way2muchcoffee

This latest incident in Phuket seems somehow indicative of the way the world has turned. Or maybe that's just how it's always been.

Canadian feels ripped off. Probably mouths off a bit. Stupidly, and probably arrogantly and self-righteously refuses to pay agreed upon price. Thai, somewhat ironically, feels cheated, but even worse can't stand the sting of his lost face. Violence ensues. Everyone loses.

A typical tourist family of 3 or 4 spends maybe 10-20,000 bt per day including hotels and stays maybe 5-10 days. How many families won't go to Phuket this year after reading about both the Canadian and Frenchman? And then there are the jet skis, the political situation, civil unrest, extremist violence in the south.

Very depressing thread.

Wow Chula campus is amazing. But what's with all the long skirts? More like ankle length oversized dresses actually. Maybe 15% of girls have on the correct attire. It was 100% at Bangkok University.

Go to Bangkok University. It will be cheaper and the skirts are shorter. Of course the school has a very poor reputation in the academic community and the degree won't be worth the paper it's written on. But since you are mostly going for the short skirts I think it would be perfect.

Chulalongkorn University is arguably the most prestigious school in Thailand. Obviously Thammasat, Mahidol, and KMUTT are up there as well. Chula has a long tradition of academic excellence (relative to most other Thai universities). Because of the relatively high standards the skirts will be somewhat longer in general. The students are proud to be there and they want to portray this in the community. Don't worry though, there will still be short skirts there if that is where you eventually go.

BIB = Boys in Brown also known as police

Fast food is not the best for you to be sure.

Bread products are high in refined carbohydrates.

Rice is high in refined carbohydrates.

Fast food often has cheese, a high calorie dairy product.

Many curries have coconut milk, a high calorie non-dairy product.

Fast food is often cooked in oil, turning to fat in the body if not burned off by exercise.

Thai food is often cooked in oil, turning to fat in the body if not burned off by exercise.

Fast food has few vegetables.

In most Thai food the vegetables have been overcooked to such a degree that they have very little benefit.

Some fast food is grilled, infusing it with cancer causing nitrites and nitrates.

Some Thai food is grilled, infusing it with cancer causing nitrites and nitrates.

What do you want?

From the long list of incidents you point to it does seem like you either have very bad luck or you circulate in some questionable circles (?) ... Mugged, kidnapped and brutally assaulted in Seattle... dam_n...

I'll remind you that the kidnapping occurred when I was 7 years old - at a high end suburban shopping mall. The perpetrator was caught and spent the next 20 years in jail.

The mugging occurred as I was walking to my apartment from the central business district at night. No buses or taxis were available, and I was relatively skint as a young 20-something. I was forced to walk through a bad area at night. And so it happened.

But this thread is about Thailand. I was only offering those non-Thai items as a comparison factor.

Not that anyone cares but here is my opinion.

From the Dem side:

1) Refund Thaksin's money, less appropriate taxes, fines for corrupt practice, reparations to gov't for lost monies due to his abuse of power. So return about half the money in total.

2) Commute existing sentence to a 10 year probation.

3) No amnesty on other charges. The charges must see the light of court in order to ascertain guilt or innocence. However a deal could be made for a blanket punishment including further fines and extension of probation period, increased consequences for probation violation, but no jail time.

From Thaksin

1) Complete and total separation from politics in Thailand or any other country, including donations, fundraisers, advisorships, the use of proxies, etc, for the duration of his life.

2) Thaksin surrenders all passports, as would any other convicted felon.

3) Probation agreement states that involvement in politics in any capacity whatsoever invalidates all probation conditions. He would then immediately serve full sentence on every conviction, in a military prison.

Well two of you not calling each other is not going to get the relationship through to January is it??

Call her.... :

Best wishes for the New Year

Agreed. Give her a call. It is New Year's Eve. Hopefully she'll answer or call back. If she doesn't then it would most definitely send up red flags. Good luck.

1) I was mugged in BKK near the Klong Tan intersection. I nearly lost a finger blocking the machete that was arcing toward my head. It was definitely unprovoked. I managed to get away, not really interested in battling two guys wielding machetes with my finger dangling, held on by bits of bone, skin, and tendon.

2) I was involved in a physical altercation with a motorcycle taxi driver at the stand below the Ratchetewi BTS station. I share responsibility with the assailant on this one though as we provoked each other.

3) The wife and I were stalked and nearly attacked by a gang of young roughs while walking along Lad Prao soi 101. We escaped harm by ducking into a temple.

4) My wife was attacked with a steel pipe last year while at a party on a visit to her family's village.

5) My wife was attacked and nearly raped by a taxi driver 3 years ago near Khlong Sam - Rangsit area.

6) Once I was pick pocketed on the BTS and lost a fair bit of cash along with ID, bank cards, etc.

7) I've found myself in numerous situations and locations where you could feel the menace from the locals there: a karaoke place, a Thai go go bar, a far away village where wife and I knew few people.

So no. I don't feel particularly safe in Thailand. But at the same time I don't give it much thought, and don't let it effect the things I do or the places I go.

And to be fair, I was mugged in Seattle earning a broken nose for my efforts at thwarting the robbery. Also as a young boy of seven I was kidnapped and brutally assaulted near a shopping mall in the suburbs of the Seattle area. So I also don't feel particularly safe at home either. And there too it didn't prevent me from going about the daily business of life and the pursuit of enjoyment, experience, and adventure.

Perhaps a change of life style is called for?

Which change do you recommend? I can only see where I was at fault in one of those instances. Should I shut myself in? Should I not go visit cousins of my wife in Lad Prao? I don't go into 'Thai only' entertainment venues anymore. Should I not take the BTS? Should I not visit a friend who lives near Klong Tan? Should my wife never take a taxi? Should my wife not have a few drinks with friends at a neighbors house in her village? Should a child never go to a shopping mall with his parents? On the face of it I don't see any merit in your suggestion, but I am open to more specific recommendations if you have any to offer.

1) I was mugged in BKK near the Klong Tan intersection. I nearly lost a finger blocking the machete that was arcing toward my head. It was definitely unprovoked. I managed to get away, not really interested in battling two guys wielding machetes with my finger dangling, held on by bits of bone, skin, and tendon.

2) I was involved in a physical altercation with a motorcycle taxi driver at the stand below the Ratchetewi BTS station. I share responsibility with the assailant on this one though as we provoked each other.

3) The wife and I were stalked and nearly attacked by a gang of young roughs while walking along Lad Prao soi 101. We escaped harm by ducking into a temple.

4) My wife was attacked with a steel pipe last year while at a party on a visit to her family's village.

5) My wife was attacked and nearly raped by a taxi driver 3 years ago near Khlong Sam - Rangsit area.

6) Once I was pick pocketed on the BTS and lost a fair bit of cash along with ID, bank cards, etc.

7) I've found myself in numerous situations and locations where you could feel the menace from the locals there: a karaoke place, a Thai go go bar, a far away village where wife and I knew few people.

So no. I don't feel particularly safe in Thailand. But at the same time I don't give it much thought, and don't let it effect the things I do or the places I go.

And to be fair, I was mugged in Seattle earning a broken nose for my efforts at thwarting the robbery. Also as a young boy of seven I was kidnapped and brutally assaulted near a shopping mall in the suburbs of the Seattle area. So I also don't feel particularly safe at home either. And there too it didn't prevent me from going about the daily business of life and the pursuit of enjoyment, experience, and adventure.

Very good news. I applaud any type or personal accountability in government.

Don't get me wrong, I really feel for this boys family, as it must be terrible for them to loose their son.

It might be moronic to you, but I still stand for my opinion that self inflicted harm should be treated as self inflicted.

 I just find it not ok that people (in this case the resort owner) will be blamed automatically for the wrong doing of the victim itself, especially when the facts are not yet clear.  

They were in the pool presumably with management approval, at least tacit approval. Otherwise how could they even be in the pool at that hour? Their drunkenness may or may not be relevant. That would depend on exactly what happened. That the electrocution occurred on private property in a public area ensures the owner is responsible, without question. If the revelers were behaving in an unsafe manner then the management had the duty to stop the dangerous behavior and maintain their safety. This was not done, clearly, as there was a death involved. This is negligence on the part of the management. I can't see any way in which the management can escape culpability, though I doubt that anything will be done.

RIP to the young man who lost his life.

Actually, Thai math curriculum is last in all SE asian nations according to the OECN. in less than 6 years thailand has gone from first in math and science to 7th and 11th out of all SE Asian nations and the curriculum is at least 3 years behind standards set by ASEAN. and other international education firms.

Have you read the Thai math curriculum? Have you read the IB Math curriculum? Have you read the IGCSE/A-Level Math Curriculum? Have you read the AP Math Curriculum? I have read and taught all of the above both in the classroom and privately. I assure you that the level of the math curriculum in Thailand is as high or higher than the others. I don't mean the Basic Curriculum from the MoE. I mean the suggested Additional Math curriculum as promulgated by most Thai schools. The content of coverage is about the same in all four systems, but the level of difficulty of the problems within any particular content area is generally much higher in the Thai math courses.

Moreover the proof is in the pudding. How is it possible that EP students in our school roundly beat competitors from ISB, Ruamrudee, and a few other international schools in two separate math competitions last year? Remember that all students in an EP are native Thai speakers, which reduces their ability to learn mathematics in English. It is also the case that students from our Thai only program routinely outperform students in our EP at mathematics. If A > B, and B > C, then it must follow that A > C. Now I realize my school may be an anomaly, but there are several public Thai schools that are broadly recognized as far superior to the school I work for. I would, however, agree that Int'l schools are more successful in that a higher percentage of their students meet the expectations of the curriculum.

I'm quite happy living in a decent sized townhouse (2.5 bdr, kitchen, parking, 3 bath, dining room, living room, large foyer) in a secured moo baan off Narathiwas Rd. between Sathorn and Rama III. Quite reasonable rent at only 12k per month. The moo baan is upscale a bit so it is very quiet with good and polite neighbors despite being in the center of the city. Excellent Thai food offerings and a 24-hour market for fresh meat/produce. Tesco nearby. Close to Silom and Sukhumvit. About 10 minutes motorcycle to work. Really it's perfect for us.

As far as i know, Thai 'teachers' only need a Bachelors degree to teach. Well........they do at our school anyway.

That was true in the past. Current law requires significant teacher education training in addition to a bachelor degree. Alternately a teacher may become teacher certified if he or she can demonstrate knowledge of the teaching profession by passing a series of Professional Knowledge Tests. These standards are being applied to all primary and secondary school teachers in Thailand.

If we don't know, why proclaim - as some posters have done for months - that is is a fact that KP is involved in scams against their customers?

And I see that WinnieTheKhwai is as liberal with quotes and truth as always.

Fair point TAWP. Guess it's just typical garbage internet comments people make without knowing or seeing evidence. Something I try to avoid, but nevertheless have done in the past and probably will do again in future.

The fact of the matter is that there isn't any incentive for the normal staff to frame any innocent people. They don't get any cut of the 'police-money' - that all goes to the negotiator and the police that is corrupting the justice system!

Not sure that's a fact. I would agree that in your very limited experience there is no evidence of such practices by staff. I would also agree that in your friend's considerably greater experience there is no evidence of such practices by staff. That does not mean that it doesn't exist. It also does not mean that it does happen. Bottom line, we just don't know.

I have been teaching in Thai schools for over 6 years, both Government and Private. I agree about the comments about Mathematics but what about English? Most Thai English teachers that I have worked with cannot speak English and certainly can't teach it. If you dont believe me try holding a conversation in English with an 18 year old who probably has had lessons in English for over 12 years. You will find that most of them can't say a thing in English. The curriculum gives a very one sided view of history and world events and grossly exaggerates the contributions made by a few individuals. I wonder if those Thai Visa members making comments have actual experience in the schools in this country.

I must agree about the woeful state of English language instruction in Thailand. Even with foreign English teachers most Thai students never really get a strong grounding in basics of the English language, and certainly not in the actual usage of the language. I am not sure why this is actually. It could be the students themselves and the values their parents and society instill in them. It seems that I learned more in 2 years of Spanish language classes in the U.S. than most Thai kids learn in 12 years of English language instruction. It baffles me.

With regards to history and geography they do have these items in their curriculum, but they also seem to be unimportant culturally and most Thai students seem to view them as irrelevant to their lives. Maybe they are right, especially in the upcountry regions.

Mathematics tends to be strong in most schools, at least in BKK. The level is generally higher than schools in the West, in keeping with Asian traditions.

Science topics will vary considerably from school to school. Unfortunately most schools don't have the budget to outfit a proper laboratory. This takes away from the practical understanding of science and effects the development critical thinking and analysis skills.

These are my impressions of the Thai school systems after working in them for 8 years as a mathematics and physics teacher.

I have to say that the education system here, more specifically the curriculum, is farcical. No geography, no history, no dedicated maths or language skills.....

All they are doing (in my opinion) is training Thai kids to become Thai adults!!

It's all singing and dancing shows and paying homage to everything that is Thai. Yes, I realise we are in Thailand but ask any teenage student the capital of UK or USA and I would believe that less than 50% would know the answers to both.

A lot of kids don't even know the geography of their own country!!

That's just plain not true. There are required classes in history, language, geography, and dedicated math every year from primary 1 to secondary 6. The teachers may not be the best, but the curriculum is comprehensive, especially in mathematics.

Just fine all the motorbikes with more than 3 people on it. There are many, especially at night with no taillight. That would be an easy start.

Here's some interesting statistics : UK population= about 60 million almost the same as Thailand's, fatalities on the road UK= 3500 per year Thailand =10000- more than 3 times as many. Why? Driver training, attitude to safety ie compulsory wearing of crash helmets on motorbikes and policing. The best way to improve Thailands bad record would be to train and test people on how to drive motorcycles, including how to look behind themselves once in a while, give large fines for not wearing a helmet. To put an age requirement on driving a motorcycle of at least 17 years. To fine anyone carrying infants or young children on motorcycles and to fine people who ride with 3 or more people on the motorbike. Just some ideas but it would take a lot more to change the Thais attitude to 'risk management.'

To be fair, it should be considered what percentage of the population rides motorcycles versus cars in the UK for these kind of comparisons to make any sense. Obviously riding a motorcycle is much more dangerous. I suspect if this was factored in the statistics wouldn't be so startling. Not that I'm defending the driving habits on the roads of Thailand. I'm not. They are dangerous, very dangerous.

I'm not anti capitalist, and definitely not pro socialist, I've done very well out of the capitalist system thank you. But it does seem as if there's a layer, below which the trickle down effect stops trickling and turns into a dribble.

What percentage of the children of rice farm workers do you reckon have a realistic chance of escaping a life of poverty (other than by the routes of lotter ticket or lottery farang)? We who have done well mostly were born into these opportunities.

Are you suggesting that what I (or others may have) was given to us, OR that by being born in the country we were born in has allowed these opportunities?

I believe that is precisely what he is suggesting. If not the first, then definitely the second. I would think anyone would be hard-pressed to formulate a reasonable argument to contradict this.

no offense but one has to be really careless to be robbed at victory monument. THERS SO MANY FREAKIN PEOPLE AROUND! IT COULD BE YOUR WIFE NEEDS to learn to be more alert.

thief prey on the feeble.

once it is just haaenstance but 2nd time in 2 weeks, ill bet itll happen 3r d time.

With a ridiculous comment like that it could be you need to get your head out of your arse. Blame the victim, yada, yada, yada....

Sympathies to the wife. It's good she wasn't injured.

Goodness. The veracity of this thread is questionable. However, if you are sincere then I suggest that you just go with the flow, but set limits where things become uncomfortable for you. It is perfectly normal bedroom behavior so long as both parties consent. There should be true respect in the relationship as a precondition for any of this type of bedroom play. I wouldn't be alarmed.

- a 1 br with a modern/ european interior, furnished

10,000 to 15,000 per month plus another 3-6k for utilities, internet, etc.

- a maid every week

1000-2000

- a motorcycle (upkeep, gas etc.)

I don't understand. You can buy a cheap one second hand for under 15k. Gas will be cheap enough. You will likely be fined by the police for false or real infractions once a month or more in BKK, depending on how often you drive. Budget about 1000 per month or so.

- to eat meat at every meal, doesn't have to be western style

Call it 500 bt per day for food or 15,000 per month

- a private language tutor every few days

4-5,000 per month

- hobby lessons- martial arts, cooking... not all at once, one at a time

4-5,000 per month, maybe less, maybe more, depending on the class

bars/clubs maybe 2-3x a week, again doesn't have to be ex-pat, just friendly and lively places

1000-2000 per evening, maybe more. Call it 15,000 per month.

I'd suggest something closer to 2,000 USD per month would be more appropriate. Plus an additional 2,000 USD to get established with apartment and transportation. Plus another 2,000 USD as an emergency fund. If you need to live on $1200 you can certainly do this and still enjoy yourself, you would just need to be a little more discerning in how you spend the cash.

Workplace inspections by the Phuket Provincial Labor Protection Office have found that minors make up a very small fraction of the Phuket workforce

Every child younger than 16 which have to work is one too much.

Only two cases from my area.

An about 10-11 y.o. Burmese girl worked on a building site, carrying stones and cement buckets

and two little girls 12+9!!! years old HELP her mother work in a rubber plantation. They are carrying heavy buckets with rubber, and cut into the trees to make

the rubber latex run.

When I asked them why they dont go to school they ansered NO MONEY .....I always thought schools are free in Thailand for EVERY kid and poor people

get their uniforms and school materials provided too

I tend to agree, but not entirely. I have no problem with children helping dad at the construction site, mom at the salon, the corner store, or doing agricultural farm work. In fact I think it is good for them to help out in this way, so long as they are allowed to go to school, are not exploited, and are not doing excessively dangerous work.

No matter what price you agreed upon before getting on the tuk tuk, the price will change once you reached the destination. best to avoid tuk tuk at all times and take the meter taxi instead.

Explorer

I don't take tuk tuk's much, maybe 100 times over 8 years, once a month. I have never had this happen to me. Not once. Yes, they overcharge. Yes they drive dangerously. Yes they can be aggressive. Yes, yes, yes. But I've never had the price changed on me.