rheinwiese

I might be missing something here, but surely Thailand needs 'quantity' to fill up all those empty hotel rooms? Quality is just going to direct high profit business to a few hotels? Thus not much of a benefit to the whole tourism business in Thailand?

Yes, exactly. It is not only 5 Star hotels needing business here,

but the full range of business from hostels to staffed villa rentals, food stalls to Michelin star chefs, ALL needing business.

But the ones with the access to TOT's ears are the upper range guys

so of course they whine for their own market segment being under filled.

What concerns me the most is the apparent uncontrolled expansion in construction of new hotels which you mentioned in a previous message. I would dearly love to know which figures the hotel owners/investors use when calculating the viability of the project. I am well acquainted with a 5 star hotel up country that has been in business over 10 years. When it was built everyone believed it would be a white elephant, and I think the rack rates when it opened were close to 10k per night at 25 to the USD. Today, you can get a room for about 2k baht.

It seems that the uncontrolled, unplanned construction of these hotels of all star ratings has been continuing apace for the last 5 years at least in many of the tourist areas, although I can't say I know all of the tourist numbers. What figures were they predicting for actual tourism growth 5 years ago to encourage this continued expansion. It seems to me, all it has done is allow tour operators to bargain down the prices and allow service to drop as targetted revenues in the hotels don't even get close. Would the country magically come to a standstill if there was a stop on new hotel licenses once the current crop of hotels under construction are finished.

At least this would give a chance for everyone to step back and take a breath and make a proper plan. Would it be a tragedy if there was a small shortage of rooms in the resorts, but it at least allowed the prices for accommodation to firm up a little bit instead of being discounted to the ground.

Of course the global recession is hurting tourism, of course the yellow/red mess has dissuaded a certain percentage of people from coming. But what is wrong with taking a given resort as it stands today and not expanding it any more for the next 5 years, give the authorities some time to really focus on improving the environment in those resorts, and stop cheapening the investments that have already been made and trying to spread thinner revenues around and ever increasing amount of establishments.

Wasn't it Thaksin's master plan to convince investors to build 5 star hotels in ChiangMai, plus promising to expand the airport into an international "hub", plus all the high end attractions like safari park etc??? How is the plan coming along??? All working perfectly?

Very Interesting read.

Article from 2001

The Nation

Date 30.02.2001

Opinion

WELCOME TO THIGHLANDIA

The prime minister (Thaksin S.) is touting tourism as a quick fix for the country’s staggering economy. The consequences are not a matter of prediction; the evidence is there for anyone who wants to look, writes Chang Noi (a pseudonym) in The Nation (30.4.01).

When the Thai economy hits trouble, the government turns to tourism. It happened in the last crisis in the early 1980s. With agriculture slumping and industry moribund, the economic planners seized on services. They sent on 200,000 Thai workers off to the Middle East and doubled tourist arrivals in five years.

As the prime minister [Thaksin Shinawatra] recently said, tourism is quick, cheap, and easy. The ingredients are already there. Sun, sea, smiles, culture. Some of these spare resources haven’t even been sold yet. With better marketing, the returns will jump. Twenty billion baht more from Chiang Mai. Ten more from Phuket. Another twenty from everywhere else. All by this time next year.

Amid this enthusiasm, it’s difficult to detect words like “control” or “consequences”. The consequences are not a matter of theory or prediction. The evidence is there for anyone who wants to look. Thailand’s main tourist product is the beach resort, with sun, sea, sand and the S-word, which the tourist planners seem so reluctant to talk about.

The development cycle is clear from the experience of 40 years.

Stage 1: Start with a place of outstanding beauty, which attracts people because it is drop-dead gorgeous. Impose absolutely no controls. Allow get-rich-quick entrepreneurs to encroach on the beach, blow up the rocks, scatter garbage and pour concrete everywhere.

Stage 2: The resort is now popular but rapidly losing its natural charm. Add large quantities of sex and comfort. Build large, luxurious hotels. Import lots of girls.

Stage 3: By now the natural beauty is totally obliterated. The seafront is an essay in bad architecture. The hinterland is a shantytown of beer bars. Develop the remains as a male fantasy theme park. Add anything with testosterone appeal – big motorbikes, shooting ranges, go-kart tracks, boxing rings, archery. Bring in more and more girls (and boys). There you have it: Thighlandia. Then stack it high and sell it cheap. You can travel round Thailand and see this development cycle in action.

Pattaya is long in stage 3. Phuket is hovering on the borderline between stage 2 and stage 3. The island has become a building site. Patong is spreading like a stain. Hua Hin is on the edge between stage 1 and stage 2. The architectural assault on the beauty of the beach-front is complete. Over the last year, Patong-ization has started, and the old fishing village is filling up with girls, bars and the trappings of Thighlandia.

Thailand’s second tourist product is the hill town offering a mixture of mountain scenery, old culture, and exotic people. This has also its development cycle.

The first visitors are attracted by nature and adventure. They climb the hills, paddle the rivers, visit the hill people and experience the temples. They generate little revenue, but they create a reputation.

At stage 2, as the numbers of visitors increase, the original appeal of nature and adventure is swamped. The temples are buried by high-rise hotels. The treks are too crowded to offer any fantasy of adventure. What’s left is buying things to take home.

At stage 3, the place is transformed into an exotic theme park with a huge specialty store. The hill people and other “natural” attractions are arranged like a zoo. The “traditional native products” are manufactured on industrial principles and sold through an ever-spreading flea market. Then add some of the bits of Thighlandia for good measure.

Thailand’s third tourist product is the festival. Mostly these have been marketed domestically. But in the last few years, the tourist authority has started turning these into export products.

Originally, Songkran was a subtle mix of two festivals found all over Asia. The first is an intimate rite of blessing by pouring water. The second is the world-turned-upside-down. For one day only, the hierarchy is upended, and social constraints are removed. Both these festivals have cultural meaning and social purpose. The rite of blessing brings people together. The day-of-misrule is an opportunity to release tensions and adjust hierarchies.

Songkran today has become a water fight. In essence, it’s a blown-up version of a paintball battle, a real world experience of a videogame splat fest. The underlying principle (as with battle simulations and arcade wars) is the exercise of violence, relieved of all its nasty consequences (blood and death). The rite of blessing has disappeared. The drama of misrule has been lost.

The current enthusiasm for tourism is more than Thaksin’s dream of a quick fix in a bad year, a yah bah [methamphetamine] pill for the economy. Last year, the World Bank produced a report on Thailand’s economic prospects after the crisis. Shorn of all the formal language, the report said: everything else is hopeless; turn Thailand into a theme park. The proposal now is to double tourist arrivals in a handful of years. That means another Pattaya, another Phuket, another battered “Rose of the North”, another “Splatkran”.

PHUKET IN THE SPOTLIGHT

– UNDER the new tourism plan, Phuket has been named an international city to generate an extra 50 billion baht (US$1.1 billion) annually from tourism. However, excess tourism has already placed a heavy drain on the island’s natural resources.

There once was an estimated 272sqkm of inland and mangrove forests on Phuket but the area under cover now has decreased to just 32sqkm and continues to shrink every year.

An influx of immigrants from other provinces has resulted in about 50 slums housing at least 100,000 people. These people live in unhygienic surroundings without adequate utilities. And as they are not registered as residents of Phuket, funding is not made available to improve their living conditions.

Phuket is also notorious for its high number of Aids inflicted. It was the 20th worst-affected province in 1996, but today it is second only to Phayao and is the worst-affected in the South.

There also are political problems. Local bodies are heavily influenced by local gang-lords and corrupt politicians. This has contributed to the rape of the natural resources. The local bodies only protect the interests of their overlords. For example, attempts to introduce zoning, which would bar activities damaging to the environment such as shrimp farms and elephants treks for tourists, have consistently been rejected. Shrimp farms continue to encroach on forest reserves, while the elephants destroy the coral when carrying tourists into the sea.

The authorities are aware of the problems caused by the shrimp farms but do nothing to enforce a law introduced in October 1997 banning the farms. Shrimp farmers have said they will accept zoning but all operating farms must be allowed to continue. There is also opposition to the zoning of elephant camps. Operators say introducing zones now would disadvantage those operating outside the designated areas. Plans for night entertainment zones have been rejected on the same grounds.

Zoning was tried in 1976, when the Tourism Authority conducted a tourism development study. The idea was shelved because it could have affected land use by the rich and powerful. Laws intended to protect the environment carry no weight on the island. The destruction of coral is just one example of the flouting of the law, with the excuse that tourism activities are an important money-spinner.

Hotels encroaching on beaches has been another longstanding problem in the island province. One five-star hotel continues to operate, despite a Counter Corruption Commission ruling calling for the rescinding of its operating licence. The Phuket governor has simply ignored the order.

Even if the government can develop Phuket as an international tourism city, there could be more adverse effects on the local people. "Of course, income from tourism will rise. But the lives of local people may deteriorate because of the higher cost of living. Who will take care of these people?" Charn Wongsatayanon, chairman of the Phuket Chamber of Commerce, recently noted at a seminar on the international city plans.

Chavalit na Nakhon, an adviser to the People's Rights Project, a group representing local people, said, "People's representatives have never been invited to a meeting on the international city campaign. The only private sector people joining such meetings are businessmen. Villagers have never been told how the promotion plan will affect their lives."

The island attracts three million tourists already each year, vastly overwhelming the 250,000 residents, so the island could already be considered an international city, albeit a poorly organized one. Without direction, investors have pushed development too fast for any environment protection measures or efforts at sustainable development to keep pace.

Lately, there has been talk of developing Phuket into a cyber city, a free port and now an international city. But with all of this talk, no one has suggested a remedy to the problems of environmental damage, the slum developments and the gangland activities which bedevil the island. 

''The former premier said such circumstances include a remedy for those affected by political violence, absolution of convicted politicians and activists from the crimes that he believes are political, and the establishment of a justice system that is truly free of political influence.''

hear hear..............

throw in bicycle lanes and the project gets my vote.

Inbound 7am today.

It took exactly 85 min to pass immigration.

50% of the booths unmanned.

http://www.tdri.or.th/reports/unpublished/os_paper/auyeung.pdf

Presentation Paper for

The Seminar on International Experiences on Good Governance

and Fighting Corruption

Thursday, February 17, 2000

Pimarnmek Room, 3rd Floor,

The Grand Hotel, Bangkok

Hong Kong had the same problems as Thailand has today.

They started the clean up in 1974.

And....it worked.

Open the file. It,s a good read.

thx for the answers,how far the way by bus and boat from KL to penang?

price aproximently for the flight?

must i booked in advance,or is it not nesarsarly?

There are 2 low-cost airlines on the KL-Penang route both from Kuala Lumpur LCC terminal.

Check out www.airasia.com and www.fireflyz.com.my.

As for buses, for the more safe ones with less accidents, check out www.aeroline.com.my.

You find all prices on the the websites.

Air travel will save you a lot of time. The bus trip from KL to Penang takes 4-5 hours.

Advance booking for promotion prices is highly recommended.

The longer you wait, the more you pay.

There are no direct flights from Chiang Mai to Penang.

I suggest Air Asia via Bangkok.

Should be the cheapest option. Around 4-5k Baht one way.

Note: only 1 Air Asia flight per day BKK PEN taking off @ 13.55

Crystal Thai isn't off the ground yet.

1st flight Feb 17th.

So far no KL service announced.

The Kasikorn exchange rate is usually a baht or more better than for instance the rate that "which bank" will give you. Just check the rates on the net right before you want to send.

http://bankexchangerates.daytodaydata.net/default.aspx

Hi,

They also told me at post office that the ban is left because we are February 8th, but i guess that they don't know and just assume because it is the date previously written on the document ?

Any more info ?

Thanks.

Managed to send a parcel (2,2kgs) to US yesterday. (Int'l Air Parcel)

1st the PO staff rejected , but after I insisted they make a phone call and the guy at the other end confirmed.

PO in CentralWorld told me that the ban will be lifted on Feb 6/7 2011 and they will accept parcel over 1 pound.

Anyone can confirm?

Went to the PO in CentralWorld again today.

Staff told me that parcels up to 2 kgs are now no problem.

Chinese junk. Aircons don't work. The cars will be down for maintaince virtually their entire working lives.

But hey those trains are cheap. That's the whole idea.

They miss the platform 1/2 the time. They sound like the wheels are coming off. I hate the new trains. I like the old German ones. Or Taiwan. Or whatever.

Absolutely agree.

I use them daily between Siam and Surasak.

It ain't a smooth ride.

Interior design is nice but they much louder then the old ones, and it seems they have a breaking problem.

Or does the software still don't work properly.

Yep, I would take a cab as well.

Cost approx 200 Baht to Thonglor.

Left last Saturday around 4pm, worst lines I've ever seen at departure. The first passport control line I came to was stretched outside the glass door area into checkin. Took the long walk to the other passport control where the line was just inside the glass door area. I waited in this line 45 minutes to get my exit stamp. Not as bad as others have reported but still not acceptable, especially when immigration had their "24 minute service" sticker pasted all over the exit immigration area! I counted 9 desks available for foreign passport processing. of these, 3 were unmanned, 5 had one officer, and only 1 had 2 officers. The security check after immigration was almost deserted, so the bottleneck is clearly the lack of manpower at exit immigration.

Here you go! 24.01.11 @ 7:30

PO in CentralWorld told me that the ban will be lifted on Feb 6/7 2011 and they will accept parcel over 1 pound.

Anyone can confirm?

I thought ThaiAir were strapped for cash? Wasn't there a story about this some months back? Funny how they can turn the business round so quickly and decide to buy new jets, or is it the case that they have to remain competitive with new planes/inflight entertainment or spiral further into a 3rd world airline? Alot of face loss here?

Actually TG will not buy these aircraft.

They will be leased from an aircraft leasing company like e.g. ILFC.

Common practice in aviation.

When I read something like this, I'm reminded that the Thai's want to build a nuclear power plant. Hmmmmm. At least there are no reports of injurys..

Exactely my thoughts.

If a reactor will ever be built in Thailand and commissioned, it's time to pack the bags.

In this respect: Google "Bataan Nuclear Power Plant". Sounds familiar?

Wow, 70.000 Chinese Traders will work in this new Centre.

Well, I think they all might need a Thai work permit.

And as we know the rules are..1 foreigner WP = 4 Thai employees.

That's 280.000 new jobs!!!!

The Airport Link is hardly "connected to the Bangkok Metro Blue Line subway". The closest entrances of the stations are about a 400 m walk apart and walking involves crossing a street. Not feasible with some luggage. I don't see an easy solution for this either. I prefer to use the City Link from Phayathai station even though it's farther from my home. One passenger permanently lost for the express

not to mention the safety check in the subway station.

u gotta pass an xray.

once it beeps and the guy is not lenient, u gotta open all your luggage.

lot's of furious looks from the queue assembling behind you.

Thanks alot guys.

The minivan sounds like the best option. how much would a taxi from the airport cost to the victory monument from the airport & nana ? and is it easy to find the minivans when you first arrive at the victory monument (never been there).

Thanks alot for your assistance and sorry if i posted it in the wrong forum

Check the attachment.

It has all information you need to take minivans from Victory Monument.

Taxi cost from airport: approx 300 Baht incl. tolls

Go to the departure level after arrival and take a taxi from there. (right hand side after stepping out of the terminal. cross the 1st road)

Saves you the 50 Baht airport taxi fee and the cabbies are happy to get a fare back to town.

BTW: Victory Monument - Thai: อนุสาวรีย์ชัยสมรภูมิ, Anusawari Chai Samoraphum

Have a save trp

Have you notice; the chinese NGV buses in Bangkok, hardly 2 years, and they all are falling apart. Worst, the BRT buses, hardly 4 months, half are broken already.

You are right and besides did anyone noticed?

These Chinese made buses are incredibly loud. 21st century technology huh?

Even the old red and blue non a/c buses are much more quiet.

Since yesterday afternoon I cannot retrieve my Email from KSC. (mail.co.th)

The log-in page ain't loading.

I tried with FF, Chrome and IE.

Anybody having the same problem????

I need to buy a few office chairs with armrest and some office furniture (desks, cabinets, drawers.

Any recommendation?

Thanks!

5 years for 640km of high speed tracks?

With bridges, tunnels, station and..........save crossings??

And where is the station to Bangkok to accommodate such High Speed train?

Hua Lamphong?

You mentioned "we".

How many people are you talking?

I guess everybody remembers the melamine tainted milk scandal in 2008.

60 tonnes of the Chinese milk powder was found in Thailand, imported by Dutch Mill.

I wonder what happened with that stuff.

Return to sender?

What did our friend Chalerm (2008 Thai Public Health Minister)do about it?

Read for yourself.

Oct 2, 2008

The Nation:

Public Health Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung is scheduled to meet the Chinese ambassador to discuss the imports of melamine-contaminated milk and milk-based products.

He said he was afraid the Food and Drug Administration (FDA)'s report on the contaminated imports would affect Thailand's trade ties with China.

He said he would ask people who personally know the Chinese ambassador and the chairman of the Chinese Association in Thailand to first explain the situation to the envoy in an informal setting.

"I did not mean that I am afraid of China, but we [the government] have to be concerned about our commercial relationship, because Thailand trades a lot with China," he said.

Chalerm has also advised the FDA to issue a press release instead of holding a press conference to explain the situation. He said public declarations of the problem would have an adverse effect on China.

He worried that China might think that FDA's action would create trade barrier for its product import to kingdom.

Meanwhile, the FDA is freezing 60 tonnes of milk powder imported by Dutch Mill for further investigation and results should be released within the week. If the powder is found contaminated, the FDA will reject the import permit for this shipment.