University Hazing

[Rhys]

That time of year again, somebody was hurt.. Well, finally, some students are standing up and are questioning this practice. Listening to past self-serving reason does not cut it anymore.. It is about abuse of power, to conform to a way of thinking.. seems a contradiction.. Thai FREE...

With all the negatives, why does this hazing the STOUS system still receive tacit support from the school ADMs?

[Scott]

Students have to learn to listen to those who are older and 'wiser.' It is a reflection of the social structure. That is why there is tacit approval of it.

[Rhys]

Thus it is going to take a parent of influence to effect a change in this policy....it will be a reaction to either the child of the POI who was responsible for the injury... or it will be a parent (poi) whose child was injured.

Hmmm do students listen to instructions?

Trust no student suffers from this...

[SlyAnimal]

I used to be pretty solidly against this, until I actually was involved in the practice last year, where I saw that when done properly, it's actually pretty cool.

As I'm in my 30s, I didn't get to participate, as I'm older than the seniors, but was able to observe and have a bit of a laugh with the others.

What I saw was just a few embarrassing activities (like singing silly songs) and a few small challenges that were easy but sorta funny. These were done over the course of maybe a week, and the seniors then took all of the juniors out to dinner.

During this time, a lot of the seniors would chat with the juniors and get to know them, likewise it gave the juniors something to chat about and helped everyone sorta bond together as a group. In general it felt like a really inclusive environment.

Some of the faculties at a few universities go overboard, and they should be dealt with appropriately by their university, or the police, as appropriate. But in general, most are fine, it seemed like a very different culture to O-week at my university in NZ (Where everyone just got absolutely wasted on campus at faculty events + the uni bars).

Although admittedly I was studying at Chula where the students are all pretty mature/responsible, the technical colleges etc might be another story lol. Although during my time in Maha Sarakham, which is a university town in Isaan, I never saw massive levels of alcohol consumption in public by students either (oy occasionally in bars/clubs), and from what I remember being told, drinking on campus was essentially forbidden (There aren't even any student bars lol).

So a week of taking the piss out of the younger students, seems like a positive alternative to simply encouraging everyone to get absolutely wasted lol (Which of course often leads to many serious injuries etc).

[Rhys]

Sly A....

Do agree when done with intention... and class... this can be a positive college experience.

However, what is being highlighted are the negatives.. and the issues the students face as a result of not conforming to this right of passage.

I seem to recall, "other colleges" with a focus on community development would take the freshman to a community and perform some type of development or clean up project..

However, some of the " spoiled" students at Chula, Thammasat, MUIC...and where ever....could not be bothered..

I did hear about one group of freshman that took things into their own hands...after the hazing was completed.. the popular student terrorist(s) males and females.. were subjected to a switch and bait gambit... and had received the same types of ill treatments performed on them blindfolded and they the student who took revenge were never found out.

Hazing will continue.. revenge follows, patiently..

Edited May 10, 2015 by Rhys

[SlyAnimal]

Community work isn't looked upon as a "fun" activity, so I'm not surprised it didn't catch on. Community service is something the courts sentence you to do if you're caught doing something stupid lol (At least in NZ anyway, I assume it's the same in the USA/EU?).

The existing SOTUS or Rab Nong activities are mostly fine, there are just a few bad eggs. The universities just need to take a hard line with them and set some firm guidelines then they'll tone it down.

Knowing Thailand, they won't take any action at all though, or if they do, it won't be enforced.

[Rhys]

Community work isn't looked upon as a "fun" activity, so I'm not surprised it didn't catch on. Community service is something the courts sentence you to do if you're caught doing something stupid lol (At least in NZ anyway, I assume it's the same in the USA/EU?).

The existing SOTUS or Rab Nong activities are mostly fine, there are just a few bad eggs. The universities just need to take a hard line with them and set some firm guidelines then they'll tone it down.

Knowing Thailand, they won't take any action at all though, or if they do, it won't be enforced.

Actually, few Thai universities encourage and perform community services.. it is not considered a punishment but a way of helping, developing, and practicing "good citizenship skills" .. but they are the exception. YES, many are not from BKK.

Some of the guidelines I have seen and experience is a " faculty representative" requested by students themselves... OK.. a bit of responsibility.

As posted by another writer, paraphrased: universities tacitly encourage and do not interfere because it is a way to keep the students in the status quo of blind obedience..

Interestingly, I noticed a Thai teacher responding to this issue, and decided to adjust his course time table and he included this in the course....so some progress.

Edited May 10, 2015 by Rhys

[Scott]

There are number of less than admirable topics on hazing:

http://news.thaivisa.com/chiang-mai/chiang-mai-university-to-probe-violent-hazing-rituals/52912/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/756329-16-year-old-student-dies-during-hazing/

There are actually quite a few in which death or injury have occurred.

[Phoebee]

I used to be pretty solidly against this, until I actually was involved in the practice last year, where I saw that when done properly, it's actually pretty cool.

I think what you're describing isn't hazing, it's initiation. Hazing is, by definition, thoroughly unpleasant or disagreeable trials that matriculating students are pressured into going through.

Most schools have a week or two for silly games and stunts that are meant to break down the walls between cliques and help the new students bond. That's not hazing.

[Rhys]

I used to be pretty solidly against this, until I actually was involved in the practice last year, where I saw that when done properly, it's actually pretty cool.

I think what you're describing isn't hazing, it's initiation. Hazing is, by definition, thoroughly unpleasant or disagreeable trials that matriculating students are pressured into going through.

Most schools have a week or two for silly games and stunts that are meant to break down the walls between cliques and help the new students bond. That's not hazing.

Experience, reports and sadness, have shown "some" students adminstering the breaking down of wall, get a whiff of power and go over board.. that is the problem.

It is not hazing but it is called ABUSE..

[Stradavarius37]

I used to be pretty solidly against this, until I actually was involved in the practice last year, where I saw that when done properly, it's actually pretty cool.

As I'm in my 30s, I didn't get to participate, as I'm older than the seniors, but was able to observe and have a bit of a laugh with the others.

What I saw was just a few embarrassing activities (like singing silly songs) and a few small challenges that were easy but sorta funny. These were done over the course of maybe a week, and the seniors then took all of the juniors out to dinner.

During this time, a lot of the seniors would chat with the juniors and get to know them, likewise it gave the juniors something to chat about and helped everyone sorta bond together as a group. In general it felt like a really inclusive environment.

Some of the faculties at a few universities go overboard, and they should be dealt with appropriately by their university, or the police, as appropriate. But in general, most are fine, it seemed like a very different culture to O-week at my university in NZ (Where everyone just got absolutely wasted on campus at faculty events + the uni bars).

Although admittedly I was studying at Chula where the students are all pretty mature/responsible, the technical colleges etc might be another story lol. Although during my time in Maha Sarakham, which is a university town in Isaan, I never saw massive levels of alcohol consumption in public by students either (oy occasionally in bars/clubs), and from what I remember being told, drinking on campus was essentially forbidden (There aren't even any student bars lol).

So a week of taking the piss out of the younger students, seems like a positive alternative to simply encouraging everyone to get absolutely wasted lol (Which of course often leads to many serious injuries etc).

No student bars in Maha Sarakham lol

[SlyAnimal]

I used to be pretty solidly against this, until I actually was involved in the practice last year, where I saw that when done properly, it's actually pretty cool.

As I'm in my 30s, I didn't get to participate, as I'm older than the seniors, but was able to observe and have a bit of a laugh with the others.

What I saw was just a few embarrassing activities (like singing silly songs) and a few small challenges that were easy but sorta funny. These were done over the course of maybe a week, and the seniors then took all of the juniors out to dinner.

During this time, a lot of the seniors would chat with the juniors and get to know them, likewise it gave the juniors something to chat about and helped everyone sorta bond together as a group. In general it felt like a really inclusive environment.

Some of the faculties at a few universities go overboard, and they should be dealt with appropriately by their university, or the police, as appropriate. But in general, most are fine, it seemed like a very different culture to O-week at my university in NZ (Where everyone just got absolutely wasted on campus at faculty events + the uni bars).

Although admittedly I was studying at Chula where the students are all pretty mature/responsible, the technical colleges etc might be another story lol. Although during my time in Maha Sarakham, which is a university town in Isaan, I never saw massive levels of alcohol consumption in public by students either (oy occasionally in bars/clubs), and from what I remember being told, drinking on campus was essentially forbidden (There aren't even any student bars lol).

So a week of taking the piss out of the younger students, seems like a positive alternative to simply encouraging everyone to get absolutely wasted lol (Which of course often leads to many serious injuries etc).

No student bars in Maha Sarakham lol

Lots of bars in the city, that students frequent, but no student bars on campus. If the army get there way, they won't even have any alcohol sold within 500m of the campus, let alone bars on campus lol.

The drinking seemed much more relaxed and leisurely. I don't think I ever saw a funnel or people standing on tables while they raced to see who could drink the fastest. I also don't think I ever saw any student pub crawls enter the various bars/clubs I was in. Likewise I didn't see that many students throwing up or falling over because they were too drunk to stand, much less than I'd see on an average night out in Auckland.

But then maybe I was in the wrong bars? Perhaps they do all of this over in Mor Mai (I was usually on the other side of town, by the Rajabhat & Mor Gao).

Although my comments were more referring to events in public outside of bars. E.g. At my university in NZ, during the day the engineers would have "kegs in the park" while we'd have our commerce BBQ and the general students association would organize drinking competitions on campus (jug skull, team jug skull, jug & pie skull, chili & jug skull, 2l milk + jug skull, topless skull, naked skull etc).

Yes they drink, but the number who drink to excess in public was significantly less than NZ students, and they didn't seem to be making dicks of themselves in the name of a good laugh. Which is probably a good thing, and perhaps a side effect of a more conservative culture & of having their various initiation rituals as an alternative way to meet people, rather than just getting s***faced together together.