Inverter refrigerators

[trd]

I'm very happy with the Panasonic inverter fridge I have. It's very quiet compared to the conventional compressor type. I haven't been able to quantify any savings, but they claim it reduces your electricity bill by up to 40%.

Which one is it? The 'Eco' with freezer at the bottom?

It doesn't say Eco anywhere, but it has the freezer at the bottom.

[IMHO]

Not sure if I'm understanding what you want correctly, but maybe you mean like this?

http://www.hitachi-th.com/hitachi2014/?act=product_detail&id=1&model_id=9189〈=en

That one is 24.5 cu ft, and under EGAT tests uses 361 units/year = 14.73 units/cu ft/year

Of course, it would use a whole lot more electricity in Commander Worf's house

I'm surprised that a knowledgeable man like you doesn't know what a side by side fridge is, to refresh your memory.

https://www.google.com/search?q=side+by+side&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=nMqMVebqNoySuQSu-6fICg&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1536&bih=721#tbm=isch&q=side+by+side+fridge

What you post is a fridge from which a large part is taken up by a vacuum compartment which of course use much less electric than a full sized freezer.

And by the way goes at " discounted" price still for 73.900 Baht, which will take about a trillion years before the saving in electric compensate for the premium over other inverters " side by sides".

http://th.priceprice.com/Hitachi-R-D6800T-12080/reviews/

OK, so you mean something like this... I'll take that one on the chin

http://www.hitachi-th.com/hitachi2014/?act=product_detail&id=1&model_id=9181〈=en

Which manages around 20 units/cu ft/year

Splitting the cabinet vertically seems to be a design compromise, efficiency-wise. A basic 2-door design like this:

http://www.hitachi-th.com/hitachi2014/?act=product_detail&id=1&model_id=1〈=en

Manages around 20% better efficiency on a units/cu ft/year basis, with comparable capacity and cost.

[Anthony5]

Not sure if I'm understanding what you want correctly, but maybe you mean like this?

http://www.hitachi-th.com/hitachi2014/?act=product_detail&id=1&model_id=9189〈=en

That one is 24.5 cu ft, and under EGAT tests uses 361 units/year = 14.73 units/cu ft/year

Of course, it would use a whole lot more electricity in Commander Worf's house

I'm surprised that a knowledgeable man like you doesn't know what a side by side fridge is, to refresh your memory.

https://www.google.com/search?q=side+by+side&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=nMqMVebqNoySuQSu-6fICg&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1536&bih=721#tbm=isch&q=side+by+side+fridge

What you post is a fridge from which a large part is taken up by a vacuum compartment which of course use much less electric than a full sized freezer.

And by the way goes at " discounted" price still for 73.900 Baht, which will take about a trillion years before the saving in electric compensate for the premium over other inverters " side by sides".

http://th.priceprice.com/Hitachi-R-D6800T-12080/reviews/

OK, so you mean something like this... I'll take that one on the chin

http://www.hitachi-th.com/hitachi2014/?act=product_detail&id=1&model_id=9181〈=en

Which manages around 20 units/cu ft/year

Splitting the cabinet vertically seems to be a design compromise, efficiency-wise. A basic 2-door design like this:

http://www.hitachi-th.com/hitachi2014/?act=product_detail&id=1&model_id=1〈=en

Manages around 20% better efficiency on a units/cu ft/year basis, with comparable capacity and cost.

With a horizantally split the freezer compartment is significantly smaller than with a side by side, hence the lower power consumption.

[spidermike007]

This unit is very obviously not a good view. Few of the high end units are. But, that does not negate the value of inverter technology in general. Be it a refrigerator or an AC unit there is some significant savings to be had on electric. What is not eco about that? It just makes sense.

[Naam]

This unit is very obviously not a good view. Few of the high end units are. But, that does not negate the value of inverter technology in general. Be it a refrigerator or an AC unit there is some significant savings to be had on electric. What is not eco about that? It just makes sense.

a generalising statement, not applicable to all situations, and therefore incorrect especially when it concerns aircon units.

[spidermike007]

This unit is very obviously not a good view. Few of the high end units are. But, that does not negate the value of inverter technology in general. Be it a refrigerator or an AC unit there is some significant savings to be had on electric. What is not eco about that? It just makes sense.

a generalising statement, not applicable to all situations, and therefore incorrect especially when it concerns aircon units.

If that is the case, why did my monthly bill drop by 800 baht after I installed an 18,000 btu inverter AC, in my master BR? I tend to be a show me kind of guy. They showed me all right.

[Anthony5]

This unit is very obviously not a good view. Few of the high end units are. But, that does not negate the value of inverter technology in general. Be it a refrigerator or an AC unit there is some significant savings to be had on electric. What is not eco about that? It just makes sense.

a generalising statement, not applicable to all situations, and therefore incorrect especially when it concerns aircon units.

If that is the case, why did my monthly bill drop by 800 baht after I installed an 18,000 btu inverter AC, in my master BR? I tend to be a show me kind of guy. They showed me all right.

Come on, Naam knows everything about aircons and you or anyone else know nothing, only that he had to eat crow in the below post.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/827478-inverter-air-con/?p=9441922

[Naam]

This unit is very obviously not a good view. Few of the high end units are. But, that does not negate the value of inverter technology in general. Be it a refrigerator or an AC unit there is some significant savings to be had on electric. What is not eco about that? It just makes sense.

a generalising statement, not applicable to all situations, and therefore incorrect especially when it concerns aircon units.

If that is the case, why did my monthly bill drop by 800 baht after I installed an 18,000 btu inverter AC, in my master BR? I tend to be a show me kind of guy. They showed me all right.

what part of "not applicable to all situations" is it you don't understand?

[Naam]

a question for the resident inverter aircon aficionados:

-every evening i am cooling our master-bedroom to ~18ºC

(if ambient temperature allows to 16ºC) using a total of 37,000 btu/h,

estimated cost approximately 20,000 Baht per annum.

-when i go to bed i switch off aircons completely.

would i save energy replacing the conventional units with inverters?

[Anthony5]

a question for the resident inverter aircon aficionados:

-every evening i am cooling our master-bedroom to ~18ºC

(if ambient temperature allows to 16ºC) using a total of 37,000 btu/h,

estimated cost approximately 20,000 Baht per annum.

-when i go to bed i switch off aircons completely.

would i save energy replacing the conventional units with inverters?

NO

[Naam]

a question for the resident inverter aircon aficionados:

-every evening i am cooling our master-bedroom to ~18ºC

(if ambient temperature allows to 16ºC) using a total of 37,000 btu/h,

estimated cost approximately 20,000 Baht per annum.

-when i go to bed i switch off aircons completely.

would i save energy replacing the conventional units with inverters?

NO

the candidate Anthony5 receives 999 points and is entitled to join the next round of the quiz in which the question is asked "why wouldn't i save any energy?"

[Anthony5]

a question for the resident inverter aircon aficionados:

-every evening i am cooling our master-bedroom to ~18ºC

(if ambient temperature allows to 16ºC) using a total of 37,000 btu/h,

estimated cost approximately 20,000 Baht per annum.

-when i go to bed i switch off aircons completely.

would i save energy replacing the conventional units with inverters?

NO

the candidate Anthony5 receives 999 points and is entitled to join the next round of the quiz in which the question is asked "why wouldn't i save any energy?"

Because an inverter only saves energy when the unit is used for an extensive time, because it regulate the speed ( current) during operation and keeps running at low speed thereby eliminating the repeated very high start up current, while a conventional unit runs either at full speed or stops completely. In your case there is actually only one start up and then running at full speed, until you have reached the desired temperature, and you switch off the unit.

Please be reminded, that this time I claim my prize.

[jcisco]

a question for the resident inverter aircon aficionados:

-every evening i am cooling our master-bedroom to ~18ºC

(if ambient temperature allows to 16ºC) using a total of 37,000 btu/h,

estimated cost approximately 20,000 Baht per annum.

-when i go to bed i switch off aircons completely.

would i save energy replacing the conventional units with inverters?

NO

the candidate Anthony5 receives 999 points and is entitled to join the next round of the quiz in which the question is asked "why wouldn't i save any energy?"

Since you have set the air-conditioner very low and close to ambient wet-bulb, the compressor will be running for an extended period (assuming from off state) at full capacity. And likely will have extended activity from the blower trying to offload heat, not at all a variable/fixed speed compressor issue, So I'm going with a no, not 100% about my reasoning but then again my profession isn't connected much to this topic other than by schooling.

Main savings from variable speed compressor I suspect actually to be a combination of a smarter controller and controllable expansion valve. Though I imagine they motor probably runs almost continually also saving start up peak usage. And will take advantage of better performance from the condenser with variable/2 speed blower or not.

However depending on the size of the room, usage habits and other heat sources into the rooms such as conductive heating from the sun and if you stayed in bed all day watching Thai soaps and news. You may save cash, it all depends.

Edited June 27, 2015 by jcisco

[spidermike007]

This unit is very obviously not a good view. Few of the high end units are. But, that does not negate the value of inverter technology in general. Be it a refrigerator or an AC unit there is some significant savings to be had on electric. What is not eco about that? It just makes sense.

a generalising statement, not applicable to all situations, and therefore incorrect especially when it concerns aircon units.

If that is the case, why did my monthly bill drop by 800 baht after I installed an 18,000 btu inverter AC, in my master BR? I tend to be a show me kind of guy. They showed me all right.

what part of "not applicable to all situations" is it you don't understand?

Me very dumb man. Me no understand science. Me only understand money. Me see low bills. Me like low bills.

[Naam]

a question for the resident inverter aircon aficionados:

-every evening i am cooling our master-bedroom to ~18ºC

(if ambient temperature allows to 16ºC) using a total of 37,000 btu/h,

estimated cost approximately 20,000 Baht per annum.

-when i go to bed i switch off aircons completely.

would i save energy replacing the conventional units with inverters?

NO

the candidate Anthony5 receives 999 points and is entitled to join the next round of the quiz in which the question is asked "why wouldn't i save any energy?"

Because an inverter only saves energy when the unit is used for an extensive time, because it regulate the speed ( current) during operation and keeps running at low speed thereby eliminating the repeated very high start up current, while a conventional unit runs either at full speed or stops completely. In your case there is actually only one start up and then running at full speed, until you have reached the desired temperature, and you switch off the unit.

Please be reminded, that this time I claim my prize.

your answer is without any doubt correct. but i would have preferred if you had dropped the often mentioned "high start-up amps" because they affect energy efficiency only in rare cases (start/stop every few minutes over prolonged hours).

under normal conditions the negative effect of the starting amps (drawn only for milliseconds at start-up) is not higher than the energy loss caused by rectifying AC to DC and then back to AC to generate the pulsewidth modulation required for variable compressor speeds. because of the latter i suspect that an inverter model is even a wee bit less efficient than a modern conventional unit in the case of my bedroom cooling.

as far as your prize is concerned i have something specific in mind but will convey that in due course by personal message.

[Naam]

Me very dumb man. Me no understand science. Me only understand money. Me see low bills. Me like low bills.

you see low bills (plural) "drop by 800 Baht" every month?

[spidermike007]

Me very dumb man. Me no understand science. Me only understand money. Me see low bills. Me like low bills.

you see low bills (plural) "drop by 800 Baht" every month?

Yes, since I got my 18,000 BTU Samsung inverter AC in the master bedroom (which is the AC I use the most) my bills have dropped by 800 baht per month. Pretty impressive how little power that puppy consumes compared to the non inverter hog I used to have. I do not think I will ever buy a non inverter AC or refrigerator again. I love the newer technology.

Edited June 28, 2015 by spidermike007

[Naam]

Me very dumb man. Me no understand science. Me only understand money. Me see low bills. Me like low bills.

you see low bills (plural) "drop by 800 Baht" every month?

Yes, since I got my 18,000 BTU Samsung inverter AC in the master bedroom (which is the AC I use the most) my bills have dropped by 800 baht per month. Pretty impressive how little power that puppy consumes compared to the non inverter hog I used to have. I do not think I will ever buy a non inverter AC or refrigerator again. I love the newer technology.

can you also tell us for how many months you realised these savings?

[spidermike007]

Me very dumb man. Me no understand science. Me only understand money. Me see low bills. Me like low bills.

you see low bills (plural) "drop by 800 Baht" every month?

Yes, since I got my 18,000 BTU Samsung inverter AC in the master bedroom (which is the AC I use the most) my bills have dropped by 800 baht per month. Pretty impressive how little power that puppy consumes compared to the non inverter hog I used to have. I do not think I will ever buy a non inverter AC or refrigerator again. I love the newer technology.

can you also tell us for how many months you realised these savings?

Yes. It has been over two years now. The savings are consistent. Each and every month, unless it is the winter time, when I use the AC rarely, as I do not need it.

[Naam]

you see low bills (plural) "drop by 800 Baht" every month?

Yes, since I got my 18,000 BTU Samsung inverter AC in the master bedroom (which is the AC I use the most) my bills have dropped by 800 baht per month. Pretty impressive how little power that puppy consumes compared to the non inverter hog I used to have. I do not think I will ever buy a non inverter AC or refrigerator again. I love the newer technology.

can you also tell us for how many months you realised these savings?

Yes. It has been over two years now. The savings are consistent. Each and every month, unless it is the winter time, when I use the AC rarely, as I do not need it.

so you think we are dumb enough to believe your "consistent" savings claim which apply to at least eight months a year but with big variations in ambient temperatures?

[jcisco]

so you think we are dumb enough to believe your "consistent" savings claim which apply to at least eight months a year but with big variations in ambient temperatures?

You are a very sceptical person upon this topic, and while I entirely agree with such an approach to the world... however you may realise people tend to be less than precise when it comes to figures like remembering 16 months worth of bills to discern their savings. Meaning that consistent is likely that of the peak bills that initiated the installation of the new AC unit just after the hottest periods of last year..... But I could be wrong.

[spidermike007]

you see low bills (plural) "drop by 800 Baht" every month?

Yes, since I got my 18,000 BTU Samsung inverter AC in the master bedroom (which is the AC I use the most) my bills have dropped by 800 baht per month. Pretty impressive how little power that puppy consumes compared to the non inverter hog I used to have. I do not think I will ever buy a non inverter AC or refrigerator again. I love the newer technology.

can you also tell us for how many months you realised these savings?

Yes. It has been over two years now. The savings are consistent. Each and every month, unless it is the winter time, when I use the AC rarely, as I do not need it.

so you think we are dumb enough to believe your "consistent" savings claim which apply to at least eight months a year but with big variations in ambient temperatures?

Frankly, your rants and objections mean very, very little to me. This is not personal for me. Being questioned by you means less than zero to me. I am just stating some facts, which you are welcome to do whatever with, as you please, as open minded individuals tend to. I am happy to let this go. It is about as important as swatting a knat. Please get on with your day. Thank you very much.