best long term visa in Asia

[hermespan]

All are in SEA and South Asia. According to my preliminary reading, experience and discussions with old Asia hands (plus a few guesses), the best deals for sojourners are, in descending order of open door policies...

EXCELLENT: India

VERY GOOD: Cambodia, Malaysia, Philippines

GOOD: Vietnam, Nepal

OK: Thailand, Hong Kong (?)

PROBLEMATIC: Everywhere else (Indonesia included?) except...

PAIN IN THE NECK: North Korea, Pakistan, Bhutan, Bangladesh, Mongolia

Two or three of these might be merely problematic.

Do you agree or disagree, and why?

................................................................................................................................

The subject of this post does not address whether being in country X is worthwhile.

This post concerns the long-stay requirements of someone who...

- does not have any ancestral connection to the country in question

- is from a major western country (UK, Australia etc)

- is not investing, not marrying a local and not studying

- will leave the country every 3-6 months for 3-5 days+

- does not want his eligibility based on age

- not frequently changing Immigration policies

In other words, a long-term tourist who makes country X their home-base from which to travel further, without significant commitment. Low cost, low stress, and unlikely to change for the worse next year.

Clearly there are many factors to consider...

- cost of visa

- days to get

- sponsorship

- age relevant

- medical check ups

- police clearance

- validity of visa (how soon one must use it)

- duration of visa (how long you can stay)

- how often one must leave

- how many times one can repeat process

- how far one has to go away

- for how long must go away

- how much bureaucracy is involved (visits to Immigration office in capital etc)

My comparison is many years in Thailand, Cambodia and Malaysia. However now I have a ten-year multi-entry visa for India as it is the best deal in Asia. The only other country-specific comments I will make are two: 1) regardless of what the policies are of Taiwan and Sri Lanka, as they are islands, visa-runs are not so fast, therefore making them worse choices than they might appear; 2) KLIA2 and Dong Muang, being Air Asia hubs make Malaysia and Thailand very cost-effective for regional travel visa runs.

Edited June 6, 2016 by hermespan

[taxout]

Problem is, this varies with your own nationality: India is great for Canadians and Americans, who can get a ten-tear visa with a 180-day stay, and not bad for some British, who might now be able to get a five-year visa. There may another case or two like these, but generally other nationalities are stuck with the usual short-term visa, and applying for an Indian visa is quite a hassle.

Further, while Hong Kong gives most travellers a 90-day stay on arrival (180 days for British), it hardly qualifies as "low cost."

(And leaving Taiwan is not that difficult or expensive, especially now with direct connections to Mainland China.)

Edited June 6, 2016 by taxout

[hermespan]

Problem is, this varies with your own nationality: India is great for Canadians and Americans, who can get a ten-tear visa with a 180-day stay, and not bad for some British, who might now be able to get a five-year visa. There may another case or two like these, but generally other nationalities are stuck with the usual short-term visa, and applying for an Indian visa is quite a hassle.

(And leaving Taiwan is not that difficult or expensive, especially now with direct connections to Mainland China.)

Well, that was quick! Thanks for your input taxout. So, my guess was wrong, a ferry ride is not slow or expensive from Taiwan to PRC eh? I was influenced by my own prejudices/inexperience. I dislike China for multiple reasons. I even have a 2-year multi entry visa for the place but after dealing with the high price of Canton Fair Guangzhou and language hassles decided that I am unlikely to go back except for business/shopping.

Taxout, I welcome your assessment list for your nationality. I am Canadian. I have been to India many times over the decades. Whether that helped or not, I do not know. It was painless and I got it within the week. I stopped sojourning in Thailand years ago, for many reasons (visa extension hassles mostly and I started to feel I wasn't really welcome, plus cost of living).

Really, everyone please create your own list. It is much more useful than responses to my comments.

[hermespan]

Taxout wrote:

"Further, while Hong Kong gives most travellers a 90-day stay on arrival (180 days for British), it hardly qualifies as "low cost."

The high cost of living in HKG is a related issue of course. But most relevant to the subject of this thread (I already got sidetracked) is the cost of the Hong Kong visa itself expensive? I doubt it. It is probably free. It was for this Canadian anyway. And there is another factor I neglected to list - how much real estate does the visa and entry/exit stamps take? Hong Kong is the only jurisdiction I know of that wastes zero space, instead issuing a paper. Paper clip - no additional cost. Even Cuba stopped doing this for everybody.

[hermespan]

Administrator: Please move to correct sister forum category. Sorry, I meant to post to section on NON-Thai visa discussion

[ubonjoe]

Moved to the visas for other countries forum.

[taxout]

Macau and Israel also use slips. And no cost for entry to Hong Kong. Though that savings is really minimal compared to the very high cost of actually staying in Hong Kong.

As for Taiwan, I was not suggesting the ferry, which is not that easy to reach, but budget airlines: round-trip to HK can be about US$120 all-in on HK Express from Taichung, for example.

Edited June 6, 2016 by taxout

[rijit]

Interesting thread, however the problem as someone has pointed out it has some many variables v difficult to cover

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[JackThompson]

With regard to the 10-year / 180-day Tourist Visa option in India - is there an issue raised with Immigration when doing out/ins every 180 days of the "what are you doing here / must be working illegally" variety?

Also, what are the tax-consequences? In Thailand, as long as you bring in money you made a year+ ago, no tax issues on non-Thai-generated income.

I have always considered Cambodia to be my 'back up plan' if things go sideways with Thai immigration / Tourist Visas before I turn 50, but with the regulations there getting slightly more difficult (vis-a-vis taxes, etc), I am looking into other options.

[taxout]

My impression is that due to the mid-year heat and rain, few foreigners actually retire full-time to India. Most commonly it's a half-year Fall to early Spring stay.

[hermespan]

Interesting thread, however the problem as someone has pointed out it has some many variables v difficult to cover

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

True. However, if everyone, or even a few hundred (few dozen?) experienced globetrotters posted their own wish lists and their own interpretation of their conclusions - soon Thai visa Forum would have a cornucopia of data for all to learn from and act on.

I encourage simple lists as I have done. Otherwise, one has to sort through reams of details. It is a great place to start. Next step, read details. Follows visit and try it out. Follows don't give up your present home base and try it out as a 'resident' for 3 months.

[hermespan]

Macau and Israel also use slips. And no cost for entry to Hong Kong. Though that savings is really minimal compared to the very high cost of actually staying in Hong Kong.

As for Taiwan, I was not suggesting the ferry, which is not that easy to reach, but budget airlines: round-trip to HK can be about US$120 all-in on HK Express from Taichung, for example.

However, land crossings are usually cheaper, depending on where you live of course, e.g. Penang to southern Thailand, Seam Reap to Isarn, etc. Philippines and Indonesia have the same challenge.

[hermespan]

With regard to the 10-year / 180-day Tourist Visa option in India - is there an issue raised with Immigration when doing out/ins every 180 days of the "what are you doing here / must be working illegally" variety?

Also, what are the tax-consequences? In Thailand, as long as you bring in money you made a year+ ago, no tax issues on non-Thai-generated income.

I have always considered Cambodia to be my 'back up plan' if things go sideways with Thai immigration / Tourist Visas before I turn 50, but with the regulations there getting slightly more difficult (vis-a-vis taxes, etc), I am looking into other options.

Taxes, working? The concepts are vaguely familiar to me. Aha, there are normal people on this forum.

To answer your first question, I have not yet tried it. And as we all know, enforcement by Immigration officers is discretionary. They can let you in or not.

I can tell you only what the monopoly India visa agency in Vancouver told me...

Every six months you must leave the country. No going back to country of citizenship. No staying outside India for X days/weeks/months/years. No 'but that doesn't include Sri Lanka and Nepal, you must go somewhere further afield such as Thailand.' Those restrictions are over.

Are there any guarantees? No. I think the most likely change is further liberalization. But let's be frank. If you leave for Pakistan frequently your situation might be different. India visas do ask your religion. Deal with it.

[JackThompson]

With regard to the 10-year / 180-day Tourist Visa option in India - is there an issue raised with Immigration when doing out/ins every 180 days of the "what are you doing here / must be working illegally" variety?

Also, what are the tax-consequences? In Thailand, as long as you bring in money you made a year+ ago, no tax issues on non-Thai-generated income.

I have always considered Cambodia to be my 'back up plan' if things go sideways with Thai immigration / Tourist Visas before I turn 50, but with the regulations there getting slightly more difficult (vis-a-vis taxes, etc), I am looking into other options.

Taxes, working? The concepts are vaguely familiar to me. Aha, there are normal people on this forum.

To answer your first question, I have not yet tried it. And as we all know, enforcement by Immigration officers is discretionary. They can let you in or not.

I can tell you only what the monopoly India visa agency in Vancouver told me...

Every six months you must leave the country. No going back to country of citizenship. No staying outside India for X days/weeks/months/years. No 'but that doesn't include Sri Lanka and Nepal, you must go somewhere further afield such as Thailand.' Those restrictions are over.

Are there any guarantees? No. I think the most likely change is further liberalization. But let's be frank. If you leave for Pakistan frequently your situation might be different. India visas do ask your religion. Deal with it.

Religion won't be an issue. Working is not an issue. But I do have 'income' to consider, thankfully.

When I last looked into it, India had a '180-day max per year' rule, as did Nepal. Back then, my plan was Nepal < 180, India < 180, Sri Lanka the rest. With flights to Thailand so inexpensive, many other options are in play. But without the 180-day limitation, I would not be compelled to "pull up stakes" by a hard and fast rule, which offers a more relaxed life.

As far as the Philippines - you do have to "check in and pay" more often there than India, but I found their Immigration people (and folks in general) to be very friendly. Flights out are inexpensive, if booked in advance, and (last I checked) you could go 14 months between out/in runs. Baguio also provides an option for those wanting to escape the heat, though you must tolerate plenty of rain.

The only downside, and I suspect might also be the case in India, is a lack of middle-class housing. When looking for places to live, I found "bed space" in a dorm was the primary available option for locals, and a decent room with kitchen and private bath had a rent comparable to Spain (the 'foreigner-price', anyway). You could find better deals (usually rooms where wealthier students lived), but they were not nearly as nice as what I have enjoyed in Thailand for the same price. And in many rural areas, "Re$ort" or "Shack" were the only two options.

[hermespan]

Jack Thompson wrote:

"When I last looked into it, India had a '180-day max per year' rule, as did Nepal. Back then, my plan was Nepal < 180, India < 180, Sri Lanka the rest."

Old news. Modi's new policies changed that, at least according to what the visa company told me in February 2016, about three months ago. And what with the weak ruppee (vis-a-vis the USD) I am keen to test out India.

[taxout]

For some reason, decent rooms are much more expensive in the Philippines, at least around Manila, than they are in India. And food is better beyond compare in India.

As to taxes, nationality comes into play again since tax treaties can affect your treatment. And if you're American (or otherwise taxed on your worldwide income by your home country), then paying tax in India, say, may not represent much of a real cost since you can credit the Indian income tax you pay against your American income tax.

[hermespan]

For some reason, decent rooms are much more expensive in the Philippines, at least around Manila, than they are in India. And food is better beyond compare in India.

As to taxes, nationality comes into play again since tax treaties can affect your treatment. And if you're American (or otherwise taxed on your worldwide income by your home country), then paying tax in India, say, may not represent much of a real cost since you can credit the Indian income tax you pay against your American income tax.

Agree with your food comment, at least if one is vegetarian and likes spices, as I do.

Income taxes? I read about that concept somewhere. Have to file to owe...

Actually, my understanding is that renting property in Indian cities is not cheap either. This would explain why most long term tourists stay in guesthouses. My challenge will be finding a place to cook or finding a venue that will cook the food I buy in market, since I get tired of heavy Indian food, cooked in restaurants with questionable oil to boot.

But again, the purpose of this thread is not to discuss pros and cons of each country, but instead to elicit expats' lists of which countries visa policies best suit their needs and why. I mean compared to each other.

So, taxout - what is your wishlist and which Asian countries, based on your experience and reading, best suit you?

But even the above is a tangent. I repeat my question from post #1...

"The subject of this post does not address whether being in country X is worthwhile."

Instead the subject of this thread is which long term stay visa is best (as in cheapest, easiest and least hassle). The merits of the country are a related question which I prefer to not address here. Back on track...

Edited June 6, 2016 by hermespan