Nationwide UK: received form from them

[chiang mai]

11 hours ago, Expattaff1308 said:

I tried to sign up to Worldfirst.co.uk and got the following message:-

 

 

7 hours ago, misterphil said:

Use transferwise.com to transfer money from the UK to Thailand and the rate is 1%

 

 

 

None of the companies mentioned are able to perform transfers from THB to another currency, outside of the country, that would amount to exporting THB which is controlled by the BOT.

[Savilesghost]

19 hours ago, Bogbrush said:

I got the same type of letter and form from Barclays IOM and I think it's more serious than some guys think; for example, there're asking for your residential address in whichever country you're residing in (the assumption seems to be you're not in the U.K.) and also are basically saying they will pass your bank account status to the country of residence as a matter of course - that's how I read it.

 

The self-assessment form also asks for your current TIN (tax identification number) or a reason why you don't have one.... this has the propensity to open up a whole world of hurt.

The IOM and Jersey are already passing British pp holders/residents account details over to the UK authorities, the UK has agreements with around 60 odd countries which will be going into effect over the next few years, but Thailand isnt a signatory, but the likes of Singapore and HK are 

[SunsetT]

18 hours ago, Expattaff1308 said:

I tried to sign up to Worldfirst.co.uk and got the following message:-

 

Thats a shame. I didnt know that. I have a UK address but a friend who lives in Thailand signed up with them. He must have a UK address to use.

 

[Expattaff1308]

7 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

 

None of the companies mentioned are able to perform transfers from THB to another currency, outside of the country, that would amount to exporting THB which is controlled by the BOT.

Its not for exporting baht but to bring in my pension from the UK, at the moment I use Xendpay but a post said Worldfirst transferred for free.

[Expattaff1308]

30 minutes ago, SunsetT said:

Thats a shame. I didnt know that. I have a UK address but a friend who lives in Thailand signed up with them. He must have a UK address to use.

 

My Bank (Nationwide) has my Thai address, no longer have a UK address.

[maxcorrigan]

On 12/16/2016 at 11:03 AM, doctormann said:

 

Me too!

Yes i pay tax in the UK on my pension which is paid into my Halifax account, i also got a form from nationwide which i top up from my main account with the Halifax, and presumably since the inland revenue would be aware of this as they know my  NI number and issue a tax code etc. but would not see any such details on my nationwide account, maybe this accounts for the very short form which seems to only verify nationality ie. passport and driving license copies, the Nationwide would know that my country of residence ie. sending my mail here, as do the Halifax!

[Savilesghost]

12 hours ago, al007 said:

 

Valuable information

 

Many people fail to appreciate how tax friendly Thailand is to retirees, I am not an expert but my understanding is pensions in Thailand are Tax free

 

Overseas income is not taxable in Thailand so long as it is not remitted in the years it is earnt, so IOM /Channel Islands accounts are not at risk

 

Savings remitted are not taxed

 

So with a little care one can live in retirement in Thailand and legally pay no tax, even if a very wealthy person

 

I am not wealthy but only pay tax at 2.5% on deduction at source on my QROPS pension from Gibraltar

 

Really very nice, makes up for a few of the minor irritations, like 90 day reports

 

Your understanding is wrong, there is no provision in the thai tax code which states pensions are tax free, after 180 days in country you are resident for tax purposes in in the Kingdom of Thailand, its that simple

 

one suspects the tax man in Thailand currently assumes overseas pensions are taxed at source and cant be bothered chasing people unless they work in Thailand, but this doesnt mean they cant at some point in future, the provisions are already stated in black and white.

 

One may eventually get to point in Thailand that anyone who claims residence in Thailand and has overseas income being remitted to Thailand need to prove to the Thai tax man that monies have been taxed and if they havent you will be taxed at preveiling rates in Thailand, they may eventually require all foreigners staying 180 days or more to submit a tax return 

 

 

  

[wajuc]

14 minutes ago, Savilesghost said:

 

Your understanding is wrong, there is no provision in the thai tax code which states pensions are tax free, after 180 days in country you are resident for tax purposes in in the Kingdom of Thailand, its that simple

 

one suspects the tax man in Thailand currently assumes overseas pensions are taxed at source and cant be bothered chasing people unless they work in Thailand, but this doesnt mean they cant at some point in future, the provisions are already stated in black and white.

 

One may eventually get to point in Thailand that anyone who claims residence in Thailand and has overseas income being remitted to Thailand need to prove to the Thai tax man that monies have been taxed and if they havent you will be taxed at preveiling rates in Thailand, they may eventually require all foreigners staying 180 days or more to submit a tax return

  

On November 26, 1996 William H. Itoh, Ambassador of the United States of America, and Amnuay Virawan, Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs for the Kingdom of Thailand signed a convention for the avoidance of double taxation and the prevention of fiscal evasion with respect to taxes on income (includes SS)

 

http://www.thailawforum.com/articles/taxleeds.html

 

You really should know a bit about what you are talking about before you post.

 

[Jip99]

4 hours ago, Expattaff1308 said:

My Bank (Nationwide) has my Thai address, no longer have a UK address.

 

I fear that may become an issue for you in the long-term.

 

If expats can no longer open accounts in the UK then there is a certain logic in them targeting accounts with overseas addresses.

 

 

Maybe not this year, but one to be aware of for the future.

 

 

There is always the Bangkok Bank, London 'get out of jail' card' to fall back on.

[misterphil]

12 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

 

None of the companies mentioned are able to perform transfers from THB to another currency, outside of the country, that would amount to exporting THB which is controlled by the BOT.

He is withdrawing his cash in the UK from an ATM in Thailand. This is a very expensive way of getting his cash. Using this is only 1% so what your quoted is what you get. 

 

What has the crap you mentioned got to do with what he is doing? 

[misterphil]

4 hours ago, Expattaff1308 said:

Its not for exporting baht but to bring in my pension from the UK, at the moment I use Xendpay but a post said Worldfirst transferred for free.

Yes transfers for free but whats the exchange rate? 

[Savilesghost]

17 minutes ago, wajuc said:

On November 26, 1996 William H. Itoh, Ambassador of the United States of America, and Amnuay Virawan, Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs for the Kingdom of Thailand signed a convention for the avoidance of double taxation and the prevention of fiscal evasion with respect to taxes on income (includes SS)

 

http://www.thailawforum.com/articles/taxleeds.html

 

You really should know a bit about what you are talking about before you post.

 

And what does this prove ?....this is a reciprocal tax agreement..all this means is countries who sign these agreements will not tax the same money twice in two separate jurisdictions

 

Lets take a very simple example even you would understand:

 

1. You draw a pension in the UK and you are taxed at source in the UK, and you are resident for tax purposes in Thailand, under the reciprocal agreement Thailand promises not to tax the same money again when its sent to Thailand...but the money is not tax free, as one had already paid tax in the UK...tax free means pay no tax anywhere, 

 

the fact remains if your resident in Thailand more than 180 days your are still resident for tax in Thailand, just because your resident doesnt mean you WILL pay tax, but you may need to prove tax has been paid

 

2. Take the same example and draw a pension in the UK and remit to Thailand and it hasnt been taxed, the reciprocal agreement doesnt apply and you would be liable for tax in Thailand on those monies..

 

One suspects it actually you who doesnt have a clue, i have no problem debating issues with you, but not going to debate with some rude, uneducated del boy 

 

[wajuc]

1 hour ago, Savilesghost said:

And what does this prove ?....this is a reciprocal tax agreement..all this means is countries who sign these agreements will not tax the same money twice in two separate jurisdictions

 

Lets take a very simple example even you would understand:

 

1. You draw a pension in the UK and you are taxed at source in the UK, and you are resident for tax purposes in Thailand, under the reciprocal agreement Thailand promises not to tax the same money again when its sent to Thailand...but the money is not tax free, as one had already paid tax in the UK...tax free means pay no tax anywhere, 

 

the fact remains if your resident in Thailand more than 180 days your are still resident for tax in Thailand, just because your resident doesnt mean you WILL pay tax, but you may need to prove tax has been paid

 

2. Take the same example and draw a pension in the UK and remit to Thailand and it hasnt been taxed, the reciprocal agreement doesnt apply and you would be liable for tax in Thailand on those monies..

 

One suspects it actually you who doesnt have a clue, i have no problem debating issues with you, but not going to debate with some rude, uneducated del boy 

 

You don't pay Thai tax on pensions because you have already paid it in your home country.  I only know about USA and SS where you pay the money in when you work and your money is paid  back out in a pension.  You don't have to prove that.  Thailand knows.  I thought that's what you were talking about.  Sorry if I missed your point.

[al007]

2 hours ago, Savilesghost said:

And what does this prove ?....this is a reciprocal tax agreement..all this means is countries who sign these agreements will not tax the same money twice in two separate jurisdictions

 

Lets take a very simple example even you would understand:

 

1. You draw a pension in the UK and you are taxed at source in the UK, and you are resident for tax purposes in Thailand, under the reciprocal agreement Thailand promises not to tax the same money again when its sent to Thailand...but the money is not tax free, as one had already paid tax in the UK...tax free means pay no tax anywhere, 

 

the fact remains if your resident in Thailand more than 180 days your are still resident for tax in Thailand, just because your resident doesnt mean you WILL pay tax, but you may need to prove tax has been paid

 

2. Take the same example and draw a pension in the UK and remit to Thailand and it hasnt been taxed, the reciprocal agreement doesnt apply and you would be liable for tax in Thailand on those monies..

 

One suspects it actually you who doesnt have a clue, i have no problem debating issues with you, but not going to debate with some rude, uneducated del boy 

 

 

 

I have no intention of becoming involved in a slanging match on this forum, and make some observations, which I believe to be correct but I could be wrong, and I definitely do not wish to mislead anyone

 

The double taxation  agreement between USA and Thailand is irrelevant to pensions from the UK 

The DTA UK/Thailand makes no specific reference to pensions

 

Any pension paid in the UK will be subject to tax at source, cannot be paid gross, even if being paid to a non resident, when this comes to Thailand I believe even if resident here tax will not be paid   QUOTE  (2. Take the same example and draw a pension in the UK and remit to Thailand and it hasnt been taxed, the reciprocal agreement doesnt apply and you would be liable for tax in Thailand on those monies..I do not believe it is possible to have any pension from the UK paid without deduction of tax, so Savilesghost is maybe writing about something that is not possible)

 

With a UK personal allowance of around £10,000 PA pensions below this will not incur a  tax liability, although in fact it has been taxed but zero liability

Qrops from Gibraltar suffer tax at 2.5 %

Qrops from Malta, I believe suffer tax at 30% because there is no DTA between Malta and Thailand

 

I am not a tax expert merely a very simple retired Chartered Accountant with probably an above the average knowledge of Taxation and financial matters

 

Savilesghost I see you are a relatively new member maybe you can tell us how you are qualified to be making such strong statements, are you a Tax adviser, Chartered Accountant or Lawyer, it would help us evaluate the quality of your information

 

 

[al007]

12 hours ago, Savilesghost said:

And what does this prove ?....this is a reciprocal tax agreement..all this means is countries who sign these agreements will not tax the same money twice in two separate jurisdictions

 

 

 

SAVILESGHOST 

I believe you may not have correct understanding of most DTA

 

Generally it means you get credit for tax paid in another jurisdiction, so if resident in thailand and tax rate 25%, if something has been taxed elsewhere like at 15% then you would still pay the difference in Thailand ie another 10%

 

Generally it means you still pay tax but get credit for any tax already paid, NOT TAX FREE

[lucky11]

On 12/17/2016 at 6:42 PM, Baerboxer said:

 

It does but the driver here is HMRC and EU. The former are putting off-shore providers under pressure to make sure they check more and more about their clients - proof of ID; proof of address; proof of source of assets held with them and income; and now this. They want to transfer the onus of checking to the account provider as they don't have the staff themselves. 

 

Therefore, even though they know your current address, and you may have been out of the UK for years of which they've been aware; they are asking that you fill this in. If not, they will assume you are still resident for tax purposes in the UK (which you may be under the new points scheme depending on your personal circumstances) and automatically provide HMRC with your account details and interest each year.

 

This is about them covering their <deleted> should HMRC ask. The old "look we've got a signed form and a TIN for country x" defense. 

 

 I haven't received one - I guess they are not concerned about my status.

 

[lucky11]

13 hours ago, misterphil said:

He is withdrawing his cash in the UK from an ATM in Thailand. This is a very expensive way of getting his cash. Using this is only 1% so what your quoted is what you get. 

 

What has the crap you mentioned got to do with what he is doing? 

 

 I was planning to send 20,000 GBP to Thailand with this lot and couldn't because the solicitor didn't have an account with them so couldn't do the transaction through them. I tried, unsuccessfully to persuade her to open an account for this purpose but to no avail. I looked at what I would have received if they had been able to do the transaction using them on the day the transfer was to be made and noted it down. I waited with trepidation at how much I was going to lose through going through a bank and when I got a message from my Thai bank detailing how much I received it was nearly 10,000 Baht MORE than Transfer wise would have given me. Scamsters!!!