Chao Phraya murder case highlights potential link between crime and visa overstays

[falang khinok]

Are hotels required to report any overstayers to immigration? I usually book a hotel under my wife's name and never show my passport to them. I'm not on overstay btw....just askin'.

I think they just copy the passport and later bring these copys to immigration...so another few days when immigration find out there is an overstayer on the loose when one of these officers make it to the hotel the guy already left five weeks ago....

[petedk]

Xenophobia rears its ugly head again. All we see in the media is negative news about foreigners living in Thailand. I strongly believe that some day in the future all but the elite foreigners, ones that are either doctors or experts in their field will be allowed to work here. The men in uniform dispise foreigners it seems to me. If they had their way we would be back in Kanchanaburi building bridges and railways in a prisoner of war camp.

A few years ago I would have replied... What utter rubbish!, but now I am inclined to agree with you.

[petedk]

Are hotels required to report any overstayers to immigration? I usually book a hotel under my wife's name and never show my passport to them. I'm not on overstay btw....just askin'.

I think they just copy the passport and later bring these copys to immigration...so another few days when immigration find out there is an overstayer on the loose when one of these officers make it to the hotel the guy already left five weeks ago....

I am not even sure they copy the visa. I think they are only interested in the page with your passport number and personal details.

I doubt very much if anyone at immigration even bothers to check them all.

[KunMatt]

Up ro 3 pages already here of mostly tapdancing, rationalising, excuse making, deflecting, and even accusations of victimization and persecution of those poor, naughty-but-well-meaning-farangs who do a little harmless extra time here.

All visas have an expiry date clearly marked, and only a mentally handicapped person could fail to realize this is important and means something and ignore it....mentally handicapped OR CRIMINALS, and say, doesn't the very act of itself qualify you for one of those two designations?

IT'S ILLEGAL ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD, FOR CHRISSAKE SAKE

It is, however I think the reason so many people are commenting about this is because Thailand is a highly corrupted country with so many more serious crimes which go ignored, so it all seems so hypocritical and arrogant to try and care about somebody else's visa status. Drinking and driving for example which is much, much more dangerous and detrimental to the country and its residents and is a big reason that Thailand has the highest road fatalities in the world but nobody seems to care or do anything about it (until they lose a loved one), so for everyone to be on their high horse about other visitors not walking out of an invisible border and then walking straight back in again by a certain date in reality is completely ridiculous and is the exact sort of jobsworth attitude that most people move to Thailand to get away from.

[simonuk]

In another story , foriegn criminal identified as having travelled to Thailand through a foriegn border.

Clear link established between foreign travel and propensity for crime.

PM orders immediate crackdown on all foriegners entering Thailand through a foreign border.

[Peterphuket]

Next week they are going to investigate the link between overstayers and the fraudulent connections of foreigner's with the Easter Bunny and Father Xmas.....

or the old ladys who are playing bridge, what do you expect in this country? N*ts!!

[simonuk]

This is a beautiful country with many lovely people but it is under the control of utter imbeciles.

I really pity the thais for having to suffer their leaders.

A pathetic , deluded , childish bunch of self interested, greedy criminals . Poor poor Thailand

[luckyman]

I have noticed already, only since the beginning of this year though, that on my business travels through this country even the smallest resorts in the Isarn region are starting to ask for my passport and or work permit during checking in.

And in some places, where a Thai driver's licence used to suffice, they want to see my passport and visa stamp now too...

Don't get me wrong, I do not think that that is a bad thing at all, but I fail to understand if it will help suppress crimes committed by foreigners.

It might help catching foreign criminals who are on the run, but only if the police follows up swiftly and properly (might be a problem) and only if the foreign criminals do not use a false passport, something which is quite easy to obtain in Amazing Thailand.

[Ulic]

Spin it any way you want. Whether the guy was legal or not has nothing to do with him

being a murderous thug. And yes I believe he is guilty.

[cumgranosalum]

It all sounds very much like a false syllogism to me.

Edited February 15, 2016 by cumgranosalum

[springheeled jack]

what is needed is a purge starting with walking street moving on to areas where all the so called goody goodies hang out moving on to people who have just arrived in the entertainment and journalistic industry their employers who are they and how long have they been here .

[cumgranosalum]

what is needed is a purge starting with walking street moving on to areas where all the so called goody goodies hang out moving on to people who have just arrived in the entertainment and journalistic industry their employers who are they and how long have they been here .

Anyone understand this? Perhaps they could elucidate?

[johnhw]

Up ro 3 pages already here of mostly tapdancing, rationalising, excuse making, deflecting, and even accusations of victimization and persecution of those poor, naughty-but-well-meaning-farangs who do a little harmless extra time here.

All visas have an expiry date clearly marked, and only a mentally handicapped person could fail to realize this is important and means something and ignore it....mentally handicapped OR CRIMINALS, and say, doesn't the very act of itself qualify you for one of those two designations?

IT'S ILLEGAL ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD, FOR CHRISSAKE SAKE

It is, however I think the reason so many people are commenting about this is because Thailand is a highly corrupted country with so many more serious crimes which go ignored, so it all seems so hypocritical and arrogant to try and care about somebody else's visa status. Drinking and driving for example which is much, much more dangerous and detrimental to the country and its residents and is a big reason that Thailand has the highest road fatalities in the world but nobody seems to care or do anything about it (until they lose a loved one), so for everyone to be on their high horse about other visitors not walking out of an invisible border and then walking straight back in again by a certain date in reality is completely ridiculous and is the exact sort of jobsworth attitude that most people move to Thailand to get away from.

[johnhw]

This is a beautiful country with many lovely people but it is under the control of utter imbeciles.

I really pity the thais for having to suffer their leaders.

A pathetic , deluded , childish bunch of self interested, greedy criminals . Poor poor Thailand

too bad they don't have geniouses like Trump, Cruz, Palin, etc to help them vote for political maturity, huh

.....your "A pathetic , deluded , childish bunch of self interested, greedy criminals..." sounds to me like a U.S. campaign platform

[KunMatt]

Up ro 3 pages already here of mostly tapdancing, rationalising, excuse making, deflecting, and even accusations of victimization and persecution of those poor, naughty-but-well-meaning-farangs who do a little harmless extra time here.

All visas have an expiry date clearly marked, and only a mentally handicapped person could fail to realize this is important and means something and ignore it....mentally handicapped OR CRIMINALS, and say, doesn't the very act of itself qualify you for one of those two designations?

IT'S ILLEGAL ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD, FOR CHRISSAKE SAKE

It is, however I think the reason so many people are commenting about this is because Thailand is a highly corrupted country with so many more serious crimes which go ignored, so it all seems so hypocritical and arrogant to try and care about somebody else's visa status. Drinking and driving for example which is much, much more dangerous and detrimental to the country and its residents and is a big reason that Thailand has the highest road fatalities in the world but nobody seems to care or do anything about it (until they lose a loved one), so for everyone to be on their high horse about other visitors not walking out of an invisible border and then walking straight back in again by a certain date in reality is completely ridiculous and is the exact sort of jobsworth attitude that most people move to Thailand to get away from.

You know your reply was empty, right?

[little mary sunshine]

I have read several other posts...I still believe these overstays are criminals, should be fined

B50,000 for overstay and banned from entering Thailand for 5-10 years. This should

Illuminate the drunks, no money trash that lie about their income and hopefully have a

Better group of Westerners remaining in Thailand. I am all for the Embassy's checking

For outstanding arrest warrants as the US Embassay does when you renew your financial

letter each year. This should send some of the deadbeats back to their home Countries,

Especially thiose that ran out on their child support and financial obligations. Irresponsible

Deadbeats!!!

[KunMatt]

I have read several other posts...I still believe these overstays are criminals, should be fined

B50,000 for overstay and banned from entering Thailand for 5-10 years. This should

Illuminate the drunks, no money trash that lie about their income and hopefully have a

Better group of Westerners remaining in Thailand. I am all for the Embassy's checking

For outstanding arrest warrants as the US Embassay does when you renew your financial

letter each year. This should send some of the deadbeats back to their home Countries,

Especially thiose that ran out on their child support and financial obligations. Irresponsible

Deadbeats!!!

Who exactly are you ranting at??

I overstayed by accident a few years ago by nearly 2 months, it was an oversight first by the Immigration officer for missing my visa on my landing card and then by me for not checking the stamp he had given to me. I don't consider myself a criminal nor should I had been banned for 10 years from the country where my wife and 2 kids were living.

Have a think about what you are really saying in real terms and you will see that you are being an hysterical old woman about this. You are all for fathers supporting their families but you also want to ban them from Thailand and their families for 10 years if they slip up on their visa status one time.

[Time Traveller]

Complete Bs. Overstaying a visa does not make anyone more likely to commit murder. Seriously the staff writer calls himself "web fact" as if their stupid opinions were scientifically proven truths.

This website forum really has become a laughing stock since it is now essentially the mouthpiece of the military govenrment's propoganda arm

[little mary sunshine]

Of. Course there are exceptions to every rule, that being

Said, a responsible father who wants to support his two children

Should never "slip" and forget to report to Immigration. It is

A privilege and to live in another Country and you are a guest

In the Country. And should have respect for its rules?

[KunMatt]

Of. Course there are exceptions to every rule, that being

Said, a responsible father who wants to support his two children

Should never "slip" and forget to report to Immigration. It is

A privilege and to live in another Country and you are a guest

In the Country. And should have respect for its rules?

I just got you a personal example of how I accidentally overstayed by 2 months. According to you I should be banned from Thailand for 10 years for this technicality.

[Wilsonandson]

I have noticed already, only since the beginning of this year though, that on my business travels through this country even the smallest resorts in the Isarn region are starting to ask for my passport and or work permit during checking in.

And in some places, where a Thai driver's licence used to suffice, they want to see my passport and visa stamp now too...

Don't get me wrong, I do not think that that is a bad thing at all, but I fail to understand if it will help suppress crimes committed by foreigners.

It might help catching foreign criminals who are on the run, but only if the police follows up swiftly and properly (might be a problem) and only if the foreign criminals do not use a false passport, something which is quite easy to obtain in Amazing Thailand.

Your right. Thailand ain't what it used to be.

[swerver]

Just another load of garbage spouted by witless buffoons..and that covers many both on and off ‘tinternet

It is painfully obvious that the Hotels/guest houses, private renters etc INSIDE this messed up place are not doing their guest/ rental agreement notifications as required by Thai Immigration rules.

This guy had ALREADY LEFT thailand …he was in Cambodia for <deleted> sake

In agreement with what you write.

BUT, in addition especial in this case the Thai Gov. checkpoint attendants (whatever they are) are not doing their job either because as information in the public domain shows he past through the Chong Chon border checkpoint in Surin Province obviously with no problem whatsoever.

Then to ad insult to injury, were there is a checkpoint going out of Thailand there is a checkpoint going in to the other country, in this case Cambodia, and he past through that checkpoint also with flying colors.

Then there is the case of him getting in and out of Thailand like a yoyo 200 times in 10-years that averages out at twenty (20) times a year and now 21st century that doesn't even sends up flags when passing through immigration entering the country.

Things over the years sure have changed, when I was working 10-weeks on 3-weeks off on the fourth entry in one-year (last one for the year) Dong Muong at that time being the international point of entry, immigration pulled me over to the side and wanted to know why I was getting in to Thailand so many times (4 in all in 1-year).

After showing them my home Thai Gov. Land Office document and my work contract document they understood and I was let in the country.

And now, guys get in and out twenty times in a year and it doesn't even send up red flags.

And now they have all them computers, the time I was pulled over there were no computers, all checking was done manual​.

Pls. Thai Gov. keep telling the world about all the improvements you're making and going to make. I just sit here and plug it into my personal experience, and it doesn't add up.

LOL in LOS

[eaglesflight]

I have read several other posts...I still believe these overstays are criminals, should be fined

B50,000 for overstay and banned from entering Thailand for 5-10 years. This should

Illuminate the drunks, no money trash that lie about their income and hopefully have a

Better group of Westerners remaining in Thailand. I am all for the Embassy's checking

For outstanding arrest warrants as the US Embassay does when you renew your financial

letter each year. This should send some of the deadbeats back to their home Countries,

Especially thiose that ran out on their child support and financial obligations. Irresponsible

Deadbeats!!!

I think every foreigner who comes here and pays to sleep with a prostitute should be deported. They are breaking the law too, so they must also be disrespecting this wonderful country in which they are guests. Strangely though, Thai Visa posters such as yourself are far more vocal about those who break the law by overstaying their visas than you are about those who break the law by sleeping with hookers. I wonder why that is..........? If we are aiming for a 'better group of Westerners' in Thailand, I'd rather we started by slinging out the pathetic idiots who sleep with, then marry, prostitutes. They are an embarrassment to the rest of us.

Edited February 15, 2016 by eaglesflight

[cumgranosalum]

Complete Bs. Overstaying a visa does not make anyone more likely to commit murder. Seriously the staff writer calls himself "web fact" as if their stupid opinions were scientifically proven truths.

This website forum really has become a laughing stock since it is now essentially the mouthpiece of the military govenrment's propoganda arm

Agreed - I would say the opposite was true.....If I were a career crim, I'd make sure my papers were all in order, who wants their devious plots foiled by some over-observant immigration official?

Edited February 15, 2016 by cumgranosalum

[Maestro]

...

The details reported online include:

- Name

- Date of birth

- Gender

- Nationality

- Passport number

- TM7 number

- Entry date

- Place of entry (airport/checkpoint)

- Visa type (specifically 7/14/30/60/90/365, visitor/business/ED)

- Visa expiry date (automatically calculated from entry date and visa type

Not all of the fields have to be filled in but when the hotel signs up for the online system they do get an e-mail reminding them of the fines for not reporting or for accepting an overstayer.

Are the details for the online report really so much different from from those listed on the paper form TM. 30? Could you please

post a screen shot or PDF file of the online form?

[Maestro]

Is it a function of the hotels etc, to play immigration police and check your visa status, 90 day is up to date, work permit properly issued etc, employment contract duly signed (if applicable), etc. and then report the facts -- don't think so and why should they ??

The hotels, etc just have to copy the information from the passport to the TM.30. Immigration will do the checking for overstay, if they care to do so.

[D3030]

Good point but the hotels report guests' names and passport numbers. The police (or immigration officials??) then check this info in the computer system. They know when you arrived, on what visa you entered the Kingdom and how long your visa is valid for.

The system doesn't give immigration officers info in real time. For a start the hotel has 24 hours to make the report in which time the guest could be long gone. The TM30 paper or online reports that hotels use, I believe, are only recorded in local databases which are not linked to the national system so it would take an IO to check the foreigner reported on the TM30 reports against the national database to confirm if they were on overstay. Given the time and man power required I doubt that happens. The reporting system is meant as a way to track where foreigners are staying and not geared up to catch out overstayers.

The online report that hotels use I believe is a national database (note this is if the hotel is using the online tool and not just dropping a paper TM30 off at the local immigration office).

As you said the hotel has 24 hours (from arrival, it doesn't have to be done every day you stay) to make the report so the guest could have checked out by the time the report is completed. All foreigners must be reported, not just the person whose name the reservation has been made under so you cannot make a booking under your Thai wife's name and not have to give your passport details.

The details reported online include:

- Name

- Date of birth

- Gender

- Nationality

- Passport number

- TM7 number

- Entry date

- Place of entry (airport/checkpoint)

- Visa type (specifically 7/14/30/60/90/365, visitor/business/ED)

- Visa expiry date (automatically calculated from entry date and visa type

Not all of the fields have to be filled in but when the hotel signs up for the online system they do get an e-mail reminding them of the fines for not reporting or for accepting an overstayer.

At the AC Apartments on South Pattaya Road, stayed there last year Aug. TGF used her ID, I was never asked to show any ID. Only asked to show $$..

Yes, it was prior to the 2nd/3rd?? warning of the overstay rule going into effect, but thought they were already suppose to be reporting tourist that checked into their crappy/noisey hotel?

The manager, upon checking out, was told we would not get our deposit back, as the old lady pointed at sign in the back entrance to the building, written in a very light yellow marker: "must give one month warning before checking out"..

I thought telling her upon checking-in, we're staying for one month was all we needed to say. Ended up, the deposit paid for the AirCon/Water, so they got a few baht.

[hawker9000]

I have overstayed a few times worst was 20000 Baht worth but never had the urge to chop someone up and dump body in Chao Phrara river so all over stayers are not murderers.

What a compelling argument for allowing overstayers ....

[Jonmarleesco]

Visa overstays = crime, including murder. That's quite a jump, even by Thai standards of imagination.

[berybert]

To the contrary, i would say the majority of folks on overstay are just plain skint rather than criminals.

one dead man and a killer with an overstay hardly a link makes

Ex friend of mine is on about 5 years overstay now and never seems to have a problem finding odd jobs. Still, I wouldn't wanna be in his shoes.

Certainly not if they are found at the bottom of the river.