Expat Statistics

[Danbkk]

I have an idea for a business opportunity, but I want to gauge its feasibility before I invest time and money into it.

I need to get some stats on the number of expats currently living in Thailand, a breakdown of nationality would also be useful.

I would also be interested in he total number of expats globally broken down into countries.

If anyone has this info or knows where I can find it I would be very grateful

Thanks

Danbkk

[Pink Mist]

do a poll

[Indo-Siam]

Hi -

I do not have Immigration figures, but my company does have data of file, that we translated from Labor Ministry records, showing number of work permits issued, by nationality (lists top five nations, and then "other," by number of permits), and also a breakdown of top five occupational categories (and then "other") by year, 1992-2002. Compiled in speadsheet format.

We provide this information to paying clients - we had to pay to get the information. Basically 1,000 baht (+ 7% VAT) per list.

I will tell you - in no year has the number of foreign work permits issued exceeded 15,000, and the number issued to "white" people has never exceeded 5,000. 2002 figures were considerably lower in both categories.

Again, this is work permits, not long-term entry permits.

I have no clue concerning global figures.

If interested on a commercial basis, pleasecontact me via private message.

Good luck!

Steve

Indo-Siam

[email protected]

www.thaitradedata.com

[Danbkk]

Hi Steve,

Not really sure my idea would be viable with such a small potential market. I imagined the figure would be much higher.

Thanks for the info.

Danbkk

[Crash999]

Found out today that there are approx. 15,000 Americans here. More than I would have thought.

Cheers!

[Indo-Siam]

My guess is that fewer than one in ten "expats" in Thailand have a work permit. This takes into consideration retirees, 30-on-30-off oilfield refugees, foreigners with Thai spouses, struggling English teachers, and various other types. I sat in my "home bar" one day, taking count of the regulars - out of 15 or so, I think only one other than me had a work permit. Then I did the same thing in my other regular "shotgun" bar - over several hours on a Sunday afternoon, maybe 20-25 regulars passed through - I don't think anyone else had a work permit.

Of the last 10 or so companies we started up, about half were for foreigners who receive salary from other employees elsewhere, and who travel sufficiently (regionally) that they won't/don't bother with work permits. If your trips outside Thailand regularly take you away for several days at a time, at less than 30 day intervals, I have seen no evidence that Immigration EVER raises its eyebrows - they totally ignore such people. All the scrutiny falls on people who only travel right before entry permits expire, and whose stay outside Thailand is only for a day or two (if that).

Indo-Siam

[issan2]

I had an interesting chat with a guy who works in Mahasarakham University BKK teaching IT earlier this week. He told me that last year there were 600 farangs there, this year there are around 160 teaching.

Perhaps the numbers of long term farangs in the country is thinning out.

[Sunbelt Asia]

If your trips outside Thailand regularly take you away for several days at a time, at less than 30 day intervals, I have seen no evidence that Immigration EVER raises its eyebrows - they totally ignore such people. All the scrutiny falls on people who only travel right before entry permits expire, and whose stay outside Thailand is only for a day or two (if that).

Steve,

Looks like time is changing. See the posts at www.thaiimmigration.com I don't think its talk either. Look likes they want to stamp out these guys that are not paying taxes and working illegal. To be frank, I don’t feel there is any excuse for a foreigner not to be legal who is working here. It’s not that difficult. The taxes are not like Europe either...not even close.

If you are only a tourist, they could care less. Working though in Thailand without a work permit, the days are numbered.

www.sunbeltasia.com

[Indo-Siam]

I'm not talking about guys who work here. I'm talking about guys who are employed by companies outside Thailand, and who start companies here - often Thai branches of their overseas companies - and serve as directors. They come and go, hiring people here, deciding on office leases, meeting with customers - but they come in on visas-on-arrival. They receive no pay here. I have several who come in twice a month - staying 3-6 days each visit. They stay in hotels, become "regulars" at bars - but really have no permanent identity here. No work permit, no non-immigrant entry permit - and they are completely ignored by Immigration. They are not violating any Thai laws - they are simply investors watching out for their investments. My guess is that there are 20,000 or more similar cases. They show up here - but have no work permit or non-immigrant entry permit. They are doing nothing wrong. But they fill up the scenery - perhaps giving the impression that they are "really" here. Not so. They are officially just visiting tourists.

The documrents I have from Labor Ministry suggest that there are fewer than 15,000 foreigners with work permits here, and of these, fewer than one quarter are 'white' people (vs. Indians, Chinese, Japanese). That's not a lot of work permits. But I have to think there are upwards of 60,000 total "white" people that are thought of as "Thailand expats." But - I don't really know.

I fully believe that someone can visit Thailand twice a month, for 5-10 days each time, on simple "entry permit on arrival" - in order to supervise business activities here (without being paid here, or having any formal identity here) - and can do this for the next 10 years, and Immigration has absolutely no concern or interest.

Immigration only focuses on guys who habitually leave Thailand just before their entry permits expire, spend a couple of hours or days in some nearby place, and then return - all without a non-immigrant visa (or with a Class B visa and no work permit). This sends up a red flag.

Cheers!

Steve

[Sunbelt Asia]

Immigration only focuses on guys who habitually leave Thailand just before their entry permits expire, spend a couple of hours or days in some nearby place, and then return - all without a non-immigrant visa (or with a Class B visa and no work permit). This sends up a red flag.

If you have a multi-entry "B" visa. Show your work permit after their new computer goes " beep beep beep" and you're on your way.

The bottom line, you have money and making it here legal or getting it from your home country, you are the hero. Make it illegal and not paid taxes, your days are numbered. Fair warning from Immigration: "Get legal."

www.sunbeltasia.com

[Foggy Bottom]

None of the above figure stack up

Chiangmai Province alone is said by Immigration to have around 26,000 farang classed as expat (regardless of visa - they're looking at those with ongoing stays).

I'd also read somewhere, maybe via www.police.go.th/thaiimb that there were 5000 in Pattaya - and I'd expect a lot more in Bangkok.

My own work permit has a very high serial number, and my Thai press card as a foreigner is in the 5000's - not exactly a common employment type.

Extremely detailed stats on incoming and outgoing numbers are available at the police website, as are the number of work permits etc issued.

e.g

in 2000, 83,259 new work permit applications were made in the Kingdom, and 81,213 applications for renewal

In 1999, 81,451 new applications & 78,833 renewal applications

These stats do not break down nationalities, but do show whether for Investment, employee etc splits. Also whether temporary or under section 12.

You can at a different part of the site, get the breakdown by nationality and industry within the same spreadsheet - nationality is in the columns and industry in the rows.

All of them are downloadable to Word .doc format from which you can import them to Excel for analysis.

Hope it helps

Gaz