007 RED

8 hours ago, Dave0206 said:

qatar are still flying cheapest 1 way ticket(which is all he needs) 16.500 baht 23hrs or 31.000 for shorter flight times so not so bad

Dave…. Like you’re thinking, but unfortunately it isn’t quite that simple. 

Air transportation of deportees is governed by international regulations which are laid down by the International Civil Aviation Organisation (ICAO), who operate under the auspices of the United Nations (UN).

Firstly, the deportee should be transported back to their home country by the most direct route, and whenever possible by the national carrier of the deportee’s home country, if there is one.  It should be noted that if a national carrier is available they cannot refuse to transport the deportee unless there are serious concerns about the deportee (as given below). 

In cases where there is no direct route, or no national carrier, and a stop over and/or a change of carrier is involved, the carriers involved in transporting the individual back to their home country will need to agree to transport the deportee. In this situation non-national carrier(s) can refuse to transport the deportee because of the additional costs that they will incur due to providing security, accommodation etc during the stop over (risk of the deportee doing a runner during the stop over).

Secondly Immigration must carry out a comprehensive risk assessment of the individual and this must be submitted to the carrier(s) before they agree to transport the individual.  If the deportee has shown any tendency towards violence, abusive behaviour or have serious mental health issues the airline (even the national carrier) can refuse to transport the person if they are not escorted.

Obviously if an escort(s) is/are required the deportee will also bear the additional cost involved with providing the escort(s) e.g. return airfares, accommodation and possibly salary etc.

Thirdly, Immigration will need to approve any proposed transportation/routing of the deportee as they (Immigration) will notify their counterparts in the deportees home country (and stop over if applicable) of the pending arrival of the deportee and reasons for the deportation, so that a ‘welcoming party’ can be arranged.

I'm aware that if I have a drone I need to obtain permission/licence to fly it from the CAAT etc.  I'm considering building a scale model warship and fitting it with a Radio Control system.  Can anyone advise me if I require permission/licence to operate model RC equipment in Thailand.  If I do, where do I go to obtain the permission/licence?

40 minutes ago, Trillian said:

That office does a same day service which is in at 9:30 am, out by 4pm, the cost is double the normal certification fee, 800 baht vs 400 baht.

Wow... CM office is expensive.... 400THB/page for normal service (next day) and 800THB/page for express service (same day)... Is this 'double pricing' for farang?

FYI..... Chaeng Watthana (BKK) charge 200THB/page for normal service (next day) and 400THB/page for express service (same day).  If you want them to return your documents by EMS they charge 60THB extra.

Post deleted

phungo .... FYI.... You can only get a translation of your marriage certificate etc certified by that Legalisation Division of the Department of Consular Affairs, Ministry of Foreign Affairs which is located at 123 Chaeng Watthana Road, Bangkok 10210.  The Legalisation Division does not have any offices located in the 'sticks' of in local Amphur offices as another member has indicated - maybe confused with Thai ID and passports issuing.

As another member has indicated, there are freelance translators who will approach you as you enter the building.  However, if you go up the escalator to the 2nd floor, immediately in front of you there is a small translation shop. 

The bonus of using this shop is that they already have 'translation templates' for most, if not all circumstances, and more importantly, the people who check the translation are employees of the Legalisation Division who do the translation checking  during their 'free time'.  As a result, the translation is very unlikely to have any errors and be rejected.  Their charges are compatible with what you will pay at most translator shops in BKK, about 400/500 BHT per page of A4 (depending upon complexity), and they will for an extra charge get the document(s) certified and posted back to you by EMS, or you can collect them if you prefer.

Hope this helps.

1 hour ago, rumak said:

well,  that is certainly a lot "clearer than mud" ..... as the OP has so put others comments.

I don't see a thank you from him......  

Thanks for your observation.... I'm not in it for the 'brownie points', but its nice to know that the information given is appreciated.... so as the Thais say.... Mia Pen Rai (No Problem).

OP.... Firstly congratulations on eventually deciding to take the plunge and marry your long term partner.

As someone has already mentioned, and I would fully endorse, you should visit the amphur where you propose to marry and enquire what documents that they require.  This is because undoubtedly each amphur will have its own list of requirements and you want to be sure that when you arrive there to get married you have all the correct documents and don't have your day ruined because you missed something which they require.

What you will need (in all cases) is an Affirmation of Marital Status certified by the British Embassy.  If you go to the Embassy link https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/information-for-british-nationals-intending-to-marry-in-thailand you will find all the details of what you need to obtain the affirmation.  You may also need a certified copy of your passport which can be done at the same time - some Amphurs require this, some don't.

Once you have obtained the certified Affirmation of Marital Status (and certified copy of passport if required) from the British Embassy you will need to get the affirmation translated into Thai and have then have the Thai translation certified by the Consular Division of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs (MFA) in Bangkok.  FYI -  some translation services can arrange (at an additional cost) to have their translation certified by the MFA.

As for having your marriage registered in the UK, if you read Q14 in the Guidance Notes & Q&A provided in the link I which I have provided above you will see that there is no requirement or facility to do this in the UK. You will need to keep a copy of your local Thai marriage certificate as evidence of your marriage.  FYI - You used to be able to register your marriage by presenting a copy of your marriage certificate and MFA certified English translation of the marriage certificate to the British Embassy who would then forward it to the UK Registrar General Office, but this is no longer required as your Thai marriage certificate is accepted in the UK (I suggest that you still get it translated into English and certified by MFA as most Brits back in the UK will have no idea what the certificate says).

Best of luck.

A few members have indicated within this thread that there is no way that the Department of Works and Pensions (DWP) is going to know if you are living outside the UK unless you voluntarily inform them.  Sorry but if you think that is correct, you are, or have been, ill informed.

Firstly, the UK Audit Office frequently does a data matching exercise to detect fraud.  They have the legal powers to obtain data from a variety of sources including Inland Revenue, DWP, HM Passport Office, UK Boarder Force, Local Authorities, Credit Reference Agencies to name but a few.

It is surprising what they can detect and the DWP is one of the main beneficiaries of these exercises.

Secondly, if you are living in Thailand and need to renew, or have renewed, your passport I suggest that you read the information contained on page 20 (Other Information) of the Passport Renewal Guidance Notes.  This clearly forewarns you that they (HMPO) may pass the information you give them to other government departments for the purpose of preventing fraud.  This is reinforced in their (HMPO) Privacy Information Notice (as per the General Data Protection Regulations) which gives details of who they may share your information with and for what purposes.

Also, ever wondered why they (VFS/HMPO) ask you for a colour copy of every page of your passport (including any unused pages) when you renew via VFS in Bangkok, and not when you renew your passport in the UK?  Remember all those lovely Thai visas and Immigration extension of permission to stay stamps?  Oh, and don’t forget that a quick check with UK Boarder Force will confirm all of your UK entries/exits and show how long you have been outside the UK for.

The big question of course is…. Will DWP act on such information?  Sorry, but I don't propose to get involved in that side of the argument.

59 minutes ago, chang50 said:

Thanks very much pal.I've also found another link giving [email protected] which is a bit different maybe both will work?

I think that using either address will end up in the same place, namely VSF Help Desk, as the only difference being the capital letters for HMPO in the middle of the address.  I suspect that the address is not case sensitive.

FYI.... the address which I supplied in the earlier post was copied and pasted from the reply email which they sent to me.

5 hours ago, chang50 said:

Could you please give a link to vfs enquiry or their email address?

No problem, the email address is:  [email protected]    As l mentioned, they responded much quicker than l was expecting.  Hope they are able to assist you.

Sorry, but it looks as though they went into liquidation (or something similar) about 6 plus months ago.  They used to have shops/concessions in MBK, Central and Terminal 21.  All suddenly shut within a few weeks of each other. 

I did a search on the internet and was only able to find a shop somewhere in Italy selling Camel Active but was not tempted to make a purchase because of shipping costs and possible import duty.

38 minutes ago, Saltire said:

Like you I debated what to take. In the end i made a pack (driving licence, signed declaration letter from the wife incl ID card, Amazon and IHerb invoices, copy of latest extension of stay passport stamp) and insisted they send them all. VFS are just a checking/sorting agency. They were happy to do so.

 

As for your full passport copy I recall the agent meticulously turning each page in my passport along  with each paper copy to see if it was complete. Giving him your option may make that job more tricky and he may ask for single pages.

Thanks for your info.

I appreciate that VSF are only a 'handling agent' acting on behalf of the UK Passport Agency.  That said they are supposed to ensure that the documents you provide comply with UKPA's requirements.

If they want one page of the passport on one sheet of A4, then that would mean in my case I would have to provide 50 pages.  In reality because when you photo copy the passport you actually copy two pages at once because of the book format, thus in my case only needing 25 pages of A4.  So printing 4 pages (which are still full size) on A4 should be OK (I think) and mean that I save 12 pages of paper.

I found an email address for VFS enquiry so have asked them the question showing the example.  Br interesting to see their reply.

Many thanks for the replies so far.  They are much appreciated.

For clarity, regarding my question of printing 4 pages of my passport onto one side of A4 paper, I have provided an example below of what I was considering.  It will provide the information that they require but just means less paper involved.  If I was really cheeky I could print double sided (8 pages on one sheet of A4), but that may be pushing my luck.

Regarding the requirement for providing proof of address:  As mentioned in my original post, all my bills have my address in Thai and the Passport Agency require it in English.  Good suggestion regarding my Thai driving licence (shown on reverse in Thai and English).  Only problem with that is only part of the address is given.

UJ.... you suggested getting the yellow book translated.  Will the translation need to be certified (MFA)/

My UK passport is due for renewal later this year and I would be grateful for some advice.

I intend to do the renewal through VFS at Trendy Building in Bangkok.  Looking at the information on their website they indicate that I need to provide a colour copy of each page of my existing passport and proof of my address here in Thailand (in English).

My questions:

1.  Regarding copies of each passport page.  Is it acceptable to print 4 pages onto one sheet of A4 paper?

2.  Regarding proof of address.  Everything that is sent to me from here in Thailand (bills, bank statements etc) has my name and address in Thai (normally copied from yellow book).  They want this proof in English.  What are the alternatives?

I am aware that I could get an agent to do everything, but happy doing it myself.

Sorry if this has been discussed before but nothing came up on the search facility.

OP…. Since your last visit to Thailand back in 2013 (Post# 10) the Thai Immigration system has been upgraded several times.

Firstly

Thailand adopted the Advance Passenger Information System (APIS).  This now means all international airlines flying into the kingdom are required to send your biographical details (basically the information contained on the photo page of your passport) to Thailand prior to you being allowed to board the flight. Your biographical information is then automatically distributed to the Immigration, Customs and Security Agencies computer systems which search their databases for you. 

If any of the above mentioned agencies have details on their system which precludes you from entering the Kingdom e.g. you have been banned, the airline will receive a “Do Not Board” (DNB) feedback code.  The airline is not informed as to the reason why you are not allowed to enter the Kingdom, but because of the DNB code they would incur very heavy financial penalties if they were to allow you to travel, so you will be rejected and your flight ticket cancelled which can be expensive if it's a long haul flight.

As several TV members have previously indicated, you would best travel to one of the neighbouring countries and then attempt to cross into Thailand via a land boarder.  If rejected it will just mean a walk back in the direction you came from rather than losing money on a cancelled long-haul flight ticket.

Secondly

During the past few years all Immigration ports of entry have been connected to the central Immigration system in Bangkok by fibre optics, thus now facilitating extremely fast and reliable data transfer. 

All Immigration desks at the ports of entry are equipped with Machine Readable Travel Document Scanners.  These allow the Immigration Officer to place the photo page of your passport onto the scanner which rapidly unlocks the encrypted information held on the microchip imbedded into your passport. 

FYI - The encrypted information on the microchip should be the same as the biographical data shown on the photo page plus an enhanced (cropped) copy of your photo.  If it isn’t the same, the system will flag up a potential fake/altered passport.

The information held on the microchip is sent to the Immigration system in Bangkok for checking against their database.  These checks include, but not limited to, checking if you are known to the system under another name, second passport (through dual citizenship) or have been banned from entering the Kingdom etc.  These checks are completed within a few second.  If you have are currently banned a warning flag will be displayed on the Immigration Office’s screen and you will then be subjected to a lot of questions.

Thirdly

The fact that your offence occurred 20 years ago does not mean that the details of your offence and subsequent deportation are not in the Immigration database.  FYI - In 1998 Thai immigration installed a new computerised database system and as part of this upgrade, they (Thai Immigration) had a blitz on their old manual records which they had transferred to the new system.  Priority at the time was given to the records of individuals who had been deported or were otherwise banned from entering the Kingdom.  So, your deportation record from 2000 will almost certainly be in the system.

Fourthly

Immigration has within the past 12 months integrated a biometric scanning facility into their system, e.g. finger printing and facial recognition.  If you were fingerprinted and photographed prior to being deported (albeit 20 years ago) that information will be in the Immigration database. 

The new fingerprint scanning software is produced by a German company, who according to their publicity blurb can match a fingerprint from within a database containing millions of ‘impressions’ within a fraction of a second.  If this is true, the odds will be very much against you entering if your fingerprints are scanned at the port of entry.

Note: Your fingerprints are not stored in the database as an image, but rather a series of numbers indicating significant points within your fingerprint thus making searching that much faster.

FYI – Whilst the fingerprint scanning system is reportedly accurate, a number of serious questions have been raised over facial recognition systems in general as they can produce unreliable matches in particular with people from a several ethnic backgrounds.

General Observations

You indicated in your OP that your passport was stamped when you were deported 20 years ago, but because you cannot read Thai you are unable to determine how long you have been banned for.  If you can post a picture of the deportation stamp no doubt one of the TV members will translate it for you.

From what I know of the Immigration here in Thailand they have a tariff system which dictates how long a ban will be based upon the nature and severity of the offence.  Bans can range from one year to life.  Given what you have indicated about your offence, I would hazard a guess that your ban would most likely be a minimum of 20 years because of the ‘hard’ substance.

How can you find out if you are still banned?  Over the years there have been many reports on TV that some lawyers and visa agents who reportedly have connection within Immigration are able to find out such information.  Knowing how the ‘brown envelope system’ works this is more than possible, but it is going to cost you.  Personally, I would suggest writing to Immigration HQ in Bangkok.  Provide them with a copy of your old passport photo page plus the page with deportation stamp and ask them if you are still banned.  You may be pleasantly surprised how helpful they can be at just the cost of a stamp.

Given the current Covid-19 situation I doubt that many people will be able to travel for quite some time so you have plenty of time to explore all avenues.

Best of luck.

1 hour ago, talahtnut said:

The Visa application is on line.

All your stuff is uploaded on the forms

Its possible they will suss you out at

that time, if not, keep original passport and

go for it. They can only turn you back.

FYI - Thai Embassies/Consulates who are responsible for the issuing of visas do not (currently) have access to the Immigration Database so they will not have any idea if a person is banned.

9 hours ago, mvdf said:

Changing your name by deed poll won't circumvent the immigration system's querying process. The change of name is recorded in the chip itself under data group 11 (DG11). You would be lucky if the chip is not system-queried but if a diligent officer were to do so and assuming the new biometric system is equipped with chip access privileges which I suspect it is as they use cross-matching to verify a passport's authenticity, then your true name will be revealed. A "hit" would then lead to a chain of further queries and, if blacklisted, possibly unravel your past escapades in Thailand. 

 

Sorry to correct you, but details of a person’s previous name(s) is not held on the so-called biometric chip which is embedded into most passports.

The only information that is currently held on the chip is basically the biographical information that is shown on the photo page of the passport, including an enhanced (cropped) copy of the passport holder’s photo. 

That said, as from June 2018 passport issuing authorities have been allowed to include the passport holder’s fingerprints within the second level security facility of the microchip.  Inclusion of fingerprints is not mandatory and each passport issuing authority can decide for themselves to include this option when now issuing a new passport.  FYI - The second level security facility of the microchip cannot be access by the Immigration standard desktop passport scanner, it requires a high security scanner that will normally only be available to Immigration investigation officers.

Regarding a person’s previous names:  This was one of a number of option that was written into the International Civil Aviation Organisation ‘s (ICAO) Doc 9303 Machine Readable Travel Documents, 7th Edition, 2105 guidelines.

However, the option to which you have referred, namely Part 10, Data Group 11 – Additional Personal Details has not been approved by the ICAO Executive Committee.  As a result, such information is not held currently held within the so-called biometric chip. 

If you had read Doc 9303, you would be aware that it was recommended that the inclusion of the Additional Personal Details (which also included the passport holder’s permanent address; telephone numbers; profession; and custody details etc) was identified as being ‘OPTIONAL’ and not mandatory thus indicating that it would be left up to individual passport issuing authorities to decide if such information would eventually be included on the microchip. 

At the time of writing this document (2015) it was appreciated that many countries Data Protection Laws preclude such personal information being shared without the individual’s explicit consent and hence this is one  of the main reasons why its inclusion has not been approved by the ICAO Executive Committee.

FYI – Most Immigration systems throughout the world are now very sophisticated and are more than capable of identifying if a person who has previously entered has changed their names or has acquired a second passport e.g. dual citizenship.

On ‎6‎/‎18‎/‎2020 at 1:20 AM, n00dle said:

To the op, there is not a snowballs chance in hell your biometric records from 20 years ago are in the immigration system. 

It may then come as a bit of a surprise for you to learn that in 1998 Thai immigration implemented a new computerised database system.  As part of this upgrade, they (Thai Immigration) had a blitz on their old manual records which they had transferred to the new system.  Priority at the time was given to the records of individuals who had been deported or were otherwise banned from entering the Kingdom.  So information relating to the OP's deportation in 2000 will most certainly be in the system. 

FYI… I first entered Thailand way back in 1992 and subsequently entered/exited over 100 times.  The details of every entry/exit, dating back to 1992, are available to the Immigration Officer if he/she ‘drills down’ into their system.  I have seen my Immigration record on several occasions thanks to friendly IO’s.

Having the planes which they lease seized because of non-payment of their debts is just one of Thai’s worries.

If they want to fly anywhere outside Thailand they are going to face some serious problems once the bankruptcy order is made because no airport outside Thailand is going to give Thai credit facilities to cover the costs of landing/ground handling fees or for topping up the ‘bird’ for its return flight.  Then of course there is the small matter of the cost of hotel accommodation/transport costs for the crew during their stop over.

It will be strictly cash only.  So, Thai had better ensure that they provide their pilots with a big suit case full of US$ if they want to fly anywhere outside Thailand.