jonclark

What a load of nonsense.

You can see where the author is coming from with the divisive "This is what Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra is now called and labelled by her upper-class critics."

This author is doing exactly what he accuses others of - using the issue to score political points and to further divide people into them & us.

Fortunately, the whole article is poorly executed.

Correct, it's not just the upper classes being critical, many ordinary Thais are being as critical if not more, as they loose everything and have to endure on very limited resources. A poor article aimed as shifting the focus to the celestial elite.

You guys should stop beating around on Yingluck and blaming her for the current flood crisis. She's just doing the best she can. You guys also don't know where the flood is going or where it will flood in 2-3 days. It's an ever-changing situation. If you guys know, then why don't you share it here? If you don't, then let her do her job.

You should blame whoever designed the drain-off systems and water canals in Bangkok and Thailand in general over the past few decades. Whoever the people are that designed those are responsible, not Yingluck who just became PM this year. Or are you suggesting she dug all the wrong-designed canals herself in the past few weeks?

Even in the times of worst crisis in Thailand, there are people that have nothing better to do than play the "blame it on the Shinawatras" game. Go out and help some people. I know I stood in knee-deep water all day helping others. It makes me sick to come home and read all this crap.

Hello Newbie,

In your haste to pass blame, I suggest you take a moment to read up on some of the people who designed or were involved in the construction of the klong (canal) systems surrounding Bangkok and in the city itself.

They were built over a hundred years ago in many cases on the advice of ,and by order of, the King. Check out klong Rangsit for one and see who it is named after.

When the klongs were designed, Bangkok was not covered in concrete and the forests in the north had not all been cut down to cause landslides etc. Since then many have been filled in to create streets for Bangkok's traffic nightmare.

This government has known for months that this was coming, given the amount of monsoon rainfall we had. But then maybe not.

So we shouldn't listen to him because he is new on this webboard? lol there is nothing holy about being a longtime member here. Knowing this much water is coming doesn't mean anything can be done about it. To think a developing country can achieve a miracle and prevent a flood here is ridiculous, let's move on to something important like how to help people in trouble and where to get the best information on where water is going, when it's going there, and how long it will take to drain. Enough with the gloating already. How about this, we all admit you are so superior and intelligent and educated than (insert your own favorite whipping boy/girl) and let's get over it.

Totally agree with all your points, now if you could perhaps pass them on to the government and have them act on them we'd all be happy as they are all valid points that the FROC team should have address days ago instead of contradicting each other, delaying the release of information, blatently lying (see pradsaplops [or whatever his name is] comments a few days back) and fudguing the whole thing to save face, by making a balls up of the assistance offered by the US.

PS - Mr. Farang - We know that Yingluck is doing the best she can, but it's fairly <deleted> obvious her best isn't good enough.

The what club?

I think judging by its name it is possibly some sort of wife swapping / swingers club for residents of Udo. Maybe Taksins is a member!!

I wasn't aware of any current military brass winning political positions in any recent electoral processes. Under what authority is Prayuth getting involved?

Totally agree. The army should keep out of this and let PTP and Yingluck cover them selves in excrement, glory; they deserve it.

Soi Sauce - What are you smoking?

A few days ago you said flooding Bangkok was part of a PTP plot to make money through the reconstruction of flood damaged Bkk, using their building firm construction contacts.

Now your saying the Governnemt will flood Bkk in order to justify the reclocation of the capital to CM.

Love your imagination and your alternative view - keep em coming!!

It would not matter who was in power, they were not going to stop this flood.

New Orleans natural disaster, could not stop flooding.

Brisbane Queensland natural disaster, could not stop flooding.

Thailand, natural disaster, could not stop flooding.

North Queensland Australia, has just had 14 inches of rain in 24 hours, natural disaster cant stop flooding.

To mention a few recent ones.

Do you think she is GOD, give me a break.

You mean she's not GOD.

Judging by the electioneering performances she put on and the promises she made during her campaign rallies I was under the impression she was!!

I thought all Shinawatras were celestial beings capable of wondrous things??

<Snip>when so many ordinary people lose their jobs, homes businesses and in some cases loved ones </snip>

The PTP/Red's didn't seem to care much when they occupied parts of central Bangkok, nor when they (allegedly) were firing grenades at BTS stations or burning down parts of the capital... why should they care now?

yes, yes we all know about that, get over it and move on, moaning about the past will not help now and it certainly won't change anything. This topic is not about the Bangkok riots, don't hijack it

Not moaning my friend, pointing out a fact.

They didn't care then, they don't care now...

Apologies for the blunt reply - didn't realize it until i revisited my post. I think its a bit harsh to say they don't care, they just don't know what to do. Its just a failure of leadership plain and simple and Yingluck needs to be held accountable for her failings

Yingluck Shinawatra - Suckling Trashiness (TV own spell check suggestions LOL)

<Snip>when so many ordinary people lose their jobs, homes businesses and in some cases loved ones </snip>

The PTP/Red's didn't seem to care much when they occupied parts of central Bangkok, nor when they (allegedly) were firing grenades at BTS stations or burning down parts of the capital... why should they care now?

yes, yes we all know about that, get over it and move on, moaning about the past will not help now and it certainly won't change anything. This topic is not about the Bangkok riots, don't hijack it

The stoicism of the Thai people is to be commended

Not really.

If Thai people were less passive, less deferential, and more selective about their leaders based on competence instead of face or wealth then maybe these situations would not happen to this degree of severity.

Thai people bend to authority far too much and when authority is grossly incompetent then the people suffer.

Yeah you're right my mistake

She wanted the job, she took the job, so shut up stop complaining or looking for excuses and get on with it.

Sorry I can't be more constructive with my comments but it makes my blood boil when so many ordinary people lose their jobs, homes businesses and in some cases loved ones and we see a teary eyed PM looking for sympathy for her and her administration crapness.

The stoicism of the Thai people is to be commended

I spoke to a senior government official. He told me "the situation is critical." He had seen the data, he said, but said the government didn't want to release it for fear of "panicking people". I think many here would rather be forewarned.

As per usual the almighty governing elite consider that the ordinary man and woman in the floods and the streets should be told nothing as it would sully the elite leaderships image. This attitude from a government that professes equality and a fairer society.

Noticeable that the mighty motor mouths of this current administration are in the main silent, indeed one wonders as to why that may be, no doubt the power struggles and the political Machiavellian plots and the jockeying for financial gains are going on in the background.

The government sits on the sidelines observing the mayhem as did those delightful mesdames at the time of the French revolution observing the dispatch of the nobility by the guillotine, Now however it is the ordinary Thai man and woman and their children who are the metaphorical nobility in the metaphorical tumbrels riding to their metaphorical execution courtesy of an inept Thaksin family dynasty establishment campaign.

It is said, "that a country gets the government it deserves."

As has now been proven this administration is indeed totally self serving and inept, clueless as how to act when disasters were seen to be approaching thus when disaster arrives it is to late to mitigate and lessen the impact of that disaster in this case the flooding of Thailand.

oh yes the Thaksin Family Dynasty were the ones that left the taps on causing the floods. The red shirts are hindering efforts to help. What dribble. There was a previous government who had a lot more time to plan ahead and put measures in place for the likelyhood of extreme floods but they did nothing sat back with the attitude we will get around to it tommorrow if tommorrow ever comes.

Listen mate - The Shinawatras want to rule Thailand, they asked, begged, promised people to vote them in to office, they wanted this position of responsibility so why defend them? They wanted to be top dog, and they after the election they are. They need to show that they are equal to their words or get the &lt;deleted&gt; out of dodge and let someone else take over. Moaning about past administrations - get a life - PTP and variations thereof has dominated the Thai Political landscape for the vast majority of the 21st Century .

Yingluck took the job thinking it would be all photo ops and make up - Now the shit hits the fan she's running for cover and her cabinet are running around like headless chickens (with cabinet ministers who have admitted lying to the public to protect their parties image) leave the public to fend for themselves.

Given the scale of the flooding (industrial parks aside) - to houses, farmland, SME businesses, infrastructure, rubbish disposal and basic clean up costs on the street, as well as more involved clean ups for chemical spills such as oils etc. 50 Billion Baht actually seems a very low amount.

Cowslip I think the response and management might have been more co-ordinate d. Many reds supporters are quick to point out that the Dems and the army are bedfellows and here today we see the army playing a pivotal role in assisting the Thai people, whilst the government chases its tail, so given the red argument of the dems and army being close we might have seen a far more structured and proactive approach in the previous administration. Most of the probelms that have occured have been from government officials being unsuitable for the positions of responsibility given to them. In retrospect a better response might have been to sign the whole thing over to the army from day one.

bit of a non-sequitur?

are you suggesting that the army is doing its job therefore not aligned with the old democrat party?

Due to decades of corruption the civil service is FULL of people who aren't up to the job. There are however engineers and others who given the opportunity can get things done....whether in the Army or any other institution.

I also thing the expression "redshirt supporter" is pretty childish.

Red supporter not redshirt supporter is what i wrote- if you have a better more universally understood expression to describe that political faction please share?

As for the rest of your comment - Clearly you misunderstood most of my post if you think it implied the army was doing its job and you therefore jumped to the conclusion that it wasn't aligned to the dems? [The undertone here is that the army wasn't doing its job when the dems were in power - how you reach that conclusion suggest wild conspiracy theories in your mind] The army and dems have and always will be thick as theives. The current government has made an almighty balls up of the situation. The previous administration would have been better - impossible to prove but just an opinion.

It just shows a complete lack of understanding of the issue

you also missed that I was questioning you not stating.

I must say that the standard of argument on TV leaves a lot to be desired.

LOL I'm still waiting for your answer to the red supporter expression question!!!

The logic which you say is missing, well we need to go back to your original quote

" THe previous admin would have been no different"

My argument is based on the fact that the dems and the army are closer (for better or worse) than the army and PTP are, and as such I would have expected a much more co-ordinated response to this that the current government has been able to muster as the only people actually doing anything are the army. Yingluck and Co probably had a brilliant idea to handle this themselves and cover themselves in glory, now its blown up in their face they've called in the Army.

I reckon the Dems would have done things differently and they would have handled things differently

Now - Red Supporter expression please?

Cowslip I think the response and management might have been more co-ordinate d. Many reds supporters are quick to point out that the Dems and the army are bedfellows and here today we see the army playing a pivotal role in assisting the Thai people, whilst the government chases its tail, so given the red argument of the dems and army being close we might have seen a far more structured and proactive approach in the previous administration. Most of the probelms that have occured have been from government officials being unsuitable for the positions of responsibility given to them. In retrospect a better response might have been to sign the whole thing over to the army from day one.

bit of a non-sequitur?

are you suggesting that the army is doing its job therefore not aligned with the old democrat party?

Due to decades of corruption the civil service is FULL of people who aren't up to the job. There are however engineers and others who given the opportunity can get things done....whether in the Army or any other institution.

I also thing the expression "redshirt supporter" is pretty childish.

Red supporter not redshirt supporter is what i wrote- if you have a better more universally understood expression to describe that political faction please share?

As for the rest of your comment - Clearly you misunderstood most of my post if you think it implied the army was doing its job and you therefore jumped to the conclusion that it wasn't aligned to the dems? [The undertone here is that the army wasn't doing its job when the dems were in power - how you reach that conclusion suggest wild conspiracy theories in your mind] The army and dems have and always will be thick as theives. The current government has made an almighty balls up of the situation. The previous administration would have been better - impossible to prove but just an opinion.

THe previous admin would have been no different.

Agreed, the previous government would have been helpless, they were in a weak coalition and had to spend vast amounts of energy trying to fend off the red mobs. They didnt get chance to govern. The last government was crippled by the red mob, this government is crippled by ineptitude.

Which is better?

Abhisit went out in a boat once. We saw the pictures. What you didn't see were the waders pushing the boat along taking the pictures. Photo-op. Nothing more. He's not in shot now.

I wonder if they'll take my posts off again!

Cowslip I think the response and management might have been more co-ordinate d. Many reds supporters are quick to point out that the Dems and the army are bedfellows and here today we see the army playing a pivotal role in assisting the Thai people, whilst the government chases its tail, so given the red argument of the dems and army being close we might have seen a far more structured and proactive approach in the previous administration. Most of the probelms that have occured have been from government officials being unsuitable for the positions of responsibility given to them. In retrospect a better response might have been to sign the whole thing over to the army from day one.

Rubbish article with the intention of denigrating the elected government . The indirect result is that it insults the Thai military. . The military has been involved in the flood relief and prevention activities since the start of the crisis. It's active role was initiated as part of the longstanding government natural disaster protocol that predates the current administration. The reason that the military has been involved is attributable to the fact that the expenditures of the Defence Ministry are among the greatest of any ministry, absorbing a large proportion of the total national budget (source Thailand Ministry of Defense, http://www.mod.go.th/eng_mod/ ) As the ministry that gobbles up a large part of the budget, it is reasonable to expect that it would then shoulder a large part of the response. The large transport trucks that the MOI has been borrowing since the start of the crisis came from the military. The Nation appears to be on a mission to muckrack and try and stir up unrest.

Mr. Hearst would have been proud.

Thank you Mr One-eye. Elected governments that prove incompetent should be criticised. Its part of the democratic process. Getting elected does not obligate the population or the media to fawn at your feet. Sorry if it upsets your useless lightweight heroes.

If someone wishes to criticize, then by all means hr/she should do so. However, the criticism should be based upon accurate facts, not subjective interpretations from biased sources that have the objective of spreading negative nonsense. You disagree with what I wrote. Fine. What is inaccurate or false about my statements? The fact of the matter is that the military was involved since the crisis started. Army engineers were deployed immediately. They did some quick work that bought some extra time. the military did the job because they had the resources. The MOI doesn't have the budget that the military has. As such it cannot provide the equipment, nor the manpower.What's the point of distoring facts?

I don't think anyone is disagreeing with the facts of your statement rather with the reasoning behind it. As with most things on TV irrespective of the topic it always degenerates into a mudslinging match between the supporters of either political faction. So when you state " the criticism should be based upon accurate facts, not subjective interpretations from biased sources that have the objective of spreading negative nonsense" The simple reply to that is why? When "the others" were in power the UDD / PTP (whom i belive you are a supporter of) ignored this basic etiquette in their dealings with the last government, (I remember some of the propaganda on Truth Today and other red media outlets, and i'm not sure they fit with your policy of criticism being based on accurate facts) however you expect that it is a courtesy that should be extended to the Yingluck Government and agencies thereof

So unfortunately for you GK you will be and are tarred by the tactics of the reds whenever you post,as what is good for the goose is also good for the gander

First report from flood surveillance system just received!!

Thailand is flooded

Red-shirt leaders like Natthawut Saikua also helped in "brainstorming"

that's reassuring...

.

:cheesy:

Help, brainstorming, Natthawut........ :cheesy:

During the brainstorming session he suggested putting up barriers at Ratchprasong.

Rubbish article with the intention of denigrating the elected government . The indirect result is that it insults the Thai military. . The military has been involved in the flood relief and prevention activities since the start of the crisis. It's active role was initiated as part of the longstanding government natural disaster protocol that predates the current administration. The reason that the military has been involved is attributable to the fact that the expenditures of the Defence Ministry are among the greatest of any ministry, absorbing a large proportion of the total national budget (source Thailand Ministry of Defense, http://www.mod.go.th/eng_mod/ ) As the ministry that gobbles up a large part of the budget, it is reasonable to expect that it would then shoulder a large part of the response. The large transport trucks that the MOI has been borrowing since the start of the crisis came from the military. The Nation appears to be on a mission to muckrack and try and stir up unrest.

Mr. Hearst would have been proud.

Fair points G'Kid but I put it to you if you or I had done our jobs as poorly as this government had done theirs when faced with this crisis, would you reasonably expect to have a job to return to? The buck stops at Yinglucks door her failure to get her house in order has resulted in this crisis becoming a catastrophe, in time of trouble a country needs a leader and in this respect she has been an abject failure - na ka!

This government are a bunch of useless c**ts so lacking in co-ordination that they couldn't even find their own backside with a map. Who within the government will show responsibility for this. No-one they will point fingers, blame someone else and then have the audacity to ask for sympathy (or burst into tears!!). If I had done my job as badly as this government I would have been sacked.

......and there are aliens at Area 51, JFK was shot by the KGB, the US never landed on the moon cause the flags waving in the wrong direction and the world will end in 2012 cause the Aztecs said so.

Sorry but you need to get out a bit more and stop the wild conspiracy theories

The Maya, not Aztecs is the source of the 2012 belief. But, they did not actually write that the world would end then. It is a misinterpretation perpetuated by the popular media.

Thanks for the correction, just goes to prove you can't believe anything you read in the papers anymore.

Good points but unfortunately whilst western countries / developed countries see education as a means of empowering individuals and society to succeed and be independent, to critically evaluate ideas and think for themselves, the exact opposite has been true in many developing countries whose production industry relies on manual labour. A proper educational system would raise the employment expectations of the next generation.

I feel the worst thing that could happen to Thailand from the economic and political viewpoint would be to have school leavers thinking about their future in terms of a careers, not work or a series of random unrelated short term jobs. Once this happens Thailand's current economic model becomes redundant. From a social perspective though it would be fantastic as a career implies development, planning and progress.

Thailand's education system; a source of endless frustration and lost dreams.

......and there are aliens at Area 51, JFK was shot by the KGB, the US never landed on the moon cause the flags waving in the wrong direction and the world will end in 2012 cause the Aztecs said so.

Sorry but you need to get out a bit more and stop the wild conspiracy theories

I would have thought the PM would have been emphasizing that the efforts to keep Bangkok water free is because Bangkok is the most densely populated part of the country and serious flooding may have results in hundreds of thousands, or millions of new flood victims.

However it seems money and the economy was the main reason ....

I guess this whole plan hinges on whether a government or private company actually wants rice / mangoes or shrimp instead of money. I know what I'd prefer.