Non-O Visa for Non-resident in Thailand

[AsianAtHeart]

Serious question.  I'm looking at the possibility of using a non-immigrant "O" visa based on having a dependent attending school in Thailand that would enable me to make regular visits to Thailand (approximately once a month) while living outside of Thailand and needing to enter via land borders, e.g. at Nongkhai's Friendship Bridge.  The visa would facilitate shopping and medical visits as well.  Insufficient age eliminates any retirement-type visa options.

 

As I understand, the following challenges present themselves:

 

1) The initial application is for a single-entry, 90-day visa that must later be extended an additional 9 months to round out the year.  However, living and working outside of Thailand would not permit a lengthy stay inside the country in order to apply for said extension after a lengthy period of time.  What is the soonest date at which one can extend/upgrade to the multi-entry visa, permitting him/her to leave Thailand while in possession of the visa/extension?

 

2) Is the 400,000 baht required in the bank before initial application or before the extension date, and if the latter, do they date back the three months' from time of application for the extension or from the time at which the extension period would naturally begin (90 days in)?

 

3) If the money must be in a bank account registered ONLY the name of the visa petitioner, is there any means of ensuring that said funds would be inherited by a designated heir in case of death or incapacitation?

 

4) What is the best and/or required method of transferral of funds from an American bank account to the Thai account, and does anyone have advice about managing the extreme red tape of setting up such an account for a US citizen?

[ubonjoe]

1. For the first extension application you would get total stay of about 15 months since the one year extension starts from the end of the 90 day entry from the non-o visa.

You would apply for the extension during the last 30 days of the 90 day entry. You could get a re-entry permit to keep the remainder of the 90 day entry valid when you re-enter the country.

2. To apply for an extension of stay based upon being the parent of child attending school you would need 500k baht in a Thai bank for 30 days for the first extension and 90 days after that on the date of application. Your child must be on extension of stay based upon attending school to apply for the extension.

3. You could do a will to designate an heir to get the money.

4. Having the non-o visa would make it easier to open a bank account.

Bangkok Bank is a good choice for transferring funds from the states since can be done via ACH to their branch in New York.

 

What is your visa status in Laos. If you are working and have a work permit you could get a multiple entry tourist visa at the embassy in Vientiane.

 

[AsianAtHeart]

Ubonjoe,

 

Thank you for your kind response.  I failed to clarify earlier that my dependent is Thai, and needs no visa to be in Thailand.  It is my understanding that I would be required to have only 400,000 baht, but please correct me if I have misunderstood.  I do have a work permit and one-year visa for Laos.  However, the car I drive is a Thai car, as is my license.  I would like to renew my driver's license soon, and was told it can be given for 5 years if I have a one-year visa in Thailand.  

 

You said having the non-o visa would make it easier to open the bank account--but isn't that, then, a Catch-22?  It seems we need the money in the bank to apply for the visa first.

[ubonjoe]

That would be an extension based upon based upon being the parent of a Thai. 

Are you the  legal father of your child by way of legitimization or marriage to their mother?

You do not need financial proof to apply for a single entry non-o visa at the embassy in Vientiane. That is only needed to apply for an extension at immigration.

Your best option may be to apply for a multiple entry non-o visa at the consulate in Penang Malaysia. They will accept the equivalent of 400k baht in any bank account. The visa will allow unlimited 90 day entries for a year from the date of issue.

[AsianAtHeart]

Legal father, yes.  The marriage is not registered in Thailand, but both parents' names appear on the birth certificate.

 

I did already inquire at the embassy in Vientiane, and they needed only 2000 baht, I think, for the application.  But until I have money in a Thai bank account, I don't think I can apply, as that will start the clock ticking, for which I need to have the 400,000 for three months--the full measure of the 90 days that visa gives me.

 

Is it easy to apply for a re-entry permit?  Obviously, that is what I would need right away in order to leave Thailand again after entry on the "single entry."

 

You said: "Your best option may be to apply for a multiple entry non-o visa at the consulate in Penang Malaysia. They will accept the equivalent of 400k baht in any bank account. The visa will allow unlimited 90 day entries for a year from the date of issue."

 

I appreciate that advice, and will look more at the Penang option.  But if I can once setup the bank account correctly, it seems I should be able to use it to renew each time.  Would I need to go to Penang once a year if going that route?  If so, the cost would seem higher in the long run.

 

Thank you again, Ubonjoe, for your sagacious help!

 

[ubonjoe]

12 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

Legal father, yes.  The marriage is not registered in Thailand, but both parents' names appear on the birth certificate.

You name on the birth certificate does not make  their legal father. If your marriage was not registered here when your child was born you are not the legal father of your child. The following topic has info.

You do not need the money in bank to apply for the non-o visa at the embassy in Vientiane. People get them all the time without it.

You could get the non-o visa and then apply for another one if you did not get the extension done.

By the rules the money does not need be in the bank for 2 months to apply for an extension based upon being the parent of Thai. But some offices do not want it to be in the bank for 2 months.

No problem to get the re-entry permit. There is a re-entry permit desk at the bridge in Nong Khai.

You would have to get new multiple entry non-o visa after it expires. That would mean another trip to Penang.

[AsianAtHeart]

Ubonjoe,

 

Your last post almost brings in more questions than answers.  I went to look at the other topic that you linked, and found more questions from there too.  It seems some people have gone through the wringer to get the father's name on the birth certificate--but then it is not considered legal?  I don't get it.  How will the immigration officers know if a father is legal or not?  What document(s) must they have?  None of the lists of documents I have seen for the non-O visa include something that I have felt unable to provide.  (On the other hand, I have yet to see a clear list anywhere.)  Am I missing something here?

[ubonjoe]

11 hours ago, AsianAtHeart said:

Ubonjoe,

 

Your last post almost brings in more questions than answers.  I went to look at the other topic that you linked, and found more questions from there too.  It seems some people have gone through the wringer to get the father's name on the birth certificate--but then it is not considered legal?  I don't get it.  How will the immigration officers know if a father is legal or not?  What document(s) must they have?  None of the lists of documents I have seen for the non-O visa include something that I have felt unable to provide.  (On the other hand, I have yet to see a clear list anywhere.)  Am I missing something here?

Your child's birth certificate will shows whether you were married or not when the child was born.

Legitimization is not normally required to get a a non-o visa from an embassy or consulate.

It is a required document to get a extension of stay based upon being the parent of Thai.

From clause 2.18 of police order 138/2557 document required for extension of stay.

Quote

3. Copy of documents proving relationship, such as a marriage certificate, a birth certificate, registration of child legitimization, household registration certificate, child adoption registration certificate, or other evidence from the government or relevant agency

 

[AsianAtHeart]

Thank you again, Joe.  I think that the birth certificate should be clear.  It lists me as the father.  It lists me as the one reporting the birth.  It says I am the father on the certificate via a little checkbox indicating relationship.  Whether this is a factor or not, it might be noted that the child was not born in Thailand, so the Thai birth certificate was not the first one obtained.  It was the one that established Thai nationality for the child.

 

 

[ubonjoe]

10 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

Thank you again, Joe.  I think that the birth certificate should be clear.  It lists me as the father.  It lists me as the one reporting the birth.  It says I am the father on the certificate via a little checkbox indicating relationship.  Whether this is a factor or not, it might be noted that the child was not born in Thailand, so the Thai birth certificate was not the first one obtained.  It was the one that established Thai nationality for the child.

 

 

If you were married in the country where your child was born then it may show you as the legal father if you were asked to show a marriage certificate when you registered their birth.

[AsianAtHeart]

16 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

If you were married in the country where your child was born then it may show you as the legal father if you were asked to show a marriage certificate when you registered their birth.

I don't remember showing the marriage certificate in Thailand, but we do have one in my home country, so that may have happened.

 

So it looks like the best options at this point are:

 

1) Go to Penang.  Obtain multi-entry, one-year non-O visa based on funds in foreign bank.

2) With visa in hand, open Thai bank account.  

3) During the visa period, transfer funds at opportune moments for exchange rates.

4) With funds in Thai bank account, next year apply for non-O without going to Penang.

 

I'm curious, if going the Penang route, does one enter Thailand at the border only to turn back to Malaysia to catch the returning flight on a round-trip ticket?  If I have understood correctly, Penang issues a multi-entry from the get-go, bypassing the 90-day single entry that must be later extended?  Also, looking on the map, it seems there are two border checkpoints on the Thai-Malaysia border.  Does it matter which one?  (I've never been to Penang.)

[ubonjoe]

19 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

4) With funds in Thai bank account, next year apply for non-O without going to Penang.

You will not need to apply for another non-o visa. You will apply for a one year extension of stay at immigration during the last 30 days of any of the 90 day entries from your visa.

 

21 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

I'm curious, if going the Penang route, does one enter Thailand at the border only to turn back to Malaysia to catch the returning flight on a round-trip ticket?  If I have understood correctly, Penang issues a multi-entry from the get-go, bypassing the 90-day single entry that must be later extended?  Also, looking on the map, it seems there are two border checkpoints on the Thai-Malaysia border.  Does it matter which one?  (I've never been to Penang.)

You can fly in and out of Penang.

I suggest you get a single entry non-o visa in Vientiane first and then apply for the multiple entry in Penang. Penang has been reported as not issuing a multiple entry non-o unless you have already gotten a single entry non-o visa.

[AsianAtHeart]

2 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

You will not need to apply for another non-o visa. You will apply for a one year extension of stay at immigration during the last 30 days of any of the 90 day entries from your visa.

Does this mean I would be required to stay in Thailand for 60 contiguous days before extending?  Is it not possible to extend earlier, such as the next day after entry?

[ubonjoe]

2 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

Does this mean I would be required to stay in Thailand for 60 contiguous days before extending?  Is it not possible to extend earlier, such as the next day after entry?

You need to get a re-entry permit for one your entries  to be down to the last 30 days of your entry.

[AsianAtHeart]

Still trying to work things out.  It's difficult to call internationally from Laos, so emailed the consulate in Penang with questions.  That was a week ago.  Still no reply--though I guess they took a long weekend starting Thursday with vacations.  But I am now doubtful, after having waited a reasonable time, that they will respond by email at all.  

 

Questions I still have, as it is not clear to me:

 

1) If the Thai bank account must be only in my name, would the foreign account fall under the same stipulation (it's a joint account)?

 

2) If the 90-day single entry visa is required in Penang before issuing the 1-year non-O, must that be used with a re-entry permit, unused, or anything else?

 

3) Is a trip to the Sadao border after visiting the embassy in Penang required, or can one simply fly back to Laos with the round-trip ticket and new visa?  (In other words, will the Vientiane border accept a pristine visa for first entry?)

 

4) If one enters Thailand from Penang, is there good train service from there to Bangkok? (One reason to consider this is that it seems some have experienced issues, such as not arriving in time to make the first 130 persons in the queue to have their passport processed that day, thus unexpectedly extending their stay--not nice if a round-trip schedule is already locked in.  One-way ticket would give more latitude.)

 

5) Does the foreign bank statement require certification/notarization by an embassy before being accepted in Penang?

 

 

 

 

[ubonjoe]

59 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

Still trying to work things out.  It's difficult to call internationally from Laos, so emailed the consulate in Penang with questions.  That was a week ago.  Still no reply--though I guess they took a long weekend starting Thursday with vacations.  But I am now doubtful, after having waited a reasonable time, that they will respond by email at all.  

Questions I still have, as it is not clear to me:

1) If the Thai bank account must be only in my name, would the foreign account fall under the same stipulation (it's a joint account)?

2) If the 90-day single entry visa is required in Penang before issuing the 1-year non-O, must that be used with a re-entry permit, unused, or anything else?

3) Is a trip to the Sadao border after visiting the embassy in Penang required, or can one simply fly back to Laos with the round-trip ticket and new visa?  (In other words, will the Vientiane border accept a pristine visa for first entry?)

4) If one enters Thailand from Penang, is there good train service from there to Bangkok? (One reason to consider this is that it seems some have experienced issues, such as not arriving in time to make the first 130 persons in the queue to have their passport processed that day, thus unexpectedly extending their stay--not nice if a round-trip schedule is already locked in.  One-way ticket would give more latitude.)

5) Does the foreign bank statement require certification/notarization by an embassy before being accepted in Penang?

1. To apply for the visa at Penang the account does not have to be in your name only.

2. Getting a re-entry permit would be a problem.

3. You could fly directly to Laos before using the visa.

4. Yes 

    As far as I know Penang has no limit on the number of visas they in issue in a day.

5. No

[AsianAtHeart]

Thank you again, Joe.

 

So am I understanding correctly that I need an unused single-entry visa before I apply for a second visa for one year?  It just boggles my mind that the officials would offer a second visa before the first one had been used.  I feel like I am missing something, or misunderstanding the requirements somewhere.  I'm not complaining about Thailand's oddities, just wanting to make sure I do things right.

[ubonjoe]

6 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

So am I understanding correctly that I need an unused single-entry visa before I apply for a second visa for one year?  

I assumed you would use the visa for entry.

You asked about using a re-entry permit which I assume would be to keep the original 90 day entry valid.

[AsianAtHeart]

Penang is in Malaysia.  If I fly from Vientiane (Laos) to Penang via Kuala Lumpur, there's no entry to Thailand required.  Does this mean I don't need the 90-day Non-O?

 

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

Penang is in Malaysia.  If I fly from Vientiane (Laos) to Penang via Kuala Lumpur, there's no entry to Thailand required.  Does this mean I don't need the 90-day Non-O?

 

I don't really understand what you mean. I assume you would use the the visa for entry from Laos to Thailand at least once.

This is what your wrote.

36 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

3) Is a trip to the Sadao border after visiting the embassy in Penang required, or can one simply fly back to Laos with the round-trip ticket and new visa?  (In other words, will the Vientiane border accept a pristine visa for first entry?)

 

[AsianAtHeart]

I am living in Laos.  My dependent is living in Thailand.  I want to be able to enter Thailand about once a month.  I currently require a visa for each entry, amounting to 1000 baht, plus 2 photos and photocopies of passport, etc., plus two trips to the Vientiane embassy during business hours on two separate (consecutive) business days per visa to enter Thailand a single time--a disruption to my schedule.  I'm looking to get the multi-entry, one-year non-O to make life simpler.  As I am in Laos, with no visa in my passport at present, I would be traveling to Penang just because Vientiane apparently does not offer the same level of service.  But I would have no need to enter Thailand to do so.  I _do_ still have one visa-free entry permitted which I have been saving for emergency use.  If Penang needs a 90-day non-O before they upgrade to a one-year non-O is the question I have.  Somewhere along the way I had the impression that such was their requirement.  If I need to enter Thailand at some point in order to "make things work," I certainly can plan to do so.  It does appear I may be unique in wanting a year visa without living in Thailand--but I see no reason for them to deny it just the same.  My need is to be able to cross the border freely--as simple as that.

[ubonjoe]

If you get a single entry non-o visa in Penang it will be valid for 3 months from the date of issue to use for an entry. You could use it more than once if you got a single re-entry (1000 baht) permit to keep the 90 day entry valid before returning to Laos after using it. There is a re-entry permit desk at Nong Khai side of the bridge.

I am sure Penang would expect the visa to be used for an entry or at least be expired before issuing another visa.

[AsianAtHeart]

I see, so if I understand correctly, if one were to arrive in Penang with no current non-O visa, he or she will get one for 90-days (and probably does not need to worry about much of the other paperwork, such as the bank balance, etc.).  However, if one has already had, and used, a 90-day visa, having exited with a re-entry permit ???, then Penang will issue a one-year visa.  Is that correct?

 

I do appreciate your help.  It doesn't sound like a trip to the border would be required while in Penang, unless one has plans to return over land through Thailand.

[ubonjoe]

9 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

I see, so if I understand correctly, if one were to arrive in Penang with no current non-O visa, he or she will get one for 90-days (and probably does not need to worry about much of the other paperwork, such as the bank balance, etc.).  However, if one has already had, and used, a 90-day visa, having exited with a re-entry permit ???, then Penang will issue a one-year visa.  Is that correct?

You may need to show the money in the bank to get the single entry visa.

The re-entry permit would only be needed if you used the visa to get a 90 day entry and wanted to keep the remainder of the remainder of the 90 days valid for another entry to Thailand.

If you have already gotten a single entry non-o visa and used it they would issue a multiple entry visa when you apply.

9 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

I do appreciate your help.  It doesn't sound like a trip to the border would be required while in Penang, unless one has plans to return over land through Thailand.

No need to enter Thailand from Penang. Just fly back to Laos and use the visa within 3 months to get the 90 day entry.

[AsianAtHeart]

You keep talking about a 90-day entry.  Does Penang issue the multi-entry non-O visa/extension (not sure on the terminology) or just the 90-day single entry that I could get here in Vientiane?  If you mean that I would need to enter at least once during the first three months of the year-long period, that would certainly be reasonable.

[ubonjoe]

8 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

You keep talking about a 90-day entry.  Does Penang issue the multi-entry non-O visa/extension (not sure on the terminology) or just the 90-day single entry that I could get here in Vientiane?  If you mean that I would need to enter at least once during the first three months of the year-long period, that would certainly be reasonable.

The 90 day entry is what a non-o visa allows. A multiple entry visa allows unlimited 90 day entries for a year from the date of issue.

Penang will issue a multiple entry non-o visa after you get a single entry visa from them.

The single entry visa would be valid to do an entry for 3 months from the date of issue.

[AsianAtHeart]

9 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Penang will issue a multiple entry non-o visa after you get a single entry visa from them.

Will Penang issue a multiple entry if the single-entry (non-O) visa came from Vientiane?  Or must one travel twice to Penang?

[ubonjoe]

2 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

Will Penang issue a multiple entry if the single-entry (non-O) visa came from Vientiane?  Or must one travel twice to Penang?

I am not  sure if they will issue on after one is obtained from another place or not.

[AsianAtHeart]

Wow.  Wonderful uncertainties.  What do people usually do? Go twice?  Go once, exit via Sadao, then return to Malaysia and get the extension the next day before returning home?  Something else?

 

I sure wish they would just process things the same way in Vientiane.  I'm not looking forward to spending about $400 on a trip to get a one-year multi-entry visa only to be turned away for some unanticipated detail.

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, AsianAtHeart said:

Wow.  Wonderful uncertainties.  What do people usually do? Go twice?  Go once, exit via Sadao, then return to Malaysia and get the extension the next day before returning home?  Something else?

They go twice. Most people would use the 90 day entry to stay until it is finished and then get a 60 day extension at immigration to visit their wife or child.