May ready for tough talks over Brexit

[jpinx]

1 minute ago, SheungWan said:

You have to be on FT Sub Breaking News or maybe Twitter feed to pick this up as only released in last few minutes.

Ah -- ok --  I'll wait for the daily mail to carry the story....  hehe!!  :)

[SheungWan]

2 minutes ago, jpinx said:

Ah -- ok --  I'll wait for the daily mail to carry the story....  hehe!!  :)

Twitter is very good for setting up breaking news story feeds from any number of sources.

[pitrevie]

11 minutes ago, jpinx said:

Link?

https://www.ft.com/content/3137c028-f517-11e6-8758-6876151821a6

 

[pitrevie]

6 minutes ago, jpinx said:

lighten up you guys -- this is a forum and a few verbal brickbats do no harm.  Attracting the mods attention will cause unwanted interruption to the natural flow.  We all know each other by now - there's only about 30 regular contributors and it's a nice argumentative club -- no referees needed.  I hope that grumpy feathered old boy will stop trying to affect the natural pecking order. 

 

Meantime, there's little to report - which is probably why people are getting cantankorus - but it's interesting thet a lot of other events are impinging on the progress of Brexit.  DT's attitude to NATO has really highlighted Germany's lack of commitment, but at the same time the Germans are saying that nobody's going to tell them what to do.  What does that indicate?  The German finance minister mouthing off about EU taking a more central role -- meaning what?  Are we going to see a EU army and navy?  That's one way for Germany to continue to not pay their share......

We all know each other really. I am supposed to be some guy called Andrew with a twitter account that has blocked Khun Han and I write stories about Royal Families. I don't even know myself now.

[jpinx]

5 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

https://www.ft.com/content/3137c028-f517-11e6-8758-6876151821a6

 

Paywall.... 

[pitrevie]

3 minutes ago, jpinx said:

Paywall.... 

Not sure how I was able to display it but this in part is what is said.

 

Peugeot offered Nissan-style Brexit promises to save Vauxhall

The British government has offered the potential new owners of the Vauxhall car plants in the UK assurances similar to those given to Nissan in an effort to save thousands of jobs. The Japanese carmaker was persuaded last year to expand its operations in Sunderland after the government offered it a package of measures designed to shield it from the impact of Brexit. These included support for electric car development and incentives for suppliers to locate to the area. The measures were designed to ensure that trading conditions at the Nissan plant would not change after Britain had left the EU, the company was told.

[jpinx]

9 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

Not sure how I was able to display it but this in part is what is said.

 

Peugeot offered Nissan-style Brexit promises to save Vauxhall

The British government has offered the potential new owners of the Vauxhall car plants in the UK assurances similar to those given to Nissan in an effort to save thousands of jobs. The Japanese carmaker was persuaded last year to expand its operations in Sunderland after the government offered it a package of measures designed to shield it from the impact of Brexit. These included support for electric car development and incentives for suppliers to locate to the area. The measures were designed to ensure that trading conditions at the Nissan plant would not change after Britain had left the EU, the company was told.

 

Thanks ---  Sounds like business as usual for a government making attractive offers to employers.  UK jobless is well down now, isn't it?  It'd be nice to keep it that way.

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, jpinx said:

lighten up you guys -- this is a forum and a few verbal brickbats do no harm.  Attracting the mods attention will cause unwanted interruption to the natural flow.  We all know each other by now - there's only about 30 regular contributors and it's a nice argumentative club -- no referees needed.  I hope that grumpy feathered old boy will stop trying to affect the natural pecking order. 

 

Meantime, there's little to report - which is probably why people are getting cantankorus - but it's interesting thet a lot of other events are impinging on the progress of Brexit.  DT's attitude to NATO has really highlighted Germany's lack of commitment, but at the same time the Germans are saying that nobody's going to tell them what to do.  What does that indicate?  The German finance minister mouthing off about EU taking a more central role -- meaning what?  Are we going to see a EU army and navy?  That's one way for Germany to continue to not pay their share......

There are some fools on here

 

Do they not teach history?

[jpinx]

3 minutes ago, Grouse said:

There are some fools on here

 

Do they not teach history?

Nobody is forcing you to post, and you don't have to run to teacher every time someone disagrees with you.    It's great when you turn up some new fact, but it's not so good when it's cloaked in less than complimentary terms about other posters.   Has your European expedition taken you to the eastern member countries?  Slovakia, Poland, Roumania - all lovely places for a holiday, but the reality of living there is not so rosy. 

[Grouse]

2 minutes ago, jpinx said:

Nobody is forcing you to post, and you don't have to run to teacher every time someone disagrees with you.    It's great when you turn up some new fact, but it's not so good when it's cloaked in less than complimentary terms about other posters.   Has your European expedition taken you to the eastern member countries?  Slovakia, Poland, Roumania - all lovely places for a holiday, but the reality of living there is not so rosy. 

No, I do not know about Eastern Europe.

 

BUT I do know European history generally and I urge caution. That's all.

[jpinx]

The point about history is well made.  Every politician should be made to pass a tough history exam before being allowed to stand     The thing about history is that it is a strong indicator.  Germany's history is of being rebuilt on UK and US money, not spending any substantial amount on defence, and joining all the clubs but not paying their dues.   Schauble's recent outburst is another glimpse of what is actually going on in their heads, and DT's commentary about NATO funding serves to highlight Germany very well.  Now are they waiting for the EU to have it's own army so that Germany can get away without paying more than token membership?

Edited February 18, 2017 by jpinx

[SheungWan]

29 minutes ago, jpinx said:

The point about history is well made.  Every politician should be made to pass a tough history exam before being allowed to stand     The thing about history is that it is a strong indicator.  Germany's history is of being rebuilt on UK and US money, not spending any substantial amount on defence, and joining all the clubs but not paying their dues.   Schauble's recent outburst is another glimpse of what is actually going on in their heads, and DT's commentary about NATO funding serves to highlight Germany very well.  Now are they waiting for the EU to have it's own army so that Germany can get away without paying more than token membership?

Please don't confuse the accretion of vaporings from nonsense websites with any systematic study of history.

[jpinx]

7 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Please don't confuse the accretion of vaporings from nonsense websites with any systematic study of history.

You'll need to be more specific before I can reply.  There are plenty of sources of history and the only variance is when they start to speculate about intentions and opinions.  Historical facts are pretty much irrefutable.

[sandyf]

5 hours ago, pitrevie said:

Not sure how I was able to display it but this in part is what is said.

 

Peugeot offered Nissan-style Brexit promises to save Vauxhall

The British government has offered the potential new owners of the Vauxhall car plants in the UK assurances similar to those given to Nissan in an effort to save thousands of jobs. The Japanese carmaker was persuaded last year to expand its operations in Sunderland after the government offered it a package of measures designed to shield it from the impact of Brexit. These included support for electric car development and incentives for suppliers to locate to the area. The measures were designed to ensure that trading conditions at the Nissan plant would not change after Britain had left the EU, the company was told.

 

And after TM's speech Nissan came back and said they would reconsider the position at a later date.

[sandyf]

5 hours ago, jpinx said:

Thanks ---  Sounds like business as usual for a government making attractive offers to employers.  UK jobless is well down now, isn't it?  It'd be nice to keep it that way.

Not surprising when you look at the size of the brexit department. Its only going to get better as they take on the additional staff for drafting all the new paperwork, customs control etc etc. 

With all the farming, NHS and service industry vacancies that will be available shortly there should also be huge savings to be made on closing Jobcentres.

[Scott]

I strongly suggest you treat others in a civil manner and stay on topic.   One person is now on suspension.  

[jpinx]

Britain will attempt to offset Brexit cost with €150 billion worth of European Union assets

Michel Barnier, the EU's chief Brexit negotiator, is understood to be preparing a list of up to £51bn of liabilities.

An independent think tank in Brussels has already estimated that Britain's assets could be worth almost £130bn.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/16/britain-will-attempt-offset-brexit-cost-150-billion-worth-european/

[jpinx]

10 hours ago, sandyf said:

Not surprising when you look at the size of the brexit department. Its only going to get better as they take on the additional staff for drafting all the new paperwork, customs control etc etc. 

With all the farming, NHS and service industry vacancies that will be available shortly there should also be huge savings to be made on closing Jobcentres.

At least they could streamline that archaic system. 

Something I didn't know was that Estonia went from virtually no health service to a fully functional digital health service since joining the EU, but UK still wallows in the murky victorian administration systems -- as does France, if it makes folks feel a bit better.  :)

It's a good example of what the EU was meant to do, but it is remarkable only because it's the only one.

 

[citybiker]

Britain will attempt to offset Brexit cost with €150 billion worth of European Union assets

Michel Barnier, the EU's chief Brexit negotiator, is understood to be preparing a list of up to £51bn of liabilities.
An independent think tank in Brussels has already estimated that Britain's assets could be worth almost £130bn.
 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/16/britain-will-attempt-offset-brexit-cost-150-billion-worth-european/

Well after 40 years as a member the value assets would certainly have increased, although the Government will only focus on the expendable parts of its portfolio as part of any offsets required.

In the meantime the worm Mandleson has said the Lords are primed for battle due to 2 amendments being demanded, so it's going to be an interesting first test for PMTM.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sandyf]

"Today is a milestone in the history of European border management. From now onwards, the external EU border of one Member State is the external border of all Member States - both legally and operationally. In less than one year we have established a fully-fledged European Border and Coast Guard system, turning into reality the principles of shared responsibility and solidarity among the Member States and the Union. This is exactly the European response that we need for the security and migration challenges of the 21^stcentury."

http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2016/10/06-launch-ebcg-agency/

 

On the surface it would appear that Mr Juncker is contradicting his own policy or is it an indication that the hard border could be elsewhere.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/jean-claude-juncker-northern-ireland-republic-post-brexit-hard-border-eu-european-commission-a7595881.html

[SheungWan]

Forum hard brexit team celebrate UKIP triumph in Stoke by-election. Onwards and upwards.

 

[jpinx]

14 minutes ago, sandyf said:

"Today is a milestone in the history of European border management. From now onwards, the external EU border of one Member State is the external border of all Member States - both legally and operationally. In less than one year we have established a fully-fledged European Border and Coast Guard system, turning into reality the principles of shared responsibility and solidarity among the Member States and the Union. This is exactly the European response that we need for the security and migration challenges of the 21^stcentury."

http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2016/10/06-launch-ebcg-agency/

 

On the surface it would appear that Mr Juncker is contradicting his own policy or is it an indication that the hard border could be elsewhere.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/jean-claude-juncker-northern-ireland-republic-post-brexit-hard-border-eu-european-commission-a7595881.html

It's safe to say that he is not worth listening to, now that he is retiring soon.  The thing that is interesting is to see who will replace him (and Schultz) in the middle of the Brexit negotiations.....   Will the new-boys have the same agenda, or will EU change direction on some of these issues?

[jpinx]

14 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Forum hard brexit team celebrate UKIP triumph in Stoke by-election. Onwards and upwards.

 

 

[pitrevie]

13 minutes ago, jpinx said:

 

Well that's the fourth time he has failed to get into the UK Parliament, I bet he is after Farage's record of 7. Now that their European gravy train is coming to a halt they are desperate to keep their snouts in the trough.

[Richard W]

3 hours ago, sandyf said:

"Today is a milestone in the history of European border management. From now onwards, the external EU border of one Member State is the external border of all Member States - both legally and operationally. In less than one year we have established a fully-fledged European Border and Coast Guard system, turning into reality the principles of shared responsibility and solidarity among the Member States and the Union. This is exactly the European response that we need for the security and migration challenges of the 21^stcentury."

http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2016/10/06-launch-ebcg-agency/

 

On the surface it would appear that Mr Juncker is contradicting his own policy or is it an indication that the hard border could be elsewhere.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/jean-claude-juncker-northern-ireland-republic-post-brexit-hard-border-eu-european-commission-a7595881.html

It would appear not to apply to Denmark or the British Isles.  In fact, I'm not sure that it has any application outside of Schengen.

[nontabury]

3 hours ago, pitrevie said:

Well that's the fourth time he has failed to get into the UK Parliament, I bet he is after Farage's record of 7. Now that their European gravy train is coming to a halt they are desperate to keep their snouts in the trough.

 Coming from a diehard Labour area,I' m not at all surprised at this result,even though Stoke recorded one of the highest votes for Briexit 70%.                                 As they say in these areas, you can put a red rosette on a Donkey and they'd still vote Labour in a domestic vote.

 What would be interesting,would the Scottish electorate who voted 62% to remain in the EU, transfer their votes to the SNP in the event of a 2nd seperation referendum, or would they realise that they are better of in the UK.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 24, 2017 by nontabury

[pitrevie]

1 minute ago, nontabury said:

 Coming from a diehard Labour area,I' m not at all surprised at this result,even though Stoke recorded one of the highest votes for Briexit 70%.                                 As they say in these areas, you can put a red rosette on a Donkey and they'd still vote Labour in a domestic vote.

 What would be interesting,would the Scottish electorate who voted 62% to remain in the EU, transfer their votes to the SNP in the event of a 2nd seperation referendum, or would they realise that they are better of in the UK.

 

 

 

 I have never understood that sort of remark as if it only applies to die hard Labour areas. I am sure there are plenty of Tory areas where if you stuck a blue rosette on a donkey the locals would still vote for it.

[SheungWan]

53 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

 I have never understood that sort of remark as if it only applies to die hard Labour areas. I am sure there are plenty of Tory areas where if you stuck a blue rosette on a donkey the locals would still vote for it.

The rosette on a donkey theory broke down in Copeland. First time ruling party wins any by-election in 35 years. The last Tory to win the area covered by Copeland was born in 1879.

Stoke on Trent: The Incredible Flying Brick, Official Monster Raving Loony Party, 127

[sandyf]

6 hours ago, jpinx said:

It's safe to say that he is not worth listening to, now that he is retiring soon.  The thing that is interesting is to see who will replace him (and Schultz) in the middle of the Brexit negotiations.....   Will the new-boys have the same agenda, or will EU change direction on some of these issues?

Are we to take it then that Juncker leaving will be the solution to the border problem. In the real world he is still around.

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, Richard W said:

It would appear not to apply to Denmark or the British Isles.  In fact, I'm not sure that it has any application outside of Schengen.

I take it you are referring to the new border control arrangements in which case Denmark would be included. The point in question is once the UK has left the EU where would the EU external border lie, on the Schengen border or the actual border with the EU between the Republic and NI.

As Ireland is not in the Schengen area if the Schengen border was considered the EU external border then Ireland could remain in the Common Travel Area.

He may well be hinting at one solution but I cannot see that going down well with the Irish government, the real objective may be to stimulate further debate on reunification.