What is wrong with the pool water analyzes? ( pictures)

[zappalot]

Our buildings pool went green three weeks ago. The current management doesn' t know anything about how to maintain a swimming pool in the right way.

 

So I bought the right chemicals including an analyzing kit (  just for pH and CL).

 

For shocking the pool they used ( don' t laugh) the chemical they had left and that was a pH decreaser. So the pH level of the board was very low, naturally :-)

 

There also has been no chlorine at all in the pool.

 

so it looked like the first pic:

 

after adding chlorine and ph+ it looked like the second picture

 

and after adding even more pH+ it looked like the third picture, but more chlorine was not added:

 

and now I am confused since the pH value increased for sure but that is not reflecting in the color. The fluid in the chlorine tube is turning more to a dark red color. And the color in the pH tube is getting brighter.

 

Now I think that probably the chemicals are filled in the wrong container. For sure there is something odd. I actually triple checked to make sure I put the chemical from the into the correct tube.

 

What did I do wrong?

 

Edited January 16, 2017 by zappalot

[SantiSuk]

Pic 1 looks like next to nil chlorine in the left CL tube (as you suggest). The colour of the right side tube looks like a chlorine drops were used again - that yellow colour is not a colour I have seen when using the pH bottle. Its not shaken up so cannot hazard a guess what reading it is giving even if it represents a second use of the chlorine dropper.

 

Pic 2 looks like strong chlorine in the CL tube - 3.0 or 3.0+. Difficult to read how much chlorine once you get above 3 with these rather crude tube tests. Again, the yellowness in the pH tube does not look like a pH read at all. The pH test liquid has never produced a yellow for me - it goes from an orangey red at 6.8, gradually losing the orangeiness into a light pink red and then to a darker pinky red as shown on the tube.

 

Pic 3 looks like 1.0 to 2.0 chlorine in the pH tube and defo a 6.8 or lower ph read in the CL tube. ie you got the liquids dropped in the wrong way round.

 

That doesn't help you very much if you are convinced you have used the correct drops in the correct tube. Perhaps someone can explain the yellow result using pH drops - maybe some reading consequent upon using chemicals to clean the greening? Don't know myself as I have been lucky enough never to have had to use such chemicals. In the early days of pool ownership I had a bit of greening but double dosing with chlorine (up to shock levels but using normal stablised chlorine) got rid of the green tinge

 

Cheap drops are fairly inexact - I only use them as a rough guide in between bi-weekly readings with a more sophisticated (digital colour match) test instrument and colour comparator tabs. Costs about 6,000 baht though for one of those types of kit and repeat orders of the comparator tabs are quite expensive, which is why I also use the droppers to reduce overall cost.

 

Also note that sometimes the pool takes time to react to corrective chemical dosing (I find). A next day read is not always an accurate reflection of the effectiveness of your dosing. I never read next day, but wait 2 or 3 days before testing. I know you are not testing total alkalinity (probably should) but for info of others who do I find that TA readings continue to climb for say 5 days before stabilising after a heavyish dose of sodium bicarbonate.

 

Cue the ex-pros on here, who may have better explanations

 

Not sure what to suggest other than take a sample to a pool shop to get your bearings and then persevere with the cheap droppers or get a better test kit. IMO the dip sticks are even worse on exactitude than the dropper kits

[sappersrest]

OK you are probably not doing anything wrong at all.

By the look of the colours of the solutions you have extremely high chlorine levels and low pH levels.

Firstly you need to determine the exact levels of chlorine,bearing in mind the lack of sophistication of your test kit so here goes.

 

FOR CHLORINE ONLY

Take a 50ml sample of pool water to this add 50 ml of distilled water (as we are not into life threatening science here bottled water will suffice) mix the two together then cary out your test multiply the answer x 2 that should give you a result.

 

If you still cannot get a reading carry out the following

Take a 20ml sample of pool water to this add 80 ml of distilled water (as we are not into life threatening science here bottled water will suffice) mix the two together then cary out your test multiply the answer x 5 that should give you a result.

 

If you still cannot get a reading carry out the following

Take a 10ml sample of pool water to this add 90 ml of distilled water (as we are not into life threatening science here bottled water will suffice) mix the two together then cary out your test multiply the answer x 10 that should give you a result.

 

If you have been dosing with stabilized chlorine ,one that has cynuric acid in it, then what will happen the stabilizer will in effect reduce the pH so you will have to increase the pH by using soda ash. Depending on the size of the pool you may need large quantities.

 

 

Now like everything in life if it was only so easy.......

 

I should imagine like every largish pool that has been badly looked after your cynuric acid levels could be through the ceiling the only way to test this accurately is to use a tester  

For this test strips will do, carry out the test as instructed  if the reading is high or above 100 cary out the dilution process as  previously described to get an accurate reading.

You should be aiming for 30 -50 ppm

One we get over  50 ppm the effectiveness of the killing power of the chlorine is diminished  over a 100 you are heading for disaster green pool/ milky pool is generally the first sign.

 

The only way to bring the levels of cynuric acid is by dilution

 

 

For those of you that have a lowish pH and your pool is starting to turn green use sodium hypochlorite (LIQUID CHLORINE) to raise the chlorine levels as it will also raise the pH.

 

Once you have added chemicals run the pumps for 24 hours then retest,remembering of course to vac the pol and backwash the filters afterwards.

Check the chemical levels again , run for a further 24 hours and so on, until all is perfect.

If it is all to much call in a pool company.

[zappalot]

thank you very much for all the answers.

 

@sappersrest: makes sense what you say but: there was no chlorine added between picture two and picture three.
There was only added some pH + to raise the pH value. So since the chlorine tube got darker from picture two to picture three I conclude that this value gained a little bit, right? Just how since there was no chlorine added?

 

Anyway I will try what you suggested now...

 

And it can be that the pH value was far too low since the maintenance guy used pH minus chemicals (And nothing else) to shock the pool (don't know how he could has this idea).

Edited January 17, 2017 by zappalot

[SantiSuk]

FYI OP. Distilled water is in the car accessories section of Big C (and probably therefore Tesco). 15 baht for something like 1.5 litres

[Hereinthailand]

You will have to shock it with strong chlorine and filter all the crap out of it. You waited to long and algae/bacteria took over. PH doesnt matter now it wont fix it. 

[sappersrest]

3 hours ago, Hereinthailand said:

You will have to shock it with strong chlorine and filter all the crap out of it. You waited to long and algae/bacteria took over. PH doesnt matter now it wont fix it. 

 

Remember if the pH is low use liquid chlorine ,(sodium hypochlorite) as this will help to raise the pH.

pH does matter to some extent as the effectiveness of chlorine does vary greatly with pH, without going to deeply into the chemistry in great detail,is that the killing power of chlorine in water pH 6 is about 95% as compared with 27% at 7.8.

That is why industry now advocates running at about 7.2 70%.

 

Also you will save money less chemicals.

 

 

[Hereinthailand]

I never mess with the ph back home in my pool in the spring when I open it up, just mega shock it and keep cleaning and back flushing the filter until it starts to clear up then you can start testing and adjusting to get your water clear. When the water is green you are past saving money on chemicals its going to cost you to clear it up.  

[grollies]

Pic1 - no Cl, pH way low

 

Pic2 - high Cl, pH around 6.8

 

Pic3 - high Cl, pH around 7.2

 

Agree with @sappersrest I use this type of kit, looks like you've mixed up the drops on pic2&3 as you've the red and yellow tube caps swapped round. Red cap goes with red-topped bottle (phenol red) for pH, yellow cap goes with yellow-topped bottle (orthotolidine) for Cl.

 

How is it now anyway?

[zappalot]

Actually after I ordered J.D. pools to solve the water problem the situation is more or less back to normal. Anyway I was not really impressed. The J.D. pools team did not even use a test kit of any kind to find out how much chlorine or anything else is in the water. The algae was dead already when they came. So what brought the pool back to normal was a special kind of filter they threw into the swimming pool by themselves to filter out all the dead algae.

 

What happened before I ordered J.D. pools to take care the pool: Even if I explained carefully to our buildings maintenance guy what to do I could not get him to follow the instructions how to solve the problem. For example when we added the Floccalant overnight and I came early in the morning together with my wife to explain to him that we need to vacuum away the debris sunk to the ground during the night and that he has to set the pumping system  in a way that the water and the dirt vacuumed away would go to the sewage water system and not back into the pool he didn' t get it.  He switched on the ordinary circulating system which immediately mixed the debris with the other pool water again. He even told the management later that this "stupid" Farang knows nothing.
That was the point when I gave up.

 

Still I find the pH value way too low. Even if I added several kilos of pH plus chemical already.

 

The attached picture is from yesterday:

 

 

@grolliesYou actually cannot mix up the colors. It' s foolproof. And I checked back with normal tap water. With normal tap water I get at least a pH value of 7.6 or higher. The first two times I actually doubted myself and repeated the test making double sure I put the right liquid into the correct tube.

Edited February 1, 2017 by zappalot

[grollies]

41 minutes ago, zappalot said:

Actually after I ordered J.D. pools to solve the water problem the situation is more or less back to normal. Anyway I was not really impressed. The J.D. pools team did not even use a test kit of any kind to find out how much chlorine or anything else is in the water. The algae was dead already when they came. So what brought the pool back to normal was a special kind of filter they threw into the swimming pool by themselves to filter out all the dead algae.

 

What happened before I ordered J.D. pools to take care the pool: Even if I explained carefully to our buildings maintenance guy what to do I could not get him to follow the instructions how to solve the problem. For example when we added the Floccalant overnight and I came early in the morning together with my wife to explain to him that we need to vacuum away the debris sunk to the ground during the night and that he has to set the pumping system  in a way that the water and the dirt vacuumed away would go to the sewage water system and not back into the pool he didn' t get it.  He switched on the ordinary circulating system which immediately mixed the debris with the other pool water again. He even told the management later that this "stupid" Farang knows nothing.
That was the point when I gave up.

 

Still I find the pH value way too low. Even if I added several kilos of pH plus chemical already.

 

The attached picture is from yesterday:

 

 

@grolliesYou actually cannot mix up the colors. It' s foolproof. And I checked back with normal tap water. With normal tap water I get at least a pH value of 7.6 or higher. The first two times I actually doubted myself and repeated the test making double sure I put the right liquid into the correct tube.

well......you could by putting the red drops in the Chlorine/Bromide tube sample......your pic 2 was a bit confusing as the yellow tube cap was on the pH tube.......and TBH that last pic doesn't look right, the right tube looks like its had the red drops in?

 

Just doing my pool at the moment adding Sodium Hypochlorite, pH gone up (see photo below).

 

 

 

Not criticizing fellah, just trying to help, after all you did ask if you were getting anything wrong with the test kit.

 

Looks like you've sorted it for them though 

 

Buildings maintenance guy has lost much face by his comments.

 

I totally get where you're coming from but you'll never get acknowledgement from Thai that you're right.

 

Nice one anyway and thanks for the reply. Have a good day.

Edited February 1, 2017 by grollies

[grollies]

@zappalot you are dead right. just tried samples with bleach and white vinegar.

 

Your pool has way to much Cl and pH is way low.

 

 

Edited February 1, 2017 by grollies