Teaching Troubles

[bangkokrick]

Any suggestions that will help my friend to legally stay in Thailand. To my knowledge he has been teaching for around 2 years in Bangkok and all was well until i received this mail from him yesterday.

I have a recent problem in that the Ministry of Education, after accepting my Teacher License application last week, decided to recind their decision yesterday. That means Work Permit bye bye too. In addition, they strongly suggested NOT to reapply as a teacher in Bangkok - again. The reason for the swift decision change is a mystery to everyone. Which leaves me in the position of needing to find new employment on my existing Non B - Employment Permitted Visa - before the end of Jan 07.

Anyone had a similar experience?

[lopburi3]

I try very hard not to be too judgmental but how exactly does "accepting my Teacher License application" become "recind their decision"? Accepting an application for something does not normally amount to approval.

Did they issue him a teachers license and then take it back? Or did his application for a teachers license fail?

In any case the teaching forum is probably your best source of information so will move there.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

I try very hard not to be too judgmental but how exactly does "accepting my Teacher License application" become "recind their decision"? Accepting an application for something does not normally amount to approval.

Did they issue him a teachers license and then take it back? Or did his application for a teachers license fail?

In any case the teaching forum is probably your best source of information so will move there.

Crook references ... crook degree ?

[Ijustwannateach]

The problem is a real one, affecting many of the more legitimate teachers in Bangkok. A number of teachers I know have received their Thai government teacher's licenses (straight from the Ministry of Education) but now are at risk of losing them because they were granted after June 2003. Silly? Yes, but the threat is real.

While I hear about different individual situations (and everyone's situation is different because this is Thailand, where regulations depend on the individuals enforcing them and not the rules), there seems to be some momentum building towards allowing those who already have their Thai teacher's licenses (even post June 2003) to be "grandfathered" into the new system, as if they are not we will have the "empty classroom" problem that could have easily been predicted by anyone with an awareness of the situation and an IQ of 80.

The best advice I can give to those who still have their jobs is to hold onto them as long as possible and not panic, as if you survive long enough you will probably be kept under the new-new regulations. If you've already lost your job & teacher's license, things are not so happy for you, as I think to save face they will be extra-stern in vetting NEW teachers for awhile (until the same kind of empty-classroom problem forces another retreat).

Good luck.

"Steven"

[PeaceBlondie]

Without details, I do not understand why none of the parties directly involved, can explain the problem. Is the school itself on the bad list of the MOE now? As Dr. PatPong asks, does the teacher have a degree, transcript, or reference which looks dodgy and cannot be verified? Does the employing school really want to keep this teacher?

If they are applying the new rules, Scots and many Europeans cannot produce "transcripts" which never existed for real degree holders. If they are looking for real, authentic, genuine proof that the teacher is licensed in his home country or adopted country, they (the officials) probably don't know how to verify it, anyway.

But to be told he's blackballed from getting a license in Bangkok is weird. It seems to suggest that other offices aren't as strict. Or, the other offices actually know how to verify documents. Or....who knows?

[bangkokrick]

I try very hard not to be too judgmental but how exactly does "accepting my Teacher License application" become "recind their decision"? Accepting an application for something does not normally amount to approval.

Did they issue him a teachers license and then take it back? Or did his application for a teachers license fail?

In any case the teaching forum is probably your best source of information so will move there.

Sorry Lop i posted in the wrong forum and thanks for moving it to the correct one. I will try to get more information on this subject.

[PeaceBlondie]

No problem, bankgkokrick; your topic is both about visas/paperwork and about teaching. I almost asked if you wanted it moved.

[Scott]

This sounds very weird. Please keep us posted. I am wondering if the degree was suspect or found to be a fake or if someone decided they didn't like this guy and tried to get rid of him.

[Loaded]

Part of the 'new' requirements require teachers to be able to draw brightly coloured flowers around all documents. Maybe he hadn't drawn anything on his degree certificate. It's also possible that he hadn't written 'I love you teacher' with a big heart next to it as stipulated by Thai teaching regulation 5.6:78

[Casanundra]

I was talking to a friend last night who told me he had just paid his 500 baht and sat the new teachers exam and to say the questions where easy was an understatment. Here are a few examples that he gave me:

Q1. What are the ingredients of Phad Thai Goong?

Q2. What colour do Thai people wear to show their love for the King?

Q3. Would you discipline a Thai student by touching his head?

Q4. What do people do on Songkran?

Q5. Is it acceptable to shout at a Thai student?

In addition to that, the questions had multiple choice answers that even a donkey could have pinned an answer to so for someone not to get their teachers licence and so forth has to be very questionable indeed and I would suggest that the OP hasn't totally been up front with us. The test I am told didn't even have a question about the English language on it either.

As my friend says "As long as you pay the 500 baht, you will pass."

Sums it all up really.

Edited December 12, 2006 by Casanundra

[Moonhunteruk]

Well i have paid my 500 baht also and i am still waiting for someone to tell me when the exam will be and where, i am teaching down in Trang in the south so im not sure if it will take longer for the papers to filter down here.

I was advised by our head that the exam will contain English grammar, language, thai culture and so on.

So i suppose its just wait and see time.

Mike

I have heard so many different things, but im sure its a non failure exam

[Munted]

I've not had this problem, but I'm working through an agency. Are you? I don't have a degree, but I've been unaffected by many of the goings-on I've read about. I teach at a govt school in SE Bangkok.

Maybe going through an agency, the school accepts their word that everything is OK. Just don't mention the truth, and do an acceptable job. Chancy - yes, but so far so good.

[bangkokrick]

I try very hard not to be too judgmental but how exactly does "accepting my Teacher License application" become "recind their decision"? Accepting an application for something does not normally amount to approval.

Did they issue him a teachers license and then take it back? Or did his application for a teachers license fail?

In any case the teaching forum is probably your best source of information so will move there.

My friend had a legitimate degree and also a teaching certificate which he obtained in Bangkok. The MOE approved his application and asked him to return later to collect his licence. When he returned he was not issued with the licence and was told not to apply again in Bangkok for at least a year.

The reason that they took this decision is a mystery to him and others teaching at the same school, as he is a dedicated teacher who thoroughly enjoys his work. His present qualifications allowed him to teach in Bangkok for two years, so why the about turn?

He is absloutely gutted because without work he cannot stay here and support his long term girlfriend.

[Moonhunteruk]

I've not had this problem, but I'm working through an agency. Are you? I don't have a degree, but I've been unaffected by many of the goings-on I've read about. I teach at a govt school in SE Bangkok.

Maybe going through an agency, the school accepts their word that everything is OK. Just don't mention the truth, and do an acceptable job. Chancy - yes, but so far so good.

I am also working in a government school, Mathayom Watkhuanwises School Trang, as i have heard every Farrang English teacher will have to take this test, why they had a cut off date at the 28th November i dont know, maybe this new licence is a time saving device, where as when you have got it you dont have to bother with all the usual crap when renewing your teacher licence. But to be honest i dont really know, i know of new teachers in Phuket that have started new schools after October 2006 and this exam has never been mentioned Private and government schools. So your guess is as good as mine,

Lets wait and see.

I bet i will be told the exam is tomorrow, i normally find things out under 24 hours before they happen but that is one of the joys of living here in the los.

Happy teaching all, christmas is next week, dried out chicken from Tesco loads of beer and regency, my school is closed from 23rd to 3rd of NEW YEAR

HAPPY CHRISTMAS AND A HAPPY NEW YEAR ALL

Mike

Edited December 18, 2006 by Moonhunteruk

[paulmw]

I've not had this problem, but I'm working through an agency. Are you? I don't have a degree, but I've been unaffected by many of the goings-on I've read about. I teach at a govt school in SE Bangkok.

Maybe going through an agency, the school accepts their word that everything is OK. Just don't mention the truth, and do an acceptable job. Chancy - yes, but so far so good.

I am also working in a government school, Mathayom Watkhuanwises School Trang, as i have heard every Farrang English teacher will have to take this test, why they had a cut off date at the 28th November i dont know, maybe this new licence is a time saving device, where as when you have got it you dont have to bother with all the usual crap when renewing your teacher licence. But to be honest i dont really know, i know of new teachers in Phuket that have started new schools after October 2006 and this exam has never been mentioned Private and government schools. So your guess is as good as mine,

Lets wait and see.

I bet i will be told the exam is tomorrow, i normally find things out under 24 hours before they happen but that is one of the joys of living here in the los.

Happy teaching all, christmas is next week, dried out chicken from Tesco loads of beer and regency, my school is closed from 23rd to 3rd of NEW YEAR

HAPPY CHRISTMAS AND A HAPPY NEW YEAR ALL

Mike

Just to follow on from this thread.

Monday i'm on my way to get a tourist visa until some joker in the MOE can get their act together.

Run in to big problems trying to get an extension to my B visa.

Old system usual doc's from school etc of over the boarder get you B visa come back apply for w/permit simple if a delay no problem get labour dept to give u a cert saying all was in process.

What have come up against due to new laws from MOE, got B visa Penang OK no problems.

went to labour dept to apply for w/permit.

Reply from Labour dept No U can't you need a teachers licence now to apply for the w/permit ( OK no problem with that)

Also only the school can apply?

OK hand all this over to the school (Great)

Now comes out after 85 days, seems some one sat on the paper work getting a message from MoE (Ministry of Education)

I don't have enough time on my visa to get a teachers Licence(OK no problem) just give me a letter so I can extend my Visa at BKK Suan Plu.

MOE don't want to know about this.

So now seems i have to go back on a tourist visa ( my thoughts).

Because without the extension, It seems to get a new B visa u need the labour dept to give u a note of confirmation to say that u have applied for a w/Permit.

But u need the MoE to give u a teachers licence to get this confirmation cert.

SOOOOOOOOOO.

It seems now to get a B visa or extension u need to have a teachers licence to even apply for extension of your visa or to get another B visa.

As its been over 2 months in with the MoE & still no teachers licence what do u do????

To extend the original visa or get a new one if MoE aren't playing ball

Just can't get my head around this one.