Eight killed, 28 injured in Kanchanaburi road accident

[SOTIRIOS]

...........'the bus fell from the road'..........bad bus...... ....insane.....

[Artisi]

Given that drivers are prone to human error - whatever te country, isn't it about time that the authorities re-engineered a piece of road with the name "100 bodies curve"?? - e.g. check the camber....barriers and of course re-think the design of these "home-made" buses.

At the same time introduce brain transplants for drivers lacking the necessary equipment.

...and so it starts; people with no knowledge of what actually happened and not a clue about road safety resort to baseless Thai-bashing.

Seeing as how the particular spot is called 100 bodies curve it can be assumed that it is a dangerous piece of road and any professional driver would be aware of it and drive accordingly - it could also be assumed without too much thought that the driver didn't take the necessary precautions - of course it could also be assumed that it was just a case of bad luck and no fault on the driver, brakes, steering etc. but I would opt for the former not the latter.

Of course the cause will never be investigated as no one has any interest is establishing the events leading up to the accident --as usual - so mai pben rai - bad luck for the dead passengers / families etc.

As for assuming that people do not have a clue about road safety is baseless bashing on your part - or can we assume you are a professional heavy vehicle driver with 1000's of hours experience to your credit and fully qualified to comment.

[tomloughney]

Given the conditions of many roads it surprises me that there are not more accidents. Very poor road design, more very poor construction, almost zero maintenance, intersections that don't match up, traffic lights that count down to zero and then wait 7 seconds after zero to turn green.

The ramp from Sumkumvitt to the 7 in Pattaya has a posted speed limit of 20.....so drive 100, slow to 20, speed up to 100.....who designed an entrance ramp like that.....

Poor road markings, XXX is a left turn, but the sign is posted 3 soi's before the actual turn, ok for locals...

The need to put destructive speed bumps on roads.....the soi is 50, but the speed bump is 3 km/hr and after the bump, you need to avoid the pot holes.They can make speed bumps for the speed they want to enforce.

The Railroad Road is an utter disaster, never worked for the first, traffic lights were a total flop, and when there are massive backups it generally due to a Traffic Police "helping" as soon as they leave, or don't show up the traffic flow is better.

4 way red lights, but normal lights in Chaing Mai.... No left turns on red in pattaya....good way to improve traffic flow.... and different that the rest of thailand....

ETC....

Yes 85% of fatalities are drunks on motorcycles....but....

[springheeled jack]

this driver was doing something he shouldn't have been doing going too fast on a dangerous part of the road 8 dead 28 injured is significant in itself .

[cumgranosalum]

this driver was doing something he shouldn't have been doing going too fast on a dangerous part of the road 8 dead 28 injured is significant in itself .

how do you know that?

[cumgranosalum]

Why do we keep labeling these incidents as Accidents , surely we should be calling them

"inevitables "

they aren't called "accidents" - that is just the media - they are referred to as incidents or collisions - the is no such thing as an accident and unlike the commonly held belief on this site there is NEVER only a single factor - these "events" are the result of the coming together of several factors.

"...are the result of the coming together of several factors".

As in 1) inept drivers; 2) badly built/converted or maintained motor vehicles or 3) general attitude as in 'life is cheap, why worry about it'

Simply put...you have no idea........ just confirming your own biases

[northernphil]

Why do we keep labeling these incidents as Accidents , surely we should be calling them

"inevitables "

they aren't called "accidents" - that is just the media - they are referred to as incidents or collisions - the is no such thing as an accident and unlike the commonly held belief on this site there is NEVER only a single factor - these "events" are the result of the coming together of several factors.

I agree with you , to me an accident is something that cannot be avoided. EG a bird flying into the windscreen. While in this pedantic mode , I don't think roads are dangerous.. A gun isn't dangerous 'till it is in someones hands. Roads are not dangerous , they might well be in a dangerous condition ,such as poor surface , negative camber. A road does no harm until a driver mis- uses it.

[cumgranosalum]

Why do we keep labeling these incidents as Accidents , surely we should be calling them

"inevitables "

they aren't called "accidents" - that is just the media - they are referred to as incidents or collisions - the is no such thing as an accident and unlike the commonly held belief on this site there is NEVER only a single factor - these "events" are the result of the coming together of several factors.

I agree with you , to me an accident is something that cannot be avoided. EG a bird flying into the windscreen. While in this pedantic mode , I don't think roads are dangerous.. A gun isn't dangerous 'till it is in someones hands. Roads are not dangerous , they might well be in a dangerous condition ,such as poor surface , negative camber. A road does no harm until a driver mis- uses it.

Unfortunately you don't understand the first thing about human nature and contradict yourself in your comments on road design and condition...don't you think it is a bit of a coincidence that many, many people suddenly decide to be "stupid" on this patch of road...like so many people on Thai\visa tyou grossly overestimate your driving skills, powers of observation and your analytical skills. Why not read up on road safety before making comments that would shame a 12-year-old schoolkid?

[lvr181]

Strange how even though it's the 2nd worst country in the world for this sort of senseless death no government ever seems to do anything about it, and the solutions are all obvious.

I An actual driving test instead of the farce in place now

2 Police enforcing the highway code

3 Confiscation of any vehicle being driven dangerously, without insurance or where the driver is drunk.

4 Proper vehicle tests yearly like the MOT to keep death traps off the roads

oh and the use of seatbelts might be a good idea, you know those stupid foreign devices

3 Confiscation of any vehicle being driven dangerously, without insurance or where the driver is drunk under the influence of alcohol or drugs, legal or not!

[NoshowJones]

Strange how even though it's the 2nd worst country in the world for this sort of senseless death no government ever seems to do anything about it, and the solutions are all obvious.

I An actual driving test instead of the farce in place now

2 Police enforcing the highway code

3 Confiscation of any vehicle being driven dangerously, without insurance or where the driver is drunk

4 Proper vehicle tests yearly like the MOT to keep death traps off the roads

oh and the use of seatbelts might be a good idea, you know those stupid foreign devices

Your No 4. The MOT in the UK is nothing more than a money making thing for the government.

I am not saying that vehicles should be driving around untested, but your vehicle could pass the MOT

one day and fail the next, then it has another 364 days to go before it is due it's next MOT.

Stand at a point by the roadside, pull in every vehicle over three years old, give it an MOT check, and IMO

about 80% of them would fail, and again most of them will still be safe to drive.

[cumgranosalum]

some people here are to road safety what the flat earth society is to science....these are the 5 main tenets of road safety...they are INTERDEPENDENT....

1. Education
2. Enforcement
3. Engineering
4. Emergency
5. Evaluation

[slapout]

The suggestion to do brain transplants, while a good idea wont work here, Thailand does not want foreign input, ideas, suggestion, etc and there is such a shortage avaliable from potential Thai donors, virtually impossible to track down.. Thailand is in reality number 1 in the world for vehicle deaths, not sure why they do not demand due reconization for their accomplishment

traffic engineering and qualified personal must not be part of the ministry of Transport request for recruitment lately/

Edited October 26, 2015 by slapout

[Johnsy]

Come it's not all bad at least they caught 9,000 foreigners illegally residing in Thailand! They were much more of a threat to Thailand than drunk, reckless, speeding, unlicensed, uninsured, unregistered vehicles and drivers who kill tens of thousands of people. It just a matter of priorities and that's something of a conundrum for Thais

[ClutchClark]

this driver was doing something he shouldn't have been doing going too fast on a dangerous part of the road 8 dead 28 injured is significant in itself .

how do you know that?

Ah...because...if...he...was...not...going...to...fast...he...would...not...have...tipped...over?

[MESmith]

Strange how even though it's the 2nd worst country in the world for this sort of senseless death no government ever seems to do anything about it, and the solutions are all obvious.

I An actual driving test instead of the farce in place now

2 Police enforcing the highway code

3 Confiscation of any vehicle being driven dangerously, without insurance or where the driver is drunk

4 Proper vehicle tests yearly like the MOT to keep death traps off the roads

oh and the use of seatbelts might be a good idea, you know those stupid foreign devices

Your No 4. The MOT in the UK is nothing more than a money making thing for the government.

I am not saying that vehicles should be driving around untested, but your vehicle could pass the MOT

one day and fail the next, then it has another 364 days to go before it is due it's next MOT.

Stand at a point by the roadside, pull in every vehicle over three years old, give it an MOT check, and IMO

about 80% of them would fail, and again most of them will still be safe to drive.

silly old me thought the MOT was a cash cow for combined testing centres/mechanics. The 2 should be independent.

[optad]

Blah blah blah..... We, the TV community, can post the same stuff again and again but until the Thais care enough to change nothing will ever happen.

They accept the numbers/

[Aussieroaming]

Murder by bus driver

[Stargeezr]

Have many of you taken this road? I am asking because I went by an 8 passenger

van through this area, and up to Mae Hong Son. The country side is full of hills and steep

valleys and gullies, making it very hard to impossible to have a safer road way.

There are many places in the world that are like this, and there will always be accidents

as brake failure does happen everywhere. It is a fact of life, the sad part is that

many people do die, as has those that died in this accident. RIP.

[balo]

It was probably the brakes, but we will never find out , next week we'll be talking about another deadly accident.

[cumgranosalum]

With the bus incident; examples of how EVERY E applies to every incident

This is by no means complete, but I offer it as an example of how the 5 Es are applied to an accident

1. Education

Driver error - probably poorly trained and unaware of good driving practices.

1. Enforcement

If the guy was over hours, or on drink or drugs, no police checks would ever find this as they are not carried out properly

Maybe there should be speed cameras on this stretch of road or speed limit and warning signs.

1. Engineering

2 parts to this

A - the road design itself is obviously at fault - it is an accident black spot n many countries road/traffic engineers would go in and alter the layout -either to make in impossible to negotiate at speed or adjust the camber and radius on the bend.

B - The vehicle itself. Many of the buses on Thai roads are death traps...their C.o.G. is way to high, and their handling characteristics are appalling....and AFTER the vehicle enters the crash cycle, the structure of the vehicle does nothing to protect the passengers thus resulting in a far higher injury count than should be expected of a modern passenger vehicle

1. Emergency

Ambulances etc. - in the UK the “A” grade emergency response is aimed to be 8 minutes. In Thailand there isn’t eve an emergency response monitor. There is no central ambulance service and the ambulances/pickups that arrive eventually are ill equipped and inconsistent with untrained or partially trained medics. It is well established that the response time is VITAL to the survival of patients even with minor injuries.

1. Evaluation

In UK, after any accident, detailed stats and surveys are carried out to establish the various factors involved - then recommendations are made as to how this can be avoided in the future - if necessary the road is closed for resurfacing and barriers replaced. Unfortunately in Thailand nothing is learned - the police will blame the driver, the marks in the road will be left for months years even until thee road surface degenerates as a result, there are no barriers to replace and no valid measurements of reports are made except for a couple of photos and some spray paint on the road.

[Assurancetourix]

It took me 4 months of training to get my PCV license in the UK.

Here i believe it's 3 days and a brown envelope.

Death traps in the hands of uneducated people, this is what happens.

Rest in peace.

Not three days but only half a day ; no necessary to give a brown envelope .

Thai people arrive to the exam driving their vehicles ( they don't have yet the license );

U need a medical certificate;

I don't write a medical exam ;

U have to go to a doctor house and the secretary will give you that paper for 100 baht ;

next time, I want to try going to an animal doctor to see if it works

In french we say : " du grand n' importe quoi " rubbish at all

[cumgranosalum]

It took me 4 months of training to get my PCV license in the UK.

Here i believe it's 3 days and a brown envelope.

Death traps in the hands of uneducated people, this is what happens.

Rest in peace.

Not three days but only half a day ; no necessary to give a brown envelope .

Thai people arrive to the exam driving their vehicles ( they don't have yet the license );

U need a medical certificate;

I don't write a medical exam ;

U have to go to a doctor house and the secretary will give you that paper for 100 baht ;

next time, I want to try going to an animal doctor to see if it works

In french we say : " du grand n' importe quoi " rubbish at all

You used to be able to do exactly the same in Northern Ireland......

[cumgranosalum]

It was probably the brakes, but we will never find out , next week we'll be talking about another deadly accident.

why? - because there is no "E" - evaluation and no E engineering in the form of roadworthy test and no E enforcement of any laws pertaining to this.

[gk10002000]

Eight killed in coach accident in Kanchanaburi

KANCHANABURI:-- The driver of a double-decker tour coach and seven other tourists were killed when the vehicle crashed into granite wall of a mountain and turned one side up as it was negotiating downhill of a mountainous route in Kanchanaburi’s Sisawat district on Sunday morning.

About 20 other tourists in the coach were also injured, some of them in serious condition. Rescue workers had to use tools to free some of them trapped inside.

Police said that the driver was crushed to death behind the steering wheel and the front side of the coach was smashed.

The tour coach was carrying about 40 tourists on their return trip to Bangkok after they spent their long weekend at rafts in Srinagarind dam. As the driver was trying to negotiate a sharp curve at Tabtao mountain, he apparently lost control and smashed head-on to the mountain face and the coach turned one side up.

Police said that the curve has been prone to accidents and motorists have been warned to exercise special caution and yet there are still accidents.

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/eight-killed-in-coach-accident-in-kanchanaburi

-- Thai PBS 2015-10-25

Sorry but the "curve" is not prone to accidents. The stupid and irresponsible people drivers are prone to accidents. Go slow and no problem. Go fast and many problems, and of course that is when the iffy brake system failure is most likely to occur when you really jam on the brakes at that last moment when you realize you are going too fast. Many sympathies for the passengers, zero sympathy for the driver.

[metisdead]

Some facile nonsense posts have been removed.

[Artisi]

It was probably the brakes, but we will never find out , next week we'll be talking about another deadly accident.

Brakes brakes brakes - in any serious accident that's all we ever hear, I would like to know what brakes have to do with poor driver education and the continual cry it was the brakes (no brakes) that caused the accident - that is BS.

The main function of brakes is to slow or stop the vehicle in an emergency - not for driving a vehicle downhill under power and expecting the brakes to arrest the vehicle when it overspeeds - the gearbox engine combination or exhaust brakes is the correct procedure for long downhill descents and a skilled driver can descend any downhill road with minimal or no requirements to use the brakes.

However situations do arise from time to time, the driver might screw-up a gear change, a drive component might fail negating gearbox/engine braking but if the driver has been preserving the braking for an emergency, with timely braking the vehicle can usually be bought to a stop.

But TIT, "it was the brakes" - simple facesaving excuse that covers the majority of cases.

[MAZ3]

One thing that has not been mentioned(as far as I can see)in this sad incident,is that 2 farang EMT nurse's were on a scooter and stopped to help the casualties. Even travelling with them and assisting at the Hospital,the details are on a local Kanchanaburi FB group page.

Bravo to them.

RIP to the victims

[cumgranosalum]

It was probably the brakes, but we will never find out , next week we'll be talking about another deadly accident.

Brakes brakes brakes - in any serious accident that's all we ever hear, I would like to know what brakes have to do with poor driver education and the continual cry it was the brakes (no brakes) that caused the accident - that is BS.

The main function of brakes is to slow or stop the vehicle in an emergency - not for driving a vehicle downhill under power and expecting the brakes to arrest the vehicle when it overspeeds - the gearbox engine combination or exhaust brakes is the correct procedure for long downhill descents and a skilled driver can descend any downhill road with minimal or no requirements to use the brakes.

However situations do arise from time to time, the driver might screw-up a gear change, a drive component might fail negating gearbox/engine braking but if the driver has been preserving the braking for an emergency, with timely braking the vehicle can usually be bought to a stop.

But TIT, "it was the brakes" - simple facesaving excuse that covers the majority of cases.

people who think they have a single factor answer for this are not only deluding themselves but also displaying a huge ignorance of road safety science.

[cumgranosalum]

Eight killed in coach accident in Kanchanaburi

KANCHANABURI:-- The driver of a double-decker tour coach and seven other tourists were killed when the vehicle crashed into granite wall of a mountain and turned one side up as it was negotiating downhill of a mountainous route in Kanchanaburi’s Sisawat district on Sunday morning.

About 20 other tourists in the coach were also injured, some of them in serious condition. Rescue workers had to use tools to free some of them trapped inside.

Police said that the driver was crushed to death behind the steering wheel and the front side of the coach was smashed.

The tour coach was carrying about 40 tourists on their return trip to Bangkok after they spent their long weekend at rafts in Srinagarind dam. As the driver was trying to negotiate a sharp curve at Tabtao mountain, he apparently lost control and smashed head-on to the mountain face and the coach turned one side up.

Police said that the curve has been prone to accidents and motorists have been warned to exercise special caution and yet there are still accidents.

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/eight-killed-in-coach-accident-in-kanchanaburi

-- Thai PBS 2015-10-25

Sorry but the "curve" is not prone to accidents. The stupid and irresponsible people drivers are prone to accidents. Go slow and no problem. Go fast and many problems, and of course that is when the iffy brake system failure is most likely to occur when you really jam on the brakes at that last moment when you realize you are going too fast. Many sympathies for the passengers, zero sympathy for the driver.

you talk as if you have knowledge of this incidence that is not available to others - is they a report out?

[Artisi]

It was probably the brakes, but we will never find out , next week we'll be talking about another deadly accident.

Brakes brakes brakes - in any serious accident that's all we ever hear, I would like to know what brakes have to do with poor driver education and the continual cry it was the brakes (no brakes) that caused the accident - that is BS.

The main function of brakes is to slow or stop the vehicle in an emergency - not for driving a vehicle downhill under power and expecting the brakes to arrest the vehicle when it overspeeds - the gearbox engine combination or exhaust brakes is the correct procedure for long downhill descents and a skilled driver can descend any downhill road with minimal or no requirements to use the brakes.

However situations do arise from time to time, the driver might screw-up a gear change, a drive component might fail negating gearbox/engine braking but if the driver has been preserving the braking for an emergency, with timely braking the vehicle can usually be bought to a stop.

But TIT, "it was the brakes" - simple facesaving excuse that covers the majority of cases.

people who think they have a single factor answer for this are not only deluding themselves but also displaying a huge ignorance of road safety science.

And people who disregard poor / unskilled driving techniques and wish to blame what ever factor suits their particular train of thought are also extremely ignorant of the fact regarding what is one of the major cause of accidents or in your thinking "incidents" - fault of one or more drivers.

I will concede that even under ideal road conditions highly skilled drivers have "incidents" sometimes their fault sometimes the fault of others. However in most advanced countries usually a full and detailed investigation is undertaken to establish the cause unlike Thailand which normally accepts the premise of mai bpen rai - clean up the mess and get back whatever you were doing as it's not our problem - it was the brakes, the curve, the hill etc.