007 RED

12 hours ago, saengd said:

I still want somebody to account for how the AOT air traffic report on plane arrivals and plane loadings shown above manages to confirm the 40 million. I expect the answer will be that AOT is not to be trusted, along with BOT, TAT, government and anyone else in Thailand!  

Simple... Have you never noticed that one of the people standing on the air bridge as you get off the plane has a handheld counter and is clicking away as each person leaves the plane.  This is TAT 0.001.

3 hours ago, Traubert said:

What about those who arrive overland or by sea?

A very valid point which makes TATs figures look even worse.

 

If they (TAT) say that 39 million people will have visited the kingdom by the end of this year, and their figures includes all arrivals by air, land and sea, then this is definitely a drop on the number of arrivals over last year. 

 

As I indicated in my post #101, Airport Of Thailand figures for 2018 indicated a total of 40.25 million international air arrivals.  If you then add the land and sea international arrivals (whatever they may be for 2018) to the international air arrivals, then the actual fall in the number of international arrivals year-on-year will be considerably more than I indicated in my original post e.g. greater than 1 million.

 

As I said, another set of ridiculous statistics produced by the Ministry of Silly Numbers (AKA TAT). 

I’m not sure why Tourism Authority Thailand (TAT) are making so much 'song and dance' about 39 million tourists arriving by the end of the year.  Quote ”the highest numbers in many years”.  This is complete, and utter, BS yet again by the Ministry of Silly Numbers.

 

In stating 39 million, they are actually admitting that the numbers are down by 1 million against last year (2018).  According to the Airports of Thailand Annual Air traffic Report for 2018 https://www.airportthai.co.th/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/Annual-Airport-2018.pdf

 

The breakdown numbers of international arrivals for 2018 are as follows:

 

Suvarnabhumi   25,483,275

Don Mueang       7,923,731

Chiang Mai         1,352,824

Hat Yai                 179,323

Phuket               5,194,929

Chiang Rai             120,535

 

Total                40,254,617

 

NOTE:

 

1.....The above figures only relate to international arrivals at the six airports managed by AOT and do not include international passengers who transited through any one of the six airports managed by AOT.  International transit numbers are given separately.

 

2.....International arrival figures for Kho Samui and Hua Hin are available from separate providers and the total number of international arrivals at these airports combined was less than 60,000 during 2018.

 

3.....There is no way that AOT, or TAT, will know if the person arriving is arriving for the purpose of tourism or for any one of several other reasons e.g. Ex-Pat returning from vacation/visa run, offshore worker or even a Thai national returning home from working overseas.  They are all classed as international arrivals.

I’m sure that the powers that be didn’t take the PM all the way along the road to inspect it. If they did, it would explain the grin on his face.

 

This road is going nowhere because of the apparent total lack of planning!

 

For the past 4 years or so my wife and I travel along the 3004 from Salaya to Wat Lam Phya floating market most Saturdays to do some shopping and must pass the construction site.  Every time we pass the site, we always chuckle and there is a big smile on our faces.

 

They started this project way back in 2012.  You would think that they (DLT) would have purchased the land before starting work, and then constructed the road as one continuous project.  OK, I know that’s western logic.

 

Just take a look at the Google map below.  I have highlighted in yellow stretches that have been completed so far.  These sections are fully tarmacked but not joined up so unless you have a 4x4 with good off-road capabilities you’re going nowhere.

 

Better still is where I have placed the yellow arrow on the above map.  Approximately 2 years ago they started constructing a flyover that will cross the 3004.  They’ve completed half of it and stopped just short of where it should cross the 3004 – see close up Google map below.

 

Just one very minor problem.  On the opposite side of the 3004 there is a large factory, and it’s been there (according to the Google map since at least 2012). 

 

I suspect that the factory owner is holding the DLT to a hefty ransom.

54 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Complete nonsense and I doubt anyone seriously thinks there are many retirees putting together convincing looking forgeries of pension statements and tax returns. 

You may be right in so far that there weren’t many, but unfortunately it only takes a few to spoil it for the majority.

 

It should also be borne in mind that British citizens applying to the Embassy for an income letter did not have to supply original documents to support their claimed income. The applicant could submit their application via email and attach a photo or PDF of their supporting documents.  Unfortunately, both photos and PDF’s can be easily altered.

 

Also, you may recall that it was reported here in TVF a couple of years ago that a few Immigration Offices in and around Bangkok were insisting that applicants presenting a British Embassy income letter to support their application for permission to stay  have the letter (or at least the signature) authenticated by the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs – Consular Division. 

 

The reason given to me by my local IO, when I present my letter, was that they (Immigration) had detected a number of letters which did not appear to be genuine.

 

FYI… The letter was produced by a standard LaserJet printer, on bog standard paper (no water marks or security ink).  The letter (in the last few years) did have an embossed red paper sticker attached to the letter.  The paper sticker was cheap and the embossing very poor, thus enabling someone with a minimal computer and handicraft skills to easy to replicate the letter.

During the interview, the Ambassador said that he estimated that some 73,000 British citizens are currently resident here in Thailand.

 

How on earth did he, or his Consular colleges, arrive at this figure?

 

Firstly:

In my passport, under section 4 of the NOTES on page 2, it states: 

 

“British nationals resident overseas who are entitled to the protection of the United Kingdom authorities should contact the nearest British High Commission, Embassy or Consulate to enquire about any arrangements for registration of their names and addresses.  Failure to do so may in an emergency result in difficulty or delay in according them assistance or protection”.

 

When I retired to Thailand, some 10 years ago, I contacted the British Embassy in order to register as advised in my passport.  I was informed at the time that the Embassy no longer maintains a register of British national living in Thailand.

 

Without such a register, how do they know, or even estimate, how many Brits live here?

 

My only guess is that Thai Immigration provide them with numbers of British citizens who currently hold long term permission to stay.  If my assumption is correct, then like figures produced by Tourist Authority of Thailand they are more than likely highly over inflated.

 

Secondly

Following the BE announcement that they were no longer able to provide income letters late last year, I made a series of Freedom of Information requests via the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in London.  One questions being… How many letters did they (the BE) provide in each of the previous 5 years?  The reply for the last year (2018) was just under 3,000 letters.

 

So, if the Ambassador’s estimate that some 73,000 British citizens are currently living in Thailand is to be believed, then only 4% of those living here used the income letter to support their extension of stay, the other 96% used alternative methods to support their application.

34 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

P.S. The company was "Insure and Go".

 

But pretty much all travel insurance (and even general health insurance) policies have general exclusions for injuries suffered due to negligence or intoxication. The following is from Insure and Go's list of General Exclusoons (which are not in small print):

 

"8. Any claim arising directly from you, your partner, relative or your travelling companion consuming alcohol"

 

18. Any claim arising from you being involved in any deliberate, malicious, reckless, illegal or criminal act."

 

As soon as any insurance company sees something like diving on the premises of a bar in the middle of the night, red flags would go up and they'd look more closely.

 

While these quotes are specific to Insure and Go you will find similiar in the General Conditions of any policy. None will insure you for injuries that occur as a direct result of being drunk or high nor for injuries that result from recklessness usually defined as something an ordinary prudent person would not do.  Now obviously there is some subjectivity with both of these things. The alcohol consumption must be a direct cause of the injury, simply having consumed alcohol by itself is not a disqualifier. And there is also room for debate around what constitutes deliberate recklessness. 

 

One would assume the family has appealed but either lost or the appeal is still in progress.

 

 

Sheryle....  I'm not sure which of the Insure and Go policies you are quoting from, but the specific backpacker (Bronze) policy is even more specific:

 

https://www.insureandgo.com/media/1336/iag_mf_pw_adv_0918.pdf

 

Quote from page 11, under the heading Reckless or Malicious Acts... Also repeated further in the policy under medical exclusions.

 

"We do not expect you to avoid alcohol consumption on your trips or holidays but we will not cover any claims arising because you have drunk so much alcohol that your judgement is seriously affected and you need to make a claim as a result e.g. any medical claim where in the opinion of the treating doctor, your excessive alcohol consumption has caused or actively contributed to your injury or illness, including but not exclusively having a blood alcohol reading of more than 150mg per 100ml".

 

I totally agree with your observation that their policy is not in small print.  That said, it is 34 pages long of double column script and I doubt very much that most young backpackers will take the time to read through it and fully understand their obligations as part of the contract.

 

It is possible that when the insurer discovered the circumstances of the incident (late night party with alcohol involved), and they subsequently requested her medical notes from the hospital, if her notes indicated that she a high blood alcohol reading at the time of initial admission, this would almost certainly have given them (the insurance company) the 'golden bullet' to deny her claim. 

The insurance company in question was named as Insure and Go (according to a BBC report dated 27 December 2018).  This is a  apparently a low cost travel insurance company who aims their business at specifically low cost travellers e.g. backpackers.

 

According to the BBC report, Insure and Go said in a statement: "We do understand that people go on holiday to have fun and enjoy themselves, but we are not able to cover circumstances where a customer has acted in a way that puts themselves at risk".

 

"This is clearly stated in the policy terms and conditions."

 

If the insurance companies statement above is to be believed, perhaps they should have made it clear in their policy (in big bold letters), that travelling to Thailand is likely to be putting yourself at risk and, therefore, we (the insurance company) won't pay out for anything that happens to you whilst your there.

 

If I recall correctly, at the time this hit the news last year, the company (Insure and Go) was being investigated by the UK Financial Ombudsman following complaints that it (the company) had refused a very high number of allegedly valid claims.

4 hours ago, overherebc said:

Your in/out records on the computer are only that. There is no way to add comments or whatever at the airport.

The only place that can 'change' anything in your computer file is at CW, eg stamped in for 30 instead of 90 at the airport. CW can do it, airport can't.

Sorry to have to correct you, but you are wrong on of the above both points.

 

Firstly, there is a facility within the Immigrations System for any IO to enter notes and this facility is used for a wide variety of purposes.  The notes field is free format, so the IO can basically enter whatever they want, subject to the restriction on the size of the field.  The only data that is prescribed within the notes field is the date the entry was made and the ID of the Officer who made the entry.

 

When an IO initially calls-up a person’s immigration data they are initially presented with the person’s basic biographical information e.g. passport number, country of origin, gender, date of birth, name(s) etc.  If the IO wants further information about the person e.g. history, he/she has to ‘drill down’ from a menu to display that information so the notes do not automatically appear unless requested by the IO.

 

Secondly, CW are not the only office in Thailand that can change details on the Immigration Database.

For example, if you were to change your passport and present both the old and new passports to your local Immigration Office they will be able to amend the database accordingly, no need to send any information to CW.  The same goes for a lot of other common issues including incorrect length of stay dates.

 

I’m somewhat surprised that your local Office was unable to amend your stay from 30 to 90 days.  I suspect that the real reason was that the IO who you spoke to was not authorised to make such changes whereas his senior most likely was but was not available at the time, hence the face-saving excuse of having to send it to CW.

 

FYI.... when an IO makes a change to specific data like in your case from 30 to 90 days the original record is not deleted, a new one is created which then supersede the previous entry and the IO may well put a note in the notes field giving the reason for the change.

 

FYI....  There are certain entries in the Immigration Database that CW, or any other office for that matter regardless of the seniority of the IO, are unable to change.  For example, if someone has been banned from entering the Kingdom and it is subsequently discovered that the ban expiry date is incorrect, the only office that can make such a change is Immigration HQ (Suan Plau).  In these cases the change is physically made by a senior system administrator who can only make the change on the written authority of a very senior Immigration Officer (Major General or above).

 

FYI.....  When any Immigration Officer logs into the Immigration system using their ID + PW, the system only allows that officer to perform certain tasks on the system which have been pre-assigned to their specific role/function/duties.  So, for example a front line officers at ports of entry may only be able to undertake tasks ‘A’, ‘B’ and ‘C’ on the system.  That officer’s senior will also be able to carry out those tasks but also tasks ‘D’ and ‘E’.  An officer in a local office will only be able to undertake tasks ‘A’, F’ and ‘G’ but not tasks 'B', 'C' or 'E'.

 

FYI…. Because the Immigration Database is considered to be part of ‘National Security’ it has a built-in audit trail facility which automatically records in the background the date/time/ID of the IO who has made any changes to the data.  It does not record who just viewed the data.

    @localexp    I'm not sure that it is necessary to start another post with exactly the same question that you asked yesterday and subsequently received some valid information.

 

 

If I’m correct, it was suggested in one of the very early posts that if the OP is denied entry he should submit form TM11 in order to appeal against his denial.  The poster kindly provided a download link to the form.

 

Firstly:   OK the download link would be great but in fact will be of little use as even the most sophisticated smart phone don’t have a printer built into them (yet) and I doubt very much if the IO is going to let the OP use his/her computer and printer.  To make matters even more complicated in order to submit the form you also need attach a passport type photo to the form, which begs the question how many people carry spare passport photos with them all the time?

 

Secondly:  You can bet your bottom dollar that if the OP asked the IO for a copy of the form he would be told sorry we don’t have any.

 

Thirdly:  Even if the OP were to submit an appeal form, what is going to happen to him whilst the appeal process takes place?  According to The Immigration Act (Section 22) the Minister should give his/her decision within 7 days.  So if the IO’s want to play ‘games’ the OP could be stuck in the airport detention suite for the next week awaiting the outcome of his appeal.

10 minutes ago, localexp said:

for the sake of devils advocate, is their any more or less safe way i could return on an exemption without going in for a tourist? i really have no qualms about being chewed on by immigration, so long as they dont say no or worse yet refuse me to visit my family for an extended time.

Sorry, but I don't have sufficient knowledge/experience to offer you sound advice on this matter, so I'll have to miss on this.

 

13 minutes ago, localexp said:

what i dont get is that, in the worse situation i have read so far, you are allowed 2 border exemptions and 3 flights in a 6 month period, under either consideration i have only been in and out three times this year and know multiple people who go in and out far more often.

You're correct that you are only allowed 2 EV through land boarder crossings in a year (Jan - Dec), however, there is no such restriction on the number of VE that you can have in a year when flying into the Kingdom. 

 

That said, what the Immigration Officer will be looking at is how long you have stayed in the Kingdom during the past 12 months.  Once again, many Immigration Officers work on the un-written rule that if someone has stayed 180 days or more during the past 12 months, they are not a tourist and this often results in a denied entry. 

 

If you've stayed in the Kingdom less that 180 days during the past 12 months, I suspect your chances of being given a VE are reasonable regardless of the number of previous entries.

 

29 minutes ago, localexp said:

and as far as how you are suppose to "act" are they looking for someone who fits the bill of "affluent tourist with money to throw away and leave" or something, what is considered the ideal foreigner nowadays?

As far as I'm aware Immigration Officers are not particularly worried about how you dress or appear. 

 

Once again, good luck.

1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

Do not show things like housebook, drivers license, bank account etc. They work against you.

 

The whole issue is that you are using tourist visas and visa exempt entries to in actually live in Thailand which is not their intended use. Proofs such as you mention just confirm that this is the case.

 

They really do not want people living here on TVs and visa exemptions and are trying to crack down on it. As fathetof a Thai child the proper way to come is on an 'O' visa which you can then extend annually a year at a time. 

 

If for some reason you need to enter one more time on TV or visa exempt and you are questioned  just say you are coming to see your daughter and meekly agree if they tell you to get an O visa in future. O visa not tourist visa.

I would concur 100% with Sheryl's advice regarding not showing things like your house book, drivers licence, bank accounts etc to the Immigration Officer if you get 'pulled to one side' for further questioning.  As Sheryle said, these will only confirm (in their mind) that you are 'living' in the Kingdom on visa exempts or tourist visas and therefore give them the reason to deny you entry (albeit falsely).

 

As has been suggested you would be better off getting an 'O' visa.

 

Good luck

2 hours ago, Billpro785 said:

I have now 7 visa exempts in my US passport in 2019. Usually stay 3 weeks than leave. Never had a issue, most of the time the officer never looks at me. 

Possible reason:

3 weeks = 21 days x 7 stays = 147 days total which is well below the so called 180 day limit.

The so called ‘180 day’ rule

 

It  has indicated by at least one member that the Thai Immigration Act indicates that there is a rule whereby a person staying in the Kingdom for more than 180 days using visa on arrivals, or visa exempts, or tourist visas in a year period commencing 1st January through to 31 December will be denied entry.

 

This is totally incorrect.  There’s absolutely no mentions of any such 180 day rule within the Thai Immigration Act, or within any of the Police Orders/Regulations that Immigration Officers are supposed to work within.

 

As has been mentioned by elviajero in post #10, the 180 days is an unofficial figure used by some Immigration Officers to determine if the person is a genuine tourist or not and that this unofficial 180 day rule applies in any give year period and not just from the beginning to the end of the year.

 

I believe that the problem, if it can be called that, stems from the Immigration Bureau Guidelines 0029.1712076, dated 24 June 2014, "Guideline for inspection of citizen from certain countries that are not required to obtain a visa when entering the Kingdom of Thailand".

 

The Guidelines are as follows:

 

To keep permission of entering in compliance with immigration law and provision concerned, it is deemed expedient to impose additional procedures of inspecting and permitting ordinary passport holders from certain countries who are not required to obtain a visa when entering Thailand for tourism purposes,

 

1.      Information checking

 

1.1.    Purpose of entering the Kingdom.  The alien must enter the Kingdom with the sole purpose of tourism, and not for work.

 

1.2.    Record of entry and stay within the Kingdom.

 

1.2.1.  The number of entries into the Kingdom.

 

1.2.2  The alien must not enter the Kingdom by exploiting 30day visa exemptions undertaking method “inout” or called by foreigners as “Visa run”. Aliens use the advantage of Tourist Visa Exemption by leaving Thailand and returning immediately for the purpose of extending their stay, which is considered from the tourism point of view to be longer than necessary and not in line with the purpose permitted while entering country.

 

2.      Reason to believe that entry into Kingdom is not for the purpose of tourism.

 

2.1     Alien will be interviewed and requested to show evidence of the purpose of tourism such as tickets, pocket money, booking slip, traveling plan.

 

2.2     The criterion as in 2.1 if deemed necessary to record as an evidence, the alien may be required to fill out the form as attached in the annex hereto.

 

3.      Reason to reject or permit entry to Thailand

 

3.1     Upon complete evidence of entering the Kingdom for tourism purpose and not for

working purpose, alien shall be granted for permission to stay for 15, 30 or 90 days as set out in the bilateral agreements.

 

3.2    Without valid reason compiled to lack of evidence required by the immigration officer, the alien shall be refused to enter the Kingdom, pursuant to immigration law provision.

 

I firmly believe that Immigration Officers are using Section 1.2.2 of the above mentioned Guidelines as their leaver to deny entry and that they are using stays exceeding 180 days as a reference point again to deny entry.

Renewal of 5 year driving licence at DLT HQ (Bangkok)

 

 

As promised in my earlier post (#33), I have describe below my experience yesterday (17/10/19) when renewing my 5 year driving car licence at the Department of Land Transport (DLT) HQ in Bangkok.

  

As advised by the admin officer who I spoke to on my previous visit, I arrived early at DLT HQ (near Mo Chit BTS) at around 07:15am and made my way down the long drive to building number 4 (on the right) where the driving licence issues/renewals are done.  The building also does certification for vehicle testing.

 

 

FYI.... Car parking space is available but you will need to get there very early as they seem to fill up very quickly.

 

 

As the main entrance door to number 4 building was open, I made my way through the entrance hall to the stairs on the left which lead up to the second floor where the registration counters are located.  There are lifts available.  On the stairway leading to the 2nd floor I found about 50 people (all Thais) already waiting for the doors to the registration counters to open.  By the time the doors opened to the registration counters the queue was snaking back through the entrance hall on the 1st floor and outside the building. 

 

The advice which I was given to get there early was very valid.

 

 

Shortly before 8:30am the doors to the registration counters were opened.  The 4 counters were all manned, so it only took about 15 minutes before I was able to present my documents to admin officer.  She looked quickly through my documents and then added a sheet (which is for the test results) to the front of the pile.  She asked me to fill my full name and telephone number in at the top of the test result sheet and then gave me a queue number ticket.  She directed me towards desks 18 or 19 located in the very large room on the right of the registration desk to have my documents validated.

 

When I got to the designated desks there were no officers at them.  There was already another foreigner sat in the waiting area if front of these two desks.  At about 09.00am a member of staff arrived at desk #18 and shortly afterwards called the other foreigner forward.

 

 

He was apparently missing a document and was sent with his passport down to the 1st floor where the photocopy facilities are located.  He returned some five minutes later.

 

While I was waiting to be called forward two other foreigners joined me in the waiting area.

 

I was called to the desk at 09:20am.  The officer asked for my documents, passport and original Thai driving licence.  She carefully scrutinised all the documents and compared each with my passport.  She then started to slowly (one finger) typing on her computer.

 

Whilst she was typing one of the admin officers from the front registration desk came and interrupter her.  With this officer was a foreigner clutching a yellow book and a pink card.  From the conversation which ensued he was attempting to use these as proof of his address.  The officer who was serving me advised the foreigner that they (DLT) don’t accept the yellow book or pink card as proof of address because the details on them is in Thai and the details on his original licence contained his passport number and name in English, so they can’t reconcile the two. 

 

The officer told him that he needed a either a letter from his Embassy or from Immigration confirming address.  To say the least the foreigner was not a happy person and insisted that this yellow book and pink card were accepted as proof of his address by lots of other official bodies.  At this point a supervisor appeared and took the man into a nearby office.  The foreigner eventually reappeared muttering away to his-self and obviously not very pleased. 

 

This just confirmed what I had been told by the registration staff the week before when I made my enquiry as to what documents were required.

 

The officer who was checking my documents eventually printed out a ‘registration sheet’ which she asked me to check and sign.  This document contained the same information as would have been was contained on the original application forms which you used to have to complete e.g. full name, date of birth, age, passport number, visa type, address and telephone number. 

 

Having checked and signed the document the officer gave me back my documents and directed me to go up to the 3rd floor for the ‘physical’ testing.  By the time I left the document checking desk it was 09:50am and by then there were six foreigners waiting to have their documents checked.  At approximately 15/20 minutes per person, they were in for a long wait, unless the second checking desk was manned.

 

On arriving at the ‘physical’ testing area on the 3rd floor, I was asked to take a seat and watch a video which shoeds the procedures for the four tests.  The commentary is in Thai, but the video is easy to follow what you are expected to do at each test station.

 

 

After watching the video several times (it’s on a loop play) I, together with about 15 other people (mix of Thais and foreigners) were ushered in line into the testing room at around 10:15am.

 

The first test is the colour blindness test. 

 

You are confronted with a ‘normal’ looking traffic light about 5 meters in front of you.  You must call out which colour is being illuminated. 

 

Sounds easy, red at the top, green at the bottom and yellow in the middle.  If you think that what happens then you’re in for a surprise. 

 

The examiner can select any colour to be displayed in each of the three lights.  So, it is important that you state what colour you see, and not the normal order your brain expects the lights to show. 

 

The examiner showed me six colours and then called me forward, marked and stamped my test result sheet and directed me to the next test station.

 

The second test is the depth perception test.

 

In this test you sit down on a stool (you can’t move it).  In front of you on a white table with white background at the end and both sides.  There are two small poles about 3 meters away and a 30cm apart.  The pole on the right is fixed and the one on the left can be moved (forward/backwards) using a handheld control box with forward/backwards buttons.  You must move the left pole so that it aligns with the fixed poles. 

 

After completing the test, the examiner took my test sheet, marked and stamped it and directed me to the next test station.

 

The third test is the reaction test.

 

You again sit on a fixed stool.  On the floor in front of you there are two pedals representing the accelerator and brake.  About three meters in front of you there is a box which has two lights on it.  You place your right foot onto the accelerator pedal until the green light appears (which represents 40km/h), then when the red light appears you must apply the brake pedal as quickly as possible with your right foot.  The examiner measures your reaction time.  You will be instructed to repeat the test a second time. 

 

Again, the examiner took my result sheet, marked and stamped it, and pointed me towards the next test station.

 

The fourth test is peripheral vision test.

 

This test involves sitting on a fixed stool and placing your head on a special device.  You are instructed to look straight ahead and then shown coloured discs (red/yellow/green) on either the left or right-hand sides of your eyes.  You must identify the coloured disc correctly.  This test is quite hard as the coloured discs are not well illuminated and they are right on the edge of your extreme peripheral vision.

 

Warning - You must keep looking straight ahead throughout the test and if you move your eyes to the left or right (which is a normal reflex reaction) during this test the examiner will warn you and you will have to start the test again.  Three restarts and you fail.

 

As with the previous tests, the examiner marked and stamped my test sheet and directed me to the exit door.

 

At the exit door of the test room an admin officer took my documents and checked my test sheet.  He advised me that I had passed the tests and that I now need to go up to the fourth floor for the training video.  I left the testing room at around 10:40am

 

Doing the tests only takes a few minutes.  The time is consumed by having to wait for the people in front of you to complete their test, and in some cases individuals had to repeat the test several times.  I noticed that a few people from the group that I entered the test room with failed (failed on the colour blindness or peripheral vision tests).

 

Sorry no photos allowed in the test room.

 

On getting to the fourth floor you report to the training control office.  The admin officer checks your test result sheet and then gives you a numbered card (receipt for your documents which they retain), you are then told to go to a numbered training room for your video training.

 

 

The training room holds approximately 50 people (it’s air condition thankfully) and at shortly after 11:00am the officer started the video.

 

 

The video is in four parts.  Part one is intended as a shocker and shows about 20 red light jump accidents from CCTV cameras.   Part two is a cartoon showing a yellow car in traffic and explaining how to be a ‘good boy’ and not upset others.  Part three is a ‘fly on the wall video’ inside a car being driven by a female with a male passenger.  It depicts the good, the bad and the ugly driving by other drivers.  Part four is another shock video of a rescue crew attending an accident.

 

All four parts of the video are in Thai, however, part three does have English subtitles at the bottom of the screen – which is not much good if your sitting towards the back of the room with lots of people’s heads/shoulders blocking your view of the bottom of the screen.

 

Frankly, and in my opinion, the video is a total waste of time as it does very little to encourage driving safely on the roads, e.g. don’t cross solid lines in the centre of the road; don’t overtake on a bend; don’t use your mobile while driving; look in your mirrors before pulling out; drive at a speed according to conditions etc. etc. etc.

 

The video finished at 12:00 noon and we were handed back our documents and test results and advised to go back to the 2nd floor registration desk to get a queue number for issuing of our licence.  The trouble being that it’s lunch hour from 12 until 1:00pm, so everything stops.  Fortunately, outside the building there are several small shops/stalls where you can get a snack and a drink.

 

Shortly before 1:00pm I returned to the 2nd floor registration area and already there were a lot of people waiting to get a queue number for licence to be issued or register for initial document checking etc. 

 

 

At the registration desk you show the admin officer your documents/test result sheet and they issue you with a queue ticket.  You are direct you into the large room to the right of the registration desks.  This is the same room that I originally had my documents checked at desk #18 in the morning.  This time you may be called to any desk (actually a small booth) from #8 to #17.  There is a big seating area in which to wait for your number to be called.  The queue and desk numbers are called out in Thai and displayed on screens around the room.

 

 

When you get to the appointed desk the officer takes your documents and checks the test your result sheet.  If everything is satisfactory the officer takes your photo and requests payment for my new 5 year car licence (505 THB in my case).  You’re given a receipt and a few minutes later the officer hands you your new licence and asks you to check that the details are correct.

 

I left the building at just gone 2:00pm.  It was a long day and I’m glad that I don’t have to go through that again for another five years. 

 

Although I have a reasonable grasp of the Thai language, I tended to use English during my conversation with the DLT staff, mainly to gauge their reactions.  I found all the staff whom I encountered had limited spoken English ability, but it was more than enough to be understood.  They were all polite, helpful and professional.

 

Maybe it helps if you dress respectfully, relax, smile and give a polite (not OTT) wai when appropriate.

 

Hope this helps if your intending to go to the DLT HQ to do your licence renewal.

 

I’m happy to answer any question, but please bear with me if I don’t respond immediately as I’m not transfixed to TVF 24/7 like some members.  Life’s too short to waste on social media.

 

Regards 007 RED

 

 

17 hours ago, inspire15 said:

And you know this because?

 

Do you even know what biometrics are, that now about 80% of all countries in the world have biometric passports and more than 1.5 billion people have their biometric data registered?

 

So hardly a Thai thing.

@inspire15....  I’m not sure where you derived the numbers from, but I can assure you that 1.5 billion people certainly do not have their biometric data registered in their passports.

 

Biometric data, as defined by the International Civil Aviation Organisation (ICAO), which functions under the auspice of the United Nations (UN), only includes fingerprints, iris scan and DNA data.  There are other forms of biometric data such as handprints, palm vein geometry etc. but these are not included within the ICAO list of biometrics.

 

The so called biometric passport, or to give it its correct name, Machine Readable Travel Document (MRTD), was first introduced in 2006.  However, since its introduction no biometric data has been stored on the microchip embedded within the passport.  The information which is held in an encrypted format on the microchip is identical to the biographical information given on the photo page of the passport, including the an enhanced photo of the passport holder which just shows just the face (top of head to chin - no space above or below).

 

In June of last year (2018) the ICAO Committee eventually ratified DOC 9303, Machine Readable Travel Documents, Seventh Edition.  This paved the way for the introduction of biometric data within MRTDs.  There is one very important point to bear in mind.  The inclusion of biometric data is not mandatory.  Individual issuing authorities may decide whether to include, or not, biometric data within their MRTDs.

 

I can say with almost 99.99% certainty, Thai Immigration are currently hyping the term biometrics to possibly justify their considerable capital investment in the new system which they have recently purchased.  Most of the detections which they attribute to biometric data are in fact as a result of the facial recognition system which they have had for some considerable time.

 

Before you ask “And you know because?”.  I spent 10 years of my life working on the eBoarder control project, which was a joint project between NSA and GCHQ following 911.  I was a principle project officer responsible for the design, development and installation of many of the eBoarder control systems (including MRTD and APIS) which are currently used throughout the world today.  Shortly before my retirement in 2013, I was awarded a CBE for my contribution to security.