playing field. I reckon it would be a better idea to simply remove all the Burmese, and pay the Thais a better wage to encourage them to work harder.

I've just had a Thai working on my house and the difference between him and the Burmese is astounding. All he does is complain of being bloody tired. He's only 45! Another Thai professor told me the same thing, the Burmese, whilst not yet up to specialisation, don't complain and rip through the building in half the time. The Thais are on a hiding to nothing with any so called competitiveness once their neighbours' skills are updated.

But you've got to ask yourself why it is that the Burmese in Thailand work harder for less money than the Thais.

Burma is bad place, very few foreign companies want to re-locate their manufacturing plants to Burma, and this is partly because Burma has far less democracy and freedom than Thailand. It's simply untrue when people claim that Burma is open for business nowadays. Even during the last few years, with the 'new' system in Burma, it still turns out that Thailand has received far more foreign investment than Burma.

Basically, one of the few ways for a Burmese man to make money is enter into Thailand, and work hard. If Burma was an okay place, well, practically all the Burmese in Thailand would go back home in Burma. A lot of the Burmese working in Thailand are illegal migrant workers, they have rights, and are scared of being sent home, that's one of the reasons why they tend to shut up and work hard. They work like slaves, and that is because, well, they are.

Is it right for Thais and foreigners in Thailand to exploit the cheap labour by giving them jobs ? Thailand itself keeps the Burmese in Thailand as slaves, a lot have no work permit and no rights. A lot of the Burmese work hard, but lose a lot of money by being forced to pay bribes, and being extorted by Thai people. Thailand will make sure that the Burmese in Thailand are second-class workers or slaves, it is cruel, but that's what's happening. The Burmese in Thailand will never be allowed to compete with the Thais on a level playing field. I reckon it would be a better idea to simply remove all the Burmese, and pay the Thais a better wage to encourage them to work harder.

I needn't 'ask myself' anything. The rest of your post is a given. However, you must ask yourself, if the situation between the Thai and the Burmese were reversed, would the Thai be as bloody indolent? From long experience of both nationals, I don't think so. The overwhelming difference is the Thai sense of 'entitlement'. No other SE Asian country comes close to this.

Sydebolle, so this was restaurant or catering firm that you was involved in ? Well, I do think that foreign companies who turn up in Thailand, will always find it pretty difficult if they are trying to make money by selling stuff or offering a service to the local Thais. It's a bit like turning up in China and trying to make a profit selling stuff to Chinese people.

The way how foreign companies can make a profit in Thailand (or China) is to close down their manufacturing plant in Europe or America, and re-open in Thailand or China, and hence, tap into the cheap labour. Now then, companies that re-locate their manufacturing plants to Thailand have a good chance of being better off. This is because the wages are so much lower, even though the quality of the workforce is not as good.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Heinecke

Ya right..

Labor is 10% of the price of a car. Restaurants normally 20%. But I'm not real sure might want to ask Bill.

I am guessing most of the posters here are over 30, as am I. I currently live in the USand in nearly every service related business you will not find a worker who is not an immigrant. Why? local kids wont work for the lower wages. They dont want to do manual labor and are relying on parents to support them. Thailand will always attract manufacturing based businesses due in part in being able to supply affordable labor, but more importantly the government providing tax relief and subsidies that make production in Thailand financially beneficial to major corporations. Just look at the investments the major car producers are making in Mexico (upwards of 10 billion dollars) to production plants. Whereas in Canada they are closing plants and the projected investment is about 750 million over the next year! Companies will always invest where it makes economic sense and in the SEA area it makes sense to invest in Thailand. Name a current surrounding country that offers the same? Vietnam?? Nope. Laos, Cambodia,Burma, Maylasia..nope. Too expensive for foreign companies to develop in these countries. For car manufacturers Mexico makes sense, cheap labor ($8/hr vs $24-30/hr in canada), huge tax incentives, and a government willing to look the other way when things go wrong and when there are issues much like Thailand.

They make stuff in Thailand because they want to sell stuff in Thailand and the surrounding areas. Labor is only one part of the equation. Taxes and shipping and on and on.

They make stuff in Thailand because they want to sell stuff in Thailand and the surrounding areas. Labor is only one part of the equation. Taxes and shipping and on and on.

Well, yes, the main reason for re-locating a factory from Europe to Thailand is because of cheaper labour, and there's a second reason. The second reason is as you say, taxes !

Basically, I think the ASEAN countries are watching Europe export it's manufactured goods to ASEAN, and ASEAN doesn't want to see a huge outflow of money to pay for these goods. So, ASEAN has taxes and quotas against European made goods, but ASEAN encourages European manufacturers to re-locate to ASEAN in order to avoid taxes and quotas. Yes, ASEAN is saying "we don't want you making the stuff in Europe and exporting it to us, how about you make the stuff in ASEAN and you escape the import tax and quotas" !!

And for Thailand, Thailand finds it relatively easy to attract the foreign factories. Laos, Cambodia and Burma don't find it so easy !

I am guessing most of the posters here are over 30, as am I. I currently live in the USand in nearly every service related business you will not find a worker who is not an immigrant. Why? local kids wont work for the lower wages. They dont want to do manual labor and are relying on parents to support them. Thailand will always attract manufacturing based businesses due in part in being able to supply affordable labor, but more importantly the government providing tax relief and subsidies that make production in Thailand financially beneficial to major corporations. Just look at the investments the major car producers are making in Mexico (upwards of 10 billion dollars) to production plants. Whereas in Canada they are closing plants and the projected investment is about 750 million over the next year! Companies will always invest where it makes economic sense and in the SEA area it makes sense to invest in Thailand. Name a current surrounding country that offers the same? Vietnam?? Nope. Laos, Cambodia,Burma, Maylasia..nope. Too expensive for foreign companies to develop in these countries. For car manufacturers Mexico makes sense, cheap labor ($8/hr vs $24-30/hr in canada), huge tax incentives, and a government willing to look the other way when things go wrong and when there are issues much like Thailand.

I agree with mostly what you say.

How's this for a point ? There is a gap between America's rich and poor, and the gap appears to be increasing. How can the gap between rich and poor in America be reduced ? Yes, local people don't want to do certain jobs, and they refuse to work for cheap wages. This means immigrants enter into America and do the cheap labour jobs. Well, how about the USA massively restricts the number of un-skilled and semi-skilled workers entering into America ? As in, only allow foreigners with special skills.

See, this will create a shortage of un-skilled and semi-skilled workers in America, and wages will (surely) go up ? Companies will always need unskilled staff, they will have to increase pay, and the better pay rates might make Americans (those who are poor) do those unpopular jobs. Surely, this means America's poor will be doing those jobs at the new higher wages ? Right now, the cheaper migrant workers are doing those jobs. Create a situation where only Americans can cut grass at rich peoples' homes. This will, surely, reduce poverty amongst Americans. And making rich Americans pay more to have their grass cut, well, is that really a problem ? Is it good to see the gap between rich and poor become less ? Surely, it is ?