speedtripler Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 15 hours ago, KittenKong said: I believe you mean opaque rather than transparent. Governments object to cryptocurrencies because they are hard to trace. I'm inclined to agree with them. It's hard to imagine that anyone using cryptocurrencies for payments does so for any reason other than to hide something (their identity, tax liability, responsibility etc.). I would rather keep my money in bitcoin than most of the scammy financial products sold by banks thesedays but to each their own.... The current price dipping was already overdue and nobody will lose anything on the 1st August If btc breaks into two chains, current holders will have equal share on both sides of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 22 hours ago, Kabula said: My opinion.... Another bubble and a math asset that an owner can't touch and has no control over. Some allege a set up... Not one competent trends forecaster or financial expert with a 20 year spot on track record recommends them. The large corporations that buy the most controls them all. If sell orders start pouring in for millions creating panic, and no one is buying most sell orders that follow will not be filled until buy order positions are taken. Then there is the competition against Bit Coin. Most people don't realize there are 600+ competing crypto currencies. And a few of the new ones are better and cheaper. It makes sense to sell expensive cryptos now, buy tokens for new ICOs for pennies and make big money. Then there are the war drums beating around the world. Try to sell when the power is taken down or cities go broke. Around the world job losses are accelerating and people are going broke. More and more will be selling crypto currency's to make ends meet while unemployed. I see see them as being very risky now. However, if one can get in an new ICO with money they don't mind losing, the upside in a few months could be rewarding. But, to follow the sheep up the hill now and over the cliff with Bit Coin at the current price is asking for pain. Most of the new icos are scams... Good luck picking the winners out of nearly 1000 digital tokens.... Bitcoin is like the reserve currency so its by far the safest bet... Ethereum is the platform for smart contracts and sub- tokens to run upon These two are relatively safe compared to the others but still highly volatile Some ico tokens are outright scams and people will gain nothing from investing in them... High risk /High reward... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theswedishguy Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 On 7/15/2017 at 8:38 PM, KittenKong said: Money for nothing. An offer no Thai can refuse. you understand that western currency have no value today? There is no gold reserve. 97% of western currency today is digital, created from nothing by banks. Crypto currency have a value: the energy it takes to create it. Western values have no value. Simple facts. Swedes: look at the riksbank homepage and how they explain the value of the currency "The value is determined by market forces. Sell and buy prices". Everything in west today is a huge bubble, created by banks, that are allowed to lend out 90% of something that don't exist and get interest on it. (A bank needs 10-15% real money of the money they lend out. 1 dollar in the bank and the bank can lend out 10 dollars. 9 dollars created from nothing) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooHaa Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 On 7/16/2017 at 2:54 PM, Time Traveller said: Yep. Intrinsically worthless, but it offers anonymity. On the other hand, the Dollar is backed by the US Treasury's ability to levy taxes on individuals and companies, however the dollar offers little in the way of anonymity except in small value cash transactions. Ultimately, Bitcoins value is primarily driven by criminal money launderers, and the late-to-the-party dumb money from the retail bandwagon speculators. Either way it's pure Ponzi. says the fellow unaware of the currencies legal status in thailand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vaultdweller0013 Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 45 minutes ago, theswedishguy said: Crypto currency have a value: the energy it takes to create it. This is a common myth, but wrong. Just because something is hard to do, doesn't give it value. It is the ability to use coins as a means of transfer that gives them value. The energy and hardware required to process the transactions places a floor on the value if the coin wants to be a functioning currency. (Because if the coins aren't worth enough to cover the mining costs, no one will mine. And, if no.one mines, no transactions get processed.) However, the coins can drop below this value, and if they do, it will trigger a death spiral where people stop using the coins and the value becomes zero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vaultdweller0013 Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 54 minutes ago, theswedishguy said: (A bank needs 10-15% real money of the money they lend out. 1 dollar in the bank and the bank can lend out 10 dollars. 9 dollars created from nothing) This is also wrong. In fractional reserve banking, a bank needs to hold a percentage of the deposits and can lend out the rest. So, if you deposit $10 in the bank, with a hypothetical 10% reserve requirement, the bank could let out $9. Now, the person who got the loan could deposit that back into the bank, which would then mean the bank has $19 of deposits on book, so they could lend out an additional $8.10. This is where the idea that banks can create money comes from, and it is true. Although it seems similiar to the quote, it is different in a key aspect. In the quoted scenario, the is no limit on the amount of currency that can be created, but how I described it (and how it works in reality), there is a limit on the maximum amount of money that can be "created" this way (its the sum of geometric series with r<1). It is done this way to allow the amount of money to be flexible. In particular, to allow the money supply to easily expand to support economic growth. Otherwise, you can run into a condition where there isn't enough hard, physical currency to support new investment. At the same time, the amount of currency can go up and down based on market demands without direct involvement of central banks. (But central banks can intervene and force the supply to what they want, sometimes for.the better and sometimes for the worse.) Its not perfect, but neither are the alternatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chivas Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 what the hell is a digital miner !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MW72 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 On 16/07/2017 at 11:20 AM, Bob12345 said: I think its more a question of public trust. Like how the USD was backed by gold in the "good old days". After decades of being exchangable into gold they let the gold standard go and only because trust was high enough the USD didn't collapse and became worthless. In the news you sometimes read stories about admins of websites accepting bitcoins making a run with the money which damages the trust in bitcoins. Or what if hackers start stealing passwords and people start losing all their Bitcoin savings? A central bank will not reimburse you. Seen a few videos of guys who didn't look after their keys and lost everything e.g. only stored on the laptop and left the laptop on a plane never to be seen again. One guy lost all of his when they were worth cents and is now understandably a little devastated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 8 hours ago, Chivas said: what the hell is a digital miner !! Go back to sleep grandpa.... It's not time for your medicine yet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbi1 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 On 16/07/2017 at 4:45 PM, Time Traveller said: Did I miss something, I thought Bitcoins was illegal in Thailand? I think you are confusing that with Uber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 1 hour ago, bbi1 said: I think you are confusing that with Uber. Or maybe prostitution.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KittenKong Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 On 17/07/2017 at 7:21 PM, theswedishguy said: you understand that western currency have no value today? There is no gold reserve. 97% of western currency today is digital, created from nothing by banks. Crypto currency have a value: the energy it takes to create it. Western values have no value. Simple facts. Yes and no. I'm not suggesting that any currency holdings make for very good investments, but I have more faith in currencies backed by huge economies than I have in a few prime numbers crunched from nothing at all and used mostly by criminals to hide their tracks. As for Bitcoin's value being the energy required to create them, that is clearly nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 8 minutes ago, KittenKong said: Yes and no. I'm not suggesting that any currency holdings make for very good investments, but I have more faith in currencies backed by huge economies than I have in a few prime numbers crunched from nothing at all and used mostly by criminals to hide their tracks. As for Bitcoin's value being the energy required to create them, that is clearly nonsense. This post is also Nonsense "Numbers crunched from nothing at all" Why don't you crunch them then? You could make billions of dollars.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob12345 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 This post is also Nonsense "Numbers crunched from nothing at all" Why don't you crunch them then? You could make billions of dollars.... You seem to have an emotional link to bitcoin, guess you invested heavily and are hoping to get in the positive some day?But the numbers are crunched from nothing, only thing stopping everybody making the billions you mention is the cost of electricity.You seem to have missed the point; nothing backs bitcoin. If they stop tomorrow you lost your money. Where you go complain? They dont have an office and nobody knows who invented bitcoin. Currencies, on the other hand, are backed by central banks and governments. They have a stake in them because you can pay your tax in their currency meaning they need to keep it afloat or become bankrupt themselves (and losing their jobs, income, power, etc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 minute ago, Bob12345 said: You seem to have an emotional link to bitcoin, guess you invested heavily and are hoping to get in the positive some day? But the numbers are crunched from nothing, only thing stopping everybody making the billions you mention is the cost of electricity. You seem to have missed the point; nothing backs bitcoin. If they stop tomorrow you lost your money. Where you go complain? They dont have an office and nobody knows who invented bitcoin. Currencies, on the other hand, are backed by central banks and governments. They have a stake in them because you can pay your tax in their currency meaning they need to keep it afloat or become bankrupt themselves (and losing their jobs, income, power, etc). CryptoCurrency is only a small fraction of my assets and I've already taken out more than I put in so even if it went to zero I'd still be way up but the amount of misinformation posted on the subject is astounding.... I bought my first bitcoins for $3 back in 2011, the industry is growing rapidly around crypto payments but Like any other market it is possible to lose your shirt in some scams People saying they could crunch prime numbers for free is the digital equivalent of trying to mine gold in your own back garden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KittenKong Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 12 hours ago, speedtripler said: This post is also Nonsense "Numbers crunched from nothing at all" Why don't you crunch them then? You could make billions of dollars.... How many reasons do you want? I dont want billions of dollars. My real investments are enough for me. I dont want to buy a load of PCs with fancy graphics cards and then have to find somewhere to put them, and then cool them all down. Cryptocurrencies are only worth bothering with early on when they are easy to generate and even then I wouldn't bother as I have more interesting things to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 7 minutes ago, KittenKong said: How many reasons do you want? I dont want billions of dollars. My real investments are enough for me. I dont want to buy a load of PCs with fancy graphics cards and then have to find somewhere to put them, and then cool them all down. Cryptocurrencies are only worth bothering with early on when they are easy to generate and even then I wouldn't bother as I have more interesting things to do. So you have finally realized you can't crunch these numbers for free ... Penny eventually dropped but you got there in the end.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob12345 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 hour ago, speedtripler said: So you have finally realized you can't crunch these numbers for free ... Penny eventually dropped but you got there in the end.... You dont seem to realize you are basing your whole story on a post you MISREAD. KittenKong originaly said "prime numbers crunched from nothing at all" and that is where you read "for nothing at all". He never said you could mine for free (no costs), he said the whole process is coming out of nowhere, which is true. So the penny didn't have to drop, you just had to read it correctly in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 6 hours ago, Bob12345 said: You dont seem to realize you are basing your whole story on a post you MISREAD. KittenKong originaly said "prime numbers crunched from nothing at all" and that is where you read "for nothing at all". He never said you could mine for free (no costs), he said the whole process is coming out of nowhere, which is true. So the penny didn't have to drop, you just had to read it correctly in the first place. You might want to consider the number crunching is only a security feature Like anything else in this world, the value is derived from peoples acceptance and if enough people believe in things then it will be used to store value or trade for goods etc The value of any network is proportional to the amount of users using it (metcalfes law) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPatrickThai Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 I bought 100 Ethers(Ethereum) this Monday at 4,700 baht. Seemed like a good idea as it was 12,000 a month or so ago. I like a gamble! If I sold now, I'd make a profit of nearly 300,000 baht but I have faith in it rising to 20,000 by the end of the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPatrickThai Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 This guy has great vdos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chivas Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 On 18/07/2017 at 10:17 AM, speedtripler said: Go back to sleep grandpa.... It's not time for your medicine yet... hardly so I'll repeat the question.....what the hell is a digital miner ?? I haven't googled.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 On 22/07/2017 at 8:35 PM, Chivas said: hardly so I'll repeat the question.....what the hell is a digital miner ?? I haven't googled.... Grandpa, you put your slippers in the dishwasher again ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PattayaJames Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) On 7/16/2017 at 3:05 PM, rocketman777 said: Bitcoin and digital coins are no more then digital gold and about as useful for the means of exchange for goods and services. Apart from being extremely volatile they (both gold and Bitcoin) need to be valued in terms of a National Currency ie USD. in order to useful in the marketplace. Those who wish to see the wide-scale use of Digital or a return to Gold fail to understand their limitations on a Macro economic scale. Regarding Digital, and in particular Bit Coin , these are nothing more then an elaborate scam constantly being hyped up by parties of interest. Take one look at the chart below and it is obviously a massive bubble had developed and has now burst with the weekly reversal from $3000 The Chart is typical of a bubble market and to me the whole affair is reminiscent of the Tulip Mania of 1636-1637 Digital currency and the technologies behind it, namely the blockchain. Will revolutionise the world. Hardly a comparison to the price of tulip bulbs 400 years ago. Anyone that thinks they missed the boat, not at all theses are still early days. Anyone getting involved now is an early adopter. Edited July 31, 2017 by PattayaJames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwdrwdrwd Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 (edited) On 7/16/2017 at 3:05 PM, rocketman777 said: Bitcoin and digital coins are no more then digital gold and about as useful for the means of exchange for goods and services. Apart from being extremely volatile they (both gold and Bitcoin) need to be valued in terms of a National Currency ie USD. in order to useful in the marketplace. Those who wish to see the wide-scale use of Digital or a return to Gold fail to understand their limitations on a Macro economic scale. Regarding Digital, and in particular Bit Coin , these are nothing more then an elaborate scam constantly being hyped up by parties of interest. Take one look at the chart below and it is obviously a massive bubble had developed and has now burst with the weekly reversal from $3000 The Chart is typical of a bubble market and to me the whole affair is reminiscent of the Tulip Mania of 1636-1637 Rather disingenuous choice of chart segment. Might have been fair comment had you posted in late 2013 but not now. Did financial institutions begin to incorporate tulips into their businesses? Edited August 2, 2017 by rwdrwdrwd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lkn Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 On 7/31/2017 at 2:22 PM, PattayaJames said: Digital currency and the technologies behind it, namely the blockchain. Will revolutionise the world. Revolutionise the world? Bitcoin has existed for 8 years, which means a lot of people must have given a lot of thought to what it can enable, and yet the only thing I see it enabling is for people to digitally accept payment without having to go through an official institution (like a bank, PayPal, or similar), and while this is certainly a nice thing, it’s not something majority of people need. So what exactly will cause digital currencies to revolutionise the world? Or are you thinking of smart contracts? Because while they do allow some neat things, it’s hard to imagine them playing a role in regular people’s life, especially because they have no power in the real world, for example we can’t make a smart contract that triggers payment once you have finished the job I have hired you to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chivas Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 On 7/30/2017 at 4:23 PM, speedtripler said: Grandpa, you put your slippers in the dishwasher again ! so we finally established you haven't a clue either.....sweet stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 1 hour ago, Chivas said: so we finally established you haven't a clue either.....sweet stuff July 29, 2010: "If you don’t believe me or don’t get it, I don’t have time to try to convince you, sorry." Satoshi Nakamoto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phycokiller Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 bitcoin is worth what its worth, why argue about it? look a the price charts and make your own decisions. I realize this comment is pure data, intrinsically worthless and backed by nothing, but personally Ive done very nicely out of bitcoin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now