4MyEgo

Fair enough mate, we all have different opinions and that's ok, hence the reason we are discussing the issue at hand. The guys I know have been here for decades and don't lodge tax returns, and one of them worked overseas for years. I don't believe anyone declares themselves as non residents when they leave Australia, perhaps except for myself as I earn interest from banks & they with hold tax and give it to the ATO. My other investments are not taxable as a non resident or the tax is already taken out when payments are made to me. Th pension is interesting to me because I am 50/50 on getting applying for it when the time arrives, albeit it the 2 years in jail is the stickler i.e. is it feasible for me, and from what I have worked out, it isn't unless I buy a 2 bedroom pad for that period vs renting, but that would then mean taking my funds out of investments which earn me money, so there would be a loss of income for those 2 years, and I earn more than what the pension would provide me, anyways, it is what it is and we will cross that road when the time comes, depending on what the world is doing and how economics play out then. The question I have is why haven't Age Pensioners being paying tax while overseas and all of a sudden there is TALK that's all, TALK that things are going to change come 1 July 2024 because they are going to change the days that will determine your residency status. Now Centrelink are linked up to border control and know when you leave the country, as soon as you pass through immigration, and if you are on the dole, your payments stop straight away, and as soon as you enter the country, they start again. The above said, why doesn't that happen with the Age Pensioner, ask yourself that, it's because Age Pensioners have the right to exit without an issue, even though the same government department is paying you. I don't like TALK, links to government legislation is what I read and like to see, because that is what makes law. Until such time I see that Age Pensioners are taxable if they live overseas on their Age Pension, then I am sticking with what I hear at the coal face with the guys I know that live here and don't pay tax on their Age Pensions, can you name one you know that pays tax as a non resident, just asking for a friend :)

To provide the link to the legislation that states that to be the case. Do you believe everything you read, ask yourself this, how many times have you heard, Centrelink, Services Australia, the ATO said this, yet the staff who play many roles, with the staff getting it wrong, hence providing a link to the legislation makes things concrete as opposed to what "Blake" from the ATO said in an ATO thread. Conclusion "Blake" is WRONG.

Please do provide this link so that I can b brought up to speed.

Or what ?

Again, you didn't read my post, you cannot find anything in the legislation that states that an Age Pensioner has to pay the 32c in the $ if they live overseas, look at the keyword I highlighted in bold from the ATO link, which means squat if your only source of income is the Age Pension when you live overseas. Note the key word below is all income, but if your only source of income is the Age Pension, you won't pay tax on it, same as in Australia. If you disagree, then put up, show US where it says the Age Pension is taxable by it's self if you are a non resident. I couldn't show you a link that says it's taxable as a non resident if it's your only source of income. So accept the fact, it is what it is. As a foreign resident for tax purposes, you will pay income tax according to foreign resident rates. This means for all income under $180k, you'll pay 32.5c per dollar. You would only report and pay tax on your Australian-sourced income to us. You'll likely be eligible for the seniors and pensioners tax offset (SAPTO) though, meaning you'll get a tax offset to help counter the tax payable. You don't have to be a resident for tax purposes to receive this.

I would say you didn't read my full post ? Extract: There is NOTHING that says Age Pensioners have to pay tax if they live overseas. I believe where people get their nickers twisted is when the Age Pension is assessable income, i.e. when other sources of income come into the mix, e.g. hypothetically speaking, if I am a non resident, and I am on the Age Pension and I am living overseas and I make an income from other sources, then I have to file a tax return and ALL of it goes into the mix and gets taxed, the only difference is there is no $18,200 threshold, plus the tax rate is higher for non residents. If you are a non resident and you don't have any other source of income, then your pension is not assessable, same if you are a resident in Australia. This all makes sense to me, and that is why they don't tax Australian's on the Age Pension and non residents on the Age Pension.

From my extensive research on the Age Pension over the years, it is clearly written that the Australian Age Pension is not taxable in Australia if it is your only source of income, however if you receive other money, be it from dividends, working part time etc etc, then it all gets assessed on the Australian Taxation Scale, meaning your Age Pension also gets taxed, as all the income is in one basket, lets not forget you get the $18,200 tax free threshold. Google, copied and pasted: The Age Pension forms part of your taxable income. However, if it is your only source of retirement income, you will pay no tax. If you're on the Age Pension, you also receive health benefits and reduced charges on rates, telephones, gas and electricity, car registration and public transport. https://www.ato.gov.au/individuals-and-families/income-deductions-offsets-and-records/income-you-must-declare/government-payments-and-allowances#ato-Taxfreegovernmentpensionsorbenefits Now, as far as I can see, the Age Pension has not come up anywhere in writing as being taxable overseas, that's because it's not, and will not be come 1 July 2024. The rate of 32% as some scaremongers are and have suggested won't happen, why, because it is not assessable income in Australia if you have no other source of income, now read that last part again, yep, my interpretation is, because the Age Pension is not assessable income in Australia if you have no other source of income, then it won't be taxed, regardless if your living overseas, suffice to say I know a few on the Oz Age Pension living here for years and they don't pay tax, and they are non residents. https://www.ato.gov.au/individuals-and-families/coming-to-australia-or-going-overseas/your-tax-residency There is NOTHING that says Age Pensioners have to pay tax if they live overseas. I believe where people get their nickers twisted is when the Age Pension is assessable income, i.e. when other sources of income come into the mix, e.g. hypothetically speaking, if I am a non resident, and I am on the Age Pension and I am living overseas and I make an income from other sources, then I have to file a tax return and it ALL of it goes into the mix and gets taxed, the only difference is there is no $18,200 threshold, plus the tax rate is higher for non residents. If you are a non resident and you don't have any other source of income, then your pension is not assessable, same if you are a resident in Australia. This all makes sense to me, and that is why they don't tax Australian's on the Age Pension and non residents on the Age Pension. Those saying that come 1 July is going to be a bad day for Australian Age Pensioners who are non residents are unfortunately talking BS in my opinion. I will stand corrected if they can back it up with some link stating the obvious, i.e. that overseas Age Pensioners who are non residents are taxed at 32%, now please don't send me an ATO link where someone online sent in a query and was told they pay 32% tax, that is because they also have an income on top of their Age Pension. Now to cover something else you mentioned later on in a post regarding tax in Thailand. I copied and pasted the below, so I can't take credit for it, and as it was from another source I suggest you and others peruse it, as it does make sense. Income that is remitted to Thailand is assessable in Thailand, funds that remain outside Thailand are not. If we take the simplest type of income and say that you transfer personal savings from overseas to Thailand and those savings were earned before 1 January 2024, those funds are not assessable. But savings earned after that date are, hence the date when the income is earned is extremely important. A word of caution, you may be asked to provide proof that savings were earned before 1 January 2024. Another common type of income is pensions, which can be complicated, depending on the type of pension and the country that it comes from. The country of origin is important because there are over 60 different types of Dual Tax Agreements, sometimes called Double Taxation Agreements (DTA’s), between Thailand and those 60+ countries and each one is different. As a general rule, most private or company pensions from most countries appear to be assessable here but YOU will need to confirm that yours is or is not. If that is true, private and company pension income IS assessable income in Thailand. US Social Security payments, a form of pension paid to some older people, can only be taxed by the US under DTA rules and Thailand is forbidden from taxing them, this means those payments are NOT assessable income. UK State pension on the other hand is not covered by a DTA so it is assessable income in Thailand whilst UK Government or Civil Service and NHS pensions are not! Australian old age pension is assessable income in Thailand. Taxable Income per year (Baht) Tax rate: 0 – 150,000 Exempt 150,000 – 300,000 5% 300,000 – 500,000 10% 500,000 – 750,000 15% 1,000,000 – 2,000,000 25% 2,000,000 – 4,000,000 30% Over 4,000,000 35% The Thai tax system contains a series of Allowances, Deductions and Exemptions that will help you reduce your tax bill and they are very generous. It is easily possible for the average expat foreign retiree to reduce their taxable income by 500,000 baht or more each year. For example, a retiree aged 65 years of age, married and living here full time, supporting a Thai wife who has no income and doesn’t file tax return, is allowed the following: a. Personal Allowance for self - 60,000 b. Personal Allowance for wife - 60,000 c. Over age 65 years exemption - 190,000 d. 50% of pension income received, up to 100k - 100,000 e. In addition, the first 150,000 of assessable income is zero rated and free of tax Additional deductions and allowances exist for health or life insurance premiums paid in Thailand. A complete list of deductions, allowances and exemptions can be found here https://www.rd.go.th/english/6045.html or from Sherrings below. https://sherrings.com/personal-tax-deductions-allowances-thailand.html I HOPE THE ABOVE HELPS CLEAR THINGS UPS, WITHOUT GETTING INTO A TENNIS MATCH WITH SOME.

I noticed that they have watered it down to make more profit, call me paranoid, but I noticed the difference just after Covid restrictions were lifted, suffice to say, I believe they did this to recoup the losses during Covid. Well that's my take on it.

https://www.resmed.co.th/

I'm with you on that, heard about this a year ago and here we are, nothings changed.

Everything (property) in Sydney goes up in value over time, that said, a studio wouldn't suit me as I would be bringing the wife and 2 kids over for 8 weeks each year, so the kids will require a room, a studio would be depressing, especially when coming from a very large house. One also has to think about resale, e.g. more buyers looking for 2 bedders, than 1 bedders of studio's, that said, I also know that the majority of studio's are under 50 square metres and banks won't led to anything under that.

I wouldn't need the wife then, suffice to say, she has a roll to play, as I do, I am the ATM, or as she puts it, broken ATM

Every immigration office has different rules, so stick with what your immigration office requires. For the past 7 years, my immigration office has always required, embassy verified translation of PP from the very first application, to the end of my old passport expiry date, e.g. expired in November 2023, I then went and saw them in September 2023 when I received the new passport and had them transfer the stamps to the new passport. My marriage extension expires at the end of this month (January) and I called them as I wasn't getting any answers here on the forum, and the immigration officer advised me to bring all the docs as usual verifying my PP (old), and the new PP, but next year I won't require the verification papers of my PP (old), just my new PP and all stamped pages along with my photo page.

My Passport expired in November 2023, I had the new Passport in September and had the stamps transferred then, my marriage extension expires 31 January 2024. I have since spoken to immigration and they advised to bring the papers I have been using, i.e. copies of the old passport translations (Oz) and the new Passport and next year I won't need to use the translation papers for the old passport, as the new Passport will be a continuation of the old Passport, if that makes sense.

I don't believe it matters. I will take copies of the old paperwork and passport, that should cover it.

Fortunately for me, we know how to enjoy things on the cheap with the wife also making cut lunches, why waste it when you don't have to.

Agree with you on that, the governments have nothing else to prop the country up with, so they create schemes to keep everyone in the property market, they of course receive the stamp duty on transfers, plus the capital gains tax on sales, not to mention foreign vendor taxes, on top of land taxes. There will come a time, that there is a correction, however having been in the industry in all facets of it, I haven't seen that correction since entering it in 1987.

You have no idea what your talking about, not all properties (units) go down in value, the smaller the block, the better, close proximity rail for the City e.g. within a 15km radius is another plus.

I am pretty sure the Sydney market where I would be looking to buy can increase 3.5% per year for 2 years, besides, repairs and maintenance would be minimal, if any as I would be buying something already renovated, or partly renovated, besides a hot water system, not much can go wrong with a unit. Naturally you would put it on the market 3-6 months before you decide to return and settlement can occur around the time you are anticipating your departure with portability in play. I have never lost on a resale on property in Sydney, you just have to know where to buy, when to buy, and know which are the agents you buy from and the agents you sell with. Worst case scenario, if it doesn't sell, I can borrow against it and use those funds to trade until it sells, that or lease it and pay tax on it, but leaving it empty would be a better proposition while using the borrowed (line of credit) funds to trade until it is sold.

I am about to apply for the annual marriage extension and am printing off my usual truck load of documents and noticed that every year, for the past 7 years I have had to print off copies of my passport translation, i.e. government stamped copies of my passport confirming it's authenticity. The question I have now is, as I have a new passport and had the old stamps transferred to the new passport back in September, will they still require me to get this new passport stamped by the issuing government office as the old one was, or do I still provide them with the old government stamped copies of my old passport and provide that to them with my new passport. I would assume that they would want everything as per normal, plus the new passport, but hey, you got to ask the question, after all, we are talking about over zealous immigration officers from my experience over the years.

Ah yes the annual run around and mountain of repeated paperwork for those got nothing else to do immigration offices to approve us an extension. As everyone mentioned and you are aware, you will require a new Kor Ror from your Amphur, 20 baht, wife gets ours while she leaves me at the bank for an hour waiting to get the letter of adequate funds in account from a few months prior, usually get photos across the road as well, if I don't have any from previous years, and then we go and drop it all off with a smile the day after, but not before getting my bankbook updated on the day, e.g. ATM withdrawal of 1,000 baht, then walk into bank and ask for bankbook to be updated, then get 2 copies of bankbook page to go with the other photocopies of the bankbook pages. Don't forget to take ALL of your paperwork and (more) just in case they ask you for more, plus the exact amount to pay, i.e. 1,900 baht, otherwise you more than likely won't see your 100 baht change. I hate this time of the year, but have it down pat, however it still takes at least 10 hours by the time you print everything off, go to where you need to go and drive to immigration and home. To think I have better things to do

Mother in-law should have taught him to iron, wash his clothes, and cook when he was younger, then booted him out when he finished his studying, either school or Uni, as we did with ours, so that they could look after themselves. She sounds like a doting mother, got to feel for the wife, she should GTF out of there, ASAP. My wife does everything, including the plumbing, not because I won't help her, she just won't have it, however of late, she agrees for me to hang out and bring in the clothes, clearing the table after dinner, bringing in the big water bottles after delivery once a week, driving the kids to school and putting the garbage out. She only agreed to this change about a year ago as I told her that I my rear end was getting sore sitting on it most of the time not doing anything, that said, it did take over a decade for her to agree to the change. I have to admit that It was VERY hard ALL of those years being told that I can't do anything because I was a useless, good for nothing farang, only good for making money. Yes I know, they broke the mould when they made this one

Living in a caravan for 2 years has got to be hard for anyone, that said, I would want to live within a 30 minute drive of my daughters place and a couple of mates that I know, for when getting together. My objective would be to enjoy the 2 years while there, e.g. train rides, site seeing, beach walks etc. Buying a 2 bedroom unit would be perfect for me as the wife and kids would have somewhere to stay for March/April school holidays when they come over for the 2 year period, and me going back to Thailand in October when the kids have school holidays shouldn't be an issue with Services Australia as I believe they allow you a 2 week trip per year and if that is the case, I would only be away from the family for 5 months at a time, which I believe is doable. While the unit will have strata levies to pay, plus council and water rates, the initial outlay, plus stamp duty and legal costs, should be recouped when I sell after the 2 year portability period is granted, that said, the outlay won't be generating me an income, but will save me about $40,000 renting for 2 years after taking away $12,000 for the above outgoings. It would be pointless making $40,000 a year on the money that I would outlay o the unit, as I usually make per year, because most would reduce the pension to nothing, suffice to say, they have you cornered every way you turn.

Hey, now there's a job you might consider doing when your there doing your 2 year stint, cause havoc.

That's a tough call, suppose you have to weigh it all up, but the rent free situation would provide you with around 30,000 a month there, as for here when portability kicks in, is another story, maybe 20,000 baht a month say, still better than a kick in the teeth. The above said, if you received $300 a week, you would want to make sure you could live on that for the 2 years. I think you should be right, and if you could, all you lost was 2 years of being here, so unless you have family here, it would be a personal choice and whether say 20,000 baht a month, so to speak would improve your quality of life here for the remaining years you would have left to kick here, now that could be anything from 2 to 22 depending on genetics and lifestyle.