phuketjock

1 minute ago, NamKangMan said:

 

Another side step to questions put to you.

 

You continue to play the poster, not the post.  It's you with zero credibility.

 

You claim to pay no key money and no tea money and run a successful business here, but refuse to say in what industry and in what location.

 

I'm calling TROLL. 

Wrong again NKM I posted the location and number of our ventures the nature of our

business has no relevance whatsoever and I have claimed nothing other than the facts

pertaining to this thread and my wife and I's businesses.

I you do not wish to accept what I say as truth then that is your prerogative good luck.

8 minutes ago, xylophone said:

The information came direct from a man whose business is selling these places and obviously I can't name him and nor would he want to be named.

 

As for a sales pitch, well sorry that you saw it that way, but then again that's one of your assumptions, because it was merely to point out that there are places for sale and this particular one is close to the action and I know of it. I want nothing to do with selling it, nor have I ever advertised that fact.

 

For the record LIK it is in the new middle road as I call it, and it is Thai freehold.

 

So sad that one poster seems to have to denigrate the poster and his integrity because that's not what this thread is all about. 

So now you are telling us it is one guy selling all these properties/businesses then? and why can't you name

him is he a dodgy dealer? or are you now telling us your information is from a property salesman because

everyone know how honest they are, so exactly where is your information coming from? If what you say has

any truth to it surely it would be the exact opposite he would want everyone to know who he is, how else could

he possibly expect to sell something by keeping it secret?? 

The only thing sad about this thread mate is that there is one poster who thinks he is so superior to all others

that his opinion is the only valid one and anyone else's opinion means nothing, unfortunately his opinion has no

factual or credible substance, only anonymous input from second hand sources. Just because someone claims

to be very good at something doesn't mean they are.............................the proof of the pudding etc,etc,.     

3 hours ago, LivinginKata said:

 

Even no so dodgy business are pressed for 'tea money'.  We know a lady who started a legitimate small scale beauty salon on Nanai Rd. The (the BiB) wanted 3,000 baht a month so 'make sure she had no problems'. It's mafia stuff. She caved and paid ....costs too high and she went out of business in less than a year.

I think they know an easy touch when they see it, still it is sad that she was bullied to that extent.

Touch wood we have never to my knowledge been approached for tea money but we were ripped off

once only by the "excise " police, made sure it will not happen again, their second try they left empty

handed. Sure they will be back to try it on again vigilance is a basic necessity daily.

It may be that my missus has one of those  " don't even think about it looks  " anytime they appear,

well that's what I put it down to, it scares me lol.

4 hours ago, madmax2 said:

So key money, tea money same,same, never paid either ever in Aust and never would here if i could be bothered having a business

Tea money is not quite the same mm2 it is what is often referred to as protection money

or a monthly brown envelope to the bib to turn a blind eye to anything dodgy that you may

be up to, as I said in a previous post, if you are paying tea money you are probably doing

something illegal? Like everywhere that such practices exist once you start paying it can only

get worse. Basically it is bribe money.

I don't actually know the answer but I would guess that there is a rather large clue in the

name of the visa ie. 90 day single-entry non immigrant O visa.

But stranger things have happened??

Please be aware there is a new form now for requesting a transfer of

stamps from old to new passport as I found out recently when I took 

a neighbour to do his annual extension renewal with his new passport,

sorry I don't know what tm. it is but perhaps UJ can tell you. 

6 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Key money is a well known concept in many countries. You pay money for the privilege of being allowed to rent/lease a property. Normally once paid per lease/rental term.

Thanks stevenl, I have never come across it before, in my many travels, but I bow to your knowledge.

16 minutes ago, madmax2 said:

As a business owner in Patong can you tell me what key money is

Never heard of it in 50 years of running businesses in Aust

Key money is something that appears to have been invented by imaginative

Thai commercial property owners and it is basically a gift to the owner/lessor by the 

lessee for the vague privilege of renting their property?

They choose the amount and if you want to rent you pay, up to you. It used to be a

one time payment for as long as you leased the property but nowadays some

enterprising (for want of a better word ) Thai owners have found a way to extract

even more money by making the key money payment a 3 year payment or I have even heard of 

annual key money demands, it is something to steer well clear of, basically a grand ripoff

But as long as there is a mug who is willing to pay, and there usually is, they will keep

demanding it. Not something I would ever entertain, if asked for key money I walk away

period.

I too had never heard of it until I came to Phuket.

14 hours ago, NamKangMan said:

 

"the time when many poorly run businesses go under every year in Patong???" - LIK has posted he has been in business here for 19 years, and owns the land and buildings.

 

He openly admits to near a zero occupancy rate in Kata, yes, Kata, not Patong, but are you saying he runs his business poorly????

 

He gave some reasons for the poor occupancy rates, and none of them were the fault of his management. 

 

This is what you NEVER address PJ.  You always say it's the fault of the owner / manager for the business going broke, even though you deny businesses here are going broke - go figure.

 

As I have said, the ground is shifting under the feet of business owners here, and there is nothing they can do about it. 

 

I have also stated in the past, when the music stops, many will be left holding the can here - we are seeing this now. 

When you start commenting from a credible knowledge base, ie run a business in Patong , then perhaps there is a chance 

that someone may listen to your fantasy rants???

14 hours ago, schlog said:

Go there if you want to see the for sale signs. Then you will see also 8 more.

Your statement was wrong that no business is for sale at beach road. It is easy as that.

 

Schlog please don't misquote me I said I had been looking for for sale signs  not that there were no business

for sale on the beach road, I also asked that anyone who seen any to please let us know and you have thanks.

2 minutes ago, schlog said:

Most businesses up for sale more then 1 year. May you have walk then you will see. This 2 are easy to find. Welcome.

Sorry schlog that is only 2  and if they are on the beach they are probably way over priced and that is confirmed 

by your statement that they have been on sale for more than 1 year. I still can't see any for sale signs???

2 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

Yes we are in 2 Nanai areas. Still make money mind you we own land and building debt free. Paying rent or key money is a mugs game.

I wish you the very best LIK and if you are making something you are not losing.

9 minutes ago, schlog said:

Are you serious? Only on beach road you could find easily more then 10 businesses for sale. Starting with the ex absolute hotel....ocean plaza mall.....

A location on these 10 business's would be helpful schlog?? or perhaps a few pics of for sale signs??

Of course you are aware it is low season, the time when many poorly run businesses go under every

year in Patong???

5 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

 

Our Kata operation (long term rentals)  Is now running at almost zero percent occupancy . We had 6+ good years here in Kata, recovered our outlay costs. For me Patong is our money earner.  So I am not going to knock Patong.

I hope you are not on Nanai? or in that area

13 minutes ago, Flustered said:

The thread became foolish when it turned into discussion about the lack of or the boom in business in the red light districts. Originally it was about the bowling alley being quiet and a lack of tourists in general.After a while it became abusive and more than one FM went on holiday.

 

Your wife's massage parlours/hourly rate guest house may be doing well but then there is always a trick or two to be turned at these establishments. However, having just returned from a short trip to Phuket and a drive through Patong, it was very quiet.

 

I suppose it all depends on what the business is and what time of day.

Don't get flustered Flustered no massage parlour or hourly rate hotel or guesthouse involved in any of our ventures, nice try though.

Just you keep following the pied piper of Nanai.

14 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

 

Well, I have for sure operated 2 long term home businesses in Patong for almost 19 yeras now.

 

I have contributed truthfull information on every one of my posts.

 

I well know that our business has declined due to a number of factors, visa problems being the most noteable, strong baht another problem, guests with failing bars etc.

 

I do believe we have reached the bottom a couple of years ago with a 50% occupancy.  I doubt we will ever recover unless we slash prices, that we will not do given we have stayed at the same rates over these 19 years.. 

 

 

Forgive me LIK  I thought you gave up your interests in Patong some time ago I was under the 

impression that you only operated in Kata/Karon?

I believe what I said about Nanai is on the money.

4 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

29 minutes ago, phuketjock said:

 

<snip>

I,m sure as I suspect there are not any current owners of business’s who actually operate one in Patong but still feel the need to contribute their second hand hearsay information and try to pass it off as genuine. Let’s see if we can induce any real current Patong business owners to contribute real firsthand knowledge to the thread? I will start by nailing my colours to the mast, if that is the correct term? ( not sure I am ex-army but I am sure you get the drift ).

 

Something on your mind LIK?

I feel it is time to end this foolish thread and I will try to explain to the rather simple people that seem to permeate this thread what is dead or dying about Patong and what and where in Patong nothing is dead or anywhere near dying.

First it is necessary, for some to give an overview of the situation regarding Patong and other resort locations worldwide generally.

Anywhere in the world where there are beaches the prime locations on those beaches are of course at the waters edge and as you retreat from the beach the area becomes less desirable and therefore less expensive to buy or rent. Patong is no different so it is a fact that accommodations on or near the beach command higher prices than they do on each road moving back from the beach making Nanai Road, ignoring hasip pee rd, the cheapest place for rentals, buying, and would be hotel or guesthouse owners/managers.

This made Nania the cheap Charlies desired location and all was well/ok until the tuktuk/taxi mafia decided to follow the airport taxi price modeling app ( cue NKM our resident public transport guru for Phuket ) then unfortunately it was not long before the cheap Charlies caught on that if they wished to go to the beach and/or shopping and out for dinner and drinks at night that their cheap room was suddenly anything but cheap when they added the 1000 or so for transport to their daily expenses. So as cheap Charlies do they began to look at other options, and guess what they could stay down nearer the beach and shopping and restaurants without the expense of the tuktuks/taxis and still pay less than they would on Nanai. And there you have it in one paragraph, simple as that, why Nanai is dead or appears to be dying, that’s the down side but the up side is that the cheap Charlies have moved down nearer the beach hotels/guesthouses boosting the business in the rest of Patong, and there is now lots of cheap rooms for all the hotel/restaurant/bars staff making sure that the other 95% of Patong is alive and kicking.

I see lots of posts by a certain poster repeatedly talking about closures here and for sale signs there. I frequent the beach road, rat-u-thit road and the third road regularly and I have been searching in vain to find any closures or for sale signs on these road, of course my eyesight is not what used to be so if anyone spots any signs please be good enough to let us know.

Now Bangla, that is a different story entirely. Imo Bangla shot itself in the foot some time ago roughly about the time Tiger 2 was ready to open and suddenly a mysterious fire burns down Tiger one. I used to frequent Bangla pretty much nightly in those days and remember that the front bars in the new tiger were commanding a whopping 7 million baht key money per bar for three years and the mugs were falling over each other to pay it, little realizing that by the time they had made enough money to pay that key money that the next one would be due absolutely crazy. Anyone who pays key money is a fool and if you are paying tea money you must be doing something illegal, another foolish move. This of course lead to a massive price hike for tourists who have put up with it for while but the word has spread as it does and people are discovering that that you can still go to Bangla to tick off your bucket list but you can also have a good inexpensive night out at other just as good venues. Don’t get me wrong Bangla will never die it is on millions of bucket lists worldwide thanks to social media but it is not the goldmine it once was and if the Thai owners/landlords don’t change their greedy ways they are I believe heading for a big surprise fall.

 I think most of the front bars on Bangla are probably still making money but nowhere near what they used to make, and the back bars they will just change hands again this low season until they change hands again next low season the cycle will continue ad in fini tum.

On 6/1/2017 at 8:16 AM, madmax2 said:

It would be interesting to know how many people who actually own and run businesses here are posting on this topic and how many do not and are just posting second hand information

Business is quite because there are far to many of the same businesses now compared to 10 years ago

I know of one guest house that had all the local business to itself until two others were built right next door to it with more modern and better facilities, the owner of the guest house complains about lack of business, his rooms are very basic and instead of upgrading them from no stars to 2 stars he just increased his prices for 2 years in a row at 100 baht a night , went from 400 to 600 baht a night for a room that was only worth 400 a night in my opinion compared we what we have seen and rented all over Thailand and now his rooms are usually empty

Accommodation, restaurants, massage shops, bike and car rental, bars you name it , there are to many of all of them  and not enough business to go around, a lot of new business owners here do not have a clue what they are doing and deserve to go under

There are a few business owners who post on this forum who are successful and know what they are doing but they are few and far between   

Hi all I’m back, did you miss me? Haha

You raise a very valid point mm2 and I am sorry I could not, until now, respond to it due to an impromptu offer I couldn’t refuse of an enforced holiday, if you get my drift.

I can see that you have had absolutely no response whatsoever from anyone to your first paragraph, not a great surprise I,m sure as I suspect there are not any current owners of business’s who actually operate one in Patong but still feel the need to contribute their second hand hearsay information and try to pass it off as genuine. Let’s see if we can induce any real current Patong business owners to contribute real firsthand knowledge to the thread? I will start by nailing my colours to the mast, if that is the correct term? ( not sure I am ex-army but I am sure you get the drift ).

My wife and I own and run three separate SME’s, as they call them here in Thailand, all in Patong, one has been going for about 4 years, one for about 3 years and one for just under 1 year. All the business’s are on Sois just off either side of Rat-U-thit rd. To date, and I touch wood when I say this, all three have, year on year, month on month, never failed to produce a profit. Believe me I am no genius if I can do it anyone can, I believe location, good service and attention to detail are three very important rules that can hopefully put anyone on the road to a successful business.

As an aside, and this is not firsthand knowledge so take it as you will, some of our suppliers are telling us that their orders and deliveries are up on the same time period last year. I hope they are right but caution is the name of the game.

Further to this one of our ventures involves association with a small hotel which specializes in self catering accommodations, and that business has been going now for about 6 years and has expanded by approx.. 12 to 15%  annually, and maintained an occupancy rate of 80%+ every year.

For all you Patong business owners please tell us how your business is doing?

4 hours ago, xylophone said:

Don't waste your time as he cannot understand what you are saying, just the same as he thought I had $2 million.........grey matter failure I'm afraid, oh, and childish misuse of my forum name, but then what can one expect!

 

Back on track, came out of hospital on Friday after a 5 day stay and was surprised to see a few more small shop closures (all Thai) and I feel sorry for these guys because as you mentioned in another post the world has changed around them and they are powerless to do anything about it (or words to that effect).

 

Also saw a new "low" with a guest-house offering a room for 5000 a month, but who can live running a business on 167 baht a night.

 

As if to add weight to the state of Patong at the moment please see the pics (at around lunchtime) that I took on Saturday in and around Jungceylon......

 

An empty Starbucks, empty fast food kiosks, empty restaurants (plenty of seats available!) and no-one poring over the sales items in Jungceylon.

 

Being a realist and seeing how things really are enables one to adapt............

You are joking right 

It is common knowledge that many of the Thais close up for the low season, see it every year.

If a guest house can fill just four rooms for 5000 a month that is quite a good earner for low season.

As for the pics it is low season you know don't you. I know when I am on holiday I usually don't

venture out until well past midday.

So really just a normal snapshot of low season in Phuket no?                

4 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

I remember 2 years ago members, including myself, were ridiculed for being doom and gloomers.  Any comment such as, they are killing the golden goose etc would have you branded as such.

 

Two short years later and look at the place.  Where will it be two years from now. 

 

So many business owners waiting out their leases with nothing to renew, or sell, at the end.  I know of a few that couldn't even wait out their lease in hope of better times.

 

Anyway, I wish all those in business here the best of luck, you are going to need it.

At least you are consistent you are still all doom and gloom, good luck with that.

8 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

 

Most of his post was not from a perspective, he simply pointed out some positive aspects of Phuket. 

 

So, why the rapid decline of the western tourism market, in favor of the Chinese package holiday makers, if all is going well here, give the positive aspect he mentioned?

Jesus man things change/happen, there isn't always a reason, that's life, move on, things will change/happen again.

You and your mates are probably the most negative people I have come across in some time. Wise up it will bring

you down in the end. Look on the bright side they are talking about a multi stop train service for the whole Island 

next year.        

Sorry, sorry I just couldn't resist sorry.

5 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

In general, I agree with Mysterion's description of Phuket, but something must be going terribly wrong here for Phuket to be losing it's western tourism market at the rate it is, and then having to resort to the Chinese market to boost numbers, and try to keep the revenue stream incoming.

 

A "view" is different to addressing economic indicators. 

 

Once again, you are playing the poster, not the post, with nothing really to contribute.

 

 

Not playing anyone just pointing out a different perspective which seems to be quite the 

opposite from you and a few others. Not claiming either is right but I personally favour 

Mysterons perspective, everyone is free to follow their own which ever that may be.

1 hour ago, Peterw42 said:

A good explanation here, Mainly aimed at undeveloped land, I think there may be some hastily erected houses.

 

http://www.ddproperty.com/en/property-news/2016/11/141397/new-land-and-building-tax-takes-effect-in-2017

Many thanks Peter42.

Hi all, I have been hearing off and on about this new land tax law, would be grateful if anyone

with knowledge of same could explain what it is and if possible how it functions?

Thanks to all respondents.

If this is in the wrong forum please feel free to move.