be careful

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

8 minutes ago, ocddave said:

Bike riders need to think for themselves, make bad choices, you pay for it. Motorcyclist here are Organ Donors waiting for a place to happen, I have never seen such total disdain for safety in my life, they literally drive like their lives don't matter much.....total insanity!

I do thanks, never had an accident in years of riding.

I said already I know how bad Thai drivers of any type of vehicle are. I would just like to know how this accident happened.

[ericthai]

On 2/14/2017 at 3:54 AM, georgemandm said:

Great to read the police say your not at fault , because I hear stories out there that the car is at fault at all times , because the car is bigger.

i have been very lucky not have had a  accident in thailand thank god .

the place is a  nightmare to drive around. 

Like playing  Russian roulette with a car .

hop it all works out for you , but that is why we all have good insurance , let them do it all for you , I would leave it up to them .

If you have to go and do a report just do it and leave.

i have heard that many times too, also that it's always the expats fault.  i had an accident that i know was my fault my breaks locked up and slid right into the back of the truck in front of me.  The police did nothing no ticket just moved us from the road. my insurance rep showed up and took care of everything.  They didnt even ask to see my license. Another time much like the OP I had a motor cycle hit the side of my truck. The motorcycle guy saw me and started wanting money saying who is going to pay for his bike. An off duty cop saw the whole thing and asked if i was ok with just fixing my car myself or did i want to go after the guy that hit me. i told him no problem my insurance will pay for it. So he told the guy to stop looking for money and should leave before the police show up. So the guy that hit me decided to leave.   

[ericthai]

15 hours ago, Bulldozer Dawn said:

You're welcome.  

 

You can give me a few crayfish if I am ever up your way.  

 

Keep in mind that although 50K is not a lot in your scope of things, it is a fortune to those at fault.  They will pulling every string at their disposal to avoid liability (or to shift it on to you). 

 

With respect to you and your wife, do not rely on her during any discussions or negotiations. The Thai men in the room will not listen to her at all.  Firstly, because she is a female, and secondly because she is a farmer. Also it is likely that you wife will not understand a good deal of the terms used during the discussion.

 

PM me if you want additional help.

Dont think that will be 50K,  body work and mechanic work is so cheap in Thailand. Should be no more than 20-25K if that. 

The cost of a new door unpainted is only about 4-6K baht.  If you have 1st class insurance they will take care of everything, they typically have a shop they want you to use.

[jacko45k]

How do you know the bike isn't taxed, it is not obligatory to display it on a motorcycle and could be under the seat.

If indeed there is no tax, there isn't going to be any insurance!

Glad none of your family were injured.

[Chongalulu]

15 hours ago, ocddave said:

Not sure I have even seen and all-around vision camera, maybe on a google vehicle, you mean a 2 channel front/back camera system? If the OP does go that route, I would probably go with the Blackvue DR650S-2CH, wish I had, but tried a different companies dashcam (hard to mount though, and camera is too big, which making mounting even harder).

Just got this brought out from uk. Doubt you'll get anything as good here.

[Foozool]

My girlfriend looks everything around (while she is driving ) but front , where she heads to. ☠☠☠

 

[connda]

12 hours ago, cyberfarang said:

How did this happen? Looks like the pickup pulled out of a side road in front of an oncoming motorcyclist.

Perhaps the motorcyclist ran a stop sign or light and T-boned the pickup.  That's pretty common.  I have a video on my dash cam showing a van and two trucks running a stop sign and crossing the main road at about 50 kpm.  It was a blind intersection.  The van and trucks couldn't see traffic on the main road unless they had stopped at the intersection due to a wall and vegetation blocking the view.  What they did was suicidal.  But that was not the first time I've seen that happen at that intersection. The van almost nailed a motorcyclist.  The first truck would have T-bone my car if I hadn't slowed to almost a stop so I could look around the blind corner.  When I did all I saw was truck grill. 
Second most dangerous roads in the world?  There is a reason for that.

[connda]

8 hours ago, ericthai said:

Dont think that will be 50K,  body work and mechanic work is so cheap in Thailand. Should be no more than 20-25K if that. 

The cost of a new door unpainted is only about 4-6K baht.  If you have 1st class insurance they will take care of everything, they typically have a shop they want you to use.

I had a Blue Songtaw sideswipe my car in a soi in Chiang Mai.  Didn't see the accident that happened at Zero Dark Thirty, but the CM to Lamphun Songtaws have a very distinct blue paint color in a world where most cars and trucks are various shades of white, black, and dull.  I visited the Songtaw stop across for Rim Ping on the CM-Lamphun road the next day and found a Songtaw with front-end damage that perfectly match where my car was hit.  My wife told me not to bother trying to report it. It wouldn't accomplish anything without witnesses. <shrug> 

The body work cost me about 20k THB for a side panel, front quarter panel and a bumper.  As ericthai said, labor is dirt cheap. After that I started parking in a pay-per-month, guarded parking lot.  Sois aren't a good place to park.

Edited February 16, 2017 by connda

[metisdead]

Offensive posts and replies have been removed. 

[Keesters]

On 2/14/2017 at 4:03 PM, kannot said:

The  amount of Thais  I see not looking at the road  for LONGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG periods of time is staggering, sometimes I sit there thinking that it  must have been 10-15 seconds or more since they glanced up, never understand it, never  will.

Last accident I had was with a Farang who did not see me behind him when he suddenly stopped his car and went into reverse. 'Not looking' is not exclusively Thai.

 

[Keesters]

On 2/16/2017 at 1:24 AM, ocddave said:

Bike riders need to think for themselves, make bad choices, you pay for it. Motorcyclist here are Organ Donors waiting for a place to happen, I have never seen such total disdain for safety in my life, they literally drive like their lives don't matter much.....total insanity!

And most cars are driven like motorcyclists don't matter.

[samsensam]

On 15/02/2017 at 5:23 AM, Bulldozer Dawn said:

Jake.

 

1. Make sure you find a male Thai (who you can trust and speaks good English) that can join you at the police station.
2. Do not rely on your wife to handle negotiations as the Thai male police officer will not listen to her.
3. If the police have said you are not at fault, then you should request a written copy of the accident report today.
4. Be mindful that those at fault may know (or be related to) the police officer that handles your initial negotiations.
5. Be mindful that those at fault may pay money to have the accident report falsified.
6. The police may seek to imply that you are partially at fault especially if money has changed hands.
7. With respect, I am not sure of your wife's education level, so do not assume that she has any understanding of this process.
8. Also do not rely upon your wife's translation of any of the content in the police report and any settlement document.
9. Do not sign any settlement document before you have had it translated to you by someone you trust (and that has the education to fully understand any terms contained therein).
10. Do not rely on the information or translations provided to you by the insurance officer that shows up for your meeting.  He may also be subject to payment and if local may also know or be related to those at fault.
11. The police will endeavor to sweep this under the mat in the first meeting.  Ensure that you are 100% clear on the entire content of any document that you are asked to sign.
12. From the point of view of fault for the accident the fact that the motorbike did not have a current tax sticker means nothing.  The police will just demand the payment of 500 baht from the lads for not having a current sticker.  Same applies if they do not have a licence.
13. You should assume that the lads do not have insurance nor the money to pay for the significant repairs required to your vehicle.
14. If the bike is unregistered and uninsured, make sure that the police report clearly states who the owner of the bike is.  This is because to get any money back you will likely have to bring a claim ( "fong saan") the owner at the local court house.  You may be lucky and get a settlement prior this the matter going before the judge, but I would not hold your breath, as the lads (and their families) are not likely to have the coin to pay for your repairs.
15. It will take about 5-6 months for your claim to go before the judge.  In the event you are awarded a judgment in your favour, then the owner of the bike will be ordered to make a monthly payment to you based upon his income.  If he has little or no income then you will (if lucky) receive a drip feed of a few hundred baht per month into the next century.  
16. You should go right now and get a quote (3 quotes would be better) for the repairs to your vehicle. If you do not have that information at hand you will be entering ill prepared into any settlement negotiations.
17. Looks like about a 30k-50K repair?  Keep in mind that that amount (especially if paid as a lump sum) is a fortune in your parts. 
18. Don't get harangued into taking less than the amount you are rightly owed (because you are a rich foreigner and should help out the poor impoverished locals). 

 

PM me if you want.

 

depends on her background; if she is uneducated, low class sure, from experience thai/chinese, professional, educated they will listen

[Keesters]

On 2/16/2017 at 5:52 AM, jacko45k said:

How do you know the bike isn't taxed, it is not obligatory to display it on a motorcycle and could be under the seat.

If indeed there is no tax, there isn't going to be any insurance!

Glad none of your family were injured.

 

I think you'll find display of tax is compulsory. It has been discussed in the past on other threads.

[Namplik]

On 15.2.2017 at 9:35 PM, timendres said:

Just another example of why I will never own or drive a vehicle in Thailand. Bad enough being a passenger. I have the luxury of being in Bangkok, so taxis and motocy are abundant. I realize those in further out places, and with families to transport, have a much more difficult situation and often need to have a vehicle. Good luck to those who must drive...

LOL, why are you on this forum? 

[ocddave]

3 hours ago, Keesters said:

And most cars are driven like motorcyclists don't matter.

So what are you saying, tit for tat? Not sure if you know this, but the motorcyclist will be on the losing end of a collision between a motorcycle and car. But there is no way you are going to convince me that car drivers are worse than motorcyclist. As far as I can tell motorcyclist here either got their licenses out of a Cracker Jacks box, or don't have a license to begin with. They are without a doubt the biggest menace on the roads AND sidewalks, complete disregard for their own safety, or anyone around them. Driving down the centerline, passing using the centerline, driving on the wrong side of the road, driving in opposite direction down the road, no taillights, no blinkers, too many riders, using the sidewalk as a means of travel, blowing thru red lights, driving thru traffic in the wrong way of travel (sideways),  no helmets, and my personal favorite-----> Putting their baby on the gas tank, with only diaper (no helmet) holding onto the handlebars while they drive like idiots thru traffic, I could go on and on and on.....they are a menace on streets and sidewalks, and should be seriously cracked down on.

[ocddave]

3 hours ago, Keesters said:

Last accident I had was with a Farang who did not see me behind him when he suddenly stopped his car and went into reverse. 'Not looking' is not exclusively Thai.

 

Not exclusive, but I am willing to bet statistically Thai's are the worse drivers on the road. I think you would be hard pressed to dispute that...

[Bulldozer Dawn]

3 minutes ago, ocddave said:

Not exclusive, but I am willing to bet statistically Thai's are the worse drivers on the road. I think you would be hard pressed to dispute that...

 

Here is some evidence to support your view:

 

Thai Roads and Driving

 

 

[timendres]

6 hours ago, Namplik said:

 

On 2/15/2017 at 9:35 AM, timendres said:

Just another example of why I will never own or drive a vehicle in Thailand. Bad enough being a passenger. I have the luxury of being in Bangkok, so taxis and motocy are abundant. I realize those in further out places, and with families to transport, have a much more difficult situation and often need to have a vehicle. Good luck to those who must drive...

LOL, why are you on this forum? 

 

Because I am an idiot?

I follow links and never really pay attention to the particular forum that I am under.

My apologies.

[Keesters]

19 hours ago, ocddave said:

Not exclusive, but I am willing to bet statistically Thai's are the worse drivers on the road. I think you would be hard pressed to dispute that...

I would not dispute that generally Thais are not good drivers. There are bad drivers in all nationalities. But thank you for agreeing with me that Thais are not the only ones who don't look.

 

 

 

[Keesters]

19 hours ago, ocddave said:

So what are you saying, tit for tat? Not sure if you know this, but the motorcyclist will be on the losing end of a collision between a motorcycle and car. But there is no way you are going to convince me that car drivers are worse than motorcyclist. As far as I can tell motorcyclist here either got their licenses out of a Cracker Jacks box, or don't have a license to begin with. They are without a doubt the biggest menace on the roads AND sidewalks, complete disregard for their own safety, or anyone around them. Driving down the centerline, passing using the centerline, driving on the wrong side of the road, driving in opposite direction down the road, no taillights, no blinkers, too many riders, using the sidewalk as a means of travel, blowing thru red lights, driving thru traffic in the wrong way of travel (sideways),  no helmets, and my personal favorite-----> Putting their baby on the gas tank, with only diaper (no helmet) holding onto the handlebars while they drive like idiots thru traffic, I could go on and on and on.....they are a menace on streets and sidewalks, and should be seriously cracked down on.

I am saying what I wrote...nothing more...nothing less.

 

And all the offenses you say are committed by motorcyclists are only committed by some NOT all. Many cars also commit same or similar offenses. Everyday as I drive my scooter I have to take emergency measures because some car driving idiot thinks he owns the road. Try riding a motorbike and I guarantee you'll change your perspective.

[ocddave]

2 hours ago, Keesters said:

I would not dispute that generally Thais are not good drivers. There are bad drivers in all nationalities. But thank you for agreeing with me that Thais are not the only ones who don't look.

 

 

 

Not even remotely agreeing with you, your just trying to deflect from the obvious, which is that Thai drivers are the issue, not the .00001% of foreign drivers that you have got in your head drive the same.

[ocddave]

2 hours ago, Keesters said:

I am saying what I wrote...nothing more...nothing less.

 

And all the offenses you say are committed by motorcyclists are only committed by some NOT all. Many cars also commit same or similar offenses. Everyday as I drive my scooter I have to take emergency measures because some car driving idiot thinks he owns the road. Try riding a motorbike and I guarantee you'll change your perspective.

I have come to the conclusion you are totally delusional, from my experience, almost 90 percent of motorcycle drivers fall into my description above, it's mass craziness. I would estimate 90 percent bad motorcycle drivers, and 50 percent cars, the roads of Thailand are filled with bad drivers, and my estimations actually are pretty close to the carnage figures that the government provides, where they already show more accidents by you guessed it motorcycle drivers.

[canthai55]

17 minutes ago, ocddave said:

I have come to the conclusion you are totally delusional, from my experience, almost 90 percent of motorcycle drivers fall into my description above, it's mass craziness. I would estimate 90 percent bad motorcycle drivers, and 50 percent cars, the roads of Thailand are filled with bad drivers, and my estimations actually are pretty close to the carnage figures that the government provides, where they already show more accidents by you guessed it motorcycle drivers.

Nonsense. How long have you lived here ? If 90% are bad drivers, they would have been weeded out years ago, leaving the good 10%. In which case there would not be so many on the roads. Same goes for your total hogwash in regard to car drivers. Ever driven in India ?  You ain't seen nothing yet.

[JaseTheBass]

Jake.
 

1. Make sure you find a male Thai (who you can trust and speaks good English) that can join you at the police station.
2. Do not rely on your wife to handle negotiations as the Thai male police officer will not listen to her.
3. If the police have said you are not at fault, then you should request a written copy of the accident report today.
4. Be mindful that those at fault may know (or be related to) the police officer that handles your initial negotiations.
5. Be mindful that those at fault may pay money to have the accident report falsified.
6. The police may seek to imply that you are partially at fault especially if money has changed hands.
7. With respect, I am not sure of your wife's education level, so do not assume that she has any understanding of this process.
8. Also do not rely upon your wife's translation of any of the content in the police report and any settlement document.
9. Do not sign any settlement document before you have had it translated to you by someone you trust (and that has the education to fully understand any terms contained therein).
10. Do not rely on the information or translations provided to you by the insurance officer that shows up for your meeting.  He may also be subject to payment and if local may also know or be related to those at fault.
11. The police will endeavor to sweep this under the mat in the first meeting.  Ensure that you are 100% clear on the entire content of any document that you are asked to sign.
12. From the point of view of fault for the accident the fact that the motorbike did not have a current tax sticker means nothing.  The police will just demand the payment of 500 baht from the lads for not having a current sticker.  Same applies if they do not have a licence.
13. You should assume that the lads do not have insurance nor the money to pay for the significant repairs required to your vehicle.
14. If the bike is unregistered and uninsured, make sure that the police report clearly states who the owner of the bike is.  This is because to get any money back you will likely have to bring a claim ( "fong saan") the owner at the local court house.  You may be lucky and get a settlement prior this the matter going before the judge, but I would not hold your breath, as the lads (and their families) are not likely to have the coin to pay for your repairs.
15. It will take about 5-6 months for your claim to go before the judge.  In the event you are awarded a judgment in your favour, then the owner of the bike will be ordered to make a monthly payment to you based upon his income.  If he has little or no income then you will (if lucky) receive a drip feed of a few hundred baht per month into the next century.  
16. You should go right now and get a quote (3 quotes would be better) for the repairs to your vehicle. If you do not have that information at hand you will be entering ill prepared into any settlement negotiations.
17. Looks like about a 30k-50K repair?  Keep in mind that that amount (especially if paid as a lump sum) is a fortune in your parts. 
18. Don't get harangued into taking less than the amount you are rightly owed (because you are a rich foreigner and should help out the poor impoverished locals). 

 
PM me if you want.

Utter rot. Get your insurance company to deal with it all.

[Si Thea01]

On ‎14‎/‎02‎/‎2017 at 1:31 PM, pigeonjake said:

you could be right, but ive been told i have to be there,

the police told me im not at fault

 

Be very careful.  Exactly the same ting happened to my wife last year, she was driving through Na Krang when an elderly rider did exactly the same thing and ploughed into her right side after driving out of a side street.  The police attended and told her she was not at fault, however, she told them she would not move the car until her insurance rep attended.  This he did, as did the relatives, and all agreed that the motorcyclist was at fault.  luckily for her that her rep attended as two days later the man, unfortunately passed away from his injuries.

 

On the second attendance, she had a different rep and everything changed, the relatives wanted money, the police told my wife she was at fault and the insurance rep took the side of the deceased.  As the deceased was drunk at the time, was not wearing a helmet, had no licence and his bike unregistered and actually drove into her, she told the police that she was not accepting this, reported all to the insurance company, who sacked the second rep and sent out the initial attendee, after which it all changed again.

 

There were discussions over two more attendances at the police station, where my wife and the rep stood firm, told the other party that the deceased was at fault and also called the doctor who did the autopsy and when it was determined that it was the handle bars into the gut of the deceased that killed him, combined with all the other factors, my wife was exonerated and the deceased's family never received any compensation.  My wife however, as per Thai custom, gave some money toward the funeral and she heard noting further.

 

So, as a warning, if you have insurance, get a rep and if not happy with the result complain to your insurer, who believe me, will be on your side, as they don't want to pay out unless they have to. And never trust the coppers, as in my wife's case, it turned out that the one investigating just happened to be a family friend.  My wife, obviously, is Thai, and told me to keep away as if they knew a Farang was involved, then they would have tried to get money out of me and have made it harder for the rep.

Edited February 18, 2017 by Si Thea01

[ocddave]

24 minutes ago, canthai55 said:

Nonsense. How long have you lived here ? If 90% are bad drivers, they would have been weeded out years ago, leaving the good 10%. In which case there would not be so many on the roads. Same goes for your total hogwash in regard to car drivers. Ever driven in India ?  You ain't seen nothing yet.

Have you driven in Bangkok?!?! There is almost no motorcycle drivers following any rules whatsoever, you would have to be blind to not notice this, or you yourself have never driven here.

[jacko45k]

On 2/17/2017 at 11:03 AM, Keesters said:

 

I think you'll find display of tax is compulsory. It has been discussed in the past on other threads.

You find it, I believe you are wrong and I have never had an issue wrt not displaying it. It isn't even a disc!

Police are happy for me to get it from under the seat and better than having it stolen

Edited February 18, 2017 by jacko45k

[canthai55]

2 hours ago, ocddave said:

Have you driven in Bangkok?!?! There is almost no motorcycle drivers following any rules whatsoever, you would have to be blind to not notice this, or you yourself have never driven here.

Yes I have. And BKK is not Thailand - or not all of it. If you can not adapt - better take a taxi or a bus. Leave the driving to those that can understand the dynamic involved and not make blanket statements condemning all and sundry.

[ocddave]

4 hours ago, canthai55 said:

Yes I have. And BKK is not Thailand - or not all of it. If you can not adapt - better take a taxi or a bus. Leave the driving to those that can understand the dynamic involved and not make blanket statements condemning all and sundry.

I am adapting perfectly, but that doesn't excuse the motorcycle drivers driving like lunatics, or on a equipment that shouldn't even be on the road, or without helmets, or without licenses, or any idea how to even drive a motorcycle for that matter. Before you ask, yes, I am a licensed motorcycle driver, and with actual driver training courses on a motorcycle (US).

[Keesters]

On 2/18/2017 at 0:49 PM, ocddave said:

I have come to the conclusion you are totally delusional, from my experience, almost 90 percent of motorcycle drivers fall into my description above, it's mass craziness. I would estimate 90 percent bad motorcycle drivers, and 50 percent cars, the roads of Thailand are filled with bad drivers, and my estimations actually are pretty close to the carnage figures that the government provides, where they already show more accidents by you guessed it motorcycle drivers.

When it comes to being disillusioned I think it is you who are that. 90% bad motorcycle vs 50% car. I would think the figures are about the same for each type of vehicle and much lower than you estimate. But at least you are now acknowledging there are bad car drivers which is much better than your only bad motorcycle claims previously.

 

Let me leave you with one further thought.

 

Let there only be 2 wheeled vehicles on the road. How many accidents. Very few in my opinion. Motorcyclists cooperate very well with each other knowing the dangers of falling or being pushed off.

 

Remove all 2 wheeled vehicles from the road. How many accidents. Probably the same as now. Cars hit cars all the time with no motorcyclist in sight.

 

Conclusion it is not the motorcycles that cause most of the accidents they just get the worst part of it when involved.