kwilco

" But it is cultural - that is the word racists use to cover up that they are racists. Like "It's a religion so that's not racist" ..and you're still obsessively playing the blame game.

read my posts. It's probably why you have such a negative view of driving in Thailand.

Ok - if you keep "having to" shout at taxi drivers - what do you conclude from that?

When it comes to road safety, you aren't even on page one - you are a road user like everyone else - where you sit has no bearing on the concept of understanding road safety - every comment you make shows you are still clinging to archaic dysfunctional perceptions that cloud your understanding. There is no such thing as a racially based tendency for any people or nationality to drive any worse or less skilfully than any others – and that includes Western expats. Idiot drivers form the same proportion of almost all societies regardless of race creed or colour. – it’s human nature that dictates this and it is what a society does do to contain those “idiots” that differs from country to country.

Ypou clearly heven't read my post that says that idiots are worldwide.

Yes

so - when you find yourself "shouting" (literally or otherwise) at other drivers you probably need to review your own driving. Again people can't let go of the nebulous concept of "bad driving" and the blame gain which means you don't even begin to grasp the concept of road safety. BYW - \i have far more driving experience than you in Thailand but also throughout the world - however, as I've said before I don't rely on anecdotal evidence I rely on my analytical and critical skills as well as my training.

how silly can you get? Clearly you don't want citations and as you admit know nothing yet you try to object - and yes, you are sealioning. It's simple - read my posts, if you don't don't agree say why....

You are now sealioning - the hallmark of someone without an argument. If you want a "citation" then you should fist check for yourself or put forward and alternative argument - which you can't do. it would seem. Would you =care to "cite" some of your own statements? Do I need to tell you what anecdotal evidence is?

If you find yourself shouting at other drivers especially in a foreign country, is it not most likely that you need to review your driving skills Most expat drivers fail to learn the local driving customs. Every country has its own set of driving customs, so it's important to learn and follow them when you are driving in a foreign country. Unfortunately rather than learn they tend to make up and cling to clichés that reinforce their own feelings of superiority. Foreigners who drive in Thailand frequently turn on the vitriol when it comes to talking about their fellow roads users...automatically excluding themselves from the equation and concomitantly implying that their driving skills are far superior to those of all Thai people. One thing that unites all human beings, regardless of age, gender, religion, economic status, or ethnic background, is that, deep down inside, they all believe that they are above-average drivers. There is a consistent view that OTHERS drive in a more risky manner than individuals themselves do. If you think this, you are probably wrong

Such a shallow thing to say – firstly there’s no such thing as an accident. ..and you are using a valueless sample criteria You comment has no statistical significance – “experience” is not a reliable predictor of crashes. – there are many other causes of apart from your driving. You are focusing on the past and not the future and your statement in no way can predict that you’ll continue to avoid accidents in the future – you can’t predict or account for changes in both Thai road safety and yourself. Teir is a myth that people are responsible for their “accident-free” driving. Essentially you are just being self-congratulatory and dangerously ignoring the overall risks of driving. You don’t even know how you would react in a sudden critical situation. Instead of focusing on the past or personal anecdotes, it's far more constructive talk about scientifically proven about safe driving practices, risk awareness, and proactive measures to minimize the likelihood of accidents. By focusing on current and FUTURE safety, you create a more responsible and accident-free driving environment for everyone

wherever I drive in the world I use all my mirrors etcto make certain where vehicles are on any side of me - not doing that is a flaw in someone's driving.

You are engaging in the blame game - so you have completely failed even to get the basics of road safety. Human error is a constant worldwide - once you understand that and stop the blame game then things can be done to rectify it. Playing the blame game was proves rubbish about 50 years ago - countries that don't doit have much lower death rates.

This is true if you drove in France in the 1960s and 70s you would apreciate the situation. In Thailand the base rule is that there is priority from the left. This again like being in a boat is engrained in Thai driving culture. most Westerners know nothing about rules of the road even in their own country they just learn by rote for their test and that's it - they don't understand that that is the "right" way and everyone else isn't the "wrong" way - they need to understand and adapt to driving in a foreign country. Rather than a home test colonialism they should show some understanding of what is going on instead of resorting to racist cliches.

You mean like you do?

You're beginning to understand! If you realise this then driving in Thailand will make sense - they know it but you don't

You are trying to justify victim blaming - this is sad becasue it underlines an unacceptable and blinkered set of values.

how many other offences weren't reported?

Victim blame - QED

I’m very dismayed to see so many comments that are engaging in victim blame – what sort of people post this stuff? Victim blaming in any situation is harmful and wrong, but it is especially damaging in the context of holiday rape cases. Victim blaming in holiday rape cases is especially harmful because it sends a message that women should not be able to enjoy their holidays without fear of violence. It also reinforces the idea that women are responsible for the safety of men’s behaviour, which is simply unfair and untrue. These kind of remarks reinforce harmful stereotypes about victim behaviour. Blaming victims for their assaults reinforces the idea that women are responsible for preventing their own rapes. This can be especially harmful for women who are traveling or living abroad, as they may be more likely to be blamed for their assaults. It also raises the question of why people engage in these statements. “There but for the grace of God….”???? All this perpetuates the cycle of violence. When we blame victims, we send a message that rape is acceptable or inevitable under certain circumstances, They are normalising a culture of violence to women making it more likely that future assaults will occur. These people are attempting to shift focus away from the perpetrator's actions; we are essentially saying that the rapist's actions were not entirely their faut, or that they were in some way justified or we might have succumbed to the same urge. It creates a culture of impunity for rapists. This “blame game” shames and silences victims - When victims are blamed for their assaults, they may feel too ashamed and afraid to come forward. This can prevent them from seeking help and support, and it can also make it more dificult for them to heal from their trauma. We can see from this report that the woman was reluctant to come forward – “the survivor broke her silence, urging caution to lone female travellers.” [Thaiger article]. This is a familiar pattern from previous incidents in Thailand when even the PM got involved with inappropriate comments. In Thailand it also undermines the already fragile justice system. (as seen with the Prayuth comments) When blame is apportioned to victims of assault , it can make it more difficult for them to get justice in the courts. This then strengthens the culture of impunity for rapists, which can only exacerbate the problem of sexual violence in the Kingdom.

You're playing the blame game, so you're basically on a hiding to nothing. It's already been established the lines are incorrectly positioned at that junction and hitting a stationary vehicle legally puts the other drive in the wrong.

re blame game - QED

I think the main problem with people on this site, the public in general and unfortunately the Thai leaders is that they don't see road safety as a public health issue and find it impossible to wrench themselves away from the "blame game". THis is a terribly unproductive way of looking at raod safety - as soon as words like "Tai drivers" 'bad driving" "his fault" come up the process is doomed. Below is a link to an Australia view on the blame game that outlines why it is a waste of time.... https://roadsonline.com.au/stopping-the-blame-game/

You don't see what I see - and we both don't see the woman until she enters the frame. te most salient point ,though is we both see the same video differently, which shows how misleading por unreliable they can be - and I'm trained to look at still and moving images. It's also worth pointing out that the man was stationary when the other bike hit him.

The 5 pillars of road safety are 1. Education 2. Enforcement 3. Engineering 4. Emergency 5. Evaluation In relation to this video how do they apply? Firstly we must acknowledge that the videos doesn’t show the whole picture – particularly the course of the woman when out of camera shot and the angles of visibility. Education Both parties involved clearly have little education on road safety – most governments do this but in Thailand it is almost non-existent, they didn’t even think to wear crash helmets and are using pee-taught driving techniques that are common to Thai road users. The woman clearly had restricted control over her vehicle. This means when human error occurs the results tend to be more serious than they need to be. (my guess is the woman saw the bike come out of the junction and assumed she would pass behind, but the man saw her late and stopped thinking she would go in front – the resulting combination of human errors - split second judgements – meant the collision occurred) Enforcement No -one stopped them from driving without helmets or carry an under-age passenger Engineering means both vehicles and roads – we can’t judge the vehicles but as has been pointed out there are several concerns about the junction – road markings and visibility been the most obvious. Emergency – the response time in the UK for SERIOUS injury is 8 minutes (at present this doesn’t happen very often) BUT in Thailand there are no targets and no uniform emergency services, first responders or paramedics. Evaluation – as can be seen by the nonsense promulgated on this thread alone analysis and metrication of this accident is pure conjecture by amateurs. Will the police do any better - of course not! The result is we learn nothing from this to help prevent future crashes PS – “sneaking round the corner” i=s not a complete description. The man is obviously being cautious because he can’t see properly and the lines of travel is extremely common on Thai roads – if you want to understand this then you need to understand that unlike Europe where road travel was common before the motorcar, in Thailand the main mode of transport was by boat – the traffic sense, rules and behaviour stem largely from that culture hence the line of the male motorcyclist. If you repeat to yourself whilst driving in Thailand “I’m in a boat” “I’m in a boat” you’ll suddenly find you for in with the traffic much better. Of course if you’ve never navigated a boat on a river, it may not be that apparent to you. You have to shed your horse and cart mentality for a boat one.