wigantojapan

Hillary Clinton was careful to say, as they are all careful to say, that she has no vote in Scotland's referendum. Well, who would have thought? Like her former boss Barack Obama, the erstwhile US Secretary of State certainly didn't want to sound as though she was interfering in anyone's democracy. Since the BBC persists in asking the question, however, the apparently coy answers keep on coming

.https://www.facebook.com/pages/Scottish-Independence/533919023290523

My Passport took over 14 weeks and only, after i got my local MP involved,plus contacted the local English MP,plus the newspapers.

.In the end i also had to pay the privilege of them releasing my passport an extra 65 pounds.

.This was in February 2014,when it was finally issued.

https://www.facebook.com/GMOFreeUSA/photos/a.468695639837571.108816.402058139834655/780660525307746/?type=1&relevant_count=1

Again the original question which the sussex man failed to answer

Is there a UKNHS?

Will treatment for Scots be different if the vote is no or yes?

very different to what he later went onto pensions and NIC

for 7 by 7 This is the initial video

please show us where the propaganda is?

Again you have failed to answer the question regarding the video?

you want serious intelligent debate ,,yet you will not answer the questions above

Wigan(Ijustlovegoogle0tojapan;

You can post as many duplicates as you like.

I have made my position on continued use of the UK NHS by residents of an independent Scotland very clear, and answered all questions put to me on the matter.

I have shown the position of all other non UK residents on this subject; including non resident British citizens.

Yet you still think that residents of an independent Scotland will be treated differently to all other non UK residents.

But, despite being repeatedly asked, you wont say why you believe this or offer any evidence to back it up; other than childish propaganda films you found via Google.

Instead you accuse me of diverting the topic to pensions; a subject brought up by someone else entirely.

This topic has had 27,000+ views since it started 8 months ago; but that does not mean that 27,000+ people are interested in it.

Many of those views will be by people like you and I who view it several times a day.

This topic is going around in circles, and I think that it should be closed; until and unless someone has something intelligent to add to the debate.

I see little point in keeping it open just so you can continually post your, often factually incorrect, propaganda videos and links and throw insults and flames at all who disagree with you.

well why dont you just leave then..if it does not satisfy your inteliigence,,simple,,,,why should it get closed down because you say so....there are over 100 days still to go,,,,new news is coming in...it is the most important decision in the UK in recent times...

one thing wont change in these 100 days though that a new UKNHS will suddenly appear

transam is ok in general,,,comes out with a few odd quotes mostly along the cap and hand and the shetlands want oil and thats about it....not so much patronizing as others

some people just have that mentality of laughing and making fun of the most vulnerable in society ,all under the pretense of humour.

.We have all lived under mass propaganda in The UK.

propaganda in itself cause as we know there has never been a United Kingdom ever

aye sometimes people fought together under a British flag and a British uniform,,but the divisions were clear to the soldiers who fought..Aye some of it was light hear ted competitiveness ,,but there always was and still is a more sinister side of control and superiority.

So the idea of Scotland being poor and coming cap in hand is a common thread even within Scotland itself far less the rest of the UK

Massive brainwashing by the establishment,,nothing more nothing less

of course through the social media and release of confidential secret Government papers we are seeing that myth about poor Scotland been blown out the water.

We can also see the intentional political act that Scotland was given to make it poor by the burying of these documents.

If happened in another country the so called fair minded Uk gentleman would be up in arms,,but here hardly a whisper in any main stream media news all buried under some bland news item

Just ANSWER my question and don't dodge it. You remind me of the BNP in England, dance around questions because ideals cannot be questioned............... ..................... Answer my question regarding the Islands living on top of your persieved gold mine............

Well the Shetland girl i posted her video gave you her answer as a Shetlander....

oil perceived goldmine,,is not my perception but ok i will answer....If the Shetland wants to be independent after Scotland gets its independence of course they can vote on that no worries.

will Scotland still survive yes,,lots of independent statistics on the wealth of Scotland without the oil.

but if you want to stick to the oil theme ...There is more oil around the Clyde basin than in the vicinity of the shetlands,,so i guess both Shetland and Scotland would prosper under an oil rich country

England on the other hand will need foreign aid from either one of them

oh do you want me to go on about energy now

or how about water

there is more water in one loch than the whole of England is a good start....yes sir can i get some more

Carry on, makes for a good learning curve for me...........Carry on.......

please inform what you have learnt first,,then i can continue,,wouldn't want to repeat myself would i

for those of you that want to forget what better together means and how we the Scots are treated as equal partners and are respected as such read on

http://newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-politics/8428-fury-after-unelected-peers-strip-power-from-scotland..

some people just have that mentality of laughing and making fun of the most vulnerable in society ,all under the pretense of humour.

.We have all lived under mass propaganda in The UK.

propaganda in itself cause as we know there has never been a United Kingdom ever

aye sometimes people fought together under a British flag and a British uniform,,but the divisions were clear to the soldiers who fought..Aye some of it was light hear ted competitiveness ,,but there always was and still is a more sinister side of control and superiority.

So the idea of Scotland being poor and coming cap in hand is a common thread even within Scotland itself far less the rest of the UK

Massive brainwashing by the establishment,,nothing more nothing less

of course through the social media and release of confidential secret Government papers we are seeing that myth about poor Scotland been blown out the water.

We can also see the intentional political act that Scotland was given to make it poor by the burying of these documents.

If happened in another country the so called fair minded Uk gentleman would be up in arms,,but here hardly a whisper in any main stream media news all buried under some bland news item

Just ANSWER my question and don't dodge it. You remind me of the BNP in England, dance around questions because ideals cannot be questioned............... ..................... Answer my question regarding the Islands living on top of your persieved gold mine............

Well the Shetland girl i posted her video gave you her answer as a Shetlander....

oil perceived goldmine,,is not my perception but ok i will answer....If the Shetland wants to be independent after Scotland gets its independence of course they can vote on that no worries.

will Scotland still survive yes,,lots of independent statistics on the wealth of Scotland without the oil.

but if you want to stick to the oil theme ...There is more oil around the Clyde basin than in the vicinity of the shetlands,,so i guess both Shetland and Scotland would prosper under an oil rich country

England on the other hand will need foreign aid from either one of them

oh do you want me to go on about energy now

or how about water

there is more water in one loch than the whole of England is a good start....yes sir can i get some more

Mods can close this thread now -- it's going around in circles for a long time already......

J pinx there is new news been released everyday, so it is very topical. and more will get release between now and the 100 days left before the vote.

yes, there has been a lot of recycling of the same issues,,and some people want to draw questions out that have no relation to the independence debate,,this we

all know,,we dont need to look to far for that

But like i said there will be new issues released ....the yes side for one has not played all its cards you can rest assured with that.

over 20000 views alone on this topic means people are taking an interest if not contributing themselves.

i will of course keep posting videos from Scotland showing that the people of Scotland are informed and are asking difficult questions

some people just have that mentality of laughing and making fun of the most vulnerable in society ,all under the pretense of humour.

.We have all lived under mass propaganda in The UK.

propaganda in itself cause as we know there has never been a United Kingdom ever

aye sometimes people fought together under a British flag and a British uniform,,but the divisions were clear to the soldiers who fought..Aye some of it was light hear ted competitiveness ,,but there always was and still is a more sinister side of control and superiority.

So the idea of Scotland being poor and coming cap in hand is a common thread even within Scotland itself far less the rest of the UK

Massive brainwashing by the establishment,,nothing more nothing less

of course through the social media and release of confidential secret Government papers we are seeing that myth about poor Scotland been blown out the water.

We can also see the intentional political act that Scotland was given to make it poor by the burying of these documents.

If happened in another country the so called fair minded Uk gentleman would be up in arms,,but here hardly a whisper in any main stream media news all buried under some bland news item

http://bellacaledonia.org.uk/2014/06/07/miriam-brett-from-aye-talks/ Well here whats one young Shetlander feels on the question

Is there a UKNHS?

Will treatment for Scots be different if the vote is no or yes?

very different to what he later went onto pensions and NIC

Is there a UKNHS?

Will treatment for Scots be different if the vote is no or yes?

very different to what he later went onto pensions and NIC

A Great Ormond Street spokeswoman said there was very little risk that independence would impede Scottish patients going there. The hospital was used routinely by patients across Europe and across the world because it had very highly specialised expertise, often not available abroad.

"Some of our specialist treatments are only available here, so we're probably quite different from a lot of standard NHS hospitals, so we do have arrangements with a lot of countries because they don't have the same level of specialist care that we can offer patients."

In a statement, the hospital said: "Great Ormond Street hospital was not consulted about this advertising, and we in no way endorse its messages, or that of any other political campaign group.

"We have contacted the Vote No Borders group to request that the advert is removed from cinemas as soon as possible."

7by7 you are confusing healthcare in the "normal" sense, and health treatments which are non-essential. I think you really need to read the fine print of the reciprocal agreements between the countries to understand it better.

Basically if you are a resident and on a doctors list in Sussex and you travel to France, etc - if you fall sick or have an accident you will get the basic care needed and the Health board in Sussex will get the bill.

He doesn't even understand that the respective health boards are independent,,,,But again the focus has been on attacking and making the sick the victim

along with Scotland wanting something they are not entitled

better together i think not

the suusex man using residents and citizens in the same sentence

That is the situation now; why should residents of an independent Scotland, who will have chosen to leave the UK, be treated any differently to British citizens who have chosen to leave the UK and live abroad?

^^ You'll note that every answer I give in this regard uses the phrase "Scottish resident." To once again clarify, I am referring to residents of Scotland, as I mentioned earlier, that includes English-born residents of Scotland. Even people from Sussex.

We agree on one thing, then.

As I have said all along, entitlement is based upon residency, not citizenship.

Can you know convince you mate from Wigan of that?

incorrect you have clearly on a number of occasions used the word citizen rather than residents...but again and you have failed to answer the initial question,,because again you have no understanding of the NHS and what its arrangements are ,,like you said in one of your primary comments on the NHS it is a complicated subject in reply to Ruam Reddy,,,,seems too complicated for yourself so you diverged onto non residents and pensions,,,,,,nothing to do in the slightest with the original question...Again the original content HAS BEEN BANNED IN CINEMA BECAUSE OF ITS INACCURATE REPORTING THAT tell you something unless you want to say now that the GREAT ORMOND is part of the yes campaign

NHS stands for NHS ENGLAND get that correct at least though they call them selves national

national in this sense means ENGLAND,

THERE IS NO NHS UK NONE 4 independent bodies.

correct if Scotland becomes independent no money from the Uk treasury

England the RUK will loose the money from Scottish tax payers to build roads around the M25 and the likes

THe NHS SCOTLAND will still pay for Scottish residents treatment in England as they do now

If westminister wants to draw up reciprocal health agreements with any country including Scotland .Thailand they can,,but as we stand these business arrangements are inplace.

Pattszero,

British pensioners who live abroad do receive their state pensions; although many, including those living in Thailand, do not get the annual increases!

There is a long running thread on TV about the injustice of that.

However, we are talking about NHS treatment; not pensions.

You stated that should Scotland become independent then Scottish residents will still be entitled to NHS treatment in the UK as they have previously paid NICs.

I have a different view and asked why they should be treated any differently to all other non UK residents; including British citizens who have paid NICs but now live outside the UK.

Like the Google fan from Wigan, you have dodged the question, and I suspect will continue to do so because you know the answer and don't care for it.

NHS treatment does not depend on National Insurance Contributions. To qualify for "FREE" NHS treatment you have to be either a UK resident and on a doctors list, otherwise you need to be a resident of a country with a reciprocal agreement such as Spain or Germany, or SCOTLAND -- where the NHS Scotland already pay for treatment to Scottish residents in England.

Please stick to the facts.

100% correct jpinx Thats what i have been telling him for days..Along alongside spokesperson for the hospital involved with the lies of the no borders video

<snip>

This is the core of your misunderstanding writ large.

I didn't say that all future Scottish residents would be entitled to full use of UK NIC related facilities. I said that the people who have paid in since 1947 and forward are entitled to see their NIC honoured. The UK government knows that.

So, for the purpose of clarity, if we get Independence in March 2016, a school leaver that year will only pay into the Scottish NIC pool. They will have no call on UK facilities. My point is clear - current contributions must be, and will be honoured.

There is no point, as I have already said, in arguing this point any further with you or wigantojapanviagoogle.

Both of you are showing that you do not understand how the NI system works.

But I will ask you a question.

You say that anyone who has previously paid NICs since 1947 is entitled to 'see their NIC honoured.' Yet British citizens who have paid NICs for many years and now live outside the UK do not have full access to the NHS and are treated the same as all other non UK residents.

That is the situation now; why should residents of an independent Scotland, who will have chosen to leave the UK, be treated any differently to British citizens who have chosen to leave the UK and live abroad?

I know plenty of people who have their UK pension fully funded while living abroad. Nothing special in that.

+++++++++++++

Tell that to 7by7

Many people paid in for many years and then left UK. They can still get a partial pension. There is no point in muddying the waters by confusing Scottish independence with some that is different to the rules that already exist.

Again the sussex man introduces residents when it should be citizens with regards to the Scottish people living in Scotland which he has so feverishly been going on about haha....oh well the better together dinnae ken hehawcampaign

the sussex man muddling the waters who would have believed

well hes swimming with sharks now,,,

someone is mixing into the equation citizenship and residency and it certainly isnt me...the sussex man does have form about taking 2 completely different aspects and splicing them together as i stated before.

show me anywhere where it says NHS UK

you obviously like a lot of things have taken the NHS national to mean NHS UK

so i will ask you what does NHS mean?

also what does NHS Scotland mean?

<snip>

Every Scottish resident that has paid into the UK NIC system is entitled to the benefits accrued. That includes the no voters. That includes the English born residents. Even those from Sussex.

At the moment; yes.

While Scotland remains in the UK; yes.

But if Scotland leaves the UK; no.

You want it all; independence from the UK but retain the benefits of being part of the UK!

This is the core of your misunderstanding writ large.

I didn't say that all future Scottish residents would be entitled to full use of UK NIC related facilities. I said that the people who have paid in since 1947 and forward are entitled to see their NIC honoured. The UK government knows that.

So, for the purpose of clarity, if we get Independence in March 2016, a school leaver that year will only pay into the Scottish NIC pool. They will have no call on UK facilities. My point is clear - current contributions must be, and will be honoured.

There is no point, as I have already said, in arguing this point any further with you or wigantojapanviagoogle.

Both of you are showing that you do not understand how the NI system works.

But I will ask you a question.

You say that anyone who has previously paid NICs since 1947 is entitled to 'see their NIC honoured.' Yet British citizens who have paid NICs for many years and now live outside the UK do not have full access to the NHS and are treated the same as all other non UK residents.

That is the situation now; why should residents of an independent Scotland, who will have chosen to leave the UK, be treated any differently to British citizens who have chosen to leave the UK and live abroad?

Excuse me it is the sussex man yourself who changed the question and brought in the NIC

The original question was about NHS

You still clearly do not understand the basics of that no matter how many times i have told you

You have clearly stated the UKNHS

IS THERE A UK NHS NO

IS there a SCOTLAND NHS yes

Who pays for Scotland NHS Scottish parliament

Who pays for the Scottish residents treatment Scottish parliement.

does the English NHS pay for Scottish patients treatment NO

Do Scottish patients get free treatment in England No.

Now you have went onto another topic because you didnt want tosee the truth in the original question

Great ormond themselves said that as did the video link,,so you diversed onto the issue of non residents

Scottish citizens will still be citizens of Britain that has already been said by cabinet ministers in Westminister,,,They are not non resident..

Now you will tell me Britain and the Uk is the same and Scotland wanting all the benefits etcetc

http://www.newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-opinion/9292-colonial-and-corrupt-times-up-for-bbc-scotland

THURSDAY, 05 JUNE 2014 22:22

37 COMMENTS

By G.A.Ponsonby

President Obama has spoken; the USA made a tragic mistake when it fought off colonial rule over 200 years ago. America wants to rejoin the self-styled 'greatest Union on earth'.

OK, not quite, but what an interesting question it would have been to the US President – why did they leave the UK when it was (then) a 100 year old success story?