Longwood50

1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:

What makes you think it was just Obama?

I did not say it was.  However irrespective it is wrong to use U.S. influence to coerce a foreign government.  Shokin may have not been a good prosecutor.  Hint  Putin is not a nice man.  It would be improper for the USA to take actions to have power groups in Russia overthrow him.  No different than it is improper for the USA to say, I will 'bribe" you with loan guarantees if you do my bidding.  

 

Criticism of United States foreign policy

Wikipedia

https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Criticism_of_United_...

 

 

 

1 hour ago, LosLobo said:

2 hours ago, Longwood50 said:

Does the term interference with a foreign government mean anything to do.  If you recall Trump faced impeachment just for suggesting that Ukraine investigate the activities at Burisma. 

And somehow you suggest that Obama had the right to tell Ukraine what do do relative to not investigating Burisma.  I am not saying you are ignorant but its the thinking part that has you stumped. 

 

Expand  

Trump was impeached for illegally asking a foreign government to interfere in the 2020 elections.

https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2019/12/politics/trump-ukraine-impeachment-inquiry-report-annotated/

44 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

But you believe everything they say without seeing the evidence.

You obviously do.  I use some common sense try it sometime.  No one hires Hunter Biden to wash his car let alone be on the board of an Oil and Gas company.  

No one gives Hunter Biden $1 billion dollars to invest because of his outstanding character and investment expertise. 

31 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Shokin refused to investigate Burisma.

Not according the Devon Archer who said Burisma approached Hunter for help to from DC. 

Irrespective does the term INTERFERENCE WITH A FOREIGN GOVERNMENT SOUND FAMILIAR.  They impeached Trump for a non quid pro quo where he merely suggested that Ukraine investigate. 

That is far different than Biden on tape saying he demanded Shokin be fired otherwise he was witholding US loan guarantees.  

That is blatant interferendce and a clear quid pro quo.  

You can argue that Shokin was not a good guy and that may or may not be true however Neither Obama or Biden have any legal right to use U.S. influence to shape the actions of a foreign government.  

https://nypost.com/2023/08/04/viktor-shokin-was-threat-to-burisma-says-hunter-biden-partner-devon-archer/

16 minutes ago, candide said:

December 2015, you cite? That was after The U.S., the EU and the IMF asked for Shokin to be dismissed

Is there a part of interference with a foreign government you have difficulty in understanding.  Trump was impeached just for making the suggestion of an investigation.  Biden is on tape saying he demanded the resignation of Shokin as a condition to get $1 billion is USA aid.  As I said, you have trouble with the thinking part. 

17 minutes ago, candide said:

Real facts: the Obama administration had been consistently criticizing Ukraine prosecutor general's office for not investigating (and even helping) Burisma

Does the term interference with a foreign government mean anything to do.  If you recall Trump faced impeachment just for suggesting that Ukraine investigate the activities at Burisma. 

And somehow you suggest that Obama had the right to tell Ukraine what do do relative to not investigating Burisma.  I am not saying you are ignorant but its the thinking part that has you stumped. 

18 minutes ago, stevenl said:

. Also that prosecutor was fired for completely different reasons as has been shown again and again

And where do you get your information from that he was fired for different reasons.  

Also even if true, his actions as VP are not allowed.  It is called interfering with the governance of a foreign country.  You don't call another country and tell them to fire the guy or you don't get money.  That is quid pro quo. 

Joe Biden ? Of course he had to fabricate a reason why he fired him 

You also omit the fact that Devon Archer Hunter Biden's partner testified that Burisma executives came to him and asked for help from DC They certainly were not talking about Daniel Craig.  Now who has a reason to lie?  Hunter Biden, Joe Biden or Devon Archer.  I suggest it aint Devon

 

Hunter Biden's business partner Devon Archer revealed that Ukrainian oil company Burisma used vague terms to demand he use his influence as the then-vice president's son for help.

According to Archer, during a dinner with Burisma executives at the Four Seasons in Dubai in December 2015, Hunter said he would be able to get 'help from D.C.' in order to relieve some 'government pressure' on the company.

 

ather, they used the 'amorphous' term: 'can we get help in D.C.?'

'The request -- you know, basically the request is like, can D.C. help?' said Archer.

'But there were not -- you know, I'm not going to -- there were not -- it wasn't like -- there weren't specific, you know, can the big guy help? It was -- it's always this amorphous, can we get help in D.C.?'

1 hour ago, Danderman123 said:

Actual proof of these allegations is not attached.

Now that is funny.  I know this will come as a shock to you but I don't sit on the Senate Oversight committee so I did not get a copy of the evidence.  

1 hour ago, candide said:

). They have never been able to come up with worse than that. Later, the content has been accessed by other media, and the pictures from the laptop have posted on the Internet. 

And there would be some mysterious laptop content incriminating one of the Biden's or both? It doesn't make sense!

You are conjecturing.  Neither you or I know what is on that laptop nor do we know what restrictions if any the New York Post and Guilliani have imposed on them.  

One way or another it is fact that Hunter Biden was put on the board of Burisma.  It is fact that he got millions despite knowing nothing about Ukraine, or the oil and gas business.  It is a fact he was widely known as a crack addict.  It is a fact that Biden witheld US loan guarantees unless the prosecutor going after Burisma was fired. You must have been on the OJ jury if you think that was all innocent. 

Your assertion that somehow this is all jsut smoke and mirrors is ludicrous.  I suspect you would have police stop a car driven by Hillary Clinton with a dead body in the trunk and a firearm with her fingerprints on it and say the evidence was only circumstantial.  

 

56 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

So the weaponized DOJ indicted Hunter Biden and Senator Menendez.

 

It's almost as if they are going after suspected criminals.

The FBI used fraudulent and unlawfully obtained FISA warrants to go after Carter Page who was on the Trump campaign.  The warrant gives two jumps meaning they can spy on anyone Page contacts and anyone that those people in turn contact.  That gives them access to Trump and everyone Trump contacts.   

The DOJ went after General Flynn but did not go after Hillary Clinton who lied to the FBI.  Interesting is that Comey is with the FBI and he have her the free pass and it was never questioned that he lacked the authority to do so.  The FBI has the role of investigating and presenting evidence to the Dept of Justice.  The Justice Dept has the role of deciding to or not to prosecute. But Comey exoneratted her.  Mind you this is the same Comey who went after Martha Stewrt not for insider trading but lying to the FBI.  

They went after Michael Cohen Trump's lawyer why.  They wanted to shakedown Cohen threatening him with additional crimes if he didn't assist in providing damaging information on Trump. 

All of this is political.  Do I think Hunter is guilty yes.  Do I think he would have been prosecuted for the gun charge if he was not the son of Joe Biden.  NO.   He did commit a crime but that offense is rarely if ever prosecuted. 

1 hour ago, candide said:

Do you think they have withheld incriminating evidence against Hunter or Joe

Yes, 

Just like I think that Hillary Clinton and the FBI planted the false dossier that was used to smear Trump.  Just like Lisa Paige and Peter Stroz used their positions to get Trump.  Just like Comey lied on FISA warrants to spy on Carter Page which gave him access to surveillance on Trump. 

Perhaps you believe USA politics is as pure as the driven snow but I don't.  Going back even a few years to Herbert Hoover he kept dossiers on his enemies and Richard Nixon had his enemies list. 

Conversely, you have Comey who obtained and convicted Martha Stewart for lying to the FBI giving Clinton a pass on lying to the FBI and ignoring subpoenas and destroying the evidence under subpoenas.  

So yes the establishment is weaponsized to use against those who are your political opponents and as a defense to shield those they want from prosecution.  
 

You have Trump being impeached for suggesting that Ukraine look into the Hunter Biden and Burisma matter as political interference.  You have Joe Biden on tape bragging he withheld a billion in US loan guarantees to Ukraine if they didn't fire the prosecutor going after Burisma where his son was receiving millions from and he was not even scolded for obviously interfering in the affairs of a foreign government. 

On 9/15/2023 at 2:36 PM, candide said:

if there were any incriminating evidence on the laptop, the right-wing NYPost would not have already found it and published it?

Candide you obviously have read very little about the Hunter Biden laptop.  The FBI has it and I understand at one time Guilliani and the Apple repair person retained copies of its hard drive. 

Devon Archer, Hunter Biden's business partner, gives testimony to Congress that then-VP Joe Biden was on more than 20 business calls with his son

• Republicans claim Archer's testimony added to evidence Joe was involved in Hunter's overseas deals that raked in millions from Ukraine, China and Romania
• Democrats claimed the phone calls were innocent and did not involve business
• Hunter and Burisma executives reportedly 'called D.C.' to discuss the firing of Ukrainian prosecutor
  
  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12356923/Hunter-Bidens-business-partner-Devon-Archer-arrives-bombshell-testimony-Joes-involvement-shady-business-deals-DOJ-accused-trying-jail-talk.html
  
  So many of the things on the laptop were corroborated by Hunter Biden's own business parter.  
  
  Though some of the items on laptop have been released to the best of my knowledge the entire contents of it have still not been made public.  
  
  Now if you think that Hunter Biden was so gifted that a Ukranian oil and gas firm would pay him millions, that he was such a nice person that the wife of the Moscow mayor would send him $3 million and then coincidentally her family was omitted from the U.S. sanctions on Russian Oligarchs.  That Hunters personal investment record was so outstanding that the Chinese would give him over a billion to invest.  I have several bridges for sale around the world and you can make monthly payments to me if you want to buy them. 
•  

On 9/16/2023 at 5:37 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

Didn't stop him getting quite wealthy though...

5 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

The laptop info you use came from the FBI or Rudy?

The contents of the laptop have not been completely released.  The photos and other information have come from what the FBI has.  To the best of my knowledge neither Rudy or the Apple store employee has publicly released information from the laptop.  It was reported that Rudy turned over the hard drive he had to government officials but it is believed he made a copy.  So there would be at least three hard drives one in possession of the FBI, one with Rudy, and one with the Apple repair store.  Impossible to manipulate all three. 

 

1 minute ago, Danderman123 said:

Explain "covfefe" to me.

Gaffe is when you make a mistake, particularly when it is an embarrasing one. 

3 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Did Rudy Guiliani have the laptop?

No,  it is my understanding the Rudy had a copy of the hard drive.  The FBI confiscated the original laptop and the owner of the Apple Repair store made a copy of the contents of the hard drive. 

Just now, ozimoron said:

Like, how many decades has he been senile now?

Senile I would say rather recently.  Not too bright, a gaffe artist, guilty of plagerism, and outright lies.  All of his life.  This is 15 years ago. 

Next is Politifact's list of lies. 

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/list/?category=&ruling=false&speaker=joe-biden

2 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

What relevance do Biden Gaffes have on a thread about Hunter Biden being indicted?

If you read the thread I said Joe Biden had mental difficulties for decades and was a gaffe artist.  The poster said supply proof. 

 

12 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

The laptop is worthless as evidence due to chain of custody issues

Now that is humerous.  I guess that those in the chain of custody somehow flew with Hunter and took those photos.  I guess that whoever had custody of the laptop somehow also got possession of Hunters internet service provider and falsified the emails on their servers.  Those same people who were in the chain of custody made the same changes to the same backup copy he made of the laptop 

6 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Please provide evidence for your accusations.

12 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

"a good prosecutor could persuade a Grand Jury "

I forgot to mention that I was a target shooter for many years and signed numerous 4473's over the years.  I went into a store where you have to complete the 4473 and then your information goes into The National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) I asked the clerk at a major chain are people really so stupid to try and purchase a gun when they know the background check will determine they have some violation that will disquality them.  The man replied, it happens each and every day.  Mostly by people who it could be confirmed were  prior felons.  

The only thing that happens to those people is that their purchase permit is rejcted Hunters was selectively chosen for scrutiny.