taxexile

they feel that the immigration authorities are at fault,and feel sorry for those who will end up kicked out.

they have been shafted.but its no good pleading unfairness,it wont help one bit,in fact it will make things worse.

but they say that this moving of the goal posts with the enforcement of the law here is all too common and something that the thais have to live with.

sort of mai pen lai, it will all settle down soon.

a lot of shrugging of the shoulders.

i think deep down they feel bad that the falangs have not been treated at all well by the authorities,it reflects badly on all thais,who i am assured love falangs and all things falang,but that immigration are under a lot of pressure at the moment from head office because of the hambali fiasco,and and they have to be seen to be doing something now ,so why not the falang visa cheats,its an easy arrest.dont even have to leave the office.

they would be pleased to see the back of the drunken late night falangs that litter our soi, and seem to remain in thailand for years on end. "how do they manage to do it? , where does their money come from?" "dont you have young women in europe?" "when is he going to get a new shirt?" "how could anybody sleep with THAT?"and would love to see immigration come around and ask a few questions.

then i really do have sympathy for those who get png'd.

it is out of all proportion to the offence.the offences were committed, yes, but there was very little criminal intent.

for those with families and loved ones here a few years in prison might seem a more humane punishment than banishment.

i hope the authorities will assess each case according to its circumstances.

i'm not looking for agreement or disagreement from other members here,you have all stated your positions on this.

however i am surprised and saddened by some of the positions taken.

mesqite,

back of the net!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

spot on.

FROM TODAYS UK PRESS

telegraph.co.uk

News home  

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Thailand jails 15 Britons sold bogus visas

By Nicola Woolcock

(Filed: 20/09/2003)

Fifteen Britons who were duped into buying bogus visas have been jailed in Thailand, the Foreign Office said yesterday.

They were arrested as they tried to leave the country when immigration authorities noticed counterfeit stamps in their passports. Each had to raise £4,600 bail, their passports have been confiscated and they cannot leave Thailand until their cases come to court.

If convicted of immigration offences they face maximum jail sentences of 10 years or large fines.

Relatives of the tourists say they are innocent victims of fraud, who paid £26 each for visa extensions at outlets they believed were legitimate.

The Foreign Office admitted that the fraud is posing a "problem" for travellers. Bangkok's European consuls met this week to discuss the situation after Irish, Swiss and Canadian citizens were also jailed.

Among the Britons arrested were Nicholas Walker, Justin Righam, Paul Killey and Aaron Hay, all in their early 20s and from Douglas in the Isle of Man. They were intending to visit Australia, but were arrested as they left Thailand on Sunday.

Auban Walker, Mr Walker's uncle, also from Douglas, said: "They were arrested simply for having the wrong stamps in their passports and were thrown into jail in Bangkok. The Thai police are treating victims of fraud as criminals, but aren't stopping the travel agents who issue these stamps."

A Foreign Office spokesman said: "Our travel advice on Thailand does give a warning about visa fraud and our understanding is that this has become a bit of a problem."

FROM TODAYS DAILY TELEGRAPH ,LONDON

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after having read catseyelands account of his visa trip and subsequent arrest,imprisonment and deportation,and assuming it is an accurate account,i find it hard to believe that posters can still think that those who use visa agents will get what they deserve.

but some tourists have now experienced, and others are about to experience a taste of the real thailand,far removed from the bars and beaches,from the videa lounges of khao san,and the elephant rides,and living the dream in a bamboo hut by the sea,from the bubble of existence that 99% percent of foriegners experience here. now we are being "invited " to join the club along with all those thais that get banged up with no regard to that western gold card called human rights,with all those third world unfortunates who fill the jails here,the burmese,cambodians,and hilltribers who due to some minor transgression find themselves behind bars,(without mobiles,and wealthy relatives back home to stump up the bail)

this is the real thailand,this is the full on experience,the falang is no longer the protected species in asia.

equality,at last.

amazing thailand !!

m.kurt,

re. your next meeting

is there any chance that the speaker from the immigration dept. can be asked specifically

1.  about the current arrests for visa run agent use,why is  it   suddenly happening and what might happen to those arrested.

2.does he have any useful advice for those with possible fake stamps and  are worried about their next exit.

if i was in bkk at the moment i would attend and ask,hopefully in view of  the amount of interest on the forums about this subject others will have the same questions.

hope the meeting goes well.

been following your posts russty and was sorry to hear of the refusal.i guess you should maintain a detailed record of your relationship and try again next year.crazy isnt it.

considering that the uk is host to many undesirable immigrants who arrive first and then claim asylum,housing,benefits,health care etc.and that these requests cannot be refused and that these people just disappear into the general population .however thats not the point here.

just good luck next time.

there seems to be some confusion here.(in my mind at least)

how does a false stamp in a british passport become more of a problem to a brit than say a false stamp in a us passport is a problem to an american citizen. the offence is the same.

the advice on the brit embassy website is a bit ambiguous to say the least,but i dont see how it can get a brit banged up.

please enlighten me.

point taken ovenman (interesting moniker,by the way), but i think the embassies have known about it for years and apparently there have been occassional arrests in the past,the embassies will have been notified.

its a mess, with guilt and blame spread over a wide area, and yes, the ultimate responsibility is with the unfortunate ones arrested or sweating out in the queues at don meuang and pedang besar.and i cant help but take a sympathetic view.

i'm just a big softy!!

the embassies post warnings on their website about jewellery shop scams,they have done for years,travellers advisories they call them,why cant they do it about visa shops.the english language newspapers have taken advertising revenue from these outfits,didnt they know they were illegal operations? this whole mess stinks more than the inside of the  koh phangan mini bus out of khao san road.

ignorance of the law is no excuse ??? get off your high horses gentlemen,in this case i believe it is.

people hate america because america,as the only superpower,dictates to the world what it thinks the world should be like, and then persecutes,either by economic means or by military pressure any country that does not conform to the american view.it runs the wto for its own benfit,it pollutes

indiscriminately,its foriegn policy is purely for the betterment of itself.it is a rich selfish nation,giving less per capita in aid than any other of the wealthy countries.the wars in iraq and afghanistan have achieved very little,were hostile acts without world backing. civilians have been the usual casualties.the use of violence abroad in order to make the world safe and compliant to the american way has been the history of the last half of the 20th century.that this stimulates endless protest and a firm conviction of secondary status among people of the third world is one agenda that america chooses to ignore.i could go on and on and on.american foreign policy is one of bullying,in the mistaken assumption that we all agree with the american model of what the world should be like.tell your politicians to back off.we've had enough of your violence,your macho,your coca cola,your stinking hamburgers,your empty smiles,your oversized teeth,your swaggering,your subsidised farmers and rice exports,your stupid films,your dumbass tv,your always trying to appeal to to the lowest common denominator cos its easy money,enough is enough.we dont need it or want it.

but please, give us more of your jazz,your blues,your rock,your new york humour,your enterprise,your novelists,your confidence and your get up and go.

i do have sympathy for many of those caught up in the scam.

especially when the services of these agents were heavily advertised in national newspapers,and to all intents and purposes seemed to be operated with the knowledge and aid of the authorities.

this was not some underhand operation carried out under the cover of darkness by men in cloaks and masks,but a high street enterprise,out there in the open.some immigration offices actually offered the service as well. it all appeared to be very legal.if the authorities knew about it ,which they did,but now wish to stop it,then they should stop it now and go easy on those caught for using it in the past.the authorities have made their point,everybody will now cross the street when passing the visa agent shop,and the problem will be solved.

dr.pat pong

i did not know that people have been prosecuted/deported for this before. but if that is the case then that makes it even harder for me to understand why embassies have not made more of it in the way of warnings to their nationals.after all, the visa agent is just another scam like the jewellery shop.

of course hindsight is a wonderful thing,but this whole mess stinks and i for one have sympathy with (some of )those caught up in this.

Embassies first consideration has to be their nationals

saneh means to charm someone

yaa saneh is the word for a thai charm potion,obviously such a thing does not exist,but a woman may joke to a friend or to someone that she wants to attract that she will put yaa saneh in the intended "victims" food or drink to make her irresistable to him.

falangs seem to be particularly susceptible to yaa saneh,the merest whiff or taste can render them devoid of sense or reason and totally under the control of the woman, who can do with her victim as she wants.the results can be seen everyday throughout the Kingdom and provide a source of free entertainment and amusement to those not yet afflicted.

thanks dr pat pong.

i thought that you meant that ones nationality would alter the way immigration looked at the case.