KevinHunt

 DH sang 'What's the Life of a Man', an appropriate trad English folk song from the west country. 

You mention Chris Ashton and Martin Chappel, plus a few others that helped Abe in his time of need who was the mysterious DH?

David Hardcastle

Well why didn't he say!! 

Every single word from the OP describes perfectly my wife n kids. After 20 years I've got used to it. Not worth getting excited about - they ain't gonna change.

Just a note to all you cost conscience people that are going to Grandview hotels buffet. They have joined the ranks of many other great establishments and eliminated their beverage area and are now charging for water. Cost isn't much though 10 baht a bottle. Still free coffee and tea...

I heard today from a regular at the Grandview Buffet that since the introduction of the 10 baht charge for water the F&B manager has been inundated with complaints fom the Farangs. Some things never change.  

I'm sure he finds it funny, but what do you think? - is it sad, stupid or just plain pathetic?

a bit late, yes. the run starts at 4am. i'll be running, hope to be finished by about 8,

in time for breakfast at the new macdonalds! i am a bit worried though, it's a long,

lonely run along the canal towards hang dong, and i'm scared of stomping on a cobra

in the dark.

I'm having an early night, so it's too late for me. How do people manage to stay up so late and still go running? 

Don't worry about the cobras, they're more worried about you stomping on them than you are.

7th day adventists church on Ekamai, Sukhumvit Soi 71 (from Sukhumvit) about 2km > turn left, I think there are signs for International school and both Thai and international church. They will distribute it to the needy and poor.

I still can't understand why anyone would want to spend an evening/afternoon/anytime with just Men?

Then don't join.

Here's a few reasons ..

1. To have a break from the missus.

2. To talk about sport (do you know any women that understand the 'off-side' rule?).

3. To avoid going shopping.

i could've sworn that was called 'a pub'.

Most pubs allow women in these days. It's the law, I believe.

I still can't understand why anyone would want to spend an evening/afternoon/anytime with just Men?

Here's a few reasons ..

1. To have a break from the missus.

2. To talk about sport (do you know any women that understand the 'off-side' rule?).

3. To avoid going shopping.

 I normally see articles in the local mags about donating clothes, bedding etc at this time of year, but I haven't noticed any lately. I've had a clear out of my wardrobe (I accept that I'm not going to get into them 34" trousers again - espescially after Christmas) and now I've got to figure out where to take them. Any ideas. I do recall seeing a clothes drop-off at one of the Supermarkets, but can't remember which one? My clear-out was based on my usual maxim 'If in doubt - throw it out'. If I could persuade my wife to do the same, we'd need a decent sized pick-up to take them away. 

the next thing you know will be chappies refering to "football" as soccer.

IT IS!!!

Football is a game where people tackle the guy with the ball. I know that happens in soccer as well, but then the primadonnas fall down and cry like babies.

I find it amusing that Brits get bothered about Americans referring to Football as 'Soccer'. Most don't realise that 'soccer' was a term first used in England to differentiate between Association Football (which was abbreviated to 'soccer') and Rugby Football. Just as it is used in the US to distinguish between American Football and Association Football. 

As a young lad, I looked forward to this time of year because somewhere amongst my Christmas gifts I hoped to find a Soccer Annual. To quote Wikipedia ..

The name association football was coined to distinguish the game from the other forms of football played at the time, specifically rugby football. The term soccer originated in England, first appearing in the 1880s as a slang abbreviation of the word "association" often credited to former England captain Charles Wreford-Brown. 

Back on topic - I think it's an interesting idea, but who or how would you decide who could join? Black balls and white balls? As someone once said 'I wouldn't want to be a member of a club that allowed people like me to be members.' (or something like that).

 DH sang 'What's the Life of a Man', an appropriate trad English folk song from the west country. 

You mention Chris Ashton and Martin Chappel, plus a few others that helped Abe in his time of need who was the mysterious DH?

Offering food is a good test of their real need(s). 

The Beatles sang a nice song along those lines "All you need is love". Nice song, but not very practical. 

The beggars song is "All you need is food". You don't need  shoes, clothes, a place to stay , soap, shampoo, water, bedding, towels ........ and heaven forbid if he should aspire to having a TV!!  That's the litmus test - if he doesn't need food he's a con man who's living the high life when we're not looking. 

Real needs are ...... food. Everything else is luxury.

Beware, brother, beware.

i always find carrying a bit salt comes in handy, especially for those that drag themselves accross the floor..

lets face it.........how desperate are they to get where they are going? i for one know that if i had only one leg with weeping sores on my good stump, clawing my way down loi kroh road would be the last thing on my list of things to do.

Salt is good for slugs as well as disabled people. I'm sure you're aware of that, already.

'Lets face it'? Good idea. Let's face reality, shall we. 

'How desperate are they?'  Extremely desperate, I would have thought. Why else would you claw your way along the road? 

And, just out of curiosity, if you, for one, only had one leg, and weeping sores on your good stump how would you survive in Thailand? What would you do? I'd be very interested to know what your survival plan would be.

Quote Sagaris "I started the O malleys v Red Lion thread about 6 years ago through wanting to get what I thought were two un publicised places discussed and lo and behold. It was the most viewed thing ever apparently."

Until I came along with the famous Free water thread (pity they deleted it). Which means that my place has been a part of TV Chiang Mai's two most popular topics! Where do I collect my pize ? Was it really six years ago? where does the time go?

Merry Christmas, and to quote Ringo - 'Peace and Love'.

ringo - keep fit

Reading about Abe, I wonder if anyone remembers another of Chiang Mai's old charachters Harry Ineichen? A cockney of Swiss descent, he was an interesting charachter from the old days of The Escape, Domino Bar, Daniels bar etc. He passed away in December 2006. I was fortunate enough to know him and visited him during his last days at his little haven in Tambon Tassala, and attended his funeral rites at a temple nearby. His lovely wife Pongsri moved back to her home town of Phrao.

In a similar vein, I was also fortunate enough to have the lovely English gentleman Bill Latham as a regular customer at the pub. His plight as a victim of smoking-related circulation problems was related in Good Morning Chiang Mai , and was used as a warning as to the dangers of smoking.

Bill Latham - amputee

Bill Latham - Part 2

His obiturary was posted in Chiang Mai mail Obituary

I visited him regulary in hospital, in his last months,  and I felt honoured to be able to help in a small way. I was also with him when he passed away - a very sad memory. I'm pleased to say that I am still good friends with his long-time partner Noy. A Thai angel, if ever there was one. Unfortunately, Bill's last days were spent in extremes of discomfort but Noy was forever at his side. She still remains, to this day, one of my heroes. I also remember, with great admiration and gratitude, the fantastic help and support offered by Khun Panida at the Bristish Consul.  

For me Abe will always be a reminder of how I saved a life.

I found out Abe had fallen and was in the hospital. I went to visit him and over the course of time the doctor said I had to take Abe away someplace.

Well Abe had nowhere to go and needed car. The only place I thought that would be was up to the Lahu village.

I removed him from the hospital with all the medicines he needed to survive and we went up to my village.

I installed him into a rental lahu house and before I had left Chang Mai I had collected enough funds from friends and my own funds to see him though.

Because I was living in another village I gave these funds to DW who was living in the village at the time. He was living with his girlfriend and was going to be able to see that Abe would get foods and care during his time.

Well DW felt that Abe did not need his medicine and Abe got worse. In the meantime DW had gone off somewhere to do something crazy and left Abe's care to his girlfriend who really was nothing more than a Thai junky.

Abe became worse and when I came back to check on him, he was lying in his bed covered in his own shit.

I had to carry him on my shoulder and showered him and then clean all up.

DW was nowhere to be found and the money was gone in drugs by his girlfriend.

I needed help.

I got David Hardy from chiang mai too help, we got a jeep and came and fetched Abe, and he was dying and needed to be back into the hospital.

We took him to the hospital and then he got better, where another friend named Chris Ashton with help from the British consulate got Abe a passport and he was gotten into the McKain place, with a small pension from the British government. Hence how Abe ended up there.

DW was a hunted man having hid out at the Lahu village and also was a criminal in Thailand for possession of pot.

I made sure immigration knew his whereabouts and that they were reminded of his past in Thailand and he was deported.

Many people disliked me for my actions but he in his stupid ways almost killed Abe and was not taking any blame, so I saw payback.I am not ashamed of my actions because I was mad at DW for his crazy way of making all look so good.

I saved Abe for a little longer. I do not know if he was happier or not but I believe he was grateful for my help.

I know who Abe was, saw him about, but never knew him personally - I wasn't much of a bar-hopper in the old days. I'd like to express my thanks to you, Hardy, Chris Ashton, the Consul and the many people that helped a fellow farang in his time of need. A very sad and yet heartwarming story at this special time of year.

An interesting anectdote I heard tonight was that if you were fortunate enough to have Abe in your team on any of the local quiz nights it was a guarantee of being in the winning team. He was very well read and extremely intelligent, by all accounts. 

It's always sad to hear of the passing of one of the old expat charachters of Chiang Mai. RIP.

Awesome!!

Will write up a detailed report as soon as I get a chance to visit.

A detailed report? It's McDonald's. Aren't they all the same? I thought that was the point - been to one you've been to them all.

Ooh look: http://www.yourdoctorfishspa.com/

only 175SGD!!...cheaper than some tickles...do they only do feet? Can they be deep fried once reached their sell by date??

Cannibalism lite?

I think you are on to something here. Total immersion fish tanks.

Is this OK ? Will stop by for my reward-discount 'Schitznel' tonite. Whoops, now I've given myself away, darn-it !

The 'No Riff Raff' sign has been replaced by a Christmas decoration, so you should be able to get in unchallenged. Just my little contribution to The Spirit Of Chrismas. Peace and Goodwill to all, and that sort of stuff. 

It goes back up in the New Year, obviously.

PS. The Burnley Supporter Club meets tonight. He posts here occasionally, so you can meet a fellow TVer. He should be in the festive spirit because they are playing lowly Wolves, and they might win for a change.

Whatever you do, don't mention Liverpool!!! (The Management reserves the right.... etc.). 

perhaps the mods should make a separate thread with the tipping content. I feel a little guilty contributing to a thread that steered off topic.

It's natural that conversations flow in different directions. Hold back on the guilt, and don't encourage the mods. They don't need it.

If I reply in any post that mentions my place (favourably or not), even to questions aimed directly at me, I get accused of promoting my pub, so I'm not replying.

You have a pub ?

Yes. It's called The Red Lion. It is in the Night Bazaar. We sell a wide range of ... .... wait, I get it! You're trying to trick me aren't you? Well done, you nearly had me there.

   Suddenly Fish Spas are all over town. I'd never heard of such a thing six months ago and now I see them everywhere. If I make a trip the short distance from the pub to Panthip Plaza , I get 'Hello Massage' about 5 times. Will I now be getting 'hello Fish Spa' every 50 metres , I wonder? 

   What I want to know is has anyone tried it - if so why?, what am I missing?, and would you go back? I think it is one of those things that you may do once, but would you want to do it again? When I see them setting these places on the likes of Changklan Rd with high rents, I wonder how long they will survive. At least massage places offer other services as well, what other services can they offer at a fish spa!!??

Its nothing serious sir- just a touch of water in the carburettor !

That reminds me of the other old joke ..

Mechanic: No problem Sir, just shit in the carburettor.

Customer: That's good, but how often should I do it?

I reckon I've seen a car in the moat at least 3 or 4 times over the years.

I imagined those poor lost souls frothing at the mouth.

Perhaps they were in need of a medicinal glass-of-free-water, poor chaps ? Or is rabies currently endemic in the Night-Bazaar area ?

I think we should be told !

Speaking of which (problems in the N.B.), I was down there recently to shop for filmic-DVDs, but could find very few new/recent-movies, except for Michael-Jackson. Does anyone know, is there some supply-problem, or has the short-supply of customers forced them to slow-down deliveries of new stock, while they sell-out the old stock ?

Perhaps someone can suggest a local hostelry, where we riff-raff might discuss this, over a beer ? British-owned and not arrogant, natch. Over to KH.

If I reply in any post that mentions my place (favourably or not), even to questions aimed directly at me, I get accused of promoting my pub, so I'm not replying.

Most western style res. as well as buffets here usually have a gratuity in the bill, so no I wouldn't tip on top of that.

   I just don't believe in tipping. I don't look at it as helping someone, I look at it as making someone a beggar. Locals don't tip so why should the expat community. I think that it is a terrible tradition. Many people make a low wage, but I didn't create the economy, I just live in it and pay accordingly.

  I accept that tourists coming here tip, because they don't know better. But I think that for the expat community it is strange that they bring their customs and force it on the locals. Next time you are with a Thai person that is not in the service industry ask them about their views on tipping. I am certain that they will tell you that it is not a sign of respect to tip. 

   Why should a server get a tip, while the cook who works just as hard, making the same low salary not get tipped?

  Which Western restaurants have a gratuity included in the bill? I've heard of one or two but 'most'? I don't think so. Besides, even if a 'gratuity' wasn't included, you wouldn't tip anyway because, as you go on to say, 'I just don't believe in tipping'.

   As regards to this respect thing - what has respect got to do with it? No-one leaves a tip, anywhere in the world, as a sign of respect. If I leave a tip it is a sign of gratitude and sympathy. As you quite rightly said, 'many people make a low wage'. I , and a few others recognise that and try to help in a small way by leaving small tips, but your attitude is 'I didn't create the economy', which is as good as saying ' I don't care'. It looks more like you are making excuses for being mean and un-caring.

   And us expats that are showing some sympathy and understanding, we're not that nice after all, it seems. We're here forcing our customs on the locals!! That's a great choice of words. I've no idea what it means, though.

   Locals don't tip? I'll give you my experience of tipping. I wouldn't normally tip in a noodle shop,other than leaving the small change maybe, but if I go to a restaurant (Thai or Western) I would always tip. If me and my wife go to a Thai restaurant I leave the decision about tipping to my wife, and she always tips - but how much may vary. I would also expect her to tell me to give 20baht to the guy in the car park who 'helped' me to park. My wife is working class Chiang Mai girl, and as long as I've known her she has always tipped. She does it because she has lots of sympathy for working class Thias, who invariably earn a pittance, and because she can. I've never had the impression that anyone was offended. 

   As someone has already pointed out, tips are always shared. The exception is if you put the tip directly into the waitresses hand. The system is - if the tip is placed on the tray then it is shared, if it goes into the hand it is a personal tip. If my wife thinks a waitress was particularly nice, or she feels sorry for them, she will put some money in her hand and leave a small amount on the tray for the rest of the staff. Since this is the custom in Thai restaurants that rarely see a Farang, then your arguments about Thais never tipping don't really ring true. Anyway, my excuse is mostly the same as my wife's - sohng saan ( I feel sorry for him/her). I actually tip here more because of my Thai wife's influence than western influences.   My wife does lots of small things that all about helping people less fortunate than her. It can be very humbling at times. You may think that she hasn't taught me well, but your arguments haven't convinced me.

Actually, my experience has been that most of the stalls are charging 25 baht these days.

Me also, but I always give the small Thai cafes 40 baht for what I believe is a great meal at twice the price. I've established some pretty good relationships that way. It's just my way of showing I appreciate what they provide at very little cost.

If I understand you correctly, you are tipping something like 56%. That's ridiculous.

If I understand him correctly it is a 15 baht tip - anything less than 15b would be no tip at all. Leaving a 10% tip on a 20baht dinner would have been 2b - now that's ridiculous.

56% of a 500 baht bill would be excessive, but 56% of a small amount is a very small amount. As you might have guessed I'm not a big fan of percentages. Saying "a 56% tip is excessive" sounds reasonable, but saying "a 15b tip is excessive" doesn't. Good on him, I say. Wealth distribution isn't such a bad thing.