Thaiwine

Update Turkey.

If anybody doubts this coup was a Erdogan power play, think again.

The purge lists were prepared beforehand and amongst the ones to be purged:

- Military

- Police

- Journalists

- Civilian servants

- Businesspeople

- Political opponents

- Opposing religious figures

And so on

The numbers are reaching 12,000+

Now 8,000 police suspended

( maybe by their nuts )

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36824045

Or a less violent way would be to deport all muslims, but then you would have to deport all asians and africans too as maybe they are muslims too and lieing about their religion, and just have white people left, ohh but they can be muslim too, then you would need a border fence/wall patroled 24 hrs a day to stop jihadis sneaking in to kill people, and then no aircraft in or out your airspace maybe a kamikazi hijact an airliner.........

You wouldn't need to deport all Muslims.

For a long time in the UK, the Finsbury Park Mosque was taken over by extremist Islamist preachers. The very people that are turning young men to violence.

These people know the UK laws and they dance around us using our own laws against us, so that they can continue what they are doing in the name of freedom of speech and human rights.

People like Anjem Choudary are prime examples. He's a distasteful character and has been associated with many jihadis - including Michael Adebolajo, the man who beheaded Lee Rigby on a UK street.

Here's Anjem preaching with Michael just behind him.

If we can't even put a stop to this hate speech and intervene when British Mosques get taken over by radicals - then we are effectively doing nothing at the source.

What we are doing is looking for people once they become active.

Political correctness is preventing us from being pro-active. Anjem Choudary should not be a free man.

Look at him here:

Anjem is a radical. He is associated with extremists. He is open about his extremist views but he hides behind weak British laws. This is a clever man, he's not been ostracized by society, he is not an outcast. He has many people looking up to him

And him and his kind are very much part of the problem. We do nothing about people like him. In fact, he was living off benefits which he jokingly calls "Jihadiseeker's allowance" (after the British "Jobseekers allowance").

The whole thing is one huge joke.

Actually I agree with you, and anyone preaching hate shoud be deported, have spys in mosques weeding out the bad guys, change the law get rid of them.

Edit regarding my previous post, I was just going OTT as you were talking about nuking countries, lol

Or a less violent way would be to deport all muslims, but then you would have to deport all asians and africans too as maybe they are muslims too and lieing about their religion, and just have white people left, ohh but they can be muslim too, then you would need a border fence/wall patroled 24 hrs a day to stop jihadis sneaking in to kill people, and then no aircraft in or out your airspace maybe a kamikazi hijact an airliner.........

Many jump on the bandwagon of 'Scotland voted to stay part of the EU'

Where as the reality is the majority of the Scots who voted, voted for the UK to remain in the EU,

There were many questions / threats that came up between both referendum -- and an understanding that this would be the only referendum IF status-quo were to continue but.... if something like Scotland were pulled out against the popular vote of Scotland... then there would have to be another referendum.

Exit polling indicated in Scotland that many people who voted stay voted stay on condition of all the promises of devolution that were made (I am not up to date on these but shortly after there seemed to be backtracking).

Also one of the big "threats" where that if Scotland voted to leave the UK they would be voting to leave the EU (while the UK with veto power could hold them out). The inference to this threat is that a vote to stay in the UK would mean staying in the EU (which polling indicated the remain side would win at that time).

It seems very clear that the vote on which to remain in the UK should article 50 be executed starting Scotland leaving the EU.... is invalid since a lot of the reasons to remain in the UK would have been invalidated. It therefore makes logical sense to take it directly to the people of Scotland that given all the changes.... do you wish to remain in the UK or the EU -- assuming that some way could not allow for both.

Are you really against letting the people of Scotland democratically clear up this quandary?

To follow this train of thought, it would not be possible to have the EU referendum, as the Scots ind referendum was to stay in the UK, so by keeping a status quo of being in the EU, only a remain vote would keep things as they were. So giving the Scots determination over the UK

Impossible.

France is an extremely racist nationalistic Nation. Liberty Equality Fraternity is exclusively afforded to citizens of historical white French decent only. The French privileged elite. French born citizens of African West Indian decent are not considered 'Pure French'. Even after they have bleached themselves, stripped themselves of their identity and culture they are still not considered 'True French' aka 'white'.

The French have demonstrated they are totally incapable of integrating an ethnic minority into their Nation. Desperately high unemployment, lack of educational and advancement opportunities, high incarceration rates, millions living in slums surrounded by wealth and privilege unable to practice their religion.

France does not face an existential threat from Islam on foreign shores it faces a savage backlash from an oppressed and badly treated minority within its borders. All of their own doing.

I fail to see why a migrant would want to live in such a terrible place.

Scotland voted remain by a much greater factor than the margin by which brexit won overal

Let's all remember that this was before "Brexit", now that the situation radically changed, should be no surprise that if another referendum will take place, the result might be very different from the previous one, many people felt the need to continue to be part of a bigger union(for good reasons), but now that England has decided to isolate itself from the rest, i wouldn't be so sure about the outcome.

I agree -- it's a new situation, but the Scottish vote to remain seemed to be significant, and could now easily add to the numbers voting for independence -- assuming hard assurances can be given about Scotland's EU membership.

Many jump on the bandwagon of 'Scotland voted to stay part of the EU'

Where as the reality is the majority of the Scots who voted, voted for the UK to remain in the EU,

My eldest is at uni in the UK. She and all her uni mates are 'remainers', the most important reason being that "We'll all have to apply for visas to travel round Europe on our college trips and holidays if we leave the EU."

Compared to all those elders which would just blame all the evil of this world to foreigners, i would say that's already a huge step forward into the right direction

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Nothing wrong in going out and experiencing other cultures around the world, no need to limit yourself to EU countries,

For those who think a degree makes you intelligent it doesn't,

And the lack of a degree doesn't make you unintelligent.

The EU has found the answer to the proplem of so many migrants drowning trying to cross the med

Give them safe passage

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/07/16/eu-1safe-routes-migrants/

Turkey, has applied to join the EU...

A number of issues stand in the way particularly human rights and democracy, but only a few months ago there certainly was back room deal done on this in an attempt to curb the numbers of migrants reaching the EU via Turkey.

So what? Turkey has wanted to become an EU member for the past 25 years. A country does not become a EU member by simply applying to become one. No. Turkey doesn't and is not going to pass the barrier to become an Eu member. This should not be too difficult fact to understand. There is no need to repeat "If Turkey would have been an EU member", never again.

Turkey will not become an EU member. It's really simple as that as long as we talk about next 25 years timespan. After that, well, who knows what kind of country Turkey is and what kind of Country EU is. Yes, I did say 'Country'.

At the minute Turkey is holding a loaded (migrant) gun to the EU's head,

who will blink first.

May's statement following her recent trip to Scotland might suggest that Scotland's Government must agree to Brexit before Article 50 is invoked. Quite right too imo. We are the UK, we stand in support of each other. If Scotland says no, that is fine by me- it can't go ahead.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/politics/eu_referendum/results

From an electorate of 46.5 million people

17.5 million voted to leave, of which over 1 million scots voted to leave

16.1 million voted to Remain, of which 1.6 million scots voted remain,

so we should cancel the result, hmmm

No the result stands. We go ahead with the consent of Scotland and N.Ireland. It's not just about the result, it's the enactment of it. Like it or not, this is the real world not binary world! It's very difficult to make nations do something they don't want to. Good intentions fall by the wayside for many reasons. Nobody's refusing to do it, just saying it may not be possible without profound implications.

Of course if the Brexiteers should come up with the trade deal promised, I don't suppose there will be any opposition all round. Slim hope though. Parliament will never agree to a bad deal for UK anyway. Would you want that?

There is a difference between listening to and doing your best to take on board than being told what to do, of course all people of the union count after all the vote was for the UK not one part of the union,

The results stands but is ignored would not be wise in my opinion, as Nigel Farage said, if the government do not deliver on Brexit watch Ukip at the 2020 elections, I think he has a point.

I would think the way to go is to show that leaving the EU is in the best intrest of the UK and so taking away supporters from any nationalistic group, after all I feel British first and then English, this would be the type of patriotism to build on

May's statement following her recent trip to Scotland might suggest that Scotland's Government must agree to Brexit before Article 50 is invoked. Quite right too imo. We are the UK, we stand in support of each other. If Scotland says no, that is fine by me- it can't go ahead.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/politics/eu_referendum/results

From an electorate of 46.5 million people

17.5 million voted to leave, of which over 1 million scots voted to leave

16.1 million voted to Remain, of which 1.6 million scots voted remain,

so we should cancel the result, hmmm

A start would be not to give citizenship to any migrants, they are citizens of their original countries

Any children they bear should be dual nationals parents origin countries and host country

Grandchildren could become full nationals of host country.

Deportation and witdrawal of residency rights to first two groups for criminal activity.

Doesn't really deter anyone who has already blown himself up along with 100 innocent people.

I hear wat you are saying,

In this case the perp would /should have been deported before the act, as he had previous

Like many have said how do you stop this happening? I don't see that we can, perhaps minimize

Just deporting all muslims is not the answer however much it appeals to many.

A start would be not to give citizenship to any migrants, they are citizens of their original countries

Any children they bear should be dual nationals parents origin countries and host country

Grandchildren could become full nationals of host country.

Deportation and witdrawal of residency rights to first two groups for criminal activity.

I see that some are still pinning their hopes on a second referendum,

The noise's so far coming out of whitehall seem to say this is a pipe dream,

There has been no mention of putting the results of negotiations to a second referendum, and nor should they.

Actually I do think the remainers have a point that the majority was slim, but the rules were set for a majority win, so the result should stand.

So perhaps parliament should make all future referndums a min 60% majority with a min 75% turnout to alter any status quo.

The only time I support the need for super-majorities is when you are changing the written constitution -- since you are creating law that will potentially overrule the democratic will of the people at the time. The rest of the time 50% + 1 should be sufficient. Referendums are one of the most direct and democratic mechanisms for getting a mandate, more so than parliament which would still be able to change the laws with a simple majority. Proposals like this are more because you think your position is in the minority and you want to thwart the democratic will of what the referendum result will bring. In effect, the people are stupid and they must not make decisions for themselves.

No, what I am talking about is much the same as you, as we would have referendums for major decisions, so a clear majority for change.

I am in favour of governments taking surveys around major cities on lesser issues to get the feeling of the people, to guide their polices instead of telling us "we know whats best for you"

Owen Smith to offer referendum on Brexit deal if elected Labour leader

The MP said Labour should be sensible and mature about the outcome of the EU referendum. “I think there are many people out there who voted in good faith for Brexit and who felt they were doing the right thing for their families and their communities and I respect them for taking that decision,” he said.

“But I think a lot of people I know are now saying to themselves, ‘It wasn’t the right decision.’--http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/13/owen-smith-to-offer-referendum-on-brexit-deal-if-elected-labour-leader

Oh that should go down real well----"The MP said Labour should be sensible and mature about the outcome of the EU referendum."

The definition of sensible & mature = we keep sending you back for a re-vote time & time again, until we get an answer that suits us...................

Not quite! A referendum of such importance should have been based on at least a 60% majority with a 75% poll participation. As such this referendum should be repeated on such a new basis.

So, assuming that there is a new referendum and 2 million of Brexit over Remain voters now switches their votes to Remain. This would mean that the results would be 52:48 in favour of Remain.

Does that mean that there would have to be yet another referendum and so on until there is a 60% majority? You will cripple the country!

Actually I do think the remainers have a point that the majority was slim, but the rules were set for a majority win, so the result should stand.

So perhaps parliament should make all future referndums a min 60% majority with a min 75% turnout to alter any status quo.

Just read David Davis's vision of how Brexit will work.

I like it except for the delay in triggering artical 50,

http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2016/07/david-davis-trade-deals-tax-cuts-and-taking-time-before-triggering-article-50-a-brexit-economic-strategy-for-britain.html

I see Boris Johnson is the new Foreign secretary

That will please some of the posters here lol

If the EU does not quickly secures his borders and not stop this unhindered influx of economic refugees, we will soon have civil war.

It seems France's head of intelligence agrees with you

Published yesterday in the Mail Online

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3685561/France-verge-civil-war-sparked-mass-sexual-assault-women-migrants-intelligence-chief-warns.html

If it took a civil servant three minutes to check one signature for authenticity that would be twenty in an hour given an eight hour working day that would be one hundred and sixty a day, divide 4,000,000 by 160 you get 25,000 days, divide by 5 days you get 5,000 weeks, if you had 100 civil servants, it would still take one year, somehow I don't think they bothered

Numbers have dropped as the borders from greece are closed now migrants are stuck in Greece and cannot get to Germany or other EU states.

So anyway, either of the two represents a shift to the right compared to Cameron, correct?

With Leadsom being more right wing than May, correct?

You may be right, then again you may be wrong. Right, left, who knows. No referendum for the new leader. Why not? No one voted for either. Democracies little foibles.

Each of the two candidates were voted for to get to be MP's,

The new PM will be voted into the Prime ministers job by the party membership, so the new PM will have been voted for twice

By the electorate? No. Why bother with the Brexit referendum? GE before Christmas is coming if the "people" matter.

We have a British system not an American one,

I don't see an GE anytime soon, we have enough instability as the current PM has showed his lack of statesmanship.

So anyway, either of the two represents a shift to the right compared to Cameron, correct?

With Leadsom being more right wing than May, correct?

You may be right, then again you may be wrong. Right, left, who knows. No referendum for the new leader. Why not? No one voted for either. Democracies little foibles.

Each of the two candidates were voted for to get to be MP's,

The new PM will be voted into the Prime ministers job by the party membership, so the new PM will have been voted for twice