Rapists Of British Tourist Escape Death Sentence

[BigSnake]

They kill this poor backpacking girl, now they got life time in jail to be somebody girlfriend. What goes around comes around, I wonder how many time they will be rape in the SLAMMER!! happyboys

[Arosouth]

Similar to the case in Kanchanatburi the police killed the English couple was sentenced to life prison,because the authority said he was a good police

Will they sterilize the two rapists ?

[Loz]

Well said GerrardBruni. Good first post.

I feel sad for the families of all involved and I hope they are able to move on. The reporters "slur" on Thailand does seem inapropriate in the context of this article. seems like someone with an axe to grind.

Its Easy to be the critic.

[nyles]

wow mister or misses Backpack, you seem to be a real bible belt American. I think that the parents of the murdered girl have far more grace than you do. Ghandi already knew that an eye for eye would make the entire world blind! The Ceath sentence is barbaric and therefore only used in barbaric societies.

drugs in itself is a death sentence so why hand out one more?

[LaoPo]

Katherine Horton's mother, Elizabeth, didn't wish the death penalty for the rapists/killers as she believed her daughter wouldn't have wanted that either.

Mrs. Elizabeth Horton has at least her wish respected and can pass away in the future, knowing they're still in jail for the rest of their lives.

LaoPo

[Soph]

The Dalai Lama has an interesting perspective on the death penalty: As long as a person is alive, he may change his attitudes. Therefore, death penalty is not wise. Let him retain the chance to advance in evolution, or spirituality.

No, I do not have a religion, but honor Truth wherever I find it. Buddhism, for me is an attitude, philosophy, way of life, and I remain eclectic.

Also, reincarnation would suggest that we have all been there before, or will be in the future, for it is experience, of every kind, that the soul desires, whether or not this is pleasing for the personality.

There are infant souls, souls that are babies, young souls, mature souls, old souls. etc.

This planet is about learning love and compassion, mastering----- keeping in balance money, power, and sex, with higher energies.

When we judge another, we invite their experience into our lives.

That same-sameness as Buddha-Nature, pure consciousnes, Christ energy, or whatever a culture wants to call it, is the only principle that animates us all, and suggests that we are One Self. Therefore, what energy I send to my seeming neighbor, I send to myself, for I am also part of the Totality.

The above are some of the lessons I am trying to learn, so that I can deal with such issues.

Chok dee to all!

I like this post, and the way of thinking. However, this murder case really shocked and moved me, and I cant help but feel deep down that these guys should be executed - ok, so I dont agree with capital punishment, but I do think that these two scumbags will eventually have an easy ride in whichever prison they are in - if they are as simple as I was lead to believe, I think they will eventually have some kind of ok life in their Thai prison. However, if Katherines parents would prefer this kind of sentence, then so be it.

[Basil B]

Had it been the other way round, two farang, high on drink and drugs, after watching porno DVD’s gone out and raped, then battered to death a nice, law abiding Thai Lady then been caught and sentenced to death would not their respective governments, heads of state, prime ministers, presidents, etc, be calling for their miserable lives to be speared???

I was very impressed on the speed of the victim’s family to say that capital punishment would not have been the wish of the victim; I fell very uneasy at the speed these guys were caught, charged, convicted and sentenced, here in the UK capitol punishment was abolished 50 years ago and many after the sentence was carried out new evidence came to light which made many convictions unsafe.

Remember many of these people have to live with themselves for the rest of their lives, only a few such as Freed West & Harold Shipman escaped this with the ultimate sacrifice; Ian Huntley has made a number of attempts.

BB

[Tammi]

The Dalai Lama has an interesting perspective on the death penalty: As long as a person is alive, he may change his attitudes. Therefore, death penalty is not wise. Let him retain the chance to advance in evolution, or spirituality.

No, I do not have a religion, but honor Truth wherever I find it. Buddhism, for me is an attitude, philosophy, way of life, and I remain eclectic.

Also, reincarnation would suggest that we have all been there before, or will be in the future, for it is experience, of every kind, that the soul desires, whether or not this is pleasing for the personality.

There are infant souls, souls that are babies, young souls, mature souls, old souls. etc.

This planet is about learning love and compassion, mastering----- keeping in balance money, power, and sex, with higher energies.

When we judge another, we invite their experience into our lives. That same-sameness as Buddha-Nature, pure consciousnes, Christ energy, or whatever a culture wants to call it, is the only principle that animates us all, and suggests that we are One Self. Therefore, what energy I send to my seeming neighbor, I send to myself, for I am also part of the Totality.

The above are some of the lessons I am trying to learn, so that I can deal with such issues.

Chok dee to all!

A great first post. Congratulations. Will look forward to more from you.

I am reading "A New Earth" by Eckhart Tolle who writes "The Truth is inseperable from who you are. Yes, you are the Truth. If you look for it elsewhere, you will be deceived every time. The very being that you are is Truth."

[britmaveric]

prob be released after this is long forgotten about!!!

[LaoPo]

prob be released after this is long forgotten about!!!

Is 'Life in prison' (for murder) in Thailand without parole possibility ? I don't know. Somebody ?

"But he said prosecutors could challenge the court's decision and bring the case to the Supreme Court by December 7."

I suppose we have to wait what the prosecutors are up to...

LaoPo

[ColPyat]

prob be released after this is long forgotten about!!!

Is 'Life in prison' (for murder) in Thailand without parole possibility ? I don't know. Somebody ?

"But he said prosecutors could challenge the court's decision and bring the case to the Supreme Court by December 7."

I suppose we have to wait what the prosecutors are up to...

LaoPo

Not as far as i know.

In most European countries it is not possible either. Only a few difficult cases will be, after having served their life term, which depending on country is roughly 15 years, transferred to secure institutions.

[Thaddeus]

prob be released after this is long forgotten about!!!

Is 'Life in prison' (for murder) in Thailand without parole possibility ? I don't know. Somebody ?

"But he said prosecutors could challenge the court's decision and bring the case to the Supreme Court by December 7."

I suppose we have to wait what the prosecutors are up to...

LaoPo

I don't know either. Every news article I read when I still resided in the UK about the life-term in Thailand (usually drug smuggling related) always mentioned a duration of 99 years.... not a clue if that is accurate or just media BS now.

[Cpt_M0ney_Sh0t]

I didn't follow this story right to the end but I was under the impression that they had been executed already.

If it was a Thai woman they had raped they WOULD have beeen!!

Thailand once again enhances it's international reputation!

If it was a Thai woman no one would have heard of her. No big time investigation, and chances are these guys would still be out fishing, drinking, and circle jerking to porn as they were the night this happened!

You know it probably wasn't their first time doing this type of crap either. Probably started off with some Thai women who were too scared to fess up or whom's bodies they never found.

While I agree with Capitol Punishment, me personaly I think suffering for eternity in a Thai Prison is worse.

Edited November 25, 2006 by Cpt_M0ney_Sh0t

[s.pylos]

Although I remember some nations around the world and their mouthpieces speaking out against the death penalty, I am sure that the majority of the populace of these countries would have prefered to see the two die. If they are given life, or 20-30 years, then they may sneak out or be let out. I have more confidence in the death penalty than I do in these guys doing 20 or 30 years. I do not think that 30 years is enough, nor is life in prison. That leaves death.

In Belgium in 1995?, some men were caught having kidnapped, held as sex-slaves, and then murdered several girls aged between 12-15. My numbers are a little off, but you get the general idea. In Belgium, there was no death penalty. While watching CNN, my Belgian friend and I watched many women demonstrating in front ot the house where the girls had been held captive. My friend translated that these women were not asking for life in prisonment.

I do not have a Texan's view on the death penalty, meaning that I do not want to see everyone out there receive it for hard crimes, and in some cases, I think it is just. The laws and penalties for breaking laws of a country should represent the views of the populace of that country. From what I see, the majority of Thai people believe in the death penalty.

Yeah let the "populace" decide !!! ang let's go back to the Dark Age.....

Sorry but there are decisions the populace should not take! Because if it were, women would still not vote and be bound to their husbands will, gay would be sent to jail, abortion would remain a crime, colonialism and salvery would be the norm, justice would be an eye for an eye, and so on... And I really don't want to leave in the US

[sandy]

Edited November 25, 2006 by s.pylos

[mitrapaap]

I hope the Thai prison system can find "special accommodations" for these two lovelies. A place where on a daily basis they endure the same pain and suffering they gave Ms. Horton as they raped her, beat her and then threw her into the ocean to die

who told you she was still alive when they threw her into the ocean?

[terry57]

Rapists of British tourist escape death sentence

While Thailand bills itself as the "Land of Smiles" with sunny beaches, there are regular incidents of foreigners involved in sexual assaults, drug offences and sometimes rape or murder.

-- news.com.au 2006-11-25

Ozzies journos to the fore again!

What crap, and what a slur on Thailand. Most of the foreigners getting into trouble with drugs and stuff are Western and Ozzie dickheads going to Kah Pang Ngan, getting stoned and pissed and behaving as crassly as they do in their own countries. It's not the Thais making them behave so stupidly.

Very safe place Thailand and we don't need third rate news agencies putting this shit out at the start of the high season.

cricky's mate,

why just single out the aussie ######s.?

got to throw in the poms, germans ,swedish ,dutch, yanks, mongolians and every other frigging nationality on this earth that get down there and disrespect thai culture.

i agree with you 125% but the thai's are making so much money out of it they will never stop it.

the police make 60,000 baht under the table for every drug bust.

[LaoPo]

I hope the Thai prison system can find "special accommodations" for these two lovelies. A place where on a daily basis they endure the same pain and suffering they gave Ms. Horton as they raped her, beat her and then threw her into the ocean to die

who told you she was still alive when they threw her into the ocean?

Countless news was written about this sad case.

32 pages in this thread alone:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=55993

Maybe the news didn't get as of yet to the British and Welsh press....?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=k...e+horton+murder

LaoPo

Edited November 25, 2006 by LaoPo

[john b good]

I didn't follow this story right to the end but I was under the impression that they had been executed already.

Me too!

If you listened to the square faced man you would be forgiven for thinking that these guys were dead and incinerated.

Don't believe anything you hear in the realm and only half of what you see.

It has been suggested that it is likely that this was not the first time this pair had offended and I would tend to go along with that (being a distinct possibility)

I do hope that they rot in hel_l.

[Nam Kao]

They'll be out in a couple of years, Anyone seen the Kanchanburi cop behind bars recently?

Iron bars not beer bar

[brahmburgers]

I agree. My crystal ball says the two fishermen and the cop in kanchanaburi will all be back on the streets in a few years. Thais generally have short memories and large capacity to forgive their own. Subjectivity rules, and along with that comes familiarity and then pity for the accused.

They'll be out in a couple of years, Anyone seen the Kanchanburi cop behind bars recently?

Iron bars not beer bar

[aussimike]

Rapists of British tourist escape death sentence

While Thailand bills itself as the "Land of Smiles" with sunny beaches, there are regular incidents of foreigners involved in sexual assaults, drug offences and sometimes rape or murder.

-- news.com.au 2006-11-25

Now Now Steve !!!!!-- who are you to be calling people Ozzie dickheads -Oh how some missinformed people like to label and generalize -- most of the farang who commit crimes here are from the US, UK - i wont say Pommie dickheads - and from Europe - most of the Aussies who manage to get into trouble overseas do it in Bali -- and this was a reasonable comment from an Aust newpaper or perhaps you have not been keeping yourself up to date with the internatinal newspapers and I personally dont think this was a slur on Thais - ya this is an open forum and people can write what they think - but some thoughts are best kept in the head ------ stupid --

Ozzies journos to the fore again!

What crap, and what a slur on Thailand. Most of the foreigners getting into trouble with drugs and stuff are Western and Ozzie dickheads going to Kah Pang Ngan, getting stoned and pissed and behaving as crassly as they do in their own countries. It's not the Thais making them behave so stupidly.

Very safe place Thailand and we don't need third rate news agencies putting this shit out at the start of the high season.

[pumbaa]

I didn't follow this story right to the end but I was under the impression that they had been executed already.

If it was a Thai woman they had raped they WOULD have beeen!!

Thailand once again enhances it's international reputation!

I doubt they would have been executed for it. Rape is very common here. Men get minimal sentences for it, and then are let out after a few years.

I would like to see a lot more Thai men executed in this country (as well as the Irishman in Jomtien for killing his GF) for their heinous crimes, but it does not happen very often.

Does anyone have statistics on the death penalty in this country?

But the lady was also KILLED, not just raped.

Futher more their is evidence that the death penatly does not work as a deterent, just look at america, 11,000 gun killings every year, more people in prison than any other contry in the world... (The land of the free)

The hel_l it's not a deterrent, I have never heard of anyone who was executed coming back to kill again. We are too soft as a nation (USA) we need to clear our death rows in every state, bring back public executions and STOP letting them live on death row at our expense for 20 years.

Wake up America.

[tingtongfarang]

The Dalai Lama has an interesting perspective on the death penalty: As long as a person is alive, he may change his attitudes. Therefore, death penalty is not wise. Let him retain the chance to advance in evolution, or spirituality.

Maybe the true answer to what some consider a lack of justice is to let the direct family flick the switch or whatever it takes to execute a person, then we can only hope their dicisions would be along the same lines as the parents of the daughter raped and murdered in samui, only they have to live with it,

Actualy in the 12 months or so i,ve been living and working in bkk some things made me feel unsafe here, the justice system has no logic most of the time, i,m often supplied from both farangs and thais with scary information and cant decide if its factual or not, ie if you get involved in an accident whilst driving the judge will any way verbaly! anounce that if the farang had,nt been here it would,nt have happened so it must be the farangs fault, the small green busses dont have any insurance,

and to top it all if your a victim in the carnage on the roads here there might not be an ambulance involved in the journey to the hospital but a tuned up pickup, the crew might not have any medical training and often its just a case of you grab the arms i take the legs, if more than one pickup arrives at the scene you might have to witness a blood bath between the two crews to decide which crew grabs your arms and legs, i,m told your wallet.. credit cards and any valubles ..watch..gold ect wont arrive with you at the hospital, at the moment i manage not to let these things occupy my mind while i,m out there on the roads but i,m not sure it would be possible if i actualy witness these things,

I might lose my nerve and change my job,

The hardest experience to swallow till now has been having money physicaly extracted from my wallet for a ficticious traffic offence, so bad that as the policeman stepped out into the main road to stop the trafic in order for me to escape the scene of his crime i had to open the car door and vomit onto the road..maybe i,m a softy...but i also now understand its expected here and the system is designed around corruption..even more strange.. i,m slowly learning to accept it too..the money extraction prosses has since happened to me many times,

we,ve all heard the saying money talks..here it screams

Also, reincarnation would suggest that we have all been there before, or will be in the future, for it is experience, of every kind, that the soul desires, whether or not this is pleasing for the personality.

ahh enlightenment...that explains why there are so many cockroaches here, could it be true they all wore brown uniforms in the previous life?

a lawyer friend just suggested its possible the two guys who raped and murdered could be free in 5 to 6 years,

[sriracha john]

The Murderers:

Bualoy Kothisit, 23, and Wichai Sonkhaoyai, 24, convicted of the rape and murder of tourist Katherine Horton from Britain, arrive to court in Surat Thani province, southern Thailand. The two fishermen have had their death sentences commuted to life imprisonment, their lawyer has said.

AFP

[LaoPo]

I certainly hope Mrs. Elizabeth Horton doesn't see this photo

LaoPo

[ColPyat]

and to top it all if your a victim in the carnage on the roads here there might not be an ambulance involved in the journey to the hospital but a tuned up pickup, the crew might not have any medical training and often its just a case of you grab the arms i take the legs, if more than one pickup arrives at the scene you might have to witness a blood bath between the two crews to decide which crew grabs your arms and legs, i,m told your wallet.. credit cards and any valubles ..watch..gold ect wont arrive with you at the hospital, at the moment i manage not to let these things occupy my mind while i,m out there on the roads but i,m not sure it would be possible if i actualy witness these things,

I might lose my nerve and change my job,

I am sorry, but that is complete nonsense.

I am one of the people who might arrive at your accident scene in a pick up truck, taking you to the hospital. Nops, i don't make a livin by stealing the valuables of the injured, and neither do the vast majority of volonteers. And yes, we do take care that you are transported with the least amount of pain involved, before lifting you we assess the extend of your injuries, we are splinting your fractures, and giving you a collar when we suspect a neck injury. We will bring you to the hospital of your choice if not too far away, in which case we will bring you to the nearest hospital that arranges your transferral.

All free of charge.

And yes, rarely there are conflicts between neighboring rescue groups, unfortunately, but if they happen, they are sorted after the injured is safely in the hospital, and sorted away from the public eye.

Fact is that these voonteers are the only functioning rescue services in Thailand, they do have ambulances as well, which are called for severe cases. The response times are in urban Bangkok so good that they have nothing to be ashamed off compared to far richer and more advanced countries.

Edited November 25, 2006 by ColPyat

[Screws]

"Futher more their is evidence that the death penatly does not work as a deterent, just look at america, 11,000 gun killings every year, more people in prison than any other contry in the world... (The land of the free)"

The death penalty is 100% effective.

[A_Traveller]

Whilst not an instinctive support of the death penalty, I do have this troubling thought that it would appear to more usual for a Thai who kills another Thai {especially a male killing an unrelated female} to be sentenced to death and that in such a case commutation is rare.

Is there a risk of creating a perception that attacking a foreigner is a lesser crime or that such a crime, in part because of the honest feelings of disquiet about the ultimate penalty held by relatives, has a reduced 'hazard' to the criminal?

Thoughts anyone?

By the by in this particular case I always wondered why no action was taken against the remainder of the crew who for several days remained silent whilst {according to interviews subsequently} having misgivings about their colleagues.

Regards

/edit clarity//

Edited November 25, 2006 by A_Traveller

[ColPyat]

Whilst not an instinctive support of the death penalty, I do have this troubling thought that it would appear to more usual for a Thai who kills another Thai {especially a male killing an unrelated female} to be sentenced to death and that in such a case commutation is rare.

It is standard in Thailand to reduce a death sentence to a life sentence, or any sentence in half, if they accused have been cooperative.

In highly publiced cases such as this, generally the courts will be much harsher on the accused than if it would have been a Thai on Thai crime.

[A_Traveller]

Whilst not an instinctive support of the death penalty, I do have this troubling thought that it would appear to more usual for a Thai who kills another Thai {especially a male killing an unrelated female} to be sentenced to death and that in such a case commutation is rare.

It is standard in Thailand to reduce a death sentence to a life sentence, or any sentence in half, if they accused have been cooperative.

In highly publiced cases such as this, generally the courts will be much harsher on the accused than if it would have been a Thai on Thai crime.

As I said, which you did not copy, there is a risk of creating such a perception. It should be noted that there was at the time considerable pressure and publicity. However, as is so often the case, once the spotlight has moved on, then the 'old way of doing things' asserts itself

In this case these individuals confessed during interrogation, they did not offer themselves up so I do not take such a charitable view of their 'cooperation'.

Regards