Thailand Outcast

6 hours ago, puukao said:

Of course a new passport doesn't hurt.  It might not help, but it certainly won't hurt.  Land crossing makes the most sense, but think of all the money trying new things...... i would be thinking about another country for a year.  do you really want to spend tens of thousands of baht just to enter?

I don't think he would have to vacate for a year, but I agree with your advice, and not just to the OP, but to anyone in a similar circumstance.

The time has come to seriously contemplate your Plan B country, and if you haven't chosen an alternative location, best to start exploring. 

14 minutes ago, Joe Mcseismic said:

No, what I said about the signage outside immigration requesting appropriate clothing, plus turning up at an interview for a job in good clothes is about "showing" respect, because both immigration and a prospective employer desire that. As you want something from immigration and a prospective employer, you play the game, only a fool wouldn't. Whether you "actually" respect them has nothing to do with it.

How come you can't come to these simple conclusions yourself? They seem pretty obvious to me.......

Well, it's difficult to respect such corrupt authorities here. 

See Post 167.

it's because I don't actually care anymore if they don't give me what I want. 

For me, from now on, I will be using agents, and not have to deal with anyone in authority anymore, except for a 5 year license renewal, but that's nothing.

If the agents cease operating, I'm off to Vietnam, and will come back on tourist visas as much as I can.  I figure about 6 months of the year, on and off. 

If I have to leave, I'll leave those left behind in Thailand to either grovel, or pay over the odds with 800k, for their visas. 

Just on this topic.  Thailand is a holiday and retiree destination.  What's wrong with an older foreign guy, who has worked hard all his life, and now calls Thailand home, calling into immigration on the way to the beach?  Isn't that the good vibe Thailand should be projecting?  The vibe they had in the past.  Easy going.  Laid back.  Friendly?  What happened to that? 

24 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

The investment-based extension requires 10M Baht in specific types of investments, including new condos.  I think it's a shame they don't expand that list and provide some sort of offsets to other extension-types. 

 

For example, someone buys a condo, so should not be required to show as much income or money in-the-bank for a retirement-extension as a renter. 

Same for a married-to-a-Thai building his family a house - why not cut a break to encourage this?

 

The attitude of the unfriendly-clique of IOs seems to more be of, "Why don't you go home, already?"  And if married to a Thai, "Why don't you take her to your country?"  Just look at their faces as they put in your stamp, and you can tell whether they are indifferent or disgusted by doing it.

I can actually understand why they appear indifferent, or disgusted.

Their country is being "occupied" except, by people with passports, instead of guns.  ????

The thing is, they rely on there occupiers for employment and investment etc.????

16 minutes ago, Cat ji said:

 

What part of this did you not understand?

 

How about Russia, South Africa, much of eastern Europe and South America, for a start.
A keyword could be "relative," a concept which is referred to quite often here, over and over. Like "relative to," and how individual circumstances and so on vary.
There is data available.  And international finance/credit rating agencies.
 

So, you have moved your life savings here, have you?  If not, why not?  It's so financially stable.  ????

13 minutes ago, Joe Mcseismic said:

Sorry, I don't look at it that way at all. I don't consider myself "a guest", I consider myself as a consumer. And just like every consumer, if you're not happy with the product, you can stop using it and switch to another brand.

I agree. 

So what's all the chest beating about you showing Thai's more respect than others?  Who really cares?

You have gone from "respect" to "consumer."  Quite a change. 

22 hours ago, Dumbastheycome said:

Not so much about character as such. Meeting the requirements with an appropriate  attitude yes.

That you or I or the IO had a shag is irrelevant to the equation except perhaps to yourself.

But presenting as  some  cocksure individual who assumes is untouchable because routine morning delight is an antidote  to bureaucratic process is a dangerous mindset.

 

I don't present as a cocksure individual, I present meeting the requirements, and paying the fee.

The difference between me and you is, I actually don't feel I have to beg to stay in Thailand.

I scoped out my Plan B a long time ago, in preparation for this day.  If they let me stay, great, I will continue staying and being happy here.

If they want to complicate my life, and try manipulate my finances, then I will leave, and come back as much as possible on tourist visas.  It's no problem to me.  Thailand is not the be all and end all.

Now, that said, it has been posted an agent in Pattaya is charging 15,000 baht.  If that's the case, and 15k to 20k is around the going rate, that's a cheap visa, just as cheap as Cambodia and Vietnam, and I don't have to do anything, go anywhere, or see anybody.  

This will have the effect of making people on the 800k / 400k method, who have to front up at immigration, showing "respect" look like they are wasting their time, cause they sure have wasted their money using that method.

So, I have some time to see how it plays out with the agents, but if they are allowed to continue, and it appears these new laws were designed for that purpose, it ctually could make my visa here easier, and I don't have to ever see an immigration officer again, let alone worry about what I wear when I attend their their office.  ????

On 4/9/2019 at 5:49 PM, Joe Mcseismic said:

Yes, they do, but, it's not like they hide it.

Outside every immigration office is a sign requesting people to wear appropriate dress.

 

Try showing up at a job interview in T-shirt, shorts and flip-flops. It isn't about "judging a book by it's cover" it's about showing respect.

I know we are guests in this country, but as foreigners here, how much "respect" do you think we receive?  I'll tell you, zero.

Respect is a two way street.

3 minutes ago, Cat ji said:

Because Thailand is a financially stable country, firmly in the USA-based global financial system. And unlike many others and we.are.not.all in North America/Europe/whatever-former-European-colonies.
 

How can a politically unstable country be financially stable?  ????

On 4/9/2019 at 4:38 PM, Joe Mcseismic said:

Let's forget about the house, because it's in your wife's name. Let's concentrate on money. You claim that because you have brought money into the country in the past, that this should count against your extensions in the present and the future.

If this is the case, someone who has lived here for twenty years should have easier targets to meet than someone who comes for a two week holiday a few times and then decides to retire here.

What if someone who has lived here only five years has brought in twice the amount of foreign currency that someone who has lived here ten years?

I think the above examples show that your suggestion is unworkable and a tad silly. You have pushed it because it is beneficial for you only. Should be filed under Wishful Thinking.

I don't think an easier visa should exist based on the amount of money you have bought into Thailand. (very large investments aside)

What I do think is Thailand should reward good character by making visas easier the longer one stays here.

Someone here for 20 years, who has never come under the notice of police, or immigration, still has to jump through the same hoops as someone going for their first visa.  

We know permanent residency is basically unachievable here, but it's quite insulting there is no recognition, by way of an easier visa, after 5, 10, 15, 20 years of residing in Thailand. 

I'm not complaining.  Just saying. 

On 4/9/2019 at 3:31 PM, fforest1 said:

In a nutshell....Thailand offers no social benefits to Expats at all.....They give no legal rights to Expats at all...They offer no long term visa security to Expats at all, and no the few PRs issued dont count....The offer no ability to work,and no the few work permits issued dont count....

 

The only thing good they offered a Expat was a easy visa...

 

Well folks with out a easy visa the Thai government is offering Expats a grand total of NOTHING what so ever....

Correct.

The sad thing is, you could be here for 20 years, with a property, vehicles, wife, kids, maybe even a business, but you will still have no more rights than the tourist coming here for the first time on a 30 day visa exemption stamp.

On that basis, why would you move 800k here, let alone your asset base? 

On 4/9/2019 at 10:42 AM, mlkik said:

I do not understand how people think that it is a bad deal. All that is needed to relocate and retire in Thailand is 800 000 baht in a Thai bank account.

Thai people have to me much tougher requirements even to get a visa for a short holliday.

Why are people so arrogant that they think they are entitled to get something for nothing ? 

If it's not such a bad deal, why don't you move all you cash / assets here?  ????

You know why you don't, and the 800k should be no different. 

23 minutes ago, wilailuk said:

Agree 100%.. I´ve done about the same, at Div. 1. CW, never any problems, never.. But I´ve seen endless stupidity and arrogant attitudes, observing almost all creeds and colors, during the average 4 to 6 hours waiting time. If your paperwork is not OK, you stink and look like you just crawled out of Nana Pl., not shaven, not showered, in T-shirt, shorts and flip-flops (yup, I´ve seen such monsters) - then you ARE in for trouble..

 

 

So, they judge a book by its cover.

What if such a person you describe parties hard every night at Nana Plaza, on the drink, and the women, because he can afford to? 

What is gained by kicking him out of the country? 

49 minutes ago, Krupps said:

I would say many seasoned investors save income tax on their other investments by living in Thailand, not to mention the lower living costs here.

so it's a trade off, you win a few, you lose a few.

Depends on their resident status, for taxation purposes, in the home country. Sometimes, you can be taxed more, if deemed to be a non resident of your home country, when you are product an income.

42 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

1.  You don't have enough money to retire in Thailand.  2.  No, you don't lose control of your money.  3. If you actually have a pot to p in go home and get a 2 year O-A visa for 2 years and stop this constant complaining about peanuts.  $259 per month to stay (borrow the money at a bank for 10 years).  If you can't afford a couple of hundred a month or a trip home once every 2 years.  You  don't have enough money to retire in Thailand.  Sorry. 

1.  I have more than enough money to retire in Thailand, and have been retired here for some years. 

2.  You can't touch 400k of you own money for as long as you want next year's visa. (stop spreading false information) I'll spend my money the way I want to.  Not the way the Thai government wants me to spend it. 

3.  Yes, O-A visa is an option, but an easier option is looking more and more like paying around 20k to an agent, and let them deal with everything.   

What's the $259????

I have be comfortably living here, legally, for some years, and have never come under the notice of police either here, or in my home country.

Just because I see the 800k method as a lousy deal, don't think that I haven't got the money to do it.      

Just now, Lacessit said:

I'll take your word for it on the subject of female company in Vietnam.

As far as paying 20K to an agent goes, I suspect that is illegal, and the other shoe may drop at any time.

I actually thought they would disappear, overnight, with these new laws, but they are still operating.

I've never used them.  Never needed to.  Still don't need to, but may chose to use them.  

Yes, their services are illegal, and have been for decades, the same as prostitution here.  ????

Illegal things are allowed to operate for a reason here.  We all know that.

One thing is for sure, if they are allowed to operate, anyone staying on the 800k method would be paying more money for the same visa, and losing control of their own money. 

1 hour ago, Dumbastheycome said:

After 15  consequ. renewals to date have never had an issue. 

Have witnessed  some others have  issues.

In over hear it is usually due to the attitude of the applicant initially or in adverse reaction to some question.

Even for a retirement extention a  formally  married partner who attempts to dominate the situation usually  turns nasty.

But that is only my observational opinion.

 

 

 

 

So, it comes down to character, and not about meeting the requirements.  Perhaps even if the immigration officer had a shag that morning.  ????

2 minutes ago, GinBoy2 said:

Now I'm only talking from my Swedish guys experiences.

 

But I thought everyone is transported to IDC in BKK prior to deportation.

 

Speculation, but does this suggest that there are other crimes he is going to be prosecuted for over and above the overstay?

I thought the same.

Perhaps going to Prachuap for a "re-enactment." 

9 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

Prachuap Khiri Khan is a town 94 kilometers south of Hua Hin. The opposite direct from Bangkok.

 

 

 

 

Yes, sounds strange he would be taken further away from the airport out. 

43 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

You have the same visa? How does that work?

I was under the impression female company in Thailand is freely available, whereas in Vietnam it is fraught with difficulty. Feel free to educate me.

I had been on the 65k method.

If the agents are allowed to continue to operate under the new laws, and their prices remain around the same as before, I will use their "services" and remain in Thailand. 

That means my 800k stays in my managed fund, in my home country, safe and secure, with a return of around 6% to 8%. 

I will have the same visa as a someone with 800k wasted in a Thai bank, 400k of which they have basically lost forever. 

You obviously haven't been to Vietnam for quite some time.  Plenty of female company in Vietnam, and no difficulty at all. 

At first, when these new visa laws came out, I thought for sure the agents would be shut down.  Now, it appears immigration is actually trying to push people onto them.

Like I have said, pay 20k to an agent without any other hoops to jump through, and maintain control over your finances, versus 800k in a Thai bank,  seasoning periods to consider, losing the right to use 400k of your own money, and you get paid 1.5% for the privilege, and, you have to deal with immigration officers.  Which one would you chose?

30 minutes ago, steven100 said:

I don't think Thailand or Vietnam wants someone of your attitude in their country to be honest.

Why do you say that? It has nothing to do with attitude.

Thailand offers itself as a "product" for prospective retirees, just like other countries.  The way you go and look at a house before you buy it, you should also look at a country before you retire there.    

There are many places one can retire to.  Thailand isn't the only place in the world expats can retire to, although Thailand would like to think it is.

Is it so unthinkable other nearby countries offer a similar lifestyle, but with easier visa requirements than Thailand, not to mention, more spending power on exchange, because the baht artificially strong, and a lot less BS?

I'll ask you the question that I have asked others.  What would be a figure for you before you said enough is enough?  1 million?  1.5 million?  2 million?  For me, it's always been 800k.  Not because I haven't got 800k to do it, but because it's a bad deal. 

1 hour ago, GeorgeCross said:

 

such as?

See Post 117 on this thread.

A poster from Australia asked the same question for his AUD. 

In a 20 second Google I found several options for him, all between 6% and 8% return, balanced, and non aggressive.  

Compare this to being forced to put 800k in a Thai bank at 1.5%, 400k of which you can never use, and you can see they are taking the p*ss. 

2 hours ago, Snow Leopard said:

I am on a 12-month O&A issued in Dubai on income method. They wanted 800K equivalent in AED in my local UAE bank account for a minimum of 3 months. I could show them that I transfer my money to Jersey and they wouldn't accept it. So income it was. 

So, you would know, as a foreigner working in the UAE, you should transfer most of your salary out, and just leave living expenses every month, otherwise, you, and your money, can be locked up in the UAE, should something unforeseen happen.

Yet, people don't see the 800k / 400k Thailand deal the same way. ????

1 hour ago, marcusarelus said:

No change for 20 years then a couple of small changes in 2019.  Not really a fast pace is it?  The big change has been the stable baht and the falling pound. 

Funny how "small changes" have big impacts in Thaiand.  Isn't it?  ????

i wonder what their next "small change" will be.  For sure it will not be for the benefit of foreigners.