Re-entry permit with Edu visa?

[kikenyoy]

Since the visa is based on my being here and attending Thai language classes is there any issue with me leaving the country for a few weeks?

[BritTim]

Firstly make sure you know the difference between "visa", "permission to stay", and "extension of permission to stay". A re-entry permit is tied to a permission to stay or an extension of such a permission to stay. No re-entry permit is required if you have an unexpired multiple entry visa.

 

If you are on an extension on the basis of studying, some immigration officials may want an explanation as to how you can complete the course if you have lost a lot of study time. (I do not know how common this is.) If you are out of the country during a scheduled break in your studies (such as the break between semesters of a university course) just showing that should be the end of any questioning. Otherwise, you might need to show why exceptional circumstances interfered with your original study plans, and to explain how you intend to catch up on your studies.

[kikenyoy]

It is an Education visa from Pro Language so there are no semester breaks or anything like that. I believe it is single entry and I extend it every 90 days.  I just got it so I haven't done that yet. A friend is getting married in Norway and I'd like to go to the wedding if possible. I don't know if that counts as exceptional circumstances.

[JackThompson]

9 minutes ago, kikenyoy said:

It is an Education visa from Pro Language so there are no semester breaks or anything like that. I believe it is single entry and I extend it every 90 days.  I just got it so I haven't done that yet. A friend is getting married in Norway and I'd like to go to the wedding if possible. I don't know if that counts as exceptional circumstances.

One guy's mother died, and he had to leave while in the middle of an ED visa period.  When he came back visa-exempt, he was not allowed into the country, even though he had plenty of cash on him.  They didn't ask to see the money, then put on his "refusal of entry" that he didn't have any.   Some IOs consider "Ed" to be a very bad thing, but this was at an airport, which has become infested with anti-long-stay-foreigner sentiment.  It would probably be no problem at a land-border, so maybe fly back to Penang, and take the train in.  Be sure to carry 20K worth of cash or traveler's checks and show it if they ask any questions.  Maybe add in a note from your school acknowledging your absence, and how you will go in with a later-starting group upon your return. 

Edited August 11, 2017 by JackThompson

[BritTim]

2 hours ago, kikenyoy said:

It is an Education visa from Pro Language so there are no semester breaks or anything like that. I believe it is single entry and I extend it every 90 days.  I just got it so I haven't done that yet. A friend is getting married in Norway and I'd like to go to the wedding if possible. I don't know if that counts as exceptional circumstances.

As is often the case with Thai immigration matters, there is a lot of uncertainty over what might happen. If an immigration official did start to question you, I think it likely that a break of "a few weeks" to attend a wedding would raise legitimate doubts as to whether you are a serious student.

 

While education visas were a good way to stay long term years ago, I now suggest to people who want to study casually as part of their stay in Thailand that they may as well just use tourist visas, although that obviously does involve visa runs. Many officials see tourist visas as something people use when they are enjoying being here, something logical and not easy to disprove. The same officials feel that they can identify people who are not genuine students. Paradoxically, that makes education visas more risky.

[kikenyoy]

Based on the last two replies I don't think it's worth it. Too bad, it would have been fun.

 

Tim, I am serious about learning Thai. The group classes were too slow and too basic for me so I'm doing 3 private lessons per week. I also want to be able to stay in Thailand long term and I've heard that too many tourist visas is a big red flag.

 

[BritTim]

23 minutes ago, kikenyoy said:

Tim, I am serious about learning Thai. The group classes were too slow and too basic for me so I'm doing 3 private lessons per week. I also want to be able to stay in Thailand long term and I've heard that too many tourist visas is a big red flag.

Understood. Unfortunately, education visas were, for a time, a favorite of illegal workers. They were cracked down on for that reason. Your reality is similar to mine years ago. I had other reasons for enjoying being in Thailand, but was highly motivated to learn Thai while here (and even during my absences from the country). Some officials are trying to treat education visas/extensions as something only legitimately used by people whose sole reason for being in Thailand is to study (something I think is vanishingly rare).

 

I assume you are well under 50 years of age, and not looking to work in Thailand. That does not leave you with a lot of options for long term stay. With care, you can probably get a couple of years from tourist entries, but it is precarious. The Thailand Elite visa is a great solution apart from the sticker shock.

[JackThompson]

8 hours ago, kikenyoy said:

Based on the last two replies I don't think it's worth it. Too bad, it would have been fun.

Tim, I am serious about learning Thai. The group classes were too slow and too basic for me so I'm doing 3 private lessons per week. I also want to be able to stay in Thailand long term and I've heard that too many tourist visas is a big red flag.

If you get a letter from the school explaining / verifying you stated reason for absence explaining you take private-lessons and can continue where you left-off PLUS enter by land, PLUS have 20K Baht in cash or travelers checks PLUS proof of where you stay, I don't think you would have trouble upon-returning.   Throw in some pics of the wedding on your phone (with you in them) for good measure.

[kikenyoy]

8 hours ago, BritTim said:

 

 

I assume you are well under 50 years of age, and not looking to work in Thailand. That does not leave you with a lot of options for long term stay. With care, you can probably get a couple of years from tourist entries, but it is precarious. The Thailand Elite visa is a great solution apart from the sticker shock.

 

I will be 44 later this year. I can do an Edu visa for 3 years (I believe) then I'll have to do tourist visas for  a couple years until I can do a retirement visa at 50.

[kikenyoy]

24 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

If you get a letter from the school explaining / verifying you stated reason for absence explaining you take private-lessons and can continue where you left-off PLUS enter by land, PLUS have 20K Baht in cash or travelers checks PLUS proof of where you stay, I don't think you would have trouble upon-returning.   Throw in some pics of the wedding on your phone (with you in them) for good measure.

 

I'll look into it some more. I have a few months to decide. Thanks.

[JackThompson]

2 minutes ago, kikenyoy said:

I will be 44 later this year. I can do an Edu visa for 3 years (I believe) then I'll have to do tourist visas for  a couple years until I can do a retirement visa at 50.

You can only study Thai at language-schools for 18 months.  You could study other languages after that to continue using ED visas to stay here.  Hopefully, your school can take care of your 3-mo extensions for you.

[MadMuhammad]

5 hours ago, JackThompson said:

You can only study Thai at language-schools for 18 months.  You could study other languages after that to continue using ED visas to stay here.  Hopefully, your school can take care of your 3-mo extensions for you.

Are you sure 18 months is the limit Jack?i have a very close mate who has bee. On an ED for several years now. I've been visiting him for 5 years now and he's been on ED visa's for thai language since my first visit. 

Edited August 12, 2017 by MadMuhammad

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, MadMuhammad said:

Are you sure 18 months is the limit Jack?i have a very close mate who has bee. On an ED for several years now. I've been visiting him for 5 years now and he's been on ED visa's for thai language since my first visit. 

At "language-schools," according to the newer rules they have set, which increased the hours/wk requirement, 18 months of Thai is the max.  But, you can change languages to any that are not your passport-country's primary language, and continue that way.

 

If you go to a "real university" (not cheap), then you can study for years, and also receive better treatment from Immigration, without having to pay special "no hassle" extension-renewal fees, etc.

 

If your mate has been studying Thai (only) for 5 years at language-schools, please ask him how he did it.  The first 3 of those I can imagine, as it was before the new-rules went into effect.  But not sure how he could have kept studying Thai after that, unless attending a 4-year University (not "language-school") for advanced classes.

Edited August 12, 2017 by JackThompson

[MadMuhammad]

6 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

At "language-schools," according to the newer rules they have set, which increased the hours/wk requirement, 18 months of Thai is the max.  But, you can change languages to any that are not your passport-country's primary language, and continue that way.

 

If you go to a "real university" (not cheap), then you can study for years, and also receive better treatment from Immigration, without having to pay special "no hassle" extension-renewal fees, etc.

 

If your mate has been studying Thai (only) for 5 years at language-schools, please ask him how he did it.  The first 3 of those I can imagine, as it was before the new-rules went into effect.  But not sure how he could have kept studying Thai after that, unless attending a 4-year University (not "language-school") for advanced classes.

He definitely attends a regular school, that I am sure of as I've been past it before. I'll be speaking to him again tomorrow so I'll ask some further details and get back to you with some solid info.

On a side note, he doesn't have to 'attend' classes either (which I am fully aware is against the rules) and he's never had an issue with a spot checkthay has been stated can happen.

He has just ticked over his 20th year full time in Thailand so he's definitely had a good system running lol.

Edited August 12, 2017 by MadMuhammad

[JackThompson]

7 minutes ago, MadMuhammad said:

He definitely attends a regular school, that I am sure of as I've been past it before. I'll be speaking to him again tomorrow so I'll ask some further details and get back to you with some solid info.

On a side note, he doesn't have to 'attend' classes wither (which I am fully aware is against the rules) and he's never had an issue with a spot check stated can happen.

He has just ticked over his 20th year full time in Thailand so he's definitely had a good system running lol.

Yes - the only thing the "crackdown" and rule-changes accomplished, was to raise the fee for no-hassle extensions and for tuition, and require changing languages more often.  I heard that some schools send out text-msg warnings when "surprise visits" by Immigration are happening the next day - but that was a couple years ago.

 

The changes drove away many "good guys" studying Thai part-time and playing by the old-rules, but had little if any effect on those who were gaming-the-system, provided they can afford the higher-costs to continue as they had been doing before. 

Edited August 12, 2017 by JackThompson

[MadMuhammad]

23 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Yes - the only thing the "crackdown" and rule-changes accomplished, was to raise the fee for no-hassle extensions and for tuition, and require changing languages more often.  I heard that some schools send out text-msg warnings when "surprise visits" by Immigration are happening the next day - but that was a couple years ago.

 

The changes drove away many "good guys" studying Thai part-time and playing by the old-rules, but had little if any effect on those who were gaming-the-system, provided they can afford the higher-costs to continue as they had been doing before. 

Just spoke to him mate. 3 year limit on a single course ie: thai. Can switch to cooking, computers or whatever. Can do for 10 years then new passport and start again. He pays the single fee to the school and they take care of everything except his yearly borde run renewal.

He's been doing this for nearly his entire time in Thailand.

;on a side note he does speak fluent thai so whether this helps him in anyway I'm not sure.

 

[JackThompson]

2 minutes ago, MadMuhammad said:

Just spoke to him mate. 3 year limit on a single course ie: thai. Can switch to cooking, computers or whatever. Can do for 10 years then new passport and start again. He pays the single fee to the school and they take care of everything except his yearly borde run renewal.

He's been doing this for nearly his entire time in Thailand.

;on a side note he does speak fluent thai so whether this helps him in anyway I'm not sure.

 

Three years was the limit before they doubled the amount of hours/wk of time required to qualify for the visa (he probably finished Thai before the changes).  The rest sounds correct - just keep changing subjects.  His school must have a "good relationship" with the local Immigration Office to get 10-years / passport of ED-Visa-extensions in a passport.

[MadMuhammad]

Ah ok, gotcha. I believe he's due for his retirement extension now so it may be that he has dodged the requirements under the new regulations Jack, may have been a case of perfect timing.

Thanks for clarifying further. My reason for checking this is that I'm due to relocate to Thailand in the next year or so and at 39 I'm making sure I have all the information I need regarding visa/extension options. 

'My initial plan is to enter on an METV to get myself and my gf settled then apply for a ED to study thai. I have some skills already but I would definitely like to immerse myself a little deeper plus having a reason to continue to use my grey matter regularly will be important also.

It looks like I'll have to look into the the Elite visa to legitimise my residency as I don't plan on marrying the gf anytime soon lol