Retirement Visa by any other name

[mommysboy]

If someone is 50 and all he says is he wants a "retirement visa" we need to know A LOT more to give any kind of good advice!

Does he want an O-A?

Is he in Thailand?

Does he understand the huge differences between starting with an O-A or not?

What financial requirements can he use?

It makes a BIG difference if going for an O-A or going for an extension, where you first need an O visa, before the extension.

If the latter, how will he get the O visa?

In his home country? Possible or not? Not always.

In a neighboring to Thailand country. Then figure out how to do that.

In Thailand. Then figure out how to do that. Depends on WHERE in Thailand he will live.

Just scratched the surface here.

If we aren't on the same page with terminology how are people supposed to understand their best (and even possible) options? Much less get GOOD advice on the best ways of going about getting what they need.

Then of course some people pay agencies to do everything and don't even ever bother to learn the first thing about what they have in their passport. I guess that's OK IF what the agent did was legal and if you're OK paying those guys indefinitely but I wouldn't be comfortable being so dependent in such a matter as my legal status here.

Some fair points, but what you describe are follow on issues for discussion that would naturally develop with prompting. It stands to reason posters don't come on with comprehensive information, otherwise they wouldn't be coming on at all if you follow my drift. Besides a run in with Thai immigration rules and regulations can turn anyone in to a a jelly brained wreck.

The main point being made is that when someone comes on the board talking about " retirement visa", we all know he is really talking about the extension of stay based on retirement. That is the issue that seems to cause most ire whichever side of the fence you sit on.

And OP is right even lawyers can call it the retirement visa.

[Jingthing]

No we do NOT know that!

You clearly haven't been paying attention.

Just mentioning "retirement visa" reveals not much at all.

Often STRONG CLUES are given but not always.

Again, people are expecting too much mind reading.

It's rude behavior to the people giving advice.

The POLITE way of asking for help here is to spill the beans mentioning details that you think MIGHT be helpful for the competent people giving advice to know what you're talking about even if you're got the terminology all botched up.

Garbage in, garbage out. If you don't explain your situation well and you expect the best advice, you are a FOOL.

My perspective is from someone who HAS given a lot of advice to people over many years, though obviously I'm no Ubonjoe and never will be.
People WHINING about too much pedantry are clearly people who haven't tried out that role much or ever.
THEN you would get this ... you REALLY would.

Edited September 27, 2015 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

If you say annual extension based on retirement, we know EXACTLY what you mean. Unless you don't.

If you say retirement visa, you could mean a number of things:

1 - An O-A visa (Long Stay Visa) from home country only (in which case if you play it right, you won't need your first annual extension for about TWO YEARS)

2- An initial O visa (not O-A) from a country other than Thailand

3 - An initial 90 day O visa (not O-A) done as a "CONVERSION" "change of status" from a 30 day stamp or tourist visa IN THAILAND

4- An annual extension based on retirement (done at your LOCAL Thailand immigration office)

So saying annual extension based on retirement (and those other terms if that's what you're talking about) is VERY USEFUL to the people giving help and also for people who care enough to understand what's really in their passport (or what they really need or want in their passport).

Clear enough?

Edited September 27, 2015 by Jingthing

[fang37]

I wish to take the opportunity to thank fellow members sincerely for their contribution to this enlightening thread.

Now, for the first time, I feel totally informed.

My only "problems" are now I am unaware of my name, my address, the I/O to which I am required to report, the appointed date thereof, appointed time, my nationality, required documents as required under the said Act.

One further question, Sir. What is the price of 1kg of small bananas at the local food market if purchased from a local producer. The purchase was effected by cash at precisely 6.32am yesterday.

BTW, I have an appointment at the barbers. I am confident that it is not next Wednesday. Why? Wednesday is an unlucky day to have a haircut.

Have a good one, fellow members.

[Jingthing]

I wish to take the opportunity to thank fellow members sincerely for their contribution to this enlightening thread.

Now, for the first time, I feel totally informed.

My only "problems" are now I am unaware of my name, my address, the I/O to which I am required to report, the appointed date thereof, appointed time, my nationality, required documents as required under the said Act.

One further question, Sir. What is the price of 1kg of small bananas at the local food market if purchased from a local producer. The purchase was effected by cash at precisely 6.32am yesterday.

BTW, I have an appointment at the barbers. I am confident that it is not next Wednesday. Why? Wednesday is an unlucky day to have a haircut.

Have a good one, fellow members.

Is this the Farang Pub?

[Jingthing]

OK, I'll give the complainers a BIG bone here.

If someone says something like, I've lived here 10 years and want to know about any changes at my office for renewing my retirement visa and people correct him and say you're not renewing your retirement visa, you're going for your next annual extension based on retirement I can understand that this looks like and might well be pedantic.

Because even though incorrect terminology was used, it is TOTALLY clear what situation the questioner is dealing with.

Yes, I am guilty of doing stuff like this.

But there is actually a reason that I do. Can't speak for others.

The reason is that lots of people other than OPs read this forum and by correcting, readers might learn the actual correct terminology which might help them understand their own situation better which may not be nearly that clear cut.

But obviously such correction was not necessary to deal with that sort of totally clear question.

But many or even most questions are not nearly that clear.

Edited September 27, 2015 by Jingthing

[tropo]

If you say annual extension based on retirement, we know EXACTLY what you mean. Unless you don't.

If you say retirement visa, you could mean a number of things:

1 - An O-A visa (Long Stay Visa) from home country only (in which case if you play it right, you won't need your first annual extension for about TWO YEARS)

2- An initial O visa (not O-A) from a country other than Thailand

3 - An initial 90 day O visa (not O-A) done as a "CONVERSION" "change of status" from a 30 day stamp or tourist visa IN THAILAND

4- An annual extension based on retirement (done at your LOCAL Thailand immigration office)

So saying annual extension based on retirement (and those other terms if that's what you're talking about) is VERY USEFUL to the people giving help and also for people who care enough to understand what's really in their passport (or what they really need or want in their passport).

Clear enough?

A waste of effort typing it all out IMO.

Once you're on your annual extensions, they're all the same, a "retirement visa".

Let's be pedantic here for a moment. All the above terminology is incorrect and you could be misleading people. There is no such thing as a "O-A visa" or a "O visa". They are in fact "non-immigrant O" and "non-immigrant O-A" visas.

Using your line of reasoning, the technical name for my particular visa would be: an "annual extension of a 90 day non-Immigrant O visa (converted from a 30 day visa-free entry), based on retirement", or something to that effect. Quite a mouth full.

Edited September 27, 2015 by tropo

[mommysboy]

OK, I'll give the complainers a BIG bone here.

If someone says something like, I've lived here 10 years and want to know about any changes at my office for renewing my retirement visa and people correct him and say you're not renewing your retirement visa, you're going for your next annual extension based on retirement I can understand that this looks like and might well be pedantic.

Because even though incorrect terminology was used, it is TOTALLY clear what situation the questioner is dealing with.

Yes, I am guilty of doing stuff like this.

But there is actually a reason that I do. Can't speak for others.

The reason is that lots of people other than OPs read this forum and by correcting, readers might learn the actual correct terminology which might help them understand their own situation better which may not be nearly that clear cut.

But obviously such correction was not necessary to deal with that sort of totally clear question.

But many or even most questions are not nearly that clear.

"If someone says something like, I've lived here 10 years and want to know about any changes at my office for renewing my retirement visa and people correct him and say you're not renewing your retirement visa, you're going for your next annual extension based on retirement I can understand that this looks like and might well be pedantic".

That is entirely the point OP was making, nothing else, no ifs or buts.

[fang37]

I wish to take the opportunity to thank fellow members sincerely for their contribution to this enlightening thread.

Now, for the first time, I feel totally informed.

My only "problems" are now I am unaware of my name, my address, the I/O to which I am required to report, the appointed date thereof, appointed time, my nationality, required documents as required under the said Act.

One further question, Sir. What is the price of 1kg of small bananas at the local food market if purchased from a local producer. The purchase was effected by cash at precisely 6.32am yesterday.

BTW, I have an appointment at the barbers. I am confident that it is not next Wednesday. Why? Wednesday is an unlucky day to have a haircut.

Have a good one, fellow members.

Is this the Farang Pub?

Good question, Sir.

I will seek counsel from my senior advisor, seek permission from the Head of Dept, urinate on the 3rd lemon tree to the right & then submit the appropriate document/s to you (in duplicate). May I interest you in any other of our services?

[Jingthing]

OK, I'll give the complainers a BIG bone here.

If someone says something like, I've lived here 10 years and want to know about any changes at my office for renewing my retirement visa and people correct him and say you're not renewing your retirement visa, you're going for your next annual extension based on retirement I can understand that this looks like and might well be pedantic.

Because even though incorrect terminology was used, it is TOTALLY clear what situation the questioner is dealing with.

Yes, I am guilty of doing stuff like this.

But there is actually a reason that I do. Can't speak for others.

The reason is that lots of people other than OPs read this forum and by correcting, readers might learn the actual correct terminology which might help them understand their own situation better which may not be nearly that clear cut.

But obviously such correction was not necessary to deal with that sort of totally clear question.

But many or even most questions are not nearly that clear.

"If someone says something like, I've lived here 10 years and want to know about any changes at my office for renewing my retirement visa and people correct him and say you're not renewing your retirement visa, you're going for your next annual extension based on retirement I can understand that this looks like and might well be pedantic".

That is entirely the point OP was making, nothing else, no ifs or buts.

I disagree that his comment was nearly that limited. He was speaking more generally and I have explained very well here why when in general people say retirement visa we quite often do not know what they are talking about as it could be one of many things.

But I do understand the concept of KEEP IT SIMPLE but for information to be useful it does need to be at least as complex as it needs to be to convey accurate information.

Honestly, the truth is that if more people get on the same page about using consistent and correct terminology here it could be kept a LOT SIMPLER (and clear)! But alas that obviously ain't gonna happen.

Edited September 27, 2015 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

I wish to take the opportunity to thank fellow members sincerely for their contribution to this enlightening thread.

Now, for the first time, I feel totally informed.

My only "problems" are now I am unaware of my name, my address, the I/O to which I am required to report, the appointed date thereof, appointed time, my nationality, required documents as required under the said Act.

One further question, Sir. What is the price of 1kg of small bananas at the local food market if purchased from a local producer. The purchase was effected by cash at precisely 6.32am yesterday.

BTW, I have an appointment at the barbers. I am confident that it is not next Wednesday. Why? Wednesday is an unlucky day to have a haircut.

Have a good one, fellow members.

Is this the Farang Pub?

Good question, Sir.

I will seek counsel from my senior advisor, seek permission from the Head of Dept, urinate on the 3rd lemon tree to the right & then submit the appropriate document/s to you (in duplicate). May I interest you in any other of our services?

Only if you're very cute.

Next ...

[fang37]

Excessively cute.

I have an aunt - spinster. Too much facial hair. Natural breath.

You may find her an interesting person for an intimate meeting.

[Jingthing]

Excessively cute.

I have an aunt - spinster. Too much facial hair. Natural breath.

You may find her an interesting person for an intimate meeting.

Let's take this offline before we scare the horses.

[Jingthing]

Anyway, I guess I have confessed that sometimes I am pedantic here but as I've explained I do it for a reason of good intentions because the posts are read by others than OPs. I have read other posts that are pedantic on these matters where it does have the tone more of a GOTCHA blood sport, even nasty.

I hope my posts done come off that way as my intention on the visa forum (pretty much only about retirement) is to be helpful when I can and to PUNT when I can't. You non-Americans understand what I mean by PUNT, yes?

Edited September 27, 2015 by Jingthing

[PS2]

When I came here I got a stamp in my passport, I am retired, please help me.

[kowpot]

OK, I'll give the complainers a BIG bone here.

If someone says something like, I've lived here 10 years and want to know about any changes at my office for renewing my retirement visa and people correct him and say you're not renewing your retirement visa, you're going for your next annual extension based on retirement I can understand that this looks like and might well be pedantic.

Because even though incorrect terminology was used, it is TOTALLY clear what situation the questioner is dealing with.

Yes, I am guilty of doing stuff like this.

But there is actually a reason that I do. Can't speak for others.

The reason is that lots of people other than OPs read this forum and by correcting, readers might learn the actual correct terminology which might help them understand their own situation better which may not be nearly that clear cut.

But obviously such correction was not necessary to deal with that sort of totally clear question.

But many or even most questions are not nearly that clear.

"If someone says something like, I've lived here 10 years and want to know about any changes at my office for renewing my retirement visa and people correct him and say you're not renewing your retirement visa, you're going for your next annual extension based on retirement I can

understand that this looks like and might well be pedantic".

That is entirely the point OP was making, nothing else, no ifs or buts.

Exactly

[Sutty]

I'm here for life based on I want to be every year I have to pay to be able to stay for another year. Visa or extension based on or retirement or marriage who cares as long as my passport is duly stamped every year what it's called

[slipperylobster]

Visas are given out at Embassies/consulates. Extensions are done at immigration. If you call your extension a "visa" then you are confusing many people...who want to get this nasty business done correctly...at the right place.

It is not that people are trying to be "Mr. Know it all"....rather it is lazy posters implying that they do not need an extension of stay, by referring to a non existant "One year retirement visa".

Not exactly. You can get a 90 day O visa in Thailand if used as the first step towards a retirement extension.

Immigration does not give 90 day O visas. Consulates and Embassies do that.

Immigration gives the one year extensions.

You are assuming that I said you must leave Thailand....to get a visa...which I did not. Please reread what I wrote.

Edited September 27, 2015 by slipperylobster

[SpokaneAl]

I'm here for life based on I want to be every year I have to pay to be able to stay for another year. Visa or extension based on or retirement or marriage who cares as long as my passport is duly stamped every year what it's called

No one does care, unless you ask for help on this forum. Then many readers, like me, read the replies and attempt to learn and better understand how the process works. When you ask a question on the forum it truly is no longer all about you. Edited September 27, 2015 by SpokaneAl

[Sutty]

I'm here for life based on I want to be every year I have to pay to be able to stay for another year. Visa or extension based on or retirement or marriage who cares as long as my passport is duly stamped every year what it's called

No one does care, unless you ask for help on this forum. Then many readers, like me, read the replies and attempt to learn and better understand how the process works. When you ask a question on the forum it truly is no longer all about you.

I ask lots of questions and yes it can be informative but being predantic with an op for instance question on marriage visa first reply "there is no such thing" really helpful post second reply "you mean extension based on marriage" another really helpful reply we all know what is meant so in the words of a great film just answer the F****** question.

[Sophon]

I think, for me, that it is important that for the sake of good order, not to mix things up, that it is much better to learn and call stuff for what it is.....

Ignorance is never a good thing, and shouldn´t be encouraged in any way in life. It is better for the less knowledgeable to learn than for the vise to step a side...

There is always a reason that there is different words in a language, and if one doesn´t acknowledge that, than we have abig problem. Big law-firms do not know the correct wording, Immigration.officers do not know the correct wording.. Does THAT makes it right?

Glegolo

ps. For post number 2 - WRONG! When you come to Thailand you have bought a VISA, you than arrive and are given by the IO an permission to stay OR period to stay.

When this runs out, it is no longer a permission or period to stay, and the VISA are about to die with it... THAN it is time to apply for a extension of stay from that permission to stay.... OK....

THIS IS THE REASON why we should use the correct wording!!

I'm with the OP on this. I find it annoying when pedantic forum members try to correct people whenever they use the informal term.

I'm going to call it a "retirement visa" as long as I post on this forum. I've made one concession - I use parentheses so as not to upset the OCD crowd too much.

Using abbreviated and/or informal terminology is common in English. Get over it! Saying it's: "an extension of stay based on retirement" sounds awkward in most contexts. When people are discussing the mechanics of how to get a visa based on retirement that's different, but if someone asks me what visa I've got, it's a "retirement visa", end of story.

Then just call it a retirement extension, then everyone will know what you are talking about. Is that so much harder than "retirement visa"?

Sophon

[Sophon]

OK, I'll give the complainers a BIG bone here.

If someone says something like, I've lived here 10 years and want to know about any changes at my office for renewing my retirement visa and people correct him and say you're not renewing your retirement visa, you're going for your next annual extension based on retirement I can understand that this looks like and might well be pedantic.

Because even though incorrect terminology was used, it is TOTALLY clear what situation the questioner is dealing with.

Yes, I am guilty of doing stuff like this.

But there is actually a reason that I do. Can't speak for others.

The reason is that lots of people other than OPs read this forum and by correcting, readers might learn the actual correct terminology which might help them understand their own situation better which may not be nearly that clear cut.

But obviously such correction was not necessary to deal with that sort of totally clear question.

But many or even most questions are not nearly that clear.

I think that even in situations where it's clear what the OP has, it's still important to correct the terminology so that other readers with limited knowledge about the subject doesn't get confused. But I agree that it can be done in different ways, and too many posters seem to just revel in correcting without actually trying to answer the question.

Whenever UbonJoe answers a question like the one in your example, he always says something like:

"There have been no changes to the requirements for a retirement extension (it's not a visa), just follow the same procedure as you did last year."

That way the OP gets his answer, and it is pointed out what the correct term is without it coming out as being pedantic.

Sophon

Edited September 28, 2015 by Sophon

[jacky54]

Anyone who cannot tell the difference between a visa and an extension based on various grounds probably should not be here.

[slipperylobster]

Visas are given out at Embassies/consulates. Extensions are done at immigration. If you call your extension a "visa" then you are confusing many people...who want to get this nasty business done correctly...at the right place.

It is not that people are trying to be "Mr. Know it all"....rather it is lazy posters implying that they do not need an extension of stay, by referring to a non existant "One year retirement visa".

Not exactly. You can get a 90 day O visa in Thailand if used as the first step towards a retirement extension.

Immigration does not give 90 day O visas. Consulates and Embassies do that.

Immigration gives the one year extensions.

You are assuming that I said you must leave Thailand....to get a visa...which I did not. Please reread what I wrote.

I am aware of the one exception that you can "Convert" a tourist visa to a 90 day O in Bangkok.... now we are talking about a conversion of a visa that you got in a consulate outside the country...that being done in Bangkok (an exception but remember..you are converting a visa that you already have) I do understand that is done at Immigration in Bangkok

[oncearugge]

Visas are given out at Embassies/consulates. Extensions are done at immigration. If you call your extension a "visa" then you are confusing many people...who want to get this nasty business done correctly...at the right place.

It is not that people are trying to be "Mr. Know it all"....rather it is lazy posters implying that they do not need an extension of stay, by referring to a non existant "One year retirement visa".

Not exactly. You can get a 90 day O visa in Thailand if used as the first step towards a retirement extension.

Immigration does not give 90 day O visas. Consulates and Embassies do that.

Immigration gives the one year extensions.

You are assuming that I said you must leave Thailand....to get a visa...which I did not. Please reread what I wrote.

I am aware of the one exception that you can "Convert" a tourist visa to a 90 day O in Bangkok.... now we are talking about a conversion of a visa that you got in a consulate outside the country...that being done in Bangkok (an exception but remember..you are converting a visa that you already have) I do understand that is done at Immigration in Bangkok

It is also possible to convert a "VISA EXEMPT ENTRY" which is not a visa and cannot be obtained other than from a Thai immigration officer.

[SpokaneAl]

Anyone who cannot tell the difference between a visa and an extension based on various grounds probably should not be here.

I think perhaps that you maybe making assumptions about the readership. Not everyone is in Thailand permanently or even in Thailand. Some make short visits or are living elsewhere and are hoping to move to Thailand. Many are elsewhere reading this information in the hopes of learning what best route to take when time and circumstances allow them to move to Thailand, or perhaps are hoping to split their time between Thailand and their home or anther country.

There are a large number of permutations of readers here.

Edited September 28, 2015 by SpokaneAl

[elviajero]

Visas are given out at Embassies/consulates. Extensions are done at immigration. If you call your extension a "visa" then you are confusing many people...who want to get this nasty business done correctly...at the right place.

It is not that people are trying to be "Mr. Know it all"....rather it is lazy posters implying that they do not need an extension of stay, by referring to a non existant "One year retirement visa".

Not exactly. You can get a 90 day O visa in Thailand if used as the first step towards a retirement extension.

Immigration does not give 90 day O visas. Consulates and Embassies do that.

Immigration gives the one year extensions.

You are assuming that I said you must leave Thailand....to get a visa...which I did not. Please reread what I wrote.

I am aware of the one exception that you can "Convert" a tourist visa to a 90 day O in Bangkok.... now we are talking about a conversion of a visa that you got in a consulate outside the country...that being done in Bangkok (an exception but remember..you are converting a visa that you already have) I do understand that is done at Immigration in Bangkok

That hole you're digging for yourself is getting bigger.

[edwardflory]

I'm going to call it a "retirement visa" as long as I post on this forum................ ( etc )

One of the reasons I feel the proper term for your "extension of stay based on xxxxxxxx" is important follows:

On my first trip OUT of, then IN to, the country... AFTER... receiving my """"RETIREMENT VISA"""", I was filling out the forms to enter Thailand, on the form was VISA NUMBER. I filled in my """"Retirement VISA number"""", headed to passport control, for some reason the "look at passport and point you where to go person" pointed me to the Thai Only line. At the counter upon a 30 second inspection, I was told my """"VISA"""" number was wrong. The officer pointed to my MULTIPLE ENTRY PERMIT and told me this was my """"VISA""""number, and being the nice person he was, corrected my """"VISA"""" number on the slip, and entered the information in the computer. "Enjoy my stay"

How MANY wrong things do you see in the above.

So after a few days I am looking for a nice place to stay ( I am staying in a OVERPRICED room in the middle of nowhere ) when I find the place I live now, The owner ( English speaking ) asks me what type of "permission to stay I have", I say I have a """"RETIREMENT VISA"""" . He asks to see my passport and says I have "permission to stay for 1 year", he then explains, his wife works at immigration, and, MANY people make the mistake of saying """"RETIREMENT VISA"""". EVEN if I do not stay at his place, he will ask his wife to explain the different Visas, permissions to stay, a "multiple entry permit" is etc, if I come back to his place that night.

Needless to say I have been living at his place 18 months

[tropo]

I think, for me, that it is important that for the sake of good order, not to mix things up, that it is much better to learn and call stuff for what it is.....

Ignorance is never a good thing, and shouldn´t be encouraged in any way in life. It is better for the less knowledgeable to learn than for the vise to step a side...

There is always a reason that there is different words in a language, and if one doesn´t acknowledge that, than we have abig problem. Big law-firms do not know the correct wording, Immigration.officers do not know the correct wording.. Does THAT makes it right?

Glegolo

ps. For post number 2 - WRONG! When you come to Thailand you have bought a VISA, you than arrive and are given by the IO an permission to stay OR period to stay.

When this runs out, it is no longer a permission or period to stay, and the VISA are about to die with it... THAN it is time to apply for a extension of stay from that permission to stay.... OK....

THIS IS THE REASON why we should use the correct wording!!

I'm with the OP on this. I find it annoying when pedantic forum members try to correct people whenever they use the informal term.

I'm going to call it a "retirement visa" as long as I post on this forum. I've made one concession - I use parentheses so as not to upset the OCD crowd too much.

Using abbreviated and/or informal terminology is common in English. Get over it! Saying it's: "an extension of stay based on retirement" sounds awkward in most contexts. When people are discussing the mechanics of how to get a visa based on retirement that's different, but if someone asks me what visa I've got, it's a "retirement visa", end of story.

Then just call it a retirement extension, then everyone will know what you are talking about. Is that so much harder than "retirement visa"?

Sophon

I made it quite clear what I call it. You are free to call it what you like. I doubt many people will be confused other than you and few others perhaps.

[fang37]

I'm with you - "RETIREMENT VISA" is an acceptable term.

No misunderstandings ensued (so far).