WDSmart

I thought you might mean SA Saudi Arabia. I see now why you included SA in your previous post. I haven't seen the topic on the ICJ's provisional ruling. I'll check that out. Thanks for alerting me. However, I do think the ruling itself is an appropriate item to mention in this topic. I've not tried to discuss it in detail.

I hope those who disagree with me will at least reconsider their views as they get more information. Some of that information is new, but some of it is old and has either been ignored by them or never presented to them. The International Court of Justice did not think South Africa's charges were nonsense, and those charges are compatible with the viewpoint I've had for many years. The International Court of Justice’s Rebuke of Israel Was Swift and Scathing | The New Republic

I do not care if Hamas and SA (who are they?) are not celebrating with me. How could the International Court of Justice's ruling not be pertinent to the topic of this thread? Isn't it about the Zionist's response to Hamas' Oct attack, just as the court's ruling is? The International Court of Justice’s Rebuke of Israel Was Swift and Scathing | The New Republic

Yes, I'd agree that the majority in my home country (USA) does not share my views on this crisis, but that's, IMO, is because they have not been presented with all the facts and the viewpoints from both sides. That, however, is changing. CNN, my primary source of news, is now presenting more information about the Palestinian and Arab perspectives. And, of course, yesterday's ruling (provisional) by the International Court of Justice will also cause more people to re-examine their positions on this crisis. I don't think the majority will every come around to my viewpoint, but I do believe the percentage will grow and grow as they learn more facts about this. I do not believe my opinions are delusiions. They are based on the "facts" I know from what I have viewed and read over the past 20 years, and that are being reinforced every day of this tragedy.

And, of course, my home country, the USA, is still funding the Zionist attacks on Gaza and the West Bank. This funding, however, is starting to become a political issue for Presiden Biden in the upcoming presidential election in November.

BINGO! (Provisional and long-overdue Bingo) The International Court of Justice’s Rebuke of Israel Was Swift and Scathing | The New Republic

A wellness resort on Koh Samui was why I first came to Thailand over 20 years ago. I'm still here - not in Koh Samui, but now living in the mountains of northeast Thailand.

Thanks again for your reply. I won't go through your post line-by-line, but I am impressed with your actual experiences in Israel/Palestine, and I will take all you have said at your word. I noticed you described "Palestinians" as "Arab citizens of Israel." That's a little telling to me. Other than that, the main thing I noticed was you differentiated between the West Bank and Gaza, implying the tensions in the West Bank were much less than those in Gaza. I assumed (there's that naughty word again! ) that was the case, but I don't know why. Maybe it's just because Gaza is more isolated than the West Bank and does not have so many sites that Israelis are interested in visiting. Gaza does seem to me much more of a powder keg, but now CNN () reports the IDF (IMO, should be "IAF" - Israeli Attack Forces ) is striking targets in the West Bank also. One thing I promise you, though, is I will try to remember all you've posted in your last two posts and consider those points when making judgments, forming opinions (yes, I'll still do that ), and posting responses. Thanks again for your recent responses...

Well, all the above is valuable information I can use when evaluating your posts. Thanks! How long ago were you last there? And when you were there, were you able to talk with both Israelis and Palestinians to hear their side of the story of this now 200-year-old conflict? What did they (especially the Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank) have to say? No, I reasoned that anyone with first-hand experience in the region of only one side of the conflict would most likely be biased. I did not expect you to have had experience with both sides, and I am still a little leery about just what kind of contact you had with Palestinians since you lean strongly toward the Israeli point of view. Did you really intermingle with "regular" Palestinians, or did you only observe them with a host of Israeli handlers around you? I've told you repeatedly I express my opinions. So, I express my opinion on what the Palestinian perspective must be, having had a portion of their land handed over to another group who then forcefully extended their claim on the land over the last 200 years. And, yes, I think I understand "their various social, political divides and groupings," at least enough to form my opinions on who the right-wing, nationalistic, militant groups are on each side. I think I have each of their political agendas straight. At this time, both are being led by the right-wing, nationalistic, militant groups on each side: Hamas and Zionists. Hamas wants to drive all Israelis out of what they consider to be their country, Palestine, and the Zionists want to drive all of the Palestinians out of what they consider to be their country, Israel. There are some exceptions to the "all" expressed above, but for me, "all" means "enough that they no longer have any control over the country." I'll close by suggesting you watch some of what CNN (my main source of news) on this subject. If you do, you'll find they are slowly coming around to expressing more and more of the viewpoint I have been posting all along. Thanks again for your explanations. I will remember them when I read your posts on this subject.

So, are you saying you have been there (I assume Israel and not Gaza or the West Bank) and do speak Hebrew (I assume not Arabic)? If so, then there is indeed a certainty that you do "come to the table with a preset biased stance." How could you not? And if all that is true, I don't blame you for that, and I would understand your fierce objections to my posts, which do present the matter from what I believe is the perspective of the Palestinians. If you validate my assumptions expressed above, I will indeed view your posts in a different light. That doesn't mean I'll agree with them, but it does mean I'll understand better where your bias comes from.

I do claim my posts are based on my opinions. So are yours. I do not lie. I express my opinion. If my opinion does not match yours or your sources, you consider my opinions lies. I know you believe and trust what you post because you believe they are backed by "fact, reality and knowledge." The "fact, reality and knowledge" are not yours, they are the opinions of others. You are just repeating what you read. You have no real knowledge of what's going on over there any more than I do. We both just rely on someone else's accounts and opinions on what is happening. Again, it is just your arrogance that convinces you that only you are right and anyone who disagrees with you is wrong and, worse yet, lying.

I know you believe in your version of what is happening and why. I think your version of "facts" is from biased sources. I don't believe you "lie." I am not lying when I cite my interpretation of what is happening. I am telling you truthfully what I see and read from a variety of sources, including many you cite. I am only offering what I believe from my perspective. The difference between us is, IMO, you are so sure of your sources and perspective that you believe any other perspective comes from some dishonesty. Mine doesn't. Also, one big difference is that you, again, IMO, are excessively arrogant, and that's what fuels your belief that you and only your perspective can not only be true but can be presented with integrity.

I have never wanted to go to Israel, and I agree with your decision now not to go on a tour of Israel. I think things there will remain unsettled for the foreseeable future. That could be many years, and things might even get worse there.

I do remember you from another forum about a month or two ago on this same topic. What I mean by expressing my opinions "for years" is I haven't changed them. I still have the same ones I had years ago, before the Hamas attack on Oct 7. That action did not change my overall opinion on this crisis. Most of my opinions do have a basis "in fact," if by "in fact" you mean they are the same as someone else's opinion that has been expressed on some trusted medium by some trusted source. I am not out of touch with reality. Your problem is you only see one reality from a biased viewpoint and refuse to entertain any other perspective on reality. You think there's only one correct viewpoint of reality, and of course, that's yours. There are many viewpoints and perspectives on reality. You may not agree with them, but they are not all "wrong." They are just different from yours.

I see that characterization as a truism. It's just an unpleasant one to accept.

I express the same opinions I've had for years, and certainly the ones I've expressed on previous forums. And yes, I remember you from them. What I'm expressing are not nonsense. They are my opinions, and they are shared by a large number of people. You disagree with them, so you classify them as "nonsense." They are not. You're previous explanations of your opinions have been biased and I didn't agree with them then, and still don't.

I don't think @NextG was siding with the Zionists. From what I've read, he, like me, doesn't "side" with either Hamas or Zionists. He also doesn't place all the blame on only one side, like you do.

Well, the Palestinian population has decreased by about 25,000 since Oct 7, and I suspect that will continue for a while longer. We'll have to wait and see what it is after the Zionists have satisfied their Terrorist and Expulsion-fighting activities.

Yes! The genocide of the Aborigines by the Aussies and the genocide of the American Indians by what is now called the US (my home country) is EXACTLY what is happening now with the Zionist takeover of Palestine.

The area we are talking about was referred to as "Palestine" by even the Balfour Declaration of 1917 which set this whole catastrophe into motion.

I don't disagree that Gaza and The West Bank are not sovereign states, but I do disagree that it was "vacant land that Jordon and Egypt didn't want and they gave it away." These were part of Palestine, as was what is now called "Israel," and belong to the Palestinians, as does, IMO, all of what is now called "Israel."

Nick Carter is: Do you also then claim that Gaza and The West Bank are a sovereign state? If not, what are they?

I disagree, but that's just my opinion. I don't have any "inside" information as to what else Hamas wants to do other than regain control of Palestine. They may think that requires the elimination of all Jews there, but not all Jews everywhere. That, again, IMO, is what the Zionists want regarding Arab Muslims in what is now called Israel. As I have said, I favor a one-state solution where BOTH Jews and Muslims inhabit Palestine, but I don't think that is ever going to happen. It's going to be one or the other, and right now, it looks like it will be the Jews.

No, they don't espouse a genocidal agenda. That's what the Zionists want to do with the Palestinians. Hamas only wants to regain control of the land that used to be theirs - Palestine. I've repeatedly said that before the 1920s, both Arabs/Muslims and Hebrews/Jews lived in peace in Palestine. It wasn't until after that when the Hebrews/Jews were given the land by the West as their "homeland," that they moved to take it completely over and call it "Israel."

Gaza. and the West Bank are only portions of the former state of Palestine. Hamas, the Freedom Fighters and Terrorists. are fighting to recover the entire state, not just the two small portions they have been forced to live in.