kwilco

Moving the goals posts somewhat That is also a form of sealioning - they are referring to Irish immigration post war - you are moving the goalposts by adding extra qualifications after your argument has been shown to be flawed.

your fallacy this time is "Appeal to tradition" – an argument supported by the fact the it has long held to be true - and is in reality not true.

Sorry it IS sealioning the answer is tangential to the topic - "its well known that Irish builders did like a drink " - you don't seem to recognise your own sweeping generalisations as pure prejudice and assumption... but.... I think you should rethink your assumptions…. (L Greenslade 1, M Pearson, M Madden - 1995) [There are] “long-standing stereotypes [that] portray Irish people as prone to use alcohol to excess. The article traces the historical origins of those stereotypes, and examines evidence drawn from a range of sources in Ireland and Britain about alcohol consumption, attributed hospital admissions and mortality.” It finds that rates of abstinence from alcohol are higher in Ireland than in Britain, and amongst migrants, the Irish are no more likely to consume alcohol than the indigenous population. Data from the General Household Survey indicated that people of Irish birth or parentage are no more likely than the British born to use alcohol at all.

See 29 - microaggressions

more sealioning!

Racism is a form of ignorance It is not based on facts, evidence or rational deduction and thought, it is based on prejudices and assumptions. Some on this thread seem to be remarkably un-informed on the topic of racism and consequently on racism in the UK. – they just rely on prejudice and assumption Furthermore some on this thread seem to have difficulty in following the discussion. They have repeatedly misread and misinterpret other peoples’ posts and their arguments just aren’t arguments. For example with my post that lists 30 possible clichés of racism. The premise is “Tropes and clichés used by racists ………. “If you can tick any one of these you are probably a racist’ They seem to think the list is complete and exclusive – it looks as if they don’t understand the premise based on “tropes” and “clichés” – consequently your arguments are largely fallacious falling into false dichotomies, false syllogisms etc and literal naïve interpretations One form of racism is those racists who don’t want to admit they are racists because of how stupid it makes them look , so characteristically they spend a lot of time arguing that they or something they said isn’t racist, but the more they do, the ore they confirm their basic racist beliefs. Another form of racist, as I pointed out earlier, a racist in the same sense as an alcoholic – they are in denial and there is less chance of ever overcoming the problem. In fact many people who hold racist views really believe they aren’t racist but ignorance prevents them from understanding this. They resort to assumption myth and misinterpretation of the evidence to continue their denial. UK thinks it’s come a log way with racism, but the reality is far from that – the fact that all forms of racism still exist in the UK id evidence of this – and those who pat themselves on the ack are in turn being racist themselves – denying there is a problem and helping to reinforce racism by their lack of resistance to it.

It just gets worse and worse!

I guess they all looked the same to you? The vast majority of “black” immigrants to the UK in the 1950s were from the West Indies and they came because they HAD JOBS with people like London Transport. I don’t think most people realise that over 2 million people EMIGRATED from the UK after WW2 to the 1960s to the point that governments were really concerned that Britain would not be able to rebuild itself. Those of the Windrush generation were key to rebuilding the country – and now 60 years on, some have been threatened with repatriation – how racist can the UK get?

Seriously? Africans??? - sweeping generalisations! Have you never heard of "Windrush"?

It's called 'sealioning." A passuve aggressive tactic of ŕepeatedly asking for unnecessary citations and references. Usually when someone doesn't have a coherent argument.

I think it would help a lot of people to understand racist Britain if the watched this Ashley Banjo program on ITV https://www.itv.com/hub/ashley-banjo-britain-in-black-and-white/10a1611a0001

Very wide of the mark....As many politicians have openly discussed a coup in just the last few months You underestimate the place of the coup as a tool in everyday politics in Thailand. Not sure what you think constitutes "moral authority" for coup? You also overlook the army's belief that they have an inalienable right to run the country. They also have a guaranteed majority in parliament thanks to the current condition. However the Taksin side of politics has since the beginning of this century had by far the largest following and potential majority. The media has had to downplay this and the government has tried to culture an image of an opposition that is spent and unimportant. Despite this they haven't lost an inch. How this will play out after an election remains to be seen. But the pheu Thai will certainly demand constitutional reform to get the military out of politics....but how they try to achieve this will determine how soon a coup will happen. My guess is massive protests in Bkk will allow the army to step in to ". "restore order". So yes, there could very well be a coup....it is a way of life in Thai politics. Let's hope that it doesn't escalate into major bloodshed. This is not the norm for coups in Thailand

Like Trump or Rishi Sunak?

There appear to be no limits to your non-racist beneficence!

As I said earlier - ".....doth protest to much, me thinks" As I said earlier being a racist is similar to being an alcoholic - until you admit you are one there is nothing you can do about it.

again a false syllogism - be interested to know where you get that idea from.

Mick - what are you actually arguing? That you are NOT racist or that your are? or something else?

Have to say, I've cut and pasted that answer - "no stop changing words" - has got to be pure gold!

sorry if that is too much for you let me elucidate Racists make sweeping subjective generalisations about nationality, creed, colour “Land of Smiles” is a sweeping Statement Therefore “Land of smiles” is racist? There is no logical connection between C the conclusion and the first 2 statements. I'm guessing you won't understand that.

That comes under 16 - “Some of my best friends are…..”

I think I've mentioned this to you before - that is a false syllogism - a logical fallacy e.g. Dogs have 4 legs My cat has 4 legs therefore my cat is a dog.

It's a pity that people don't understand history and how it relates to today. "No dogs no Iraish no coloureds" were legal until the 1960s as was discrimination re employment, but laws were brought in to prevent this. It means that most people didn't agree with these attitudes but it doesn't mean they don't exist anymore. Nowadays racists try ti hide their racism....see the list I posted. But institutional racism has been here for decades and still exists....if you understand a little of the history, you can see where it comes from and how it survives. Complacency is racism best friend. People who sit back and do nothing in the face of evil are as bad as those who commit it.

Sorry, I don't understand. Who can? Do you mean a work permit? If so what sort are you referring to?

It seems many people on this thread are trying to make a poin but don't know what that point is, or maybe they just don't know how to read a graph?

4 chancellors in 4 months! And a nearly 100% turnaround by the new chancellor on the PM’s policy on which she was elected about a month ago.. Today sees one of the biggest U-tuns in British history! There are pros and cons for a cheap pound but beyond this there is the reputation of the UK - and this as been smashed thanks to successive Tory admins culminating in the extreme and predicted stupidity of Lz Truss - who's dogma-based decisions will mean she will be booted out , probably by the end of the week - but this still won't fully repair the UK's international reputation. ... The Bank of England stated last week that before this government, the UK was regarded internationally as financially as secure as the USA and Germany, now they are regarded on the same level as Italy and Greece – except the UK doesn’t have the might of the EU to back them up. Until 2016 the pound was buying the dollar between 1.60 and 1.40. After 2016 it has fallen steadily until today with the chancellor’s announcement of a 100% U-turn, it has RISEN – to a level of 1.13, still way below its pre-Brexit level.